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#61 of 237 Old 12-01-2008, 05:27 PM
 
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I have only the last book to go - woohoo. My mental obsession will finally end.

I agree that they are addictive, in fact, I was "jonesing' so bad for the 4th I had to go online and read a spoiler just so I wouldnt drop everything obsess about the book instead of family this week.

Cant wait to get the emotion of the book though!!
: BD comes into the library for me tomorrow and I can't wait! but i'm also a little sad for it to be all over too.






SPOILERS!










Ok, I see why people think Edward is controlling but I think Jake is the worse choice for Bella. I understand that she could "see" her life with Jake, but I took that as the way anyone can picture their life with someone else than the person they are with. My issue with Jake is that he was constantly forcing himself on Bella and yes she was sending mixed signals but still, the forced kisses and the mind games he played on her seemed really extreme to me. Yes Edward left her, but to protect her and when he realized how badly it had changed Bella he came back and swore not to leave again. I think Bella used Jacob and sent him mixed signals throughout the story (I've got Book 4 to go) and Jacob knew that and tried to use her guilt to his advantage.

Edward wanted to protect her and keep her from going places where she could get hurt but he never tried to convince her to love him, she always did and knew it. Jacob is sore loser who doesn't play fair IMO. Also, I always thought that Bella truly loved Edward. Though she loved Jacob it wasn't the same type of love at all and to compare them just didn't make sense to me.

What about the imprinting? I hate to admit it, but I'd be seriously worried about that. Imagine if Bella had chosen Jacob and then he imprinted on someone else? (which I believe he does in the 4th book right?) So she'd have this life with him and then he'd be in love with someone else the way that she was in love with Edward.

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#62 of 237 Old 12-02-2008, 03:47 AM
 
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I just got to the Bella view point of Breaking Dawn. I read the first three books in four days or so, but I've been on this last one for about four days. I don't want it to end, as silly as that sounds!

I didn't like the viewpoint of Jacob much. It was necessary, I think, for the imprinting scene and to understand him, but she wasted a lot of good book with his point of view. I would have enjoyed an Edward point of view.

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#63 of 237 Old 12-02-2008, 08:57 AM
 
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I dont have a problem with the "negative role model" part of the book. As I see it, this is a FANTASY romance series. It's not just Edward who is more than human, their love is supernatural. To bind it with all the usual expectations lessens it.

I doubt that the majority of teenage girls will tolerate "vampire" characteristics in their boyfriends any more than I would start looking for a UPS guy to blow after watching Samantha do it in Sex in the City. And those who do, inlcluding women who are trapped in those situations, have many deeper reasons for it than a paranormal romance novel.
His controlling behavior and constant 'I'm trying not to hurt you physically even though I want to' is not a vampire only trait. I was looking at it more generally, the whole 'a man is so in love with me that even though he wants to hurt me, it's ok'. Remember that annoying 'he only hits you because he likes you' crap people tell little girls?

As for Samantha, ummm, no she isn't 'making' women do anything. It's more the general attitude & glorification of having lots of random unprotected (rarely a condom wrapper in sight) sex that's the problem.

Again, I don't think people are going to be hooked on specific actions, but the general intent behind them. And yes, I do think that having a constant supply of general themes (lots of random sex is good, men who control me want to protect me, if a man wants to hurt me it's because he loves me so much, etc) has an impact. I think the current popular culture of vapid status symbols, lots of sex/glorification of porn, materialism, consumerism is constantly coming through various media forms which 'normalizes' it. I'm tired of hearing & reading general story lines where a guy is controlling of his female significant other to 'protect' her. Am I making any sense?

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#64 of 237 Old 12-02-2008, 11:51 AM
 
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His controlling behavior and constant 'I'm trying not to hurt you physically even though I want to' is not a vampire only trait. I was looking at it more generally, the whole 'a man is so in love with me that even though he wants to hurt me, it's ok'.

I never saw Edward as the abusive boyfriend type. I think it is completely different. With an abusive boyfriend it is about anger and control. For Bella and Edward I think Meyers was trying to say that at any moment edward could kill Bella, that it was (for him as a vampire) the most natural and easy thing in the world to do, but because of the over powering love he felt for her he could resist his most basic needs.
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#65 of 237 Old 12-02-2008, 10:28 PM
 
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I guess I never saw it as a problem because well...

* Edward has no control over the fact that he is in fact a vampire, and the truth of the matter is - vampires need blood to survive. An abusive partner has all of the control in the relationship.

* Edward tries to distance himself from Bella, because she'd be "safer" without him around. An abusive partner simply doesn't consider such things, it is all about their own needs, and never about the needs of the other person.

* Bella has a very clear possibility to leave Edward. He always tells her "I'll be here as long as YOU want me". I doubt abusive partners are ever this generous with their victims.

I can't really place their relationship into "abusive" category. I know we won't agree on this , I just wanna defend Edward...

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#66 of 237 Old 12-03-2008, 01:26 AM
 
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I guess I never saw it as a problem because well...

* Edward has no control over the fact that he is in fact a vampire, and the truth of the matter is - vampires need blood to survive. An abusive partner has all of the control in the relationship.

* Edward tries to distance himself from Bella, because she'd be "safer" without him around. An abusive partner simply doesn't consider such things, it is all about their own needs, and never about the needs of the other person.

* Bella has a very clear possibility to leave Edward. He always tells her "I'll be here as long as YOU want me". I doubt abusive partners are ever this generous with their victims.

I can't really place their relationship into "abusive" category. I know we won't agree on this , I just wanna defend Edward...
: Well said Oriole, that's exactly how I feel but you articulated it much better!

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#67 of 237 Old 12-03-2008, 09:49 PM
 
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I finished Breakind Dawn. Yay!... and boohooooo.

On the imprinting can someone clarify why it creeps you out? I guess to me it just fits in with the whole feel of the series - supernatural. Like Bella & Edward - they were fated to be together, what else could overcome such numerous and violent obstacles.

Imprinting to me seems just like fate - you just dont have to wonder "is it, isnt it". You know. Breaking Dawn gives more insight into what its like for the female half of the imprinted pair and that may make it more clear for you.

As to "what if Bella had chosen Jacob?", she didnt, she couldnt because she was fated to be with Edward.
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#68 of 237 Old 12-03-2008, 09:59 PM
 
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I finished Breakind Dawn. Yay!... and boohooooo.

On the imprinting can someone clarify why it creeps you out? I guess to me it just fits in with the whole feel of the series - supernatural. Like Bella & Edward - they were fated to be together, what else could overcome such numerous and violent obstacles.

Imprinting to me seems just like fate - you just dont have to wonder "is it, isnt it". You know. Breaking Dawn gives more insight into what its like for the female half of the imprinted pair and that may make it more clear for you.

As to "what if Bella had chosen Jacob?", she didnt, she couldnt because she was fated to be with Edward.
Yes, yes, and yes to everything you said. That's exactly how I read and understood BD.

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#69 of 237 Old 12-03-2008, 11:18 PM
 
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Who needs Breaking Dawn? I will give you my copy - with smudges from eating while reading - for cost of shipping....
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#70 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 02:36 AM
 
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Ooh, have any of you read Christine Feehan novels? carpathian vampire series? They also have an imprinting type thing except only the males know it. without true love they lose the ability to see color. when they see their soul mate they regain the ability. there is also an "imprinting" episode in one of the novels where a carpathian desperate for a mate (without one he will become evil) manipulates a fetus and "makes" her his one true mate. THAT is icky.
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#71 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 02:28 PM
 
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Oh man I'm like a teenage girl with this series. I'm so in love with Edward. I've finished the first two books and the online Edward manuscript and I'm a few chapters into the third book. And I'm going to see the movie for a second time Saturday even though it's nowhere near as good as the book. I'm so silly..

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#72 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 02:49 PM
 
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Stacey... if only I lived in SC! I'd go with you for a 2nd time!!
Then go home and promptly pick up the book with where I left off
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#73 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 02:53 PM
 
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Stacey... if only I lived in SC! I'd go with you for a 2nd time!!
Then go home and promptly pick up the book with where I left off
I'd love that! My SIL is going with me this Sat and it will be her third time! But her first time since reading the book. I seriously considered going to see it this week by myself then going Saturday too but I figured DH would make fun of me too much!! I'm SUCH a nerd!!

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#74 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 03:15 PM
 
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My DH would probably tease me, too! Nerd's unite

Has anyone had conversations with their kids regarding the books? My DS who is 7 has been asking really good questions about the stories and we have had some great conversations about the options we are given in our lives and the choices that we make (What makes Edward a good vampire?)! I never thought that it would bring up free will!!! Nothing like homeschooling your 7 yr old son with Twilight!

If only my kids were old enough to read the books with me!
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#75 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 03:59 PM
 
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My DH would probably tease me, too! Nerd's unite

Has anyone had conversations with their kids regarding the books? My DS who is 7 has been asking really good questions about the stories and we have had some great conversations about the options we are given in our lives and the choices that we make (What makes Edward a good vampire?)! I never thought that it would bring up free will!!! Nothing like homeschooling your 7 yr old son with Twilight!

If only my kids were old enough to read the books with me!
LOL! My kids don't know too much about it except for the clip they've seen of the movie on yahoo movies and that I'm reading them. But self-control and free will are SUCH important topics for kids. How many times do we hear "She MADE me such and such" or "It's all HIS fault!!" I wish my kids were old enough to read the books too!

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#76 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 05:10 PM
 
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love the books. and the movie. and the online Midnight Sun.
guess i am a Twilighter afterall
on a OT note, DH and i are watching Heroes on Netflix online, and last night i saw Emmett!!! he was playing the love interest of Claire 5 years in the future.
he is so adorable!
oh, and i am team Edward all the way!

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#77 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 06:44 PM
 
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LOL! My kids don't know too much about it except for the clip they've seen of the movie on yahoo movies and that I'm reading them. But self-control and free will are SUCH important topics for kids. How many times do we hear "She MADE me such and such" or "It's all HIS fault!!" I wish my kids were old enough to read the books too!
I have had talks with my mom and friends about the books and suddenly he started asking the questions! Its amazing how much they pick up...


I think the use of self-control and free will is what appeals to me about Edward vs Jacob. Yes... Edward could force himself on Bella but he doesn't (whereas Jacob does on many occasions). I have given a lot of thought about the "unheathliness" comments about Edward and Bella's relationship and I keep coming back to that point. I would venture to say that we all have had times where we could cause our loved ones harm, the difference is whether we do or not!

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#78 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 06:47 PM
 
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BTW... has anyone read the outtakes on Stephenies Meyers website? There are some under both Twilight and New Moon! Just more reads... My girlfriend has my last two books so I am seeking out more...

I really have to get help
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#79 of 237 Old 12-04-2008, 10:49 PM
 
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I saw the movie twice already. I am seriously considering going for a third time. I loved the story..I loved that it was a love story that was different and I loved how strong the love was between Bella and Edward.

After I saw it twice I went out and bought all four books. They were so good! The writing wasn't spectacular but the story was.

The imprinting with babies freaked me out a bit. Imprinting with adult women doesn't. I'm kind of mad that Jacob ends up with Bella's daughter, especially after his behavior with forcing kisses on Bella. But, oh well.
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#80 of 237 Old 12-05-2008, 12:34 PM
 
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I saw the movie again. I enjoyed it better the second time knowing what to expect! Robert Pattinson is VERY nice to look at!! There are just a couple of scenes I would've changed or done without. And RP did a good job with the American accent. It did sound a little off sometimes but I think he was an acceptable Edward. I'm looking forward to seeing it again!

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#81 of 237 Old 12-05-2008, 12:37 PM
 
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Yeah I think his accent was weird, bu in a good I was born in 1900 way.

Yeah there were a couple cheesy close ups I could do without.

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#82 of 237 Old 12-05-2008, 02:04 PM
 
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They certainly made the most of RP appeal! I really want to go see it again, I may have to go alone if that is what it comes down to. I am trying to convince my husband he would survive!

I thought about Jacob imprinting on Renesme. At first it freaked me out as well but imprinting makes him be what she needs at anytime in her life. So a caregiver that cares for her like a father would... that can't be so bad...

Any thoughts on this series for a 11 year old reader? I would say no unless her mom was reading it with her and having good conversations about it... my niece wants it and I would love to share this with her but I don't see her much.
My Sister-in-law seems to not care but she did ask my opinion and I told her I would think about it. Any thoughts?!?
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#83 of 237 Old 12-05-2008, 04:07 PM
 
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I don't really care for the scene in the forest when they're spilling their guts to each other. She tells him she knows he's a vampire. He tells her all about him. I HATE the part where he says she can't fight him off because he's too strong then he throws the tree. It's just too cheesy the way it's done. Then the whole lion fell in love with the lamb stuff. It's too rushed. I don't like it.

But overall I did like the movie. Enough that I'm going to see it again tomorrow with my SIL. It's really cool to see the characters come to life since they took so much care in making the characters look like they do in the book.

I'm midway through Eclipse. I know Edward and Bella end up together since I already have BD and I peeked. But I'm enjoying the competition b/t Edward and Jacob. Bella just punched Jacob in the face. Very entertaining!

Any thoughts on the actor that played Jacob? He has some BIG shoes to fill doesn't he. He's going to have to beef up big time for the next movie too. Should be interesting.

I'm not sure about the series for an 11yo. If it were my kids I think I'd wait a few years but that's just me.

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#84 of 237 Old 12-05-2008, 06:46 PM
 
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Well.. I was curious about the movie but I always like to read the book first so I picked up Twilight last week... and now after totally ignoring all but the most basic duties of my life and burning through all four books.. I'm trying to pick up the pieces of my life.. the laundry is a mountain, the dishes are all dirty and the kids think I've become a book zombie. *sigh* It's a rough return to reality.

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#85 of 237 Old 12-05-2008, 11:00 PM
 
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Well.. I was curious about the movie but I always like to read the book first so I picked up Twilight last week... and now after totally ignoring all but the most basic duties of my life and burning through all four books.. I'm trying to pick up the pieces of my life.. the laundry is a mountain, the dishes are all dirty and the kids think I've become a book zombie. *sigh* It's a rough return to reality.
I'm right there with you on being obsessed with the books! But I'm trying VERY hard not to read them too fast. I love the anticipation of knowing I have more to read. I remember the night I got the last Harry Potter book and I just stood there with the book in my hands thinking that it would be the very LAST time I had a new HP book to read! What a feeling!!!

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#86 of 237 Old 12-06-2008, 12:09 AM
 
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I'm right there with you on being obsessed with the books! But I'm trying VERY hard not to read them too fast. I love the anticipation of knowing I have more to read. I remember the night I got the last Harry Potter book and I just stood there with the book in my hands thinking that it would be the very LAST time I had a new HP book to read! What a feeling!!!
that's me too. I've only got the last book to go and I'm holding off because I know once I start I won't be able to stop. It's so hard!

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#87 of 237 Old 12-06-2008, 12:46 AM
 
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I have been reading this series too. I never, ever thought I would get into a vampire series. However, I had two friends who I really trusted who told me I HAD to read this book. I just finished Eclipse yesterday. I love Twilight, I thought New Moon was good too, but I felt kind of blah about Eclipse. Bella's character started to really irritate me in Eclipse. I have only read the first few pages of Breaking Dawn, I hope it is better than Eclipse, b/c that book kind of left a bad taste in my mouth.

As for the comparison btwn the HP series, hands down HP is better and is most definitely a classic. I like the Twilight series, but still kind of consider it fluff reading.
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#88 of 237 Old 12-06-2008, 11:10 AM
 
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I'm about as big an HP fan as they come. I was standing in line at midnight for the last book when I was HUGELY pregnant. But I'm really finding that I'm enjoying this series every bit as much. Maybe even more. It's hard to compare in some ways. With the focus on Edward and Bella's love and relationship it's just a lot different then HP.

I honestly don't know how people are reading them so fast. Maybe staying up all night?? I don't know. I started the first book two weeks ago yesterday and I'm nearing the end of the third book. And I'm reading them A LOT. I'm having trouble getting anything else done. Maybe I'd be going through them faster if DH didn't work from home some days. I don't want him to see me slacking to bad!!

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#89 of 237 Old 12-06-2008, 11:44 AM
 
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I'm not sure about the 11-year old thing. I would've been more unequivocably "No" until earlier this morning, though, when I watched an interview a journalist did with her 14-year old neice. She asked her "Didn't you find the first book steamy? I thought it was so steamy." And the 14-year old replied, "No, it wasn't steamy. It was romantic."

I think we fill in so much of our own experience. As a sexually active adult, I find the books pretty steamy, too. But a virginal 14-year old? Probably not as much. Sure, the sexual tension would be there. But I think we "imprint" our own life stage on the experience of reading the book.

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#90 of 237 Old 12-06-2008, 01:26 PM
 
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I started Twilight on Thanksgiving day and read it twice before reading the other three. I finished BD yesterday and it was almost a relief to no longer feel the all-consuming need to read read read. A LOT of things went undone during the past week! I have mixed feelings about these books as teen/YA reading. On the one hand, it's probably more intense than a lot of people think would be appropriate for that demographic. However, I don't think that teens are any strangers to intense feelings and I can certainly remember having quite intense feelings myself when I was the age of this series' target audience. However, even though Edward is PERFECT in my mind *sigh* I don't care for the idea of "I love you so much that my life is meaningless without you and I will kill myself rather than live without you" mentality being presented so positively to that audience. But selfishly and without regard for the "target" audience, I LOVED this story. I've read Rice's vampire books and liked them, but I liked these differently. I loved the passion between Bella and Edward more than anything. Anyone have any recommendations for books that I might enjoy that have a similar "feel" to them? The vampire bit is interesting, but not critical for what I'm looking for.

Oh, and I have no desire to see the movie. I never like movie adaptations, although I'm relieved that so many here feel that these movies are better than the HP ones - bleh.
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