The Circ Stalemate - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 08:17 PM - Thread Starter
 
serenekitten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 477
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Have you gone through a pregnancy/birth being anti-circ while your partner is pro-circ?

No amount of persuasion has helped sway my DP towards being anti-circ. We've gone 'round in circles about it. He's hung up on the possibility of problems down the road that might result in having to circumcise our son. I don't feel that it's medically necessary, it's impractical ($500 out of pocket that we don't have), having an open wound could expose him to MRSA (which may have taken my dad's leg), and I just emotionally could not deal with putting my baby through it.

He's given up for now because he knows he can't convince me to take his side, and that makes him upset.

And me, I'm just plain upset in general. I didn't want to have to take a side at all. Then I found out I was having a boy.

- Born 7/21/09
serenekitten is offline  
#2 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 08:23 PM
 
LionessMom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Iowa
Posts: 3,662
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
i know how you feel, except the part where we know what we are having. I know DH feels that circ is good b/c he thinks it reduces the risk of some diseases. I say no way. after all the research and reading i have done on here, i will never allow it to be done to my son. i will say no. and i know that will cause contention. I plan on trying to show him a video i have seen linked around here, of a baby actually getting it done. i am hoping that it will change his mind or at least give up, b/c it is not happening.

Me,DH,DS1'95, '98,DSD'03,DD1'07,DD2'09,DS2'12 Living with Fructose Malabsorption Syndrome and Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome Type 3-Hypermobility.)o( and sometimes I get toif I am lucky.
LionessMom is offline  
#3 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 08:49 PM
 
Greg B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Dover, DE, US
Posts: 776
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Maybe if he reads this it will help:

http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...yStatement.pdf

The discussion should be carefully structured. It sounds like this is not happening. Instead it sounds like he has strong feelings about it, but has not sat down and carefully laid out the issues.

One way would be to first detail the different alternatives:

1) Do not circ
2) circ at a later age
3) circ as an infant

Then lay out the advantages and disadvantages of each. This will take some time to do thoughtfully and comprhensively. Then compare each alternative against one another. See which is better based on the advantages and disavantages. Do not forget to include the issues of human rights, sexual feelings, pain and risk, the ability of your son to make his own decision later, etc.

He may still have strong feelings, but I bet once things are carefully laid out like this, it will be hard to argue for RIC.
Greg B is offline  
#4 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 08:56 PM
 
calngavinsmom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ontario Canada....EH!?!
Posts: 2,079
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'm so sorry you are going through this. My dh wasn't too hard to convince, even though he is circed, partially because where we live, it is getting to be pretty rare(about 10% circ rate). Does your dh know that over 80% of the worlds population does NOT circumcise and that if properly cared for, the foreskin is in large part problem free?

In this link to the Canadian Pediatric Society's circ page, circ is explained as a purely social, cosmetic procedure(rather than medical), and further outlines that circing has more problems than not.

http://www.caringforkids.cps.ca/preg...rcumcision.htm

Good luck to you and your unborn son. I hope your partner comes around and if not, you are still the one who has the final say in the matter.

Take care,
Tara

Tara Momma to Callum and Gavin
calngavinsmom is offline  
#5 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 09:28 PM
 
LionessMom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Iowa
Posts: 3,662
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
i dont think my DH even thinks about it. i just told him that if we have a boy that the research says that circ has no benefits etc. he says "why do you have to read all that crap online?" as if there is something wrong with wanting to make the righht decision for my children. i will jsut have my super cool doc read the DOC paper and then tell DH she reccomends against and all the bad things associated with it and there is no good to come of it. maybe he will listen to her.

either way. my foot is down. my boy will not be circ'ed. he will be intact.

Me,DH,DS1'95, '98,DSD'03,DD1'07,DD2'09,DS2'12 Living with Fructose Malabsorption Syndrome and Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome Type 3-Hypermobility.)o( and sometimes I get toif I am lucky.
LionessMom is offline  
#6 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 09:38 PM
 
Fyrestorm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 4,102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenekitten View Post
He's hung up on the possibility of problems down the road that might result in having to circumcise our son.
More boys have to have corrective surgery to correct a botched circumcision and adhesions and skin bridges, than ever need to be circumcised later for a medical reason (gangrene, cancer, frostbite and severe trauma being the only legit reasons for 'having' to do it.)

There is also the unreported issue of meatal stenosis that is a complication of circumcision that can appear MUCH later in life (my DH is dealing with this and has to have corrective surgery). MS only occurs in cut men.

Victim of Birth Rape & Coerced ribboncesarean.gifUnnecesareanribboncesarean.gif What makes people think they can cut up someone else's genitals? nocirc.gif
Fyrestorm is offline  
#7 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 09:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
serenekitten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 477
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by LionessMom View Post
I plan on trying to show him a video i have seen linked around here, of a baby actually getting it done. i am hoping that it will change his mind or at least give up, b/c it is not happening.
I showed him a video that contained a couple of clips of actual circumcisions. His reply was that, yes, it hurts and he feels sorry for the baby but the baby is not aware enough of the world to know what it is and won't remember it.

Meanwhile, I sat cringing and curled up in my chair while wanting to reach through the computer screen to protect the babies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg B View Post
The discussion should be carefully structured.
It came on as a spur of the moment discussion this evening, not as carefully structured as I would have liked. This won't be the last we speak of the issue -- I want to include my midwife in the discussion to see what insight she has. Unfortunately, we're both so stubbornly stuck on opposite sides of the issue that it's going to be difficult to come to an agreement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by calngavinsmom View Post
Does your dh know that over 80% of the worlds population does NOT circumcise and that if properly cared for, the foreskin is in large part problem free?
I'm not sure that he realizes that. And when we tried to discuss hygiene, he brought up the fact that some of the cleanest women he knows have frequent yeast infections. I was so flabbergasted that he threw such a thing out that I couldn't come up with an effective argument against it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LionessMom View Post
he says "why do you have to read all that crap online?" as if there is something wrong with wanting to make the righht decision for my children.
Ugh. I've been doing research on different things since my first BFP in November. I wish you good luck with your DH. I don't want to have to play the "Mommy card," and it's very difficult for me to put my foot down or go against my DP about anything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fyrestorm View Post
More boys have to have corrective surgery to correct a botched circumcision and adhesions and skin bridges, than ever need to be circumcised later for a medical reason (gangrene, cancer, frostbite and severe trauma being the only legit reasons for 'having' to do it.)

There is also the unreported issue of meatal stenosis that is a complication of circumcision that can appear MUCH later in life (my DH is dealing with this and has to have corrective surgery). MS only occurs in cut men.
Thanks for pointing these out. I'll try to remember them the next time we talk about it.

- Born 7/21/09
serenekitten is offline  
#8 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 10:11 PM
 
Fyrestorm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 4,102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenekitten View Post
\he brought up the fact that some of the cleanest women he knows have frequent yeast infections. \
Chances are that this woman cleans too much and has disrupted the natural flora thus causing yeast to take hold.

Victim of Birth Rape & Coerced ribboncesarean.gifUnnecesareanribboncesarean.gif What makes people think they can cut up someone else's genitals? nocirc.gif
Fyrestorm is offline  
#9 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 10:24 PM
 
robertandenith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 2,113
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Please, PLEASE, watch yourself this video AND show it to HIM
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...65256830319025

This is the new 20 min DVD - Circumcision Decision. Featuring Dr Dean Edell.

Does not only shows a circ but also several doctors, activists and a lawyer talks about it. Very informative.

Latina Mama of 3 and Wife of a great man since 1997
: : : : : : :
robertandenith is offline  
#10 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 10:30 PM
 
MCatLvrMom2A&X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: With Vin Diesel ;) YUMMMM
Posts: 14,785
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Since you are the only one in the hospital that can concent in most states just dont sign.

It will be great if you can convice him that circ is a horrific thing but sometimes that isnt possible so you just have to be the mama bear and say no it isnt happening end of story.

 
SAHMlady.gifread.giflovin' trekkie.giffan intactivist.gifwinner.jpg to loveeyes.gifenergy.gifDD 10/00 & superhero.gifmoon.gifDS 10/04 ribbonpb.gifIf your ds is intact, keep him safe, visit the Case Against Circ forumnocirc.gifCirc, a personal choice, Your sonsyes.gifbrokenheart.gif11/98brokenheart.gif6/99ribbonbrown.gifanti-tobaccoribbonyellow.gifThyroid cancer survivor. With cat.gif& goldfish.gif & (Boxer)dog2.gif wishing 4 whale.gif&ribbonwhite.gifsigncirc1.gifselectivevax.gifdelayedvax.gif

MCatLvrMom2A&X is offline  
#11 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 11:09 PM
 
*Erin*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: in a magnolia tree
Posts: 2,489
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MCatLvrMom2A&X View Post
Since you are the only one in the hospital that can concent in most states just dont sign.

It will be great if you can convice him that circ is a horrific thing but sometimes that isnt possible so you just have to be the mama bear and say no it isnt happening end of story.
yep that.
hopefully, he'll get it before it comes to you having to refuse in the hospital though. good luck, mama.

Erin, 33, salty southern mama, sitting by the sea with my DH35, DD10, DS4, &DD2!
*Erin* is offline  
#12 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 11:25 PM
 
KBecks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,002
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Your DP doesn't have to be anti-circ, he just needs to be OK with an intact son. It may be easier to say intact is OK for him than to deal with his emotions about circ.
KBecks is offline  
#13 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 11:27 PM
A&A
 
A&A's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 16,861
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Here are two links for YOU to read, only. Do NOT show these to your dh:

http://www.udonet.com/circumcision/v...ty_of_men.html

http://www.noharmm.org/feminist.htm

"Our task is not to see the future, but to enable it."
A&A is offline  
#14 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 11:32 PM
 
Getz's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 963
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MCatLvrMom2A&X View Post
Since you are the only one in the hospital that can concent in most states just dont sign.

It will be great if you can convice him that circ is a horrific thing but sometimes that isnt possible so you just have to be the mama bear and say no it isnt happening end of story.

That's what I had to do. Nothing would convince my DH was circumcision was not an option for our son. So I had to say over my dead body. He is still convince circumcision is the right choice. My son is intact so that is all that matters to me at the end of the day.
Getz is offline  
#15 of 49 Old 03-20-2009, 11:48 PM
 
yarngoddess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Placerville,CA~best place for me!~
Posts: 1,808
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I would rather play the Mommy Rulz card, and have my DH/DP mad at me than be RESPONSIBLE for my son's circ. I AM responsible for my son's circ, and he does have issues with it- I accept that. That was ME being uneducated. HOWEVER my littlest son is INTACT for a reaon, I learned and did better. YOU know better- could YOU live with the ramifications of something going really wrong? Besides the actual circ just plain being wrong. I hope you come to a comfortable decision, and your DP learns to accept it. And REALLY- how often is he going to see his son's penis? How often does he see his own fathers????? As long as he loves his son, it won't matter what his penis loooks like

Married to Michael and Mother of Jake 9, Jillianne 7, Jensen 5, Jacen 4. I've got severe osteoporosis, a fractured hip and chronic pain-so please be patient with me! Pagan,Crocheter,Reader,Homeschooler- that's me in a nutshell.

yarngoddess is offline  
#16 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 12:27 AM
 
latinalonestar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 840
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The only reason your son would ever need a medical circumcision would be in the case of frostbite, malignancy, gangrene, or serious trauma. THAT IS IT! This should put your partner at ease.

The fear of "foreskin problems" is primarily due to the fact that US doctors know very little about the development of the intact boy. Doctors will ignorantly recommend circ when either 1) there is a less invasive treatment or 2) b/c the doctor does not recognize the normal development of the intact boy.

Read through these:
http://www.nocirc.org/publish/pamphlet7.html

http://www.mothering.com/articles/ne...uncircson.html

http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...kinleaflet.pdf

Foreskin actually prevents more problems than it could possibly cause.
latinalonestar is offline  
#17 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 12:28 AM
 
jessjgh1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: South Shore MA
Posts: 4,956
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
((Hugs momma to be)) I wish I had more time to reply.... will be hoping for a happier update... please keep coming with questions and for support as you make way through your birth journey.

A peaceful birth is both a birth right and a mother's gift to her child. Maybe your partner will realize how much this will damage what should be a beautiful time for all of you.

Jessica

Jessica..lady.gifintactlact.gif Falling in love all over again..... 
Dhprivateeyes.gif, Joshua rolleyes.gif Rebeccagrouphug.gifand dog2.gif.    candle.gif for Laura
jessjgh1 is offline  
#18 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 12:39 AM
 
latinalonestar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 840
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenekitten View Post
I

I'm not sure that he realizes that. And when we tried to discuss hygiene, he brought up the fact that some of the cleanest women he knows have frequent yeast infections. I was so flabbergasted that he threw such a thing out that I couldn't come up with an effective argument against it.
Actually yeast infections in men, especially circumcised men, are asymptomatic. This means they can pass the yeast infection to their partner without even knowing that they have one. Intact men are NOT any more likely to get a yeast infection than a circumcised men. This is the same with STDs, they are generally asymptomatic too. This is probably why the US has the highest rate of STD transmission of any country. Men don't get tested b/c they don't know they have anything since they show no symptoms.
latinalonestar is offline  
#19 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 06:02 AM
 
Claire and Boys's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,407
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The chance of needing a circumcision in Scandinavia, where routine circ is not performed and Drs are used to intact penises, is 1 in 16,000. Whereas around 1 in 100 circs will need a later surgical revision.

It doesn't make any sense - the whole performing surgery to avoid later surgery. What other body parts would he have removed to prevent later problems? You know, remove the appendix while they're at it. It's more likely he will need that out (around 7% of people need their appendix removed at some point in their life)
Claire and Boys is offline  
#20 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 11:02 AM - Thread Starter
 
serenekitten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 477
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertandenith View Post
Please, PLEASE, watch yourself this video AND show it to HIM
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...65256830319025

This is the new 20 min DVD - Circumcision Decision. Featuring Dr Dean Edell
Yep, I watched that, but didn't get a chance to show DP. I'm not sure he'd take it seriously where it has a bias, but it's worth a shot. I'll try again, later.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MCatLvrMom2A&X View Post
It will be great if you can convice him that circ is a horrific thing but sometimes that isnt possible so you just have to be the mama bear and say no it isnt happening end of story.
Yeah. It's gonna be tough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by *Erin* View Post
yep that.
hopefully, he'll get it before it comes to you having to refuse in the hospital though. good luck, mama.
Thanks, I'll need it. (Good thing we found out the gender and went through this now, right? )

Quote:
Originally Posted by KBecks View Post
Your DP doesn't have to be anti-circ, he just needs to be OK with an intact son. It may be easier to say intact is OK for him than to deal with his emotions about circ.
Good point. I'll have to try phrasing it like that and see what he thinks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by A&A View Post
Here are two links for YOU to read, only. Do NOT show these to your dh:

http://www.udonet.com/circumcision/v...ty_of_men.html

http://www.noharmm.org/feminist.htm
Thanks. They were an interesting read. The story from the Jewish woman who left her son intact made me a little weepy (that just might be the hormones talking).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Getz View Post
That's what I had to do. Nothing would convince my DH was circumcision was not an option for our son. So I had to say over my dead body. He is still convince circumcision is the right choice. My son is intact so that is all that matters to me at the end of the day.
It's good to know that I might not be the only one, when all is said and done. I'm sorry your DH still feels that way, but you're right, having an intact son is all that matters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yarngoddess View Post
I would rather play the Mommy Rulz card, and have my DH/DP mad at me than be RESPONSIBLE for my son's circ. I AM responsible for my son's circ, and he does have issues with it- I accept that. That was ME being uneducated. HOWEVER my littlest son is INTACT for a reaon, I learned and did better. YOU know better- could YOU live with the ramifications of something going really wrong? Besides the actual circ just plain being wrong. I hope you come to a comfortable decision, and your DP learns to accept it. And REALLY- how often is he going to see his son's penis? How often does he see his own fathers????? As long as he loves his son, it won't matter what his penis loooks like
You know, I like to think DP is going to be more focused on his face than what's below the belt once the baby is born.

Quote:
Originally Posted by latinalonestar View Post
The only reason your son would ever need a medical circumcision would be in the case of frostbite, malignancy, gangrene, or serious trauma. THAT IS IT! This should put your partner at ease.
I keep forgetting that, and it could have been a real help in our discussion. I'll remember for next time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jessjgh1 View Post
((Hugs momma to be)) I wish I had more time to reply.... will be hoping for a happier update... please keep coming with questions and for support as you make way through your birth journey
s Thanks, I hope I have a happier update sometime soon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by latinalonestar View Post
Actually yeast infections in men, especially circumcised men, are asymptomatic. This means they can pass the yeast infection to their partner without even knowing that they have one. Intact men are NOT any more likely to get a yeast infection than a circumcised men. This is the same with STDs, they are generally asymptomatic too. This is probably why the US has the highest rate of STD transmission of any country. Men don't get tested b/c they don't know they have anything since they show no symptoms.
Wow. I really didn't realize it, but it makes sense. Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Claire and Boys View Post
The chance of needing a circumcision in Scandinavia, where routine circ is not performed and Drs are used to intact penises, is 1 in 16,000. Whereas around 1 in 100 circs will need a later surgical revision.

It doesn't make any sense - the whole performing surgery to avoid later surgery. What other body parts would he have removed to prevent later problems? You know, remove the appendix while they're at it. It's more likely he will need that out (around 7% of people need their appendix removed at some point in their life)
Thank you for that statistic. *adds it to her file of stuff to bring up later* And you're right -- my dad had to have his leg amputated in September, after three years of fighting to keep it intact. Should it have been cut off when he was a few hours/days old?

- Born 7/21/09
serenekitten is offline  
#21 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 12:20 PM
Banned
 
Yulia_R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Lafayette, CO
Posts: 3,128
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fyrestorm View Post
Chances are that this woman cleans too much and has disrupted the natural flora thus causing yeast to take hold.
Yeah to the above plus the fact that circ does NOT protect from infections, including yeast.
Yulia_R is offline  
#22 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 01:16 PM
 
Ron_Low's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Chicago
Posts: 392
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
He's given up for now because he knows he can't convince me to take his side, and that makes him upset.

And me, I'm just plain upset in general. I didn't want to have to take a side at all. Then I found out I was having a boy.
WELL, that makes one vote for, and one vote against, and the other family member who gets a vote is

YOUR SON.

-Ron
HIS body, HIS decision.
Ron_Low is offline  
#23 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 01:24 PM
 
Fyrestorm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 4,102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Also, a good position if there isn't an agreement is to go with the default.

Should we buy a new house? If you say yes and he says no...you stay where you are.

Should we paint the kitchen pink? he says no, you say yes...you either leave it like it is, or go with something neutral.

Should we vaccinate? You say yes, he says no, the default is leave him as nature intended.

Should we have an unnecessary operation preformed on our son? You say np, he says yes...the default is to not do anything.

Victim of Birth Rape & Coerced ribboncesarean.gifUnnecesareanribboncesarean.gif What makes people think they can cut up someone else's genitals? nocirc.gif
Fyrestorm is offline  
#24 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 02:43 PM
 
nd_deadhead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,152
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Poor you! I didn't have to go through this (both DH and I agreed fro the beginning that cricumcision on a healthy baby was no more than cosmetic surgery - a social custom that we did not feel obligated to perpatuate).

Your son will be born with a foreskin, and he will be perfectly normal and healthy that way.

Your son will also be born with little toes. If your DH felt strongly about cutting off your son's pinky toes at birth, he would have to come up with a pretty good reason to do it, wouldn't he? Unfortunately, in our society infant circumcision is so commonplace that many people DO have it done' without even thinking about it - without realizing that it is an operation ("it's just a snip" - No Way!)

I suggest two alternatives: first, unless your DH comes up with a valid medical reason to circumcise (from a legitimate source, like a major medical organization - there are a lot of flashy pro-circumcision web sites out there), you leave your baby the way he was born. I promise you that he will NOT find a medical organization that recommends infant circumcision, but perhaps doing the research himself will help to convince him.

Second, perhaps you can compromise - assure your DH that if your son DOES develop a problem with his foreskin that cannot be treated with less invasive means, you will agree to circumcision as treatment. Since amputation is rarely the first course of treatment for a medical condition, the chances of this are very, very slim.

Meanwhile, keep using the phrase "cosmetic surgery".

And it might not hurt to remind your DH, whom you love very much, that this isn't about HIM, and what his penis looks like - it's about your son, and the kind of penis he's born with.

Best wishes to you, and keep us updated.

If the chips are down, the buffalo is empty.

nd_deadhead is offline  
#25 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 03:29 PM
 
Ann-Marita's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,580
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron_Low View Post
WELL, that makes one vote for, and one vote against, and the other family member who gets a vote is

YOUR SON.
Thank you for saying this, Ron!

As I was reading through this thread, I kept thinking "OK, so it's a tie. There's still one more vote to be made - the son's."

Ann-Marita. I deleted my usual signature due to, oh, wait, if I say why, that might give too much away. 

Ann-Marita is offline  
#26 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 03:38 PM
 
Ann-Marita's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,580
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenekitten View Post
And when we tried to discuss hygiene, he brought up the fact that some of the cleanest women he knows have frequent yeast infections. I was so flabbergasted that he threw such a thing out that I couldn't come up with an effective argument against it.
Would he slice off part of a daughter to possibly avoid future yeast infections? Of course not. Why would it be any different for a son?

(Also, those women may have partners with asymptomatic yeast infections. And so, they keep getting re-infected, even after treatment. Unless both partners are treated at the same time, yeast can just keep getting passed between them.)

Ann-Marita. I deleted my usual signature due to, oh, wait, if I say why, that might give too much away. 

Ann-Marita is offline  
#27 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 10:34 PM
 
blackapple's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 96
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
My DH was anti-circ before we even met, he watched the Penn and Teller thing on his own one night, since it was on TV. So I am glad I didn't have to make the argument.

Well, since being intact is the default, have him research it and find reputable information that supports it. When he brings it, you have then a chance for rebuttal, which will be easy.

He will likely still be unchanged in his opinion, b/c for most men, it is an emotional choice. It takes a lot for a man (assuming he is circed) to go against it b/c in a way, it's implying his own penis is less than perfect and that is a hard pill to swallow. My DH never knew the difference, he didn't even know what circing was til the Penn and Teller show. Afterwards, he saw so much of the show's discussed cons in his own penis and was determined to not short change any son of his.

If worst comes to worst, it is the mother that has to sign it off, so he has no say. None of us want it to come to that though, as parents. But that at least is there as a safeguard.

I have also known some women to "bargain" with their DH on it. One friend gave her DH naming rights so they didn't have to circ. He is glad they didn't now.

mama to 35 m/o Oscar and Matilda + 3 Harper, Quinn, & Averill
and a hopeful
blackapple is offline  
#28 of 49 Old 03-21-2009, 10:39 PM
 
blackapple's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 96
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Oh, one more thing. My uncle wasn't circed, and my grandparents were given terrible advice about foreskin care (to force it back at each change, applying vaseline, cleansing it with alcohol after poos, etc. Needless to say, he got major scarring and thus infections for his whole life. He's always complained and wished he was circed. Never mind that his on father and all 4 of his brothers were intact and never had a problem. He refuses to believe it was b/c they treated it wrongly, not knowing any better. So, when he ended up getting bit on his foreskin by a brown recluse, which turned into infection, and was so bad and invasive, it required circing, he was telling me a few days later:

"See, you really should circ Oscar. Mom and dad could have saved me a lot of trouble."

I replied "Um, well, if you hadn't had your foreskin, the bite would have been on your penis, and that would have been removed instead."

He goes, well...I guess. Never said another word about it.

I know that is a rare case, getting bit by a spider on your penis, but it does happen and for reasons such as that is one of the many functions of the foreskin- to protect the glans. Why lose that protection needlessly?

mama to 35 m/o Oscar and Matilda + 3 Harper, Quinn, & Averill
and a hopeful
blackapple is offline  
#29 of 49 Old 03-22-2009, 01:28 PM
 
Galatea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 7,166
Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
I just put my foot down with my dh and he eventually came around on his own. I figured it was his issue to work out, since it was more about his circumcision than the baby's.

That is why your dh is obsessing about "needing" it done later in life - he is subconsciously in pain for his own circumcision, yet still needs to think it was necessary, so he is transferring his own pain onto the baby. Therefore the baby will eventually "need" it done, but it will be painful. Understand?

This is what I say, and there is no arguing it. You will only have stewardship of the penis for 3 years. For the next 80 years, your son will be the one living with it, peeing out of it, and having sex with it. Therefore all permanent decisions about it should belong to him. If he "needs" to be circumcised as an adult (and it is more likely he will need a mastectomy for breast cancer), he can make the decision himself after exhausting all treatment options, and he will get adequate pain relief during and after. There is nothing emergent about his baby foreskin and so it can just be left alone.

After that, it is your dh's responsibility to work out his own issues. The more you try to make it easy on him, the less responsibility he has to take for himself.

DS1 2004 ~ DS2 2005 ~ DD1 2008 ~ DS3 2010 ~ DD2 due Dec. 2014
On hospital bedrest for pPROM since 23 weeks
Galatea is online now  
#30 of 49 Old 03-22-2009, 03:10 PM
 
NaturalMindedMomma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,959
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Tell him, ok!

As long as you get to cut off your daughters breasts at birth, just in case she gets breast cancer, which is much more prevalent than any of the REAL reasons to circumcise.

Don't consent. Attach a sign to your son in the hospital if you have to.
NaturalMindedMomma is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off