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#61 of 81 Old 11-16-2010, 12:15 PM
 
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Ok, for some reason when I quote a reply it doesn't ever make the actual comments I type below the quote appear.  Maybe a glitch with IE9 and these new forums?

 

Anyways, what I wrote is that no TSA employee is going to stand up and say it's not ok.  They would probably get written up and fired and then have no way to find a new job because their current boss would give them a bad rec to anyplace they applied.  While I'm sure some TSA employees do not agree with what is going on, there is no way they're going to risk their jobs.  And I totally understand that.

 

I also can't believe the amount of taxpayer money is going into buying these machines?  Anyone know if elected officials received campaign contributions from whatever company makes the scanners?


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#62 of 81 Old 11-17-2010, 04:37 PM
 
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I thought it was interesting to note that just the other day, after the TSA website says that photo scans are absolutely NOT stored anywhere, the TSA admitted that they have been storing some body scan images.  

 

http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-20012583-281.html

 

The thought of my child's body image being stored and looked at by some stranger eeks me way more than a pat down with me right there.


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#63 of 81 Old 11-18-2010, 03:46 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrunchyChristianMama View Post

Exactly.  I don't know why we aren't more upset about this as a nation and refusing being subjected to it.

 


People are buying the idea that this makes us "safer", therefore it's worth it. I wonder if they'll feel the same after someone smuggles explosives aboard in a body cavity and random "screening" via body cavity check gets put into place?

 



Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishmommy View Post

Just so I'm clear,  you only get the enhanced patdown if you refuse the xray machine?  But if you go through the regular metal detector, there's no patdown?  So that makes the patdown a punishment for refusing the xray.  Cruel and unusual?  Isn't that against the US Constitution?

This is my understanding, but I've also read at least one account (can't find the link) of a child being required to have a patdown after the x-ray, because he moved and the scan wasn't clear.
 


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peggy O'Mara View Post

I wouldn't use them either, and have not been to an airport where they are used exclusively. I was surprised to hear Mercola say not to worry about them at the recent International Chiropractic Pediatric Association (ICPA) conference in October. I can't find anything on his site.


I've become very disillusioned with Dr. Mercola of late, and suspect he can't find a way to make any money off people refusing the scans.


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#65 of 81 Old 11-18-2010, 08:53 PM
 
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I was pulled out for an "enhanced patdown" and it was utterly and completely humiliating. I broke down in tears. It didn't help that I was exhausted from the international flight and going through customs, but honestly, it ranks up there with some of the worst experiences of my life. (I also was in no way prepared for it -- I didn't think I would be singled out, and even if I was singled out, I didn't think it would be like that.) For myself, if I absolutely had to fly, I would go through the body scanner. For my daughter, if the choice were body scanner or patdown, I would leave, miss the flight, and take my chances with the $11,000 fine.


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#66 of 81 Old 11-18-2010, 09:39 PM
 
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I'm all for being safe...but the steps the TSA takes in attempting to thwart another attack are laughable and really pointless. They are certainly reactionary and not preemptive and they don't make me feel one bit safe. Any real terrorist is 3 (or 30) steps ahead of the metal detectors and body scanners. If someone wanted to bring an explosive on board, they could easily do it by inserting it into an orifice. Or they could just bring a baby with them so they don't have to go through the body scanner. 

 

And once someone is successful the next time or an attempt is thwarted, cavity searches will be mandatory and babies will be banned. And while we are reacting to that, terrorists will be thinking of a totally new way to bring down a plane. 

 

I really just wish they'd say "Hey, we are going to check IDs, follow the No-fly list, use metal detectors and scan all luggage. We'll have some plain clothes air marshalls on flights. Then fly at your own risk cause if someone really wants to bring down a plane we can't stop them."

 

Cause really, that's all they can do. 

 

But no. I have to take the Robeez off of my baby and be felt up by a stranger. Cause THAT makes flying safer. 

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#67 of 81 Old 11-18-2010, 11:55 PM
 
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Are you talking about scan searching? I mean to check your body about illegal stuff.

 

dave,

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#68 of 81 Old 11-19-2010, 03:35 PM
 
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http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/travelwise/2013474414_trpucci19.html

 

"...Passenger rights, electronic privacy and civil liberties advocates raised plenty of red flags at the time, but their concerns fell mostly on ears clogged with information from what became known in Washington, D.C., circles as the "full-body scanner lobby."

Among the most alarming revelations was the role former Homeland Security Chief Michael Chertoff played in advocating for the controversial backscatter scanners made by a California-based Rapiscan Systems, a client of his consulting firm, the Chertoff Group.

Those scanners, which produce revealing body images and emit X-ray-like ionizing radiation, are among the more controversial of two systems in place.

About half the scanners, including 14 installed at Sea-Tac, are backscatter machines....

 

...TSA only recently changed its website to reflect the use of body scanners, and the need to remove wallets and everything else from pockets — not just items that might set off a metal detector.

Still missing is information on the pat-down procedure for children, which spokesmen have described as "modified," leaving parents to imagine for themselves what that might mean."

 

 

 

 


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#69 of 81 Old 11-20-2010, 09:16 AM
 
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a friend of mine just posted about this woan's breast being exposed on facebook:

http://gizmodo.com/5692583/woman-suing-federal-government-after-tsa-screener-exposed-her-breasts-to-entire-airport

 

And, how Israel's airports are safer than ours even though they don't any of the feel-you-up-see-you-naked stuff:

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/744199---israelification-high-security-little-bother


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#70 of 81 Old 11-20-2010, 09:42 AM
 
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oops, double post

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#71 of 81 Old 11-20-2010, 09:43 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DahliaRW View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Super~Single~Mama View Post
Are you in the US? I've flown with my ds several times, and I always wear him through security. I NEVER have to do anything other than walk through the metal detector.

Have you tried just taking him off in preparation for going through the detectors? Don't ask, don't offer, just take him off, put the carrier through, and carry him through.
In nearly 6 years of flying with kids I have ALWAYS have been told to take them out of the carrier. I've gone through security at SEA, PIT, DTW, ORD, LGB, and JNU -every one of them required the child be taken out of the carrier.


This is weird, I've been through SEA, JFK and LGA several times in the last 1.5years, and always have my ds on my back in either the Ergo or Beco, and I've never been pulled aside for anything - no patting down, no wand, nothing.

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#72 of 81 Old 11-20-2010, 10:00 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waiting2bemommy View Post

a friend of mine just posted about this woan's breast being exposed on facebook:

http://gizmodo.com/5692583/woman-suing-federal-government-after-tsa-screener-exposed-her-breasts-to-entire-airport

 

And, how Israel's airports are safer than ours even though they don't any of the feel-you-up-see-you-naked stuff:

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/744199---israelification-high-security-little-bother


Loved reading that second story. Too bad that will never be the way we do things here. *sigh*

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#73 of 81 Old 11-20-2010, 12:22 PM
 
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just a note- not all the scanner types are X rays. Newark uses the radio waves model. These are called millimeter-wave scanners and don't pose a harmful radiation risk.


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#74 of 81 Old 11-20-2010, 03:41 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Super~Single~Mama View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by DahliaRW View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Super~Single~Mama View Post
Are you in the US? I've flown with my ds several times, and I always wear him through security. I NEVER have to do anything other than walk through the metal detector.

Have you tried just taking him off in preparation for going through the detectors? Don't ask, don't offer, just take him off, put the carrier through, and carry him through.
In nearly 6 years of flying with kids I have ALWAYS have been told to take them out of the carrier. I've gone through security at SEA, PIT, DTW, ORD, LGB, and JNU -every one of them required the child be taken out of the carrier.


This is weird, I've been through SEA, JFK and LGA several times in the last 1.5years, and always have my ds on my back in either the Ergo or Beco, and I've never been pulled aside for anything - no patting down, no wand, nothing.

 

I've never been asked either when I've worn my son in a wrap or Beco, usually I fly out of BOS and ICT. The worst thing about our security theater is that so much of what you'll have to do depends on the individual TSA agent at the individual checkpoint. If they just feel like making you do something, you have to do it.
 


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#75 of 81 Old 11-22-2010, 07:22 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DahliaRW View Post


I also can't believe the amount of taxpayer money is going into buying these machines?  Anyone know if elected officials received campaign contributions from whatever company makes the scanners?



Rapiscan, one of the manufacturers of the nude-o-scopes, was a client of former head of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff's security consulting company.  He was a huge proponent of the machines.  I'm sure  he's made millions from them.

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#76 of 81 Old 11-22-2010, 01:15 PM
 
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We flew out of Hartford, CT on 11/18 and out of O'Hare on 11/22.  Out of Hartford, no one in my group went through the x-rays -  they were not in use.  Out of O'Hare, everyone in my group (5 adults) EXCEPT me was selected to go through the x-ray machines. I was carrying DD (7months).  It looked like it was being done at random, but I was so thankful that I was not asked to choose between radiation (mild I know, but still) and a stranger touching my child.  I still had not decided which was worse when I got to the airport. 

 

Obviously I don't know what other people will experience, I just thought some mommas might feel better knowing that it might not be required. 


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#77 of 81 Old 11-22-2010, 01:40 PM
 
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I know as we approach the big holiday travel season the safety of these new scanners is on everyone's mind.

 

I just want to put on my mod hat and remind you that the Family Safety forum is the appropriate place to host a discussion about the SAFETY of these devices. However, discussions around this issue as a current event should go in the News and Current Events forum and not here in Family Safety. Threads that are off the safety topic will be moved. Thanks for understanding!


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#78 of 81 Old 12-08-2010, 07:18 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smithie View Post

if we end up in the line that has it, and they can just feel me up in public with three kids running wild and see how they like that.


 ROTFLMAO.gifbow.gif

I am simultaneously laughing my head off and worshipping you at the same time for this comment.  AWESOME.

I am trying to decide what to do about these myself, and this comment pretty much sums up how I'm feeling right now.

XOXO

B


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#79 of 81 Old 12-11-2010, 12:46 PM
 
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I didn't see anyone mention it, but if you are patted down, demand that the agent put on a pair of fresh gloves. I absolutely do not want to be frisked with gloves that have touched hundreds or thousands of people with unknown hygienic status. Scabies, fungi, herpes, the list goes on...just eww.


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#80 of 81 Old 12-11-2010, 05:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Equuskia View Post

I didn't see anyone mention it, but if you are patted down, demand that the agent put on a pair of fresh gloves. I absolutely do not want to be frisked with gloves that have touched hundreds or thousands of people with unknown hygienic status. Scabies, fungi, herpes, the list goes on...just eww.


Ewww, totally gross to imagine!  Good reminder tip, Equuskia!


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#81 of 81 Old 12-12-2010, 01:33 PM
 
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The very idea of flying makes me sick to my stomach now. We have a 6 year old DD, a 14 year old DD and another DD on the way. I WILL NOT risk our health or mental well being to fly on an airplane. I cannot put my kids through the possibility of invasive touching by strangers much less risk any form a radiation that isn't medically necessary.

 

Ive seen to many stories in the news recently involving bodily fluids being exposed during body searches and sorry but I seriously doubt that anyone is disenfecting the "private" rooms.

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