ARGH! (rant about a friend) - Mothering Forums
The Case Against Circumcision > ARGH! (rant about a friend)
lotusdebi's Avatar lotusdebi 07:25 PM 12-30-2003

Dragonfly's Avatar Dragonfly 08:49 PM 12-30-2003
Originally posted by lotusdebi
She got angry that I'm not respecting her parenting decisions.
Yeah... what decisions? It's apparent she's circumventing the decision-making process and just going with the default option.

If people aren't even willing to TRY to make the best choices for their children, I can't be around them. I can't support them in their bad parenting choices.
It is so hard to see little ones wounded. Your anger and upset come through so clearly - it sounds as if this is necessary for self-preservation.

if you want it. I'm sorry for your experience.
lotusdebi's Avatar lotusdebi 09:38 PM 12-30-2003
asherah's Avatar asherah 09:59 PM 12-30-2003
Maybe give her some more time to come around?

When I was newly pregnant, I knew NOTHING. And of course I was doing a lot of reading.. but there isn't a lot of stuff out there about anti-circ. I really just assumed I would, it never occured to me to question it.

Then I joined hipmama.. and stumbled into a thread on circ.
Well needless to say I got reamed from here to eternity for even mentioning that I was CONSIDERING it.
I was pretty upset.. but the fact that people felt so strongly about it got me thinking. And I eventually DID do the research, and I did not circ.

The place was gone before I could go back and tell them they'd gotten through to me.. albeit not very kindly. I felt really defensive at first, too.

Maybe once she cools off she will think about what you said and reconsider...

If not.. well at least you know you spoke your truth.
Sarah's Avatar Sarah 12:49 AM 12-31-2003
Who knows Debi... maybe she will try to go blow off steam to someone else about how "mean" you were and hope she gets some sympathy, and she might find out more people agree with you...

I am really proud of you for speaking up on behalf of her baby! Good for you.

Love Sarah
TigerTail's Avatar TigerTail 02:25 AM 12-31-2003
i agree with everything you said, dragonfly, except that imo, intact IS default. you can *pretend* you're just 'going with the flow' to circ, but no way does anyone let someone cut off a piece of their baby without thinking about it- it's just what they're thinking is wrong, wrong, wrong. definately not researching enough, definately making choices in error, but it's no longer the days when people are circ'd without parental consent- er, *intentionally*- it's a choice, all right.

btw, this is in no way meant to hurt or offend anyone who mistakenly and without good info has circ'd their boy(s) and is filled with regrets- who could make you feel any worse even if they wanted to? ((((((hugs))))

debi, you go, girl. more people ought to be willing to piss people off when it comes to assaulting little children. someday she may bless you for caring enough to try.

lotusdebi's Avatar lotusdebi 03:09 AM 12-31-2003
Dragonfly's Avatar Dragonfly 03:19 AM 12-31-2003
Originally posted by suseyblue
i agree with everything you said, dragonfly, except that imo, intact IS default.
I don't want a support thread to turn into a disagreement - but I'm not so sure I agree. I know that had I done nothing in the hospital but sign all consent forms that were put in front of me (without reading - which, I imagine - is what many parents do), ds would have been circumcised. This could very well have happened if I hadn't stumbled on the anti-circumcision board at another website because, until then, I was completely unaware that there was any other option. And my medical providers certainly didn't bring it up.

Anyway - just wanted to clarify. I *wish* that intact was the default, but I think it often does work out that way in reality.
Xenogenesis's Avatar Xenogenesis 07:18 AM 12-31-2003
Wow. I don't blame you for being upset with her. And yeah, you're right . . . 'bout the flies-n-honey thing, but . . . only you and yourself know how to react to your friend, after all, You Have Established A Relationship.

I am so proud of you for speaking your mind/thoughts on circumcision. I only dream more people would.

Maybe mail her a real nice friendship card letting her know you love her with all your heart along with an envelope of decadent bath salts . . .

ps. mamajulie has a REAL GOOD bumpersticker . . .

There are other pamphlets to print out that others can prolly provide the links for. Afterwards you can go thru them with her and bring up a topic or two that seems to strike/address her way of thinking.
Frankly Speaking's Avatar Frankly Speaking 12:39 PM 12-31-2003

Something that you may want to try is to give her some circumcision stats. Since she lives in the Pacific Northwest, only about 30% of his classmates will be circumcised and just across the border in BC, only about 15% will be circumcised. That will bring up all kinds of questions.

What do all of these parents know that she doesn't? Why aren't all of these boys having hygiene issues and infections? Why aren't the medico's seeing problems and strongly recommending circumcision? What will her son say when he realizes most of his friends are intact? What will he say when he learns the truth about circumcision? What will his future lovers think about her intense interest in cutting off part of his sexual organ?

May be some food for thought for her and the beginnings of a change of opinion.


PS: Of course, peer influence is also a strong motivator. Keep it up!
Xenogenesis's Avatar Xenogenesis 05:19 PM 12-31-2003
Condense/combine your last post with some of Frank's suggestions and you'd have an interesting note for her.

lotusdebi's Avatar lotusdebi 12:56 AM 01-03-2004
Xenogenesis's Avatar Xenogenesis 05:01 PM 01-03-2004
If It Were Me, I Would Try The Letter First.

Emails seem to come across as sometimes impersonal and can all too easily be erased.

A letter can be picked up at a later date and hopefully read more than once.