UPDATE: post #154 I'm at a loss, really, I just cant' believe a parent can have so little regard for a child's safety - Page 6 - Mothering Forums
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#151 of 160 Old 06-12-2009, 01:03 PM
 
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What gets me is he is comparing FF videos, whereas my kid was rear facing at that age. I can guarantee you that the videos would be quite different if the kid in a car seat was rf. I wish car seat manufacturers would make extended rf seats available that you can get in europe.
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#152 of 160 Old 06-12-2009, 01:08 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no5no5 View Post
Anyway, in trying to find a way to access the full text of the above study, I stumbled across a new study undertaken by two public-safety-expert, non-economist types. They wrote:
That study uses data going back to 1996. Carseats have come a LONG way in 13 years.

Carseat-checking (CPST) and WAH mama to a twelve-year-old girl.
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#153 of 160 Old 06-13-2009, 11:42 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no5no5 View Post
O
Anyway, in trying to find a way to access the full text of the above study, I stumbled across a new study undertaken by two public-safety-expert, non-economist types. They wrote:
Actually, I just used this study for a critique project in my english class. They did state that they did not find any significant difference, but they also go on to state that they didn't take into account ejected children, and in their conclusion recommend that children remain in harnessed seats until 4 years and 40 pounds.

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#154 of 160 Old 06-17-2009, 11:23 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Just a follow-up:

The photos were just posted on Facebook and there are about 15 pictures of the 3yo nestled safe and sound in the car, wait for it, in her 16yo sister's lap in the front seat

I'm not trying to revive this spirited thread (which, seriously, I LOVED) but I thought I should follow up since people invested so much time, effort, passion and research to this topic.

I'm actually really kind of proud, it's the first time I've started a thread that had such a longrunning and meaningful conversation. Thans mommas!!

Julie, proud graduate of the AOW 3 year program in the study of boobology . Me : + DH : = Super Bubba !
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#155 of 160 Old 06-18-2009, 12:06 AM
 
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Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post
I am not trying to rehash the debate, but I do it because I believe (and IMO for good reason) that properly used car crashes DO save kids' lives, and if I can help teach people to use car seats properly, and in some cases help them obtain the seats, it's worth it.
this debate was crazy... and very informative... and i thought it ended on a fascinating note

and fwiw i am related to a whole pack of economists and every single one of them will tell you that statistics are great theoretically. and that economists are numbers people.. but numbers only take you so far when you take in to account unpredictability. if it were even .5% safer to put a kid in a carseat that is where they belong. seatbelts were not made with children in mind. neither were the seats in cars for that matter. they were made to support and adult frame. i think most would agree that it is not a risk worth taking.
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#156 of 160 Old 06-18-2009, 02:50 AM
 
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Another interesting article.... Not sure if the link will work since I had to logon to access the article, but the citation is at the bottom of the quote:

Quote:
In 2005, a widely-cited report found that lap-shoulder safety belts were as protective as child safety seats for 2-6 year olds, and were far less expensive. The report challenged what many experts had found, and now researchers have challenged the findings of that report.

The authors used U.S. data on a national sample of crashes that were severe enough to require that at least one vehicle had to be towed away. If a toddler, aged 2-3 years, was involved in the crash and sitting in the rear seat, the authors studied whether they were injured and whether they had been restrained by a lap-shoulder bell or in a child safety seat. They found that the chances of injury were about 20% less if the toddler was in a safety seat, leading them to conclude that "laws requiring that children younger than 4 years travel in child safety seats have a sound basis and should remain in force." (Zaloshnja E et al: Archives of Pediatric and Adolescent Medicine, January, 2007, pp. 65-68)

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#157 of 160 Old 06-18-2009, 10:09 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Love_My_Bubba View Post
Just a follow-up:

The photos were just posted on Facebook and there are about 15 pictures of the 3yo nestled safe and sound in the car, wait for it, in her 16yo sister's lap in the front seat

I'm not trying to revive this spirited thread (which, seriously, I LOVED) but I thought I should follow up since people invested so much time, effort, passion and research to this topic.

I'm actually really kind of proud, it's the first time I've started a thread that had such a longrunning and meaningful conversation. Thans mommas!!
That's just sad. I'm glad nothing happened, but the fact that nothing happened will probably make it that much easier for them to do something like it again in the future. Hopefully, their luck will not run out.
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#158 of 160 Old 06-18-2009, 11:39 AM
 
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Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
this debate was crazy... and very informative... and i thought it ended on a fascinating note

and fwiw i am related to a whole pack of economists and every single one of them will tell you that statistics are great theoretically. and that economists are numbers people.. but numbers only take you so far when you take in to account unpredictability. if it were even .5% safer to put a kid in a carseat that is where they belong. seatbelts were not made with children in mind. neither were the seats in cars for that matter. they were made to support and adult frame. i think most would agree that it is not a risk worth taking.
And really, most seats/belts were made for large male frames. Smaller adults still don't fit all that well in most cars. Fortunately many newer have adjustable seatbelts in the front, which helps.

Happily married to my dh, mama to ds1 (01/2005), ds2 (07/2007)  and dd (07/2009).
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#159 of 160 Old 06-18-2009, 11:54 AM
 
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And really, most seats/belts were made for large male frames. Smaller adults still don't fit all that well in most cars. Fortunately many newer have adjustable seatbelts in the front, which helps.
Yeah my 5ft 2in self is still to short to sit normally and comfortably in the car.
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#160 of 160 Old 06-18-2009, 01:42 PM
 
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I'm going to lock this thread, due to the new Family Safety Forum guidelines. They state, in part:
Quote:
We ask that threads focus on safety information gathering, education, advocacy and sharing of personal experience rather than critiques of individuals or venting about others. Insulting, belittling or condemning others is neither productive nor appropriate. While we understand that it can be difficult to watch others make choices that are not in line with your own, the focus of this forum is on "safety." We ask that discussion focus on facts and information rather than venting about others who make different decisions for their families.
This thread started out as a vent thread, but then did go on to be more about facts, education, and advocacy. If anyone wants to keep up THAT part of the discussion, you are most welcome to post a new thread, with that as the goal.

Thanks!
Becky

Becky, partner to Teague, SAHM to Keagan (7yo), Jonah (2yo)
 

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