teaching boys the realities of the police - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 01:36 PM
 
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I am not accusing anyone in this thread of doing this but I do have a little somehting Ive noticed in real life. My best friend and I are both married to hispanic men. We are both caucasian. They are incessently finding themselves in situations where they are discriminated against because of his race. He is second generation Mexican American, no accent, light skin. My husband is first generation Mexican, heavy accent, limited english. We have encountered one incident where we felt we were treated unfairly and rudely due to his race. Sometimes I wonder if its the attitude put forth.
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#62 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 02:21 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mamawannab View Post
I am not accusing anyone in this thread of doing this but I do have a little somehting Ive noticed in real life. My best friend and I are both married to hispanic men. We are both caucasian. They are incessently finding themselves in situations where they are discriminated against because of his race. He is second generation Mexican American, no accent, light skin. My husband is first generation Mexican, heavy accent, limited english. We have encountered one incident where we felt we were treated unfairly and rudely due to his race. Sometimes I wonder if its the attitude put forth.
What exactly do you mean by this??

I could have written your post almost. My husband is 2nd generation Mexican, light skinned, and doesn't even speak Spanish at all! He is 6'6" and looks more Scottish from his mother's side than anything else. There is only ONE time I can say that he "might" have experience discrimination and that was by a police officer.

He was pulled over for no reason at all. The police officer tried to claim it was because my 8 year old daughter was not in a car seat. The law was 6 at the time. Also he was behind my DH and they were in a truck so there was no way he could tell if she was in a booster or not until he walked up to the car. He told DH to put her in a car seat...DH was like umm she is 8?? And the officer let him go.

It is "my belief" with obviously no proof, that the officer ran the tags on the beater pick up we had at that time, saw it come back with a Mexican last name and pulled him over. When he saw that DH didn't look Mexican, had a valid license and insurance he had not choice but to let him go. But obviously that is just my opinion.

So anyway.. can you tell me what attitude my DH might have put forth while driving down the highway taking my daughter to school that might have gotten him pulled over?
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#63 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 02:42 PM
 
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I guess my phrasing wasnt quite correct. Obviously your DH or daughter could not have put forth an attitude. I also said "sometimes", not always. In referance to my friend(who I was talking about when I said that about the attitude) I feel like shes almost looking for him to be discriminated against, and maybe sometimes she puts that into a situation, where it might not be warrented. Obviously there is racial profiling, discrimination, and hatred out there. Im just saying if you find yourself constantly being treated poorly maybe it might be your read on a situation or yes your attitude, causing this and not race at all. In the case of my friend a lot of these instances have occurred in restaurants. Ill be the first to say, sometimes I am emberrassed to go to a restaurant with her because she is generally rude. Whether her husband is with her or not, its just that when he is, she acts like any bad conduct on the part of the staff, is because of her husbands ethnicity.

When I said the attitude you put forth, I meant what you are putting out into the universe or what you may be expecting to happen. I did not mean everyone, all the time.
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#64 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 04:06 PM
 
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I guess my phrasing wasnt quite correct. Obviously your DH or daughter could not have put forth an attitude. I also said "sometimes", not always. In referance to my friend(who I was talking about when I said that about the attitude) I feel like shes almost looking for him to be discriminated against, and maybe sometimes she puts that into a situation, where it might not be warrented. Obviously there is racial profiling, discrimination, and hatred out there. Im just saying if you find yourself constantly being treated poorly maybe it might be your read on a situation or yes your attitude, causing this and not race at all. In the case of my friend a lot of these instances have occurred in restaurants. Ill be the first to say, sometimes I am emberrassed to go to a restaurant with her because she is generally rude. Whether her husband is with her or not, its just that when he is, she acts like any bad conduct on the part of the staff, is because of her husbands ethnicity.

When I said the attitude you put forth, I meant what you are putting out into the universe or what you may be expecting to happen. I did not mean everyone, all the time.
It doesn't sound from YYA's posts that she has any attitude other than patience and respect for people in authority (admittedly, we only have her side of the story). I think you are awfully close to blaming the victims, here. True, if you are rude and snotty to police, no matter what your color is, they won't have a hard time being rude and snotty back. But the reality of many people of color around the world is that they are treated poorly simply because of the color of their skin. Blaming this on *them* instead of on the racists who perpetrate it is really wrong and inappropriate. Like telling a woman she was raped because of the way she was dressed-- "she was asking for it."

You've been lucky. May you and your husband continue to be so.
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#65 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 04:55 PM
 
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mamawannab,

I think the attitude you are talking about is what I saw in high school.

I am white, my passanger was black. I was speeding....breaking the law...deserved to be pulled over. I had to tell my passanger "Shut the ***K up." She would not stop running her mouth our or attitude.

I know a few people (different races) that have been arrested then later admit when the cop walked up to their car they asked "Why the **** you pull me over." Then they wonder why the cop gets attitude.
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#66 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 05:03 PM
 
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mamawannab,

I think the attitude you are talking about is what I saw in high school.

I am white, my passanger was black. I was speeding....breaking the law...deserved to be pulled over. I had to tell my passanger "Shut the ***K up." She would not stop running her mouth our or attitude.

I know a few people (different races) that have been arrested then later admit when the cop walked up to their car they asked "Why the **** you pull me over." Then they wonder why the cop gets attitude.
I have seen it too. Not just from minorities, but from whites that I used to hang out with too that simply had a bad attitude. In hindsight, I think we brought on half the trouble we found ourselves in. We just expected things to go badly from the start so we were on the defense when there wasn't anything to be defensive of at that point.

ETA: I also know that there are some cops that are just looking to give it to someone no matter what you do. I have had that happen myself even because of the people I hung out with. A particular cop was dying to get me for something even though I wasn't doing anything wrong. At one time I was even cuffed and brought in for "questioning" on complete BS stuff. So, I have no doubt that this happens to people for the color of their skin of the area they live in as well.
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#67 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 05:40 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Marylizah View Post
It doesn't sound from YYA's posts that she has any attitude other than patience and respect for people in authority (admittedly, we only have her side of the story). I think you are awfully close to blaming the victims, here. True, if you are rude and snotty to police, no matter what your color is, they won't have a hard time being rude and snotty back. But the reality of many people of color around the world is that they are treated poorly simply because of the color of their skin. Blaming this on *them* instead of on the racists who perpetrate it is really wrong and inappropriate. Like telling a woman she was raped because of the way she was dressed-- "she was asking for it."

You've been lucky. May you and your husband continue to be so.
I don't think it is that simple. I think we need to accept that there can be two parts of the problem. The cop/authority figure and the person that is involved. I unfortantly cannot correct the racist/jerk cop for everyone but I can teach my child approprate behaviors and to not be part of the problem.

If you cuss a cop you are part of the problem. Fix what you can It is not like a rape victim, nothing is their fault.
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#68 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 05:45 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mamawannab View Post
I am not accusing anyone in this thread of doing this but I do have a little somehting Ive noticed in real life. My best friend and I are both married to hispanic men. We are both caucasian. They are incessently finding themselves in situations where they are discriminated against because of his race. He is second generation Mexican American, no accent, light skin. My husband is first generation Mexican, heavy accent, limited english. We have encountered one incident where we felt we were treated unfairly and rudely due to his race. Sometimes I wonder if its the attitude put forth.
I don't know if you're referring to me or not, but if you see my post where I relate the incident where I was pulled over for turning the wrong way down a one way street (definitely my fault!), you'll see where I wasn't even ticketed at the end. That was also the first time -- in 22 years of driving at that point -- that I had ever been stopped. I also have not been stopped since that time while driving. You'll also note that a good friend of mine is a white, female police sergeant. When I was growing up, my next door neighbor was a black male police officer (and I grew up in a solidly upper middle class integrated neighborhood in a large, diverse city). Also, my father, who was Puerto Rican, was a police officer who was killed in the line of duty.

I'm not going to go on and on, because at the end of the day people believe what they want to believe and if you believe -- not even knowing me or anything about me or others, or even where we live for that matter -- that we're "putting forth an attitude", then so be it.
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#69 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 06:57 PM
 
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nope YYA I definately wasnt talking about you, I tried to make it clear I was talking about noone in this thread it was more of a general thought on the entire thread. Im sorry if you thought I was talking about you. It would be highly unsensitive and plain wrong of me to make a statement like that about someone whose attitude or personality I know nothing about. Thats why I used my friend as an example to illustrate what I was talking about. I know her attitude.

As for the rape victim connection...um no not the same. There are ways in which someone can misinterperate the meaning behind the way someone treats them. Nothing can be misinterperated about a rape.

Yes marsupialmom, my point exactly. There can be two parts to the problem.

I said there are times where racism is unquestionably the culprit. But racism and prejudice go both ways, and automatically teaching your children to dislike a group of people, based on skin color, hair color, religion, personal beliefs, or their job is a sure fire way to perpetuate the problem. This creates unnecassary hatred and an attitude that might cause further problems, of the type you are trying to avoid, down the line.

That was the point of my post. Pure and simple. Im not blaming the victim. Im saying dont make yourself a victim unnecessarily. Thats all.
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#70 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 07:52 PM
 
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What a horrible situation for those kids! Do you happen to know if there were any repurcussions for the gas station attendant? Was there an apology for the teens? That, in conjunction with how the kids were talked to (e.g., were they spoken to any differently than they would have been if they were white) would have also affected if the police were "bad" or not in this situation.

I once had a situation 5 days after I moved to this city where I was driving a rental car and was hopelessly lost and made a wrong turn down a one way street. It was dark, the street was poorly lit, and shortly after I turned a police officer came up behind me. I had never been stopped by a police officer while driving before and honestly didn't know the protocol so I slowed down and turned the corner so I was facing the proper direction and stopped. My (then) infant son was wailing at the top of his lungs (as he had been for over an hour at that point since we were coming in from out of town) and my dd was tired and grumpy. The (white, female) police officer yelled at me as soon as I let my window down and proceed to tell me how much trouble I was in and I was prepared to accept my ticket. My dd was terrified as the bright flashlight was shone in her face. When the officer chastised me, I explained to her that I had no idea that I was supposed to stop facing the wrong way in traffic as I'd never done that before and had never been stopped while driving. I told her that I was new in town and was lost and I apologized. I just told her the truth. I gave her my out of state drivers' license. She checked the kids' car seats, ran my license and the plates of the rental car and continued to yell at me. She asked where I lived and didn't know how to get there herself. I showed her my rental lease to substantiate my story as my ds continued to cry. She radioed in for directions and relayed them and instructed me to get a new drivers' license ASAP and drove off without ticketing me. My dd was shaken up and I explained to her that I had made a mistake and the officer tried to help us but everything was okay. The directions the officer had given me were wrong, but we eventually made it back. It was a scary encounter, but it all worked out in the end.
They were treated the same way white teens in the area get treated, but it still was horribly unfair for them, since searching what was a typical messy teenagers beater took quite a while and they sat on the curb for around an hour and got frisked.

I have no idea if anything happened to the gas station attendant, but what could they do? How could they determined if the attendant had genuinely believed he saw a gun, or was just messing with the teens for whatever reason.

Timmy's Mommy WARNINGyslexic typing with help of preschooler, beware of typos
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#71 of 71 Old 09-15-2009, 10:44 PM
 
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They were treated the same way white teens in the area get treated, but it still was horribly unfair for them, since searching what was a typical messy teenagers beater took quite a while and they sat on the curb for around an hour and got frisked.

I have no idea if anything happened to the gas station attendant, but what could they do? How could they determined if the attendant had genuinely believed he saw a gun, or was just messing with the teens for whatever reason.
I have to laugh........I know this story is irrelevant but it popped into my head.

I was a gas attendant once. I had this dad shut his kid into the trunk. I saw him go around to the back unlock the trunk. Yell at the kid (didn't hear could just see he was mad and was being stern) then slam the trunk. I was about to call the police when one of the other customers came in laughing and told me what the dad said. Apparently they had a new car. This child thought it was fun to unbuckle its see and crawl into the trunk. From my point of view It looked horrible. But the dad yelled at the kid to get seating buckled in the seat like he should be. I missed the kid popped into the back seat and put it up.
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