Do you think its appropriate for an 11 year old to get any body part waxed? - Page 5 - Mothering Forums

View Poll Results: Should 11 year old giirls get their eyebrows waxed?
yes 190 53.52%
no 165 46.48%
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:03 PM
 
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Originally Posted by numom499
about the clothing, i will say it again,...why not encourage clothing manufactureres.designers to make cloths that fit women with real breasts, instead of changing ones body to fit the clothes...come onm thats a little messed up dont you think?

cut my body or cut some fabric...hmmmm.
This isnt realistic. Everyone is so different that it is impossible to clothing manufacturers to fit every breast perfectly. I make my own clothes and even I sometimes have a hard time with things fitting right on me. I personally am ok with that, but if others are not then I am not one to judge.

If my dds came to me wanting to wax and eyebrow or something of course I would suggest that they really think about it and encourage them to believe that they are beautiful however they are. BUT ultimately it is their body hair and their choice.

Further, every adult has preferences and is free to do as they please with their body. I don't shave my armpits in the winter but I often do in the summer, it has nothing to do with perception of me but everything to do with how I feel. Long armpit hair in the summer makes me feel sweaty and I tend to smell more....so I shave it. It has nothing to do with how confident I am or not.

I wonder how self confident you and MITB really are considering all the constant judging and criticism of others between the two of you. What does it say about you that you need to continuously put other women down, contiously criticize other mother's? Maybe you are lacking something in yourself.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:07 PM
 
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I answered no. If there were extenuating circumstances which I don't currently see happening, I might reconsider. If she really wanted to at age 11 get her eyebrows waxed that's fine if that's what she wants to spend her allowance on. I wouldn't give her extra money to do it. I have to be honest though I tried plucking my eyebrows once when I was 14, way too painful. No idea why anyone does that to themselves and my eyebrows probably would look better plucked.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:11 PM
 
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I don't think women who have small or average size breasts don't have "real breasts" they are just the norm. Most thin/average size women don't have a DD cup, they have a B or C cup. And even plus size clothes accomodate the larget breasts ie a size 2X shirt would fit a 40DD breasted woman just fine.

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Old 07-31-2006, 06:16 PM
 
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Like the above poster said, it's entirely unrealistic to assume that clothing manufacturers are going to hop up and change the way they make clothing any time in my lifetime. Not to mention, who are they going to change for? My breasts? The woman with the same waist size as me but huge breasts? I mean, they do make clothes that fit real women. I know plenty of real women that have no trouble finding clothes that fit them properly. I, however, am not one of them.

I have seen the website with all the breasts and as wonderful as it is to see all those women shedding their shirts and baring all proudly, it's still not what I'm talking about here. I really don't see any difference between my wanting to get breast implants so that I can fit into clothing that I like better and the women who lose weight for the same purpose. Even if we like ourselves exactly as we are there is no reason for us to feel badly about wanting to improve things that we think could use some improving.

And yes, I did say that I think my breasts post babies/nursing look wierd. If you saw my breasts you might think so too. Or maybe you'd think they looked just fine. Who knows. What I do know is that 15 years ago I had breasts that I liked. They have changed and look different than I want them to look at to me they look weird. If I saw the same breasts on another woman I don't know that I'd think they looked weird because it's how I've always seen them on that person. If I were to get into some sort of accident and ended up with a huge scar on my face I would think that looked weird too because it wasn't there before. I don't see anything wrong with thinking that after quite a bit of changing they look weird.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by PatchyMama
I wonder how self confident you and MITB really are considering all the constant judging and criticism of others between the two of you. What does it say about you that you need to continuously put other women down, contiously criticize other mother's? Maybe you are lacking something in yourself.
I didn't read any posts putting women down. If a person feels put-down, that is a sign of low self-esteem/low self-confidence.

I see nothing wrong with questioning why mothers are okay conditioning their daughters to conform to unrealistic societal 'norms'.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:17 PM
 
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As a rather hairy person, I would permit an 11 year old to get a wax if she so desired one. Heck, if she wanted her upper lip done, I would be all for it. Unless you have experienced life as a very young girl with facial hair, I don't think you can fully understand how embarassing it is to have a moustache thicker than your older brother's or to have your eyebrows grow togther. It was a great boost to my positive feelings of myself to get this done.

It doesn't lead to modifying other body parts.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:18 PM
 
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It's much more appropriate to teach our daughters to be so anti-conformist that they spend their lives being the freak down the street.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:20 PM
 
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Originally Posted by numom499
I would rather encourage clothing manufacturers to desing clothes that fit real women, not alter my bidy to fit into somebodys image of what womens bodys look like.
This is completely impossible. Everyone is different. I'm tall, a size 8 in pants/waist/etc... but wear a 34DD bra. My wedding, my HS prom even, I wore separate skirt and top because any dress that fit my boobs I was swimming in from the waist down, anything that fit my butt and waist wouldn't zip past my boobs. One of my closest friend, is a size 12 and completely flat chested, she has the opposite trouble where tops look dumb on her because they sag at her chest.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by wende
I'm perfectly happy and content in my decision to get breast implants. I decided when I was 16 that I was getting them. I turn 30 next month. I'm not a child making a rash decision and I won't entertain any idea that I'm an idiot for doing so.
So, you have held onto this since you were 16 years old. How can you say it is not a rash decision made by a child?
Why haven't you spent those years loving your breasts/body for what they are/have become?
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:25 PM
 
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I see nothing wrong with questioning why mothers are okay conditioning their daughters to conform to unrealistic societal 'norms'.
I don't think anyone here is advocating "conditioning" there dd to conform. I think what most people are saying is that if their dd came to them and truely wanted to wax they would allow it. Would I ask my dd or encourage her to do it? No, but it is her body and it's not perminate so why should I not allow it? Picking your battles is important.

We all do little things to make us feel more attractive (paint our nails, dye hair, or cut it in a particular way) weither it be by our own standards or societies. Why should I deny my dd that if she truely wants it?
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by wende
It's much more appropriate to teach our daughters to be so anti-conformist that they spend their lives being the freak down the street.
Wow! That is harsh. I don't think instilling a strong sense of self-confidence/self-worth creates a freak. Then again, this freak (me) loves shining bright.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:28 PM
 
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So, you have held onto this since you were 16 years old. How can you say it is not a rash decision made by a child?
How can you say that she hasn't spent the last 14 years meditating about if it is the right decision for her.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by stellimamo
Why should I deny my dd that if she truely wants it?
I never said to deny them their rights to their bodies. I did ask why not instill a sense of self-confidence in their body?
It seems to me that if I had my dd's eyebrows waxed at age 11, it would be a clear sign that I don't consider her to be attractive.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:30 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MamaInTheBoonies
So, you have held onto this since you were 16 years old. How can you say it is not a rash decision made by a child?
Why haven't you spent those years loving your breasts/body for what they are/have become?
Umm, because A) I became a parent at 15 years old, and a good parent, not some juvinile who was out acting like a child. And B) because I've done a ton of research and soul searching in the years since becoming a parent and have come to the reasonable decision that I don't want to spend the rest of my life trying to safety pin my clothing together so that they fit me properly. I have not done it yet because I knew that I would have more children. Now that I am done having children I am looking at it more strongly. As an adult TODAY I can say that I do not like the way my breasts look. I do not like the way my clothing fits me.

I haven't spent the last 15 years hating my body. I don't cover up my body or hide in shame. I do love my body and what it's become. I also love my hair, but I change it whenever I see fit. That's much more cosmetic than getting my breasts done. I see getting my breasts done as a much more necessary issue than cutting and coloring my hair.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:31 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Sharlla
I don't think women who have small or average size breasts don't have "real breasts" they are just the norm. Most thin/average size women don't have a DD cup, they have a B or C cup. And even plus size clothes accomodate the larget breasts ie a size 2X shirt would fit a 40DD breasted woman just fine.
I have to agree with this. I'm smaller, perhaps, than average, but I'm 5'3, 120-125ish normally (no idea how much I weigh right now) and a 34B.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by stellimamo
How can you say that she hasn't spent the last 14 years meditating about if it is the right decision for her.
I can't. That is why I asked the question.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:33 PM
 
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Where's that peddling smile?
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:34 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MamaInTheBoonies
Wow! That is harsh. I don't think instilling a strong sense of self-confidence/self-worth creates a freak. Then again, this freak (me) loves shining bright.
My kids all have a very strong sense of self-confidence and self-worth as well. They also cut/color their hair and shave their legs. I also put braces on them so that they had straight teeth. : I let them do those things not because I think them unattractive otherwise, but because it's what they want to do and if they have a desire to fit in and not stick out like a sore thumb, who am I to tell them that they must? However, if they want to stick out like a sore thumb, great! Who am I to tell them that they can't? My kids shine brightly. "Conforming" to sociatal norms has not prevented that from happening.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by wende
because I've done a ton of research and soul searching in the years since becoming a parent and have come to the reasonable decision that I don't want to spend the rest of my life trying to safety pin my clothing together so that they fit me properly.
Why didn't you spend those years learning how to sew/design your own clothing? Seems less risky and more confident to design your own clothes than to alter your breasts to fit in pre-made clothes.

FWIW, I don't know how to sew, but my mom and Aunt do, and I have had them make my clothes, so, maybe I am used to it.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:40 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MamaInTheBoonies
Why didn't you spend those years learning how to sew/design your own clothing? Seems less risky and more confident to design your own clothes than to alter your breasts to fit in pre-made clothes.

FWIW, I don't know how to sew, but my mom and Aunt do, and I have had them make my clothes, so, maybe I am used to it.
Because I have better things to do with my time. Like hanging out on a message board arguing with people about my right to do whatever I want with my own body. :

Also, like I said, it's not ONLY about fitting into clothes properly. That's the main reason, but also because I personally don't like the way my breasts have changed. I don't like what pregnancy and nursing did to my teeth either so those will also change.

I have tattoos. Those are a permanant body modification. I've never had anyone make such a huge stink about those as they have about my decision to get breast implants. It's all so silly really, trying to convince a total stranger about what he or she should do with her own body.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:51 PM
 
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I voted no, but I think that in the case of a serious unibrow or something it would be okay. I would strongly discourage my daughter (at any age really) from getting her eyebrows shaped just to make them "perfect".

Of course, I rarely shave, have never waxed anything. and have no problem (anymore) with my saggy pendulous breasts...

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Old 07-31-2006, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by wende
Because I have better things to do with my time. Like hanging out on a message board arguing with people about my right to do whatever I want with my own body. : It's all so silly really, trying to convince a total stranger about what he or she should do with her own body.
My apologies if you felt that I was trying to change your mind. I wasn't. I was just trying to understand why you wouldn't research alternatives. Now, I understand. Thank you for responding to my questions. Again, I am sorry if they offended you.
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Old 07-31-2006, 06:54 PM
 
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What made you assume that I'd not researched alternatives? Contrary to popular beliefs, humans are not as stupid as we appear.
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Old 07-31-2006, 07:01 PM - Thread Starter
 
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wende...I am not trying to change your mind at all. I am talking about society in general. Why is it that young (and 11 really is young) girls feel the need to change the way they look. Thats really what I was asking. It is sad to me to think of some beautiful girl going and waxing any part of her body when, really, her body is just so new.

And I am also surprised that here on what is a Natural family living site, people would be condoning hair removal and breast implants for anyone. What is natural about breat implants? Also, why would anyone subject themselves to elective surgery. Surgery cannot be good for your body. Having foreign objects in your body cannot be good. FWIW, I feel the same way about LASIK. I wouldn't do it. I think we are supposed to mess with our bodies as little as possible and I am a little surprised that more people at this site don't agree.

I am not being snarky, and I am not judging anyone. I am stating my own feelings.
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Old 07-31-2006, 07:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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also, what if you had an accidental pregnancy after you modified your breasts and weren't able to nurse?
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Old 07-31-2006, 07:06 PM
 
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Originally Posted by wende
I have tattoos. Those are a permanant body modification. I've never had anyone make such a huge stink about those as they have about my decision to get breast implants. It's all so silly really, trying to convince a total stranger about what he or she should do with her own body.
There's a big difference between tattoos and breast implants, IMO. Firstly, as long as disposable needles are used in a sterile tattoo studio, the risks are pretty much nil (or very very extremely low). Not so with breast implants, at all.

I wish I still had all my graphic links to share with you (I might have shared them on MDC before) but there are very real risks to getting breast implants. Even saline implants are encased in silicone, which makes soooo many women very sick. Even plastic surgeons and breast implant manufacturers suggest that breast implants be replaced every ten years, so someone who gets breast implants should be planning to be able to afford multiple surgeries for the rest of their lives, assuming ALL GOES WELL.

So let's budget $2500-4000 every ten years (assuming everything is hunky dory and no extra surgeries are needed), that's $250-400 a year spent on breast implant surgery...not even including any time off work, etc., and this money could INSTEAD be spent on TAILORS altering all of your clothing to make it fit better, to personalize it and tailor it to your particular body type.

No health risks, no downtime, and no toxic silicone injected into your precious vessel.

I know what it's like to have trouble finding clothes to fit. I have always had extremely large breasts for my frame. It was extremely embarrassing to be flat at the beginning of age 12 then to grow to a D before I turned 13 and still be less than 100 lbs. Back then, I couldn't even find a "d" bra to save my life, except for the rare granny bra which didn't even fit my breasts either.

It's probably actually convenient for me that I live in a country where breast implants are so much more common as D and DD and F and G bras are so much easier to find, even so, I will try on 30 bras to get one that fits. Every time. Then I order 5 of them in different colors, or in the same color, since who knows if that bra will even be manufactured the next time I go to shop (they rarely are). And that is not even mentioning tops, dresses, etc. I have certainly never found a spaghetti strap dress that actually fits me. Bathing suits were so hard before they came out with mix-and-match and tankinis, because my top size would be many sizes larger than my bottom size. Just because I had large breasts did not mean I was plus size, that's for sure.

Anyway, I LOVE my body. My body has grown and nourished and held and cuddled my beloved family and I wouldn't do anything to change it (even though it'd be heavenly to not have to try on 20 cute shirts to find one that fits - if there even is one). I am sad that others haven't been able to find that kind of contentment with their bodies.

On the other hand, I do shave some parts of my body but haven't always. It's definitely a societal thing that leads me to want to do it. I admit that.
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Old 07-31-2006, 07:07 PM
 
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Originally Posted by numom499
wende...I am not trying to change your mind at all. I am talking about society in general. Why is it that young (and 11 really is young) girls feel the need to change the way they look. Thats really what I was asking. It is sad to me to think of some beautiful girl going and waxing any part of her body when, really, her body is just so new.

And I am also surprised that here on what is a Natural family living site, people would be condoning hair removal and breast implants for anyone. What is natural about breat implants? Also, why would anyone subject themselves to elective surgery. Surgery cannot be good for your body. Having foreign objects in your body cannot be good. FWIW, I feel the same way about LASIK. I wouldn't do it. I think we are supposed to mess with our bodies as little as possible and I am a little surprised that more people at this site don't agree.

I am not being snarky, and I am not judging anyone. I am stating my own feelings.
My 11yo is really not all that young. I mean, I just have a hard time seeing her as a little girl these days, as much as I'd like to. It's not as if we're advocating permanent cosmetic procedures for a little girl, we are accepting that our almost teenaged daughters are wanting a simple brow wax. If they decide that they liked the way they looked better before, the brows will grow back. I don't see what the big deal is.

What's natural about coloring ones hair, or wearing eye glasses or contacts? What's natural about porceline veneers or dentures? What's natural about having hip replacement surgery? What's natural about tubes in ears? What's natural about oxygen tanks? What's natural about sitting in front of a computer and driving a car? What's natural about tattoos and body piercings? There are lots of things that aren't natural that we accept every single day. Why is this any different?
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Old 07-31-2006, 07:07 PM
 
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Originally Posted by wende
It's much more appropriate to teach our daughters to be so anti-conformist that they spend their lives being the freak down the street.


I'm guessing that on MDC, we have a large percentage (half even? LOL) of self-confessed freaks and this comment just wreaks of hilariousness. : : : : : :
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Old 07-31-2006, 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by numom499
And I am also surprised that here on what is a Natural family living site, people would be condoning hair removal and breast implants for anyone. What is natural about breat implants? Also, why would anyone subject themselves to elective surgery. Surgery cannot be good for your body. Having foreign objects in your body cannot be good. FWIW, I feel the same way about LASIK. I wouldn't do it. I think we are supposed to mess with our bodies as little as possible and I am a little surprised that more people at this site don't agree.

I am not being snarky, and I am not judging anyone. I am stating my own feelings.
With me, My breasts are causing health problems. My core muscles can be as strong as steel, and have been, and my back is suffering anyway. I am waiting until I"m done nursing, but I WILL Get a reduction/Lift once everything is said and done. Call me vain, but I would MUCH rather have a proper strait spine when I hit 80 than be a twisted crippled wreck because of my breast weight.

And LASIK? If you KNEW how much I spent on glasses and contacts every two years, you'd realize that LASIK is acctually the most frugal long term solution for most peoples eye problems.

My glasses alone cost $200 without the frames. I get the cheapest frames and they still run me about $300 a pop. Hmm...For $1000 I could be glasses and contact free for LIFE.

So what if it's not natural to get Lasik, it's not natural to be blind as bat either. GLASSES aren't "Natural" but people like me need them to see.

My breasts need to be reduced. Plain and simple. I need glasses to see.

Call me "vain" Call me whatever you want. Judgement is one of those things that need to be flushed with the rest of someones bodily waste in the mornings....
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Old 07-31-2006, 07:10 PM
 
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Originally Posted by numom499
also, what if you had an accidental pregnancy after you modified your breasts and weren't able to nurse?
Honestly, at this point in my life if I were to have an accidental pregnancy I don't think that I'd continue the pregnancy. My body has decided that I shouldn't have more children and I'm listening. Plus, that's unlikely as I plan to have my tubes tied. Also unnatural.
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