The big HP and the Deathly Hallows thread! *Contains spoilers* - Page 13 - Mothering Forums

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#361 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:08 AM
 
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Not gonna even TRY to read this whole thread....LOL...just popping in to say finished it earlier this evening, loved it, gonna read it again. So happy Harry, Hermione, and Ron live, even though Fred died which sucked. Loved the "19 years later" chapter. Very gratifying. Was totally in the "Harry is a horcrux" camp and the "Harry is gonna die" camp. Pleasantly surprised when he died but didn't die.

WTG, JKR.
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#362 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:09 AM
 
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Well, actually they were three brothers that got the three items originally. They would have all been Peverells.. so theoretically, Harry or Voldy could have been inherited any or all ..

Did it say where Dumbledore's buddy got the wand?
When Voldemort goes to Gregorovich, he sees a memory of Grindelvald stealing it from Gregorovich.
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#363 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:10 AM
 
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You forgot Colin Creevey. Poor little nosy sweet guy. He was mentioned along with Lupin, Tonks, Fred, and "50 others" as having died during the battle.
okey, doke. Thanks! Off to fix.
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#364 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:11 AM
 
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Well, actually they were three brothers that got the three items originally. They would have all been Peverells.. so theoretically, Harry or Voldy could have been inherited any or all ..

Did it say where Dumbledore's buddy got the wand?
He was the "merry faced thief" who stole the Elder Wand from Gregorovitch.
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#365 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:12 AM
 
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The only part that made me cry was when everyone starting giving items of clothing to Dobby's body, so he could be buried in them. <sniff>
Yea, that was such a touching moment.

Why King's Cross during Harry's death experience? DD has to ask him where they are, says something like "it's YOUR party," and is amused when Harry tells him where they are. Is it because in Harry's world the most logical place to house a transition from life to heaven (for lack of a better word) is the place that takes him to his heaven-ON-earth (Hogwarts)?

Not the way I would have put it, but yes, that's the general idea I got. He was at a crossroads which I think translates to a train station nicely. (Sorry, I can't do double quotes!)
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#366 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:17 AM - Thread Starter
 
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OK, here's a question--
If Ted Tonks is a Muggle, how did he fix up Harry's ribs and teeth and arms after the big flight and fight? Or did he just mean he threw some bandaids on it and gave Harry an aspirin?

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#367 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:17 AM
 
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When Voldemort goes to Gregorovich, he sees a memory of Grindelvald stealing it from Gregorovich.
Yup. Then Dumbledore wins it from Grindelvald when he defeats him.

The legend of the Elder Wand is that it was passed on through defeat of the previous owner. So tracing it back to the original Peverell would be impossible. But... if I had to guess, I would guess that Dumbledore was the descendant of the third Peverell brother.

Interesting line of thought... the powers conferred by the three hallows were power (wand), reviving the dead (stone), and escape from death (cloak). Compare those to their holders in the current generation. As we learned in this book, Dumbledore had issues with craving power. He held the wand. Voldemort devised ways to revive himself after death. He held the stone. Harry only wanted to live a quiet life. The cloak was held by the brother who wanted to go through life quietly and for a long time, then die on his own terms. He was the one who wasn't greedy, like Harry.
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#368 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:18 AM
 
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OK, here's a question--
If Ted Tonks is a Muggle, how did he fix up Harry's ribs and teeth and arms after the big flight and fight? Or did he just mean he threw some bandaids on it and gave Harry an aspirin?
He's muggle-BORN, not a muggle.
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#369 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:21 AM
 
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OK, here's a question--
If Ted Tonks is a Muggle, how did he fix up Harry's ribs and teeth and arms after the big flight and fight? Or did he just mean he threw some bandaids on it and gave Harry an aspirin?
For that matter, why was he on the lam? They weren't arresting and trying Muggles, they were arresting Muggle-born wizards. I got the impression in this book that he was a Muggle-born wizard; but that contradicts Tonks' statement in OOTP that he was simply a Muggle.
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#370 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:24 AM
 
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whew! ok, i just read 375 posts, and it was more exhausting than reading the book!

dh totally took over yesterday to give me the whole day of reading. dd was less than thrilled, but i had been preparing her for weeks & she was, thankfully, a pretty good sport about me being totally tuned out for the day!

i was so proud of neville- he really came into his own!

very very very glad about snape. my fingers were crossed but i kept wavering. (sorry, severus!)

i was so sad about dobby and fred. those hit me very hard.

i assumed George would've gotten the honor of naming a child after Fred. Seems fitting.

i honestly didn't see Ron & Hermione staying together happily ever after. i thought it would be a "thing" and they'd get over it. eh.

overall, i was pretty satisfied. even with the epilogue : i would've read another 750 pages, so it's not like i wouldn't have liked more info! but all in all, i'm feeling content
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#371 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:25 AM
 
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I don't remember Lucius' wand description, although it may have had dragon heartstring as well.

It's in chapter one when Voldemort takes his wand

Not all those who wander are lost 
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#372 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:25 AM
 
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For that matter, why was he on the lam? They weren't arresting and trying Muggles, they were arresting Muggle-born wizards. I got the impression in this book that he was a Muggle-born wizard; but that contradicts Tonks' statement in OOTP that he was simply a Muggle.
From Order of the Phoenix:
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Oh, yeah, her mother Andromeda was my favourite cousin,' said Sirius, examining the tapestry closely. 'No, Andromeda's not on here either, look -'
He pointed to another small round burn mark between two names, Bellatrix and Narcissa.
'Andromeda's sisters are still here because they made lovely, respectable pure-blood marriages, but Andromeda married a Muggle-born, Ted Tonks, so -'
Sirius mimed blasting the tapestry with a wand and laughed sourly. Harry, however, did not laugh; he was too busy staring at the names to the right of Andromeda's burn mark.
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#373 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:28 AM
 
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Well, Neville took it - not Harry.
Yeah, but he still broke in! They seem to frown upon that.
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#374 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:31 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Wow. They are updating The Lexicon already. Now that's dedication.

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#375 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:36 AM
 
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I loved the book. Finished it a few hours ago and am now trying to hurry DH through it so I can talk about it (he's on ch 5!). DH got mad whenever I laughed or cried or reacted to the book at all because he didn't want it ruined for him so I felt a bit inhibited in my reactions-- plus DS kept asking me to put down "that book" and read him a different one!

I agree with a lot of people's reactions, but I did like the epilogue-- definitely cheesy, but it was nice to see them all happy at the end and see life as "normal". I wanted to know if Harry became an auror, though! (was that even still an option without finishing school??). I'm also happy that it seems clear that there won't be any "future" books about Harry-- it bugs me when authors draw out their stories forever and they get weaker and weaker-- better to end on a strong note and with 7 books as planned all along (much as I'll miss them all!).

One of the only things that I didn't like about the book was that I wanted Ginny to have a bigger role. She's one of my favorite characters and it really bugged me that her mother was once again treating her like a baby when she was only a year younger than all the others who were fighting. Plus I wanted to see her and Harry fighting side by side as equals like he always did with Ron and Hermione.

I LOVED the Hogwarts battle-- it was so cool that all the professors and students voluntarily took up arms to defend the school.

Dobby's death was the saddest one in the book, I think-- though I was really shocked by Fred's death.

I think it was totally justified for Tonks and Lupin to leave their baby to fight... Tonks was, after all, an auror, one of the few trained to handle this sort of battle and the fight was for the future of everyone, including their baby... I don't see how she could have skipped the battle. It was so sad that they both died, though.

I loved the Snape background and thought it complemented book 6 really well considering I thought he was rather lacking from that book in spite of the fact that it had him in the title!

I was satisfied with the ending battle with Voldemort and I loved that Neville was the one to kill Nagini. I liked that Harry, Dumbledore, Ron, Hermione, and Neville all got to dispatch one Horcrux each.

I did feel a bit skeptical about Harry being a Horcrux himself... does that mean that V's soul was actually split in 8 pieces? (diary, ring, necklace, cup, diadem, snake, Harry, and his own piece? or did V no longer have any soul?). I have a ready suspension of disbelief, though, so I was ok with this being a bit unclear.

The only parts of the book that I did not think were wonderful were the wedding (seemed unnecessary and out of place to spend so much time on that occasion in the midst of all that was going on) and I thought there was a bit too much time spent setting up tents and moving from one place to another in the woods. Once that part was done it moved along nicely.

I really thought Rowling wrapped up all the loose ends and did an amazing job considering it was a 7 book series written over so many years. I had been worried that it would seem to be thrown together at the last minute, but it seemed to me to be well thought out. I feel sad that their story is over, but I can't wait to read it again! Plus this really helped me kill time and stop thinking about the fact that my baby is a week "overdue" today...

Mommy to two boys, ages 4 and 6.

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#376 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:37 AM
 
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All your wands are belong to us.


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The only part that made me cry was when everyone starting giving items of clothing to Dobby's body, so he could be buried in them. <sniff>
Me too. I was SO over Dobby.

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Interesting line of thought... the powers conferred by the three hallows were power (wand), reviving the dead (stone), and escape from death (cloak). Compare those to their holders in the current generation. As we learned in this book, Dumbledore had issues with craving power. He held the wand. Voldemort devised ways to revive himself after death. He held the stone. Harry only wanted to live a quiet life. The cloak was held by the brother who wanted to go through life quietly and for a long time, then die on his own terms. He was the one who wasn't greedy, like Harry.
This was very interesting.
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#377 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:39 AM
 
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Re: Harry becoming an Auror, and Harry getting back into his Gringotts vault. Er... Harry was no longer merely the Boy who Lived, or the Chosen One. He was the guy who killed Voldemort! I think the Wizarding world would have gilded every square of his toilet paper for him if he'd asked them to. Of course they would have made him an Auror if he wanted. And I think they would have put considerable pressure on the goblins to overlook his transgression.

Anyway... the goblins may well have been impressed with the fact that he succeeded
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#378 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:41 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I loved the death and resurrection imagery in this book. I almost wonder if one of the reasons she didn't have Harry completely die was so she wouldn't tick off Christians by making him too much of a Christ figure? Just a thought.

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#379 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:53 AM
 
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Now, the Secret Keeper was changed only shortly before the event. So it would make sense that at the time of the letter, Sirius was still Secret Keeper and DD knew the location of the house.
I don't think sirius was ever the secret keeper for the potters. In POA it just states that at the last minute Sirus conviced James to change to using Petigrew. I always assumed that just meant shortly before the spell was performed not that they changed an already completed spell.


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Also, what happens to a Fidelius charm when the secret becomes obsolete? That could explain why the house in Godric's Hollow became visible after Harry left it. But then, wouldn't 12 Grimmauld become visible (at least to Wizards) after the Order vacated it as their hq? Then again, the secret for that charm might have been worded in a more complex manner: for instance, hiding the entire existence of 12 Grimmauld, not merely hiding the fact that the Order is hq-ing there. That would explain DD's comment that Voldemort could press his nose against the glass at the Godric's Hollow house and not see James and Lily. After all, if the GH house worked like 12 Grimmauld, Voldemort wouldn't even be able to see the house to press his nose against the glass.
Grimmuald place also had other protection's that surius's father had placed upon it. Making it unplottable and all the things wizards can do to protect their house from other wizards as well as muggles, so there was more protecting it that just the fidelius charm -- which will explain some of the differences. It also depends what the secret is the the keeper is hiding I would think the charm is "the magical concealment of a secret inside a single living soul" (POA American ed pg 205) So if the secret Pettigrew was keeping had to do somehow with the location of the people (Lily, James) rather than the location of the house itself the house would be visible. You just wouldn't see/hear the people inside --- I thinkit would all depend on the wording/nature of the secret.

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But, the cloak thing is a time discontinuity. If Lily's telling Sirius that James had given DD the cloak back around the time of Harry's birthday, why is DD telling Harry James had lent it to him a few days before he died? Why would DD be keeping it from James for three months?
maybe it took longer to study than he expected?
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#380 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:54 AM
 
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One of the only things that I didn't like about the book was that I wanted Ginny to have a bigger role. She's one of my favorite characters and it really bugged me that her mother was once again treating her like a baby when she was only a year younger than all the others who were fighting. Plus I wanted to see her and Harry fighting side by side as equals like he always did with Ron and Hermione.
I think Mrs. Weasley is overprotective of Ginny because she is the girl.. As a mother of 5 SONS, I know that dh and I would be the same way if we had a girl.. probably not right, but natural, I think..

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I think it was totally justified for Tonks and Lupin to leave their baby to fight... Tonks was, after all, an auror, one of the few trained to handle this sort of battle and the fight was for the future of everyone, including their baby... I don't see how she could have skipped the battle. It was so sad that they both died, though.

Very true. I also think if I had been in her shoes, I would have joined the battle too. If her dh dies, she would think that MAYBE things could have turned out differently HAD she been there for the rest of her life, etc..

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I loved the Snape background and thought it complemented book 6 really well considering I thought he was rather lacking from that book in spite of the fact that it had him in the title!
Me, too!

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I was satisfied with the ending battle with Voldemort and I loved that Neville was the one to kill Nagini. I liked that Harry, Dumbledore, Ron, Hermione, and Neville all got to dispatch one Horcrux each.

I did feel a bit skeptical about Harry being a Horcrux himself... does that mean that V's soul was actually split in 8 pieces? (diary, ring, necklace, cup, diadem, snake, Harry, and his own piece? or did V no longer have any soul?). I have a ready suspension of disbelief, though, so I was ok with this being a bit unclear.
Dumbledore said something about Harry being #7... so I don't think Voldy counts..

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The only parts of the book that I did not think were wonderful were the wedding (seemed unnecessary and out of place to spend so much time on that occasion in the midst of all that was going on) and I thought there was a bit too much time spent setting up tents and moving from one place to another in the woods. Once that part was done it moved along nicely.
I never understood that part either, except that Xeno had to be dressed up for SOMETHING to wear the pin.. and harry had to get some background info.. I never got the part about the tiara though..

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I really thought Rowling wrapped up all the loose ends and did an amazing job considering it was a 7 book series written over so many years. I had been worried that it would seem to be thrown together at the last minute, but it seemed to me to be well thought out. I feel sad that their story is over, but I can't wait to read it again! Plus this really helped me kill time and stop thinking about the fact that my baby is a week "overdue" today...
I am absolutely DEPRESSED it is all over.. I need a new series (and fwiw, I did start a new thread a few weeks ago about what to do AFTER HP but I didn't get many responses- I need a new healthy addiction.. I mean, I can wait for the movies, and the theme park... but .. I have lost all my adrenaline I guess.. congrats on the baby.. (vibes)
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#381 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 12:54 AM
 
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I'm still frustrated that we don't know what happened the weeks, months, and years after the Battle at Hogwarts. I loved the battle scene itself- full Tolkienian glory with all the different creatures taking part!

But I'd like to know how George did after his twin's death. Did he keep the joke shop? Did Harry, Hermione, Ron, and/or Draco go back to Hogwart's the following year and do their 7th year the same time Ginny was doing her 7th year? Other than Neville, we don't know what careers they entered. Nor did we ever find out what Harry's parents did for a living.

Gah. I hope JKR answers these questions in interviews or puts them on her website or something. I don't want to wait until she feels like writing another book (she mentioned maybe writing an encylopedia of HP characters) to get answers!

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#382 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:03 AM
 
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maybe it took longer to study than he expected?
But doesn't DD tell Harry that James had given it to him a few days before the Potters' deaths?
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#383 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:09 AM
 
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I thought the Percy rejoining his family was a bit lame - he turned away from them for years - I thought something big would need to happen for him to rejoin them.
A declaration of war wasn't big enough? :

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OMG

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#384 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:09 AM
 
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maybe it took longer to study than he expected?
But doesn't DD tell Harry that James had given it to him a few days before the Potters' deaths?
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#385 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:11 AM
 
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OK, here's a question--
If Ted Tonks is a Muggle, how did he fix up Harry's ribs and teeth and arms after the big flight and fight? Or did he just mean he threw some bandaids on it and gave Harry an aspirin?
I just went to that lexicon you linked earlier.. I found the Black family tree, on it it says that Tonks is a muggle, but if you look below, the quotes say he is "muggle born"... Maybe he is the person that Jo was referring to about magic later in life?? not sure..

there was a passage in there somewhere about the original tree drawn by Jo was donated and auctioned, so it may be that Jo originally thought Tonks should be a muggle, but later decided on muggle born instead? Not sure if it is just a mistake on the lexicon as a misunderstanding of the text or if it was a change in plans from the original plan of the book to its actual writing..
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#386 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:12 AM
 
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But doesn't DD tell Harry that James had given it to him a few days before the Potters' deaths?
Maybe the birthday gift or the thank you note were late. Isn't that what we're basing this timeline on?

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#387 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:14 AM
 
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I just wanted to say that I think it is so sad that Snape loved Lilly so much and that she could not forgive him. I think that is so sweet and I don't know, just sad. It makes me cry.

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#388 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:15 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Ruthla View Post
I'm still frustrated that we don't know what happened the weeks, months, and years after the Battle at Hogwarts. I loved the battle scene itself- full Tolkienian glory with all the different creatures taking part!

But I'd like to know how George did after his twin's death. Did he keep the joke shop? Did Harry, Hermione, Ron, and/or Draco go back to Hogwart's the following year and do their 7th year the same time Ginny was doing her 7th year? Other than Neville, we don't know what careers they entered. Nor did we ever find out what Harry's parents did for a living.

Gah. I hope JKR answers these questions in interviews or puts them on her website or something. I don't want to wait until she feels like writing another book (she mentioned maybe writing an encylopedia of HP characters) to get answers!
Everything you said and did I miss out on who the new Headmaster is? Is Minerva still around? Sprout seems to have moved on. Was Teddy part wolf? And please, who married who beyond 3 couples (2.5 since Draco's wife wasn't named). And what about Harry's Grandparents? It seems James had parents when he was at Hogwarts and he and Lily were quite young still when they had Harry, so what happened? It was about time Percy caught on! (I was proud, but not as proud as I was for Neville!) And ew! the creature V becomes, just ew! And the Malfoys, I get that they can actually love their son, but I wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them! Does anyone think it would be fitting if the Dursleys survived and Dudley had a witch or wizard for a child?:
I cried and cried with dread and anticipation almost the entire book, and then more at the end! Today I looked like I'd lost a relative, eyes all puffy and bloodshot. DH keeps saying, "it's just a book!" he obviously doesn't get it! He should remember back to book 6 when I was pregnant and cried for hours.
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#389 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:23 AM
 
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Originally Posted by tboroson View Post
But doesn't DD tell Harry that James had given it to him a few days before the Potters' deaths?
Maybe Dumbledore considered 90 days to be "a few".

Ruth, single mommy to Leah, 19 (in Israel for another school year), Hannah, 18 (commuting to college), and Jack, 12(homeschooled)
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#390 of 1280 Old 07-23-2007, 01:25 AM
 
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Originally Posted by alaskanteach View Post
Madeye
Hegwid
Dobby
tonks
Lupin
Snape
Voldemort
Harry (questionable)
Fred
Pettigrew
Bellatrix
Fenrir?
Charity Burbage
Bathilda Bagshot
Colin Creevey

ok. here's a compilation.. I put "questionable" near Harry's name to appease all sides.. FWIW, I went back to that chapter to reread it, and Dumbledore says that harry was "killed" but they debate back and forth as to whether he is "dead"...

So, I guess I should have just made this a list of people that were "killed" rather than people that are "dead" although from a semantic sense, that doesn't really add up.. Personally I think he was dead, but chose to come back.. that follows with other literary "rebirths" for me..

so.. 13 or 14, right (depending on how you look at it) NAMED characters..
Gregorovitch (or at least it's implied)
Crabbe
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