Extreme depression, getting worse -- is it just the hormones? - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm feeling incredibly down lately, and it's getting progressively worse. I guess I'm just wondering if it's likely due to the pregnancy, or the fact that I'm exhausted and frustrated from dealing with my toddler's sleep issues and having extreme nursing aversion (see this thread and my other one in Breastfeeding Beyond Infancy if you like), or a combination of both. I spent half an hour this morning sobbing uncontrollably while my daughter watched Curious George in another room -- I hate her watching television, but I didn't know what else to do, I felt like I was losing my mind. I don't remember feeling like this with my first pregnancy, except in the first trimester -- I'm well out of my first trimester, so I can't understand why it's getting so bad right now. I'm planning to talk to my midwife about it today at my appointment, if I can (it's hard to talk about these things since I'll have my toddler in the room with me), but I was just wondering if anyone else is going through the same thing.

ETA: I should add that I've been struggling with depression for as long as I can remember (as in, I remember having days when I couldn't bring myself to get out of bed and face the day at the age of 3). But my first pregnancy was a time of euphoria, with the exception of 2 or 3 weeks in the first trimester. I'm just very confused as to why it's so bad right now.
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#2 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 11:25 AM
 
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I don't have any advice just wanted to drop a line of support. I would definately talk to your midwife. Everyone needs a time out every now and then while pregnant or not. If that means that dd is watching tv for a little while then that's what it means. We have to remember to take care of ourselves too! I hope you are feeling better soon.
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#3 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 11:36 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for the support, Katie. I just wish I had some idea why it was this bad all of a sudden. I mean, I know that I'm under a lot of stress and there are a lot of things going on, but honestly, my first pregnancy was just as stressful, if not more so -- we were planning to move to another state (ended up moving when baby was 11 days old, and I'd never seen our house before the day we moved in because I was too pregnant to travel to see it), we were having marital problems, I was working my butt off, among other things, and yet I didn't have this severe depression. Anyway. I'm hoping my midwife can help a little bit, I'm just at a loss and I can't keep being this way. I have a daughter, I want to set a positive example for her.
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#4 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 11:59 AM
 
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I'm so there with you! My first 2 pregnancies were fine. And I never had PPD or anything, but now (as of 2 weeks ago), I'm on Zoloft!

Come to the Mental Health forum. There's lots of great info there. Your MW will probably suggest TONS of fish oil, B vitamin and some others. These are a great place to start because you can get relief fast.

Since you have a history of depression, having a "trigger" during pregnancy is very common. Also, most women who experience depression during pregnancy are likely to experience PPD. So, please don't ignore this!!!

If you have a back-up OB, you should probably discuss it with him/her as well. I sent my MW links to some of my threads on MDC because I knew I wouldn't be able to really talk to her about it. I also found a new counselor/therapist, and I'll be going to see her nearly weekly for a while.

You are NOT alone! Pregnancy depression is just about as common as PPD, but it just doesn't get the same kind of attention!
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#5 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 12:00 PM
 
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I'm just at a loss and I can't keep being this way. I have a daughter, I want to set a positive example for her.
The best example you can set for your daughter is to get help. She may not understand it now, but she will.
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#6 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 12:02 PM
 
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: there is help in the form of meds I had to take them my whole pg with ds. Tho I did stop them a few months before he was born so they would be out of his system when he was born. It is really hard not only on you but on the baby in their the stress affects them as well. Please get help.

 
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#7 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 12:06 PM
 
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I agree. You should seek help for this asap, because not only will your depression affect your little one, but it has effects on the developing fetus, as well. Studies have shown that it's less harmful to a fetus to be exposed to antidepressants than it is to be exposed to a mom who is depressed. I don't have the links, but I was just looking at this yesterday.

If you have struggled with depression in the past, you know how important it is to get help. Do it for yourself and your kids. Therapy is great, and I have found that it just helps to have SOMEBODY to really talk to once a week.

You can check out Postpartum Support International to find a therapist near you that deals with post and antenatal depression.

Best wishes to you. I know it's hard. I'm pregnant with a toddler to run after, too. And I've been dealing with preterm labor and other junk. We just put our dog to sleep and I have been having SUCH a rough time with that.

Just wanted to offer support.

Mom to two beautiful boys, now in school to be a therapist and help other women with PPD.  
 

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#8 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 12:06 PM - Thread Starter
 
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leewd, thank you. Crap, I'm crying again reading your post. I'm just so frustrated because I felt like I had a handle on things and now all of a sudden it's out of control. I'll hop over to the MH forum after I talk to my midwife this afternoon and see what she says, so I know what suggestions she has for me as well. Thank you for sharing your experience and support, it means a lot.

I know that a lot of the problem too is that I feel that I can't talk to anybody. My hsuband is SO stressed out with work, and I know he'd gladly listen and try to help but I can't put that on him so much right now, even though I have talked with him a little and he encourages me to talk more. I can't talk to my mom, because her first reaction is always, "Wean the baby! Let her CIO!" or something equally infuriating. I can't talk to my sisters, because they'll tell Mom. And I have no close friends here, since we just moved here last summer. Mind you, none of this is much different from how it was during my last pregnancy, but this time around it's a huge problem. Ugh.
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#9 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 12:10 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Wow, more posts as I was writing. The support means so much ladies. I know I need to find a therapist. I'm strongly against chemical medications, largely because of bad experiences with them in the past, so I'd like to avoid that if possible, but I was actually trying to find a therapist earlier in the summer when this started to happen. I do'nt know if people were on vacation or what, but I called 5 therapists and got no call back, and a sixth I had to cancel the appointment I had with her, and when I called to reschedule I couldnt' get an answer or a return call. Very frustrating. I did find out last week that my insurance offers "liaisons" that can help with that kind of situation, so I'll take advantage of that.
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#10 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 02:02 PM
 
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I'm strongly against chemical medications, largely because of bad experiences with them in the past, so I'd like to avoid that if possible,
In this case, your best route is nutritional and lifestyle.
Fish Oil with the highest EPA content you can find (usually 340-360 mg per softgel), and take as much of it as you can handle. I'm taking 8 per day (2880mg EPA) plus 2 Flax Oil (ALA, not EPA). Taking up to 4000 mg EPA has been shown to be helpful (although that's literally "hard to swollow").
B Vitamins in the middle of the day is good. And early morning exercise in the first morning sun can help to boost (or maybe just straighten out??) seratonin levels. As us may know, one of the S's in SSRI's is "seratonin," so helping to straighten out seratonin levels can make your brain function better.

There's a book that's mentioned a lot on the MH board called The Mood Cure. I haven't read it, but I've looked at their wedsite (moodcure.com???? - not sure, but you can find it if you do a search). It's all nutritional and you should see results within a few days.

In the end though, please don't be closed-minded about meds. They may be necessary. I'd never even considered them until some MDCers suggested it. For some reason, crying ALL day and having to leave work because I couldn't stop crying didn't strike me as something serious enough to require meds until others mentioned it. Sometimes we cannot see what's in front of our own faces.

Having my 3yo ask me if I'm crying or if I'm sad has been a real eye-opener for me. Sometimes she can articulate it better than I can.

Anyway, this is longer than I meant it to be. If you want to know more about my situation, you can search for posts by me on the MH board. I've posted things there that I never imagined I would post on a public forum . . .
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#11 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 02:23 PM
 
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I was TOTALLY against meds, too. But when I got to the point where I could not get out of bed and was convinced I was going to die every day... I knew I needed to get some help in the form of meds.

I totally respect your wanting to try something else, and hopefully that will work. Just know that there is nothing wrong with going to meds if they will help you get out of the black hole you are in.

There is a book, What your Dr. May not Tell you about Depression, that may help you, as well. Also there are workbooks for depression. I tried all of the above, plus fish oil, B complex, etc. and finally had to go for meds. Just my case, though.

Best wishes and hopefully you will come out of it with therapy and nutrition. Get LOTS of light, too.

Mom to two beautiful boys, now in school to be a therapist and help other women with PPD.  
 

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#12 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 02:26 PM
 
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I am on Prozac. I see a psych who was an OB/GYN for 25 years, so she specializes in pregnancy and postpartum depression. There are lots of new meds out there that can really help, if the natural stuff you try doesn't help. No shame in getting help, none at all.
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#13 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 03:52 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Well, I just got back from my midwife appointment. She was super helpful. She prescribed a new prenatal for me (one without a generic equivalent, so I could get the real thing, since my insurance insists on giving generics when possible and the one I'm on isn't working well), gave me some advice on supplements to take and things to work on, and is getting me some information on therapists that I can see that might be willing to waive the co-pay, since we really can't afford it. I'd go anyway, but it would be better if I don't make us go broke for it. She said that we need to find a way to get me more sleep, which is a big duh, but I don't know how that's going to happen -- but whatever. I was glad that she was so willing to help, and she said that anytime I feel like I need to come in just to call and they'll squeeze me in for a talk appointment. So I'm feeling better. A bit embarrassed that I totally lost it in the office telling her what's going on, but that goes with the territory and it's ok.

As far as the meds go, I know there's no shame in taking them, I just don't want to go that route. Like I said, I've had bad experiences and want to avoid that if I can. My sister is currently taking meds for depression as well, and she has had a really hard time finding one that worked without making her crazy and/or lethargic -- and then she found one that worked, but now her body is getting used to it and it's not working anymore, and she has to find something else. I jsut really want to try to fix it naturally so I don't have to go through that again.
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#14 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 03:59 PM
 
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I'm glad you talked to your MW.
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#15 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 04:08 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by leewd View Post
In this case, your best route is nutritional and lifestyle.
Fish Oil with the highest EPA content you can find (usually 340-360 mg per softgel), and take as much of it as you can handle. I'm taking 8 per day (2880mg EPA) plus 2 Flax Oil (ALA, not EPA). Taking up to 4000 mg EPA has been shown to be helpful (although that's literally "hard to swollow").
B Vitamins in the middle of the day is good.
EPA? ALA? What does that mean? And I know that there is some issue with one of the B vitamins (as in, it's possible to OD on it), but I don't know which one or how to avoid that -- what is a good place to start with the B's?
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#16 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 05:16 PM
 
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EPA, ALA, and DHA are in the oils that contain "Omega 3 fatty acids." EPA and DHA are now in baby formula because they're good for developing brains, brain function, etc.

EPA is the one that's good for depression.

ALA is also good in general. I started taking Flax Seed Oil (ALA, not EPA) because Fish Oil is hard for me to tolerate. After all my problems starting creaping in, I sucked it up and now I'm downing the Fish Oil.

As for B vitamins, my MW has me taking a children's chewable with lunch. This probably isn't the best source, but it's cheap and readily available in a house with preschoolers running around like my own

DH's Psych recommended a liquid B Complex with Folate that you squirt under your tongue. I haven't had a chance to look into it yet. I'm not sure if this would be good for PG me or just for bipolar2 DH who's on meds that will depleat the vitamins in his body . . .

There's a lady on the MH board called AnyMama. She is VERY knowledgeable about this stuff! Also, there are threads call "I'm confused about Fish Oil/EPA/Omega 3" and stuff like that you can look at.
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#17 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 11:01 PM
 
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Queenbean, I am so glad you spoke with your midwife about this. You are so worth the effort, to be a priority in your life, to take care of yourself. Raising the flag to in the MW office is a good way of saying "Hey, I need help here!" You are important enough, and you matter, I hope you get some help. Seems like a good place to start to have the insurance carrier 'liaison' and help in getting a counselling appointment. After 6 tries (honestly, who could blame you for needing a break from trying!!??!?!?) using someone else's help is not a bad idea!

I too have struggled with depression throughout my life and have just started a super low dose of Prozac. I had bad experiences in the past with a couple of meds and was very reluctant for many, many years to try again. However, being a mother to one, and now with another on the way, I felt like it was getting serious enough that I need more help before adding a new 'stressor' to the picture (a newborn, etc.). My midwife said that if you have a history of depression, and are adding a second baby to the picture, you are setting yourself up for MAJOR depression. I seem to be very sensitive to meds, and the psychiatrist I met with LISTENED...she prescribed a course of 2 mg/day/1 week, 5 mg/day/1wk, 7 mg/day/1wk, 10mg/day/1wk. It may go up from there. So far I am still in the 2 mg phase and have felt NO side effects whatsoever. Of course this is a SUPER low dose. But this is a miracle to me, given what I've experienced taking one 37.5 mg of Effexor and no more because it was so unpleasant! I'm just saying all this to give an example that maybe there is a slow, gentle way to introduce meds in the future, if that is an option you want to revisit at some point. I was just reading that you are a good candidate for meds if [insert numerous factors here which include:] you have a family member who was successfully treated by meds, you have had repeated bouts of depression, are feeling suicidal (and other things I can't remember). I can say that I really understand how reluctant you feel to try meds again when you've had bad experiences.

I have also had periods where I've said to myself, "I've had way more stress in my life than this? Why am I getting sick (like a time I got shingles)/or feeling down now?" Flare ups during pregnancy -- your body is different chemically during the second pregnancy than it was during the first. So who knows? So many factors.

It's not uncommon for PPD to 'start' during pregnancy. So please continue to try to get the support and help you need. Perhaps the supplements, a strict dietary regiment (nutritious, whole foods, cut out junk/refined sugars/caffeine/etc), more sleep, and psychotherapy/counselling will provide some improvement. It also strikes me that more social stimulation would be a happy thing. Are there any Moms Groups you could attend? It sucks to be cut off socially. Any moms you can talk to who understand IRL? Keep coming here to vent too, of course!

You mentioned dh being under a lot of stress. Does that stress you out? Does he need some of his own support? I wonder if he might spend some time or energy getting some of what he needs, given his stress.

On a practical level, do you have some ideas for dealing with your toddler's sleep issues? Sorry, I haven't read the nursing aversion thread but I hope some people have had helpful suggestions in there.

Sorry this is so long! Take care of yourself and keep us posted.

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#18 of 23 Old 09-05-2007, 11:22 PM
 
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I was right there with you a few days ago. I had crazy mood swings and it was just horrible. I felt ok and then I'd just break down and cry. I was sad and angry, it was just really horrible (and I'm normally a passionate person so it isn't like I was feeling an emotion and overreacting or something). I told my midwife about my feelings, going into more detail than I am here, and she told me to get evening primrose. I am very against meds, I will use them but only as a last resort. She takes a very natural approach with everything so that's why she recommended an herb. The change is amazing. No more crying jags, no wanting to scream and yell and hit something. I don't feel so... Horrible all the time. I still have upsets and things but I can deal with them like a person as opposed to the monster-like feelings I had before. I'm also taking fish oil, a b vitamin complex and sometimes skullcap (contractions) and I'm not sure how those play into it. But the evening primrose has changed ME. I can't explain it better than that but I feel so much better and so much closer to who I was before pregnancy. The feelings just really threw me this time, I didn't experience this with my previous pregnancies. I was in a hole, thinking I would never feel better... I just can't emphasize how much good this herb did for me.

Ok that long gush was basically to say, ask your midwife about evening primrose. I bought mine in a local natural store, Whole Foods might have it too. It was only about $5. I hope you feel better soon!

ETA: Just saw that you asked about the B vitamins. My midwife recommended a simple B complex taken once a day. It includes folic acid (the one I got anyway). She said the important thing was to take it only once a day.

Mama to two boys and a girl.
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#19 of 23 Old 09-06-2007, 02:17 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for the suggestions. We have to go to the store today (we're out of food) so I'll pick up a B complex and get started on that. Crap, I forgot to take my flaxseed oil with lunch... gotta do that. Anyway. Today's better, but I get the feeling that it's not going to last. I think that all the bawling I did yesterday helped release some of the pressure, but it didn't make it really go away.

If my daughter ever wakes up, we'll go outside for a while this afternoon. We were supposed to go to playgroup, but she started her nap late and is still napping 2 hours later! I shouldn't be surprised -- the nights have been rough on her since I'm trying to get her to stop night nursing, and last night she woke up at 4 and my husband went to get her. She didn't cry, but she decided it was play time and was up for an hour and a half. Then we all woke up at 7 like normal. So she's bound to be tired today -- I figured though that she'd nap earlier and we could go to playgroup. Oh well. Anyway, I *think* we're on the road to ending the night nursing, which hopefully means we're on the road to her sleeping better in general, so maybe there's a light at the end of the tunnel in that respect. I could sure use the rest. She doesn't like that I won't let her nurse at night, but she didn't get as angry last night, so hopefully it won't be much longer before she'll accept regular snuggles with me. Snuggles I can do.
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#20 of 23 Old 09-06-2007, 04:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm getting a really warm welcome over there in MH. I think my post is too long. I talk too much. Ah well. Somebody will eventually be bored enough to read the whole thing and talk to me.
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#21 of 23 Old 09-06-2007, 10:50 PM
 
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#22 of 23 Old 09-07-2007, 10:38 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Anybody want to send me enough money to hire a live-in nanny for a week so I can get some sleep? I'd probably be a LOT less crabby if I could sleep for a couple of nights. Last night was pretty terrible. But at least she didn't insist on nursing, so maybe we're making some progress. But she got up three times and now we've been awake since 5. Urg.

I'm gonna buy chocolate today and eat lots of it.
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#23 of 23 Old 09-07-2007, 11:34 AM
 
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me too! me too!

I've been working PT for the last 3 weeks, and I'm STILL not getting enough sleep! I think I'll just go back to FT, since it's not making a difference

--LEE
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