Refused to help with a circ today, rather long vent... - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 30 Old 06-28-2011, 05:12 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hi all!

I am a seasoned OB nurse, and, after some time away from work due to a move and being a SAHM, I started working again this month at a very small regional hospital as a contingent nurse.  Where I worked before, I was not expected to assist with circumcision, as this was the responsibility of the tech in the nursery.  I have a strong personal belief about circumcision--I will not participate in this procedure.

 

Anyhow, I had a baby boy in my care today, and I refused to help with the circ (restraining, etc). The pediatrician responded very angrily that it wasn't ok for me to refuse.  I replied that, in fact, it was, since I had been told at my HR orientation that if I was uncomfortable with something I was asked to do, I was supported in declining, as long as it was not endangering/delaying care/etc.  Another nurse was willing to help, so she stepped in. I stood by to ask the other nurse some questions about the after-care protocol at this institution, as the ped muttered about how I'd get along with the "anti-circ" pediatrician in his office.  He then asked me if I had children, and where I took them for medical care.  


After the circ, the baby was crying, breathing fast and clearly uncomfortable.  I asked if there were orders for tylenol placed, and he scoffed, saying "they don't need that, they tolerate this just fine."  He left (leaving all the dirty instruments, scalpel, and foreskin just sitting out on a table), and went to the mother's room to update her.  I brought the baby back to her, and placed him in her arms, planning to help her get the baby undressed and skin to skin; she mentioned the baby's noisy fast  breathing.  I told her we'd place the baby skin to skin, and he'd likely calm right away.  The pediatrician looked at me like I was crazy, and demanded that the baby be brought back to the nursery for monitoring.  Once there, all was well, monitoring was reassuring and he told me "bring him back in a little while."  When I asked him to tell me what he meant by a little while, he huffed and said "when you think he's stable." I replied that, in my judgement, the baby needn't have left the mother's room at all (since he was in no apparent distress other than pain and need for comfort).  He rolled his eyes, and asked the other nurse to look after the baby; he then left the unit.  I brought the babe back to mom, put him skin to skin and his breathing slowed, evened out and he closed his eyes and rested. 30 minutes later he chose to nurse.  

 

Shortly after, I was called to my manager's office to discuss the phone call she'd gotten from the pedi. I was very comfortable representing myself, and made it clear that I wouldn't assist with circs. I reviewed the conversation from my point of view.  She kept trying to work me around to saying that I would if nobody else was available. I will not. I'd rather not work there, or just work night shift, when circs are not done.  The same "anti-circ" pedi I mentioned above is not questioned or challenged on his refusal to cut boys' genitals.  I brought this up, and got no satisfactory reassurance that I would be held to that same standard.  Basically, she said that she thought the pedi treated me this way because he thought I was challenging him. Duh. But, that doesn't make it okay!! Professional communication is NOT a strong suit in many hospitals, but it's certainly something to shoot for!

 

I'm frustrated, angry and sad. Yet, I'm also feeling very good that I stood up for my beliefs and didn't get bullied into it. The confrontation with the pedi that followed was very unprofessional, as were the pedi's questions about my children and their medical care.  I let my manager know that, and also shared with her that this was not the first unprofessional interaction I've had on this unit (4 weeks into working there).  I let her know that I'd be happy to have a mediated discussion with the pedi, but that his behavior was not ok with me.

Thanks for reading, and any feedback is welcome.  Mostly, just needed to vent, and review this after my shift. 


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#2 of 30 Old 06-28-2011, 09:24 PM
 
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It is so awesome you were able to stand up to the pedi. I love how you advocated for your little patient for skin-to-skin contact. I don't understand the lack of pain management for newborns. Why are so many mat/child units in the dark ages still?? Evidence-based practice seems to lose every time when it comes to tradition and hospital policy.

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#3 of 30 Old 06-28-2011, 09:41 PM
 
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why do you think he was asking about your children and their medical care? did you tell him who you see? do you think he will go to that pediatrician and bad mouth you in any way?

 

let us know how it turns out for you in the weeks ahead. 

 

i think the best thing you can do is stay calm. at least you have given the ped something to think about.


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#4 of 30 Old 06-28-2011, 09:55 PM
 
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I commend you for refusing to participate in the violation of a child's bodily integrity!  You are type of compassionate people that are needed in the medical community.

 

That a child is forced to undergo surgery without anesthesia is unethical and horriffic.  That comfort measures from his mother were denied to him adds insult to injury.

 

I am not surprised at the lack of professional conduct from the ped. 

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#5 of 30 Old 06-29-2011, 01:16 AM
 
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Good job Mama!! thumb.gif


Cindy, joyful SAH mama to rainbow1284.gif William & Katherinefly-by-nursing2.gif Forever missing Amelia 7-12-09 angel3.gif  signcirc1.gifsaynovax.giflactivist.gif Ask me about my natural cesarean! 

 

 

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#6 of 30 Old 06-29-2011, 03:32 AM
 
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Great job!! My mom was a maternity nurse, and now a hypnobirthing instructor and IBCLC. She is the reason my 3 boys are intact. It's good to know there are some medical profesionals out there that feel the same way.

 
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#7 of 30 Old 06-29-2011, 09:48 AM
 
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Wow, it's remarkable how professional you were and how unprofessional that physician was.  To begin with, if you are anti-circ, dealing with this kind of situation, pre-op or post-op, is unsettling and I think you did an awesome job.  He had absolutely no right to ask you about your kids.  I hope you won't have to work with him in the near future, but if you do, your idea for a mediated discussion is great.  

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#8 of 30 Old 06-29-2011, 04:05 PM
 
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I haven't posted here in a really long time, but happened to be browsing today, and how perfect that your post was at the top of the list! I have a similar story to tell from last Fall. Please feel free to PM me if you want to correspond more about this, as I probably won't be checking the board again. Hopefully some of my story will provide you emotional support and concrete ideas for dealing with you own situation.

 

I am an RN working in newborn nursery and NICU for the past 11+ years. I have twice been threatened with termination for refusing to assist in circumcisions and getting reported by several docs involved who took offense to it (others were perfectly fine with asking someone else to help). The first time it happened years back, I was taken by surprise on the disciplinary action they undertook against me, and I didn't know how to defend myself. So I ended up walking on eggshells and feeling very disempowered for a long time. Then last Fall, I had to defend myself again, over a very stressful 3 month period, in which they really were on the verge of firing me if I didn't agree to their conditions. But this time I wasn't going to let them walk all over me. I negotiated my way through 3 difficult meetings with my supervisors and HR all by myself, wrote position statements and policy proposals, met with the head of the Ethics Committee, consulted with lawyers, looked up JCAHO and federal healthcare conscience protection regs, and also sought out support and advice from others who had been down the same path - Marilyn Milos, Mary Conant, and Betty Sperlich (of Nurses for the Rights of the Child) among them. It very scary, very stressful, and very exhausting, but the short story is, I am still employed, and no I still don't assist with circumcisions.

 

They felt they were being accomodating by saying that, OK,  I didn't have to assist myself in circumcisions, but that if asked to assist, I at least needed to get someone else to assist. This was where we could not find common ground. Although I told them I would assist if there were a medical emergency during the circumcision, and that I would do whatever after care and teaching was needed, I maintained that I would not get someone else to assist with the performance of the regular circumcision itself, since that to me was being complicit with an unethical practice and system as much as doing it myself.

 

JCAHO regs support the principle of health care conscientious objection, with the stipulation that it must not delay, interrupt, or compromise patient care, and each hospital must have a policy on this. (Of course, circumcision does not constitute any kind of medically valid "care", but they didn't buy that argument.) My hospital's policy included in three places that care must not be interrupted, and while it listed multiple factors that were to be taken into consideration in responding to employees' objections to participation (e.g. the ethical issue itself, alternative means of providing staffing, avoiding future problems with the same issue), all of these were ignored. All they cared about was that the provision of circumcisions must not be interrupted. Bleah! When I countered that federal policy allowed for healthcare professionals not to have to participate, they said that they had checked with "corporate legal" which had said that my contract states that I have to do whatever they tell me to do ("other tasks as assigned").

 

If we had failed to come to agreement on this point, they were going to terminate me, with my only recourse being appealing to the Ethics Committee, part of the HR conscientious objection policy. The chaplain who was the head of the ethics committee had been intrigued by the information I had given him, but he did not seem like he was going to stick his neck out to fight for me. I was told I could present to the Ethics Committee, but I could not talk about the ethics of circumcision, only my case for why I should not have to participate in getting someone to assist, and only for about 15 minutes. Plus they wanted the Ethics Committee to meet within the next few days (the week before Christmas!), and come to an immediate decision, because the negotiations had dragged on long enough in their opinion. If the Ethics Committee approach had failed (which I'm sure it would have under the conditions), I believe I would in fact have been terminated, and my only other recourse would have been to undertake an expensive, ugly, and hugely stressful lawsuit, which I believe also probably would have failed.

 

But at the last moment, they batted an eye. In wrapping up my final meeting with them, I said that I valued my job at the hospital, and I had considered every way I could think of to make this situation work. The only options I could see for myself were to either 1) make myself unavailable everytime a doc came into the nursery to do a circ (thus taking away from care of my other patients), 2) doing what I was asked to do (assist) and feeling I was compromising my conscience, or 2) having a conversation about my ethical stance with any doc that asked for help (right in the middle of them doing the circ), asking that they get someone else to help them, and hoping for the best. My supervisor then got the aha! idea that I could write a letter on hospital letter head and with her express support to communicate to all the docs that did circumcisions that I had ethical objections to circumcision, and respectfully asking them not to ask me to assist, also listing the situations under which I would assist (eg. emergency). To make a long story short, that's what we did, and the episode was over. Not an ideal solution, but a shift on their part, and the best communication to doctors and the best support I had gotten from them in the 11 years I had worked there.

 

Of course, now they have changed to a new staffing model recommended by AWHONN in which a nurse has to be present for every circumcision. So now instead of random occasions of request for assistance, ALL nurses are in a position of being expected to assist, including all the postpartum nurses who never had to do it before. Besides making me sick to see all the nurses being inculcated into taking on this role in sheep-like manner, it leaves me again in an unsupported position, as so far no alternative system of staffing when a nurse objects to participation has been put in place. If I had a patient who was going to get circumcised on a given day, I would again be put in a position of having to get someone to take my place. As far as I know, the charge nurses all understand my position and basically respect it, but there is no directive from management for what they should do if I refuse to assist. So for now, I just try to ask for assignments in the morning of boys that are known to not be getting discharged (or circumcised) that day so as to avoid the problem. Back to having to be a rat trying to stay out of the streetlight. Having just gone through all this in the Fall,  I don't have the stomach to go in and rabblerouse for a conscinetious objection policy all over again now for this new staffing arrangement, especially since I am already a persona non grata in their eyes in this regard, and they are swamped with lots of snags and annoyed employees with the new staffing system, for other reasons. I guess that's part of their strategy, to wear you down.

 

Although my supervisors were not nasty to me throughout this episode, they did lay some trips on me like "you're imposing on your fellow nurses when you refuse to assist" "other nurses resent when you do this" "if you care about babies, why won't you do everything you can to relieve their pain?" (i.e. stand there an hold a pacifier in their mouth!!) "you're not a team player", "you have to make a decision whether you want to work here or not," and pulling out the big guns like "corporate legal" etc. Still,  in honesty, they were mostly sympathetic, good listeners, and patient mediators. It could have been much worse.

 

I think there were some things that helped this work out as positively as it did (at least before the change to the AWHONN staffing), which might give some indicators to help you. First, I had already been there for 11 years, and we were all familiar with each other, and I was a valued part of the staff there. I really don't think they wanted to fire me, but they had boxed themselves into a position, so I think they were happy to jump at a solution that seemed to bridge our two positions (the letter to the docs). Since you've only been there a month, I think you will have to show a lot of professionalism and good will in negotiating this with them, since the rapport and trust is not already in place. Second, I think the fact that this played out over several meetings over several months (I asked for time to work up responses, and then there were interruptions in my supervisor's availability) gave them time to do some internal processing on this, rather than force a hard-line solution immediately. Hopefully, you can use this to your advantage in this situation too.

 

Also, I would show your willingness to contribute solutions to the situation, not just refusing, such as suggesting alternate staffing arrangements, or communications processes. I would also suggest you write up this recent interaction with the doctor in detail to refer to later if other accusations or episodes come up later. (The same doctor became involved in both of my disciplinary actions, and I should have recorded all the details of our original interaction to prove that he was being an a**hole the first time around). Also, I would write up some kind of position statement that describes your ethical stance, what you are or are not willing to do, expresses a good faith desire to collaborate with them to find a solution. Also, I would become familiar with the language of the hospital policy on staff rights to refusal to participate in procedures to which they have ethical, religious, or cultural objections. Also, try to find other literature and policy statements that relate to conscientious objection in heatlh care settings.

 

I hope you will send me a PM. I am very happy to correspond with you on this. You are not alone, and each one of us that goes through this is educating our colleagues and paving the way for making it easier for those that come after us. One big thing that will lead to the end of circumcision, is when health professionals are educated enough, and feel supported in standing up and saying "I will not participate in this." Good luck. Gillian RN

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#9 of 30 Old 06-29-2011, 04:57 PM
 
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wow, way to go haurelia and Gillian. Hospitals need more professionals like you.

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#10 of 30 Old 06-29-2011, 05:19 PM
 
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Haurelia, I think you did a great job advocating for yourself and your patient. I recently left my job as an OB hosp. nurse because Maternity and Newborn departments were merging to "mother-baby" care. I would have had to at least help w/ circ care, teaching, etc. and I couldn't do that (I think they would have expected me to assist w/ circs also but I'm not 100% on that now). Anyway, I was ready for something else for a while and it just seemed like the right time to leave. I think you handled the situation w/ grace & tact. I don't see how an employer could force you to assist w/ it if it goes against your ethics. They can't force a nurse to assist w/ an abortion if she doesn't want to. Of course, one would have to if they took a job at an abortion clinic but seeing as you didn't hire on to work in a "circ clinic", I don't see how they could force you. I'm also not trying to debate abortion or not, only that some people in the medical field are very much against it, others are not (feel I must say that otherwise someone at this forum might feel I'm trying to debate preg. termination).

 

Anyway, I wish you would have asked the doctor "Why do you ask? Who is the health care provider of your children"??? Maybe that would have shut him up. I agree w/ others that he got miffed because he felt questioned as a doctor and many have huge egos that can't handle that! But who knows, maybe his "anti-circ" doctor he works with has been giving him a hard time and maybe he's starting to question it. Probably not. It's good to know there is an anti-circ doctor in your area. Maybe find out his/her name and post it so others can use him.

 

Stick to your guns, you did a good thing! You didn't say (that I see) if the Dr used a penile block or EMLA before the circ. If it's not a mandatory protocol at your facility, I wonder if you could bring it up and suggest it to your manager?


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#11 of 30 Old 06-29-2011, 05:54 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks to all for reading and replying.

Glongley, I am going to PM you. Thank you. 

Night_Nurse, I used the abortion example for my manager, as it was one I was most familiar with in my previous workplace (where 2nd trimester abortions were commonplace and staff who weren't willing to provide care to those women were excused).  To answer your question, the doc did use a penile block for the circ. 

 

I wish more health care providers would be open to really looking at what a circ is, and reconsidering their position.  First do no harm! 

 

 


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#12 of 30 Old 06-29-2011, 08:05 PM
 
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Bravo to all of you. We need more ethical health care providers such as yourselves!

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#13 of 30 Old 06-30-2011, 06:41 PM
 
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You nurses are heroes!  I'm glad you both stand up for your beliefs and for babies!


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#14 of 30 Old 07-01-2011, 03:26 AM
 
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Stopping circumcision may very well reside in conscientious objectors like yourselves. Kudos for stepping up! Someone in the "circumcision machine" has to say no. The baby is saying no, but he isn't given a say in the matter. Someone in the cycle has to say no for him: nurses, doctors, parents, insurance companies, or legislators.

 

 

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#15 of 30 Old 07-01-2011, 03:28 AM
 
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You both deserve commendations for holding to your principles and professionalism in the face of unprofessional brow beating and pressure tactics.  Great job!  I understand how difficult it can be, having been through some occassions similar, though unrelated to circumcision.  That took not only courage but maintainig a clear head.

 

Regards

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#16 of 30 Old 07-04-2011, 06:00 AM
 
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I can't believe he had the nerve to ask about your own children and who their care provider was. Clearly none of his business and not pertinent to the situation at hand. 

 

And yes we need more health care providers like you both.

 

 

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#17 of 30 Old 07-08-2011, 01:49 PM
 
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Reading this scares me to death. I'm starting nursing school this fall with the ultimate goal of becoming a CNM. This would necessitate working in L&D or postpartum before grad school. I am terrified that this is going to be an issue. I absolutely will not have anything to do with circumcision - I will not set up, assist in any way (except in emergencies like hemorrhage), or find someone to assist in my place. I figured it would be a good idea to tell them up front when I get hired, but I worry I won't get a job if I do. I also don't want to be in the place of having to assist in childhood circumcisions during my surgery rotation. Since I know that 99.9% of them are unnecessary or iatrogenic, I don't feel I could assist in those as well.


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#18 of 30 Old 07-08-2011, 10:05 PM
 
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'haurelia',  Gillian and 'Night Nurse:  I applaud all of you for your courage in standing up for what is right and ethical.  It disturbs me greatly that you have to do this and face threats of disciplinary action.  Needless to say, stories such as yours do nothing to invoke trust in our doctors, or for that matter the management (and ethics commitees) in our hospitals.

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#19 of 30 Old 07-09-2011, 08:18 AM
 
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I didn't have time to read everything above... but there are some good resources:

 

NURSES FOR THE RIGHTS OF THE CHILD

http://nurses.cirp.org/

including a link to this article: R.N. Conscientious Objectors to Infant Circumcision: A Model for Nurse Empowerment  http://nurses.cirp.org/R.N._Conscientious_Objecto.html

 

http://www.circumstitions.com/nurses.html

 

 

The Nurses of St. Vincent: Saying "No" to Circumcision

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOjYrxzCMmI#F6gQHc54mJ

 

 

This also has come up on this board several times over the years, so you might be able to pull more info or contacts up.

 

Good luck.


Jessica

 

 


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#20 of 30 Old 07-09-2011, 09:34 PM
 
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Since newborn circumcisions are never an emergency medical necessity (and I suspect are pretty much never medically necessary emergency or not), I wish "baby friendly" hospitals would throw away their circ equipment.

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#21 of 30 Old 07-10-2011, 01:27 PM
 
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There is a Facebook group called "Nurses Against the Circumcision of Minors" where you can post your stories, learn, and seek support.

http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Nurses-Against-the-Circumcision-of-Minors/109163295802166

 

@Minkajane: We need more nurses and CNMs like you, who already get that circumcision is wrong! Yes, you may run up against some situations in your training or future workplace. But you will play an incredibly important role in the shift MUST take place in the health professions over this. You can educate your fellow students, professors, and colleagues.You can speak with authority to the parents you work with. And you can lead by example in your professional life by refusing to participate, with your solid knowledge base in science and ethics. There are many more of us out there to collaborate with, and who can be an emotional safety net for you, if the going gets rough. Together, with more nurses like you, we will get there! Bravo for the start of your nursing training journey!

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#22 of 30 Old 07-11-2011, 08:06 PM
 
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Hi!  I'm a NICU nurse and I don't assist with circ's either.  It's nothing official but I haven't done one in 3 years. 

My job is (or should be) to take care of sick infants, not take time away from my sick patients and their families to do a non-therapeutic procedure.

 

We had a baby on supplemental oxygen who was circ'ed the other day.  Makes me ill.  That baby was nowhere near healthy enough for elective genital surgery.

 

Anyway, I'm very glad to "meet" other anti circ RN's. Fortunately,  I work with many in my unit, including my asst. manager.

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#23 of 30 Old 07-12-2011, 11:05 AM
 
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@Bug McGee... you are lucky to have allies in your workplace. There are a few other nurses in my unit who didn't circumcise their sons, and others who I have educated about the lack of necessity of circumcision, but no body is in the same place I am of refusing to be part of it as a matter of conscience. I think people just don't want to stick their necks out - easier to just go along and not rock the boat. Nurses are trained basically that this is something we do as health professionals, not really necessary but could have potential benefits and no real down sides, and its the parents right to make the choice [Note: I'm NOT saying this is true, but it is more or less what health professionals are taught]. It takes a lot of self-education, and a lot of inner strength to come to the place of standing up to such a system of ethically unreflective complacency.

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#24 of 30 Old 07-13-2011, 05:03 PM
 
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I just made an account here because I saw this thread.  First I would like to say thank you for standing up for what you know is right.  I have 4 boys: 1 circumcised and 3 intact.  With my first child, I was barely 18 years old and that's no excuse for not doing my own research and making a decision rather than just blindly saying okay.  I wanted to share the story very briefly, nearly 22 years ago.  When the nurse came in to talk to me about circumcising my son, she told me it was necessary that he would have all kinds of problems if I didn't agree to it.  I asked, Will it hurt?  She said, No, he'll be fine.  I asked, Would he cry?  She said, No, they usually don't cry.  I asked, Could I be there with him?  She said, Absolutely not.  It's not allowed.  I said, Can you at least tell me when you're doing it so I can pray during the procedure?  She said yes.  The next morning, another nurse brought him to me and he was asleep but sucking hard on his pacifier and acting like when a child cries hard trying to catch his breath.  I didn't know what or why.  I asked when they would be doing the circumcision and she told me it was already done.  No one even came to tell me they were doing it as I asked.  I was so sad, obviously he had pain.

 

Another quick story.  A few months ago I sat with a mom in labor.  I am not a doula, but I tend to end up in that roll several times a year.  Anyway, this mom was at a hospital I wasn't familiar with, I drove 2 hours to get there.  When I got there, the nurse had the mom talked into the epidural, told her that she needed it and it would be so much easier to deal with labor.  Which part of that is true, but this mom wanted a natural childbirth without the epidural.  So I talked to her about what she said she wanted previously, and how she would feel after her baby was born.  I talked to her about how well she was coping and progressing.  We hadn't talked long, the mom was riding the fence about having the epidural or not.  Then it was shift change, and she had a new nurse.  The new nurse was very matter of fact, told her she could totally do this without the epidural if she wanted to.  She reassurred her that she was doing well and progressing well the same as I had.  At this point, two of us said the same thing and she decided against the epidural.

 

The point I'm trying to make is that as nurses interacting with parents, can you tell your own story?  Can you say you didn't circumcise your own boys.  Here are the benefits that helped us make the decision not to circumcise?  You don't even have to mention it from a medical stand point, just talking about real life.  I can think of so many times in my life that one person said something that caused me to think and research and make my own decision, this too being one of them.  We all get caught up in the norms around us, they become so second nature we don't even think to question it.  What, or why, or anything else.  We do it without thinking, just like brushing out teeth.  No second thought.  I always said that I wanted to be one to dare to judge the standards or what is right and wrong, because who made those standards anyway.  But to do that, first I have to be aware.  I'm thankful to the lady who first mentioned that circumcision wasn't necessary to me.  I never would have given it a thought otherwise.

 

Keep standing up, I'm thankful for you and the changes you're making in our world. 

 

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#25 of 30 Old 07-14-2011, 07:35 PM
 
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Reading this scares me to death. I'm starting nursing school this fall with the ultimate goal of becoming a CNM. This would necessitate working in L&D or postpartum before grad school. I am terrified that this is going to be an issue. I absolutely will not have anything to do with circumcision - I will not set up, assist in any way (except in emergencies like hemorrhage), or find someone to assist in my place. I figured it would be a good idea to tell them up front when I get hired, but I worry I won't get a job if I do. I also don't want to be in the place of having to assist in childhood circumcisions during my surgery rotation. Since I know that 99.9% of them are unnecessary or iatrogenic, I don't feel I could assist in those as well.

Yep - I start clinicals in the fall, and my OB/peds rotation will be in two more semesters. I WILL NOT participate in circumcision. I just won't. I want to be an RN, but I know that I won't work in L&D, OB, or neonatal care because I don't want to have any part of circumcision. Thinking about assisting in such a barbaric "procedure" makes me ill, angry, and so, so sad. I'm praying that no one asks me to participate while I'm in school. That has the potential of getting really ugly. 
 

 


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DS 10 reading.gif  DS 8 fencing.gif DS 5, DD 3 energy.gif and a new DS  belly.gif 3/2011
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#26 of 30 Old 07-21-2011, 05:21 PM
 
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Wow, I am in awe of your moral courage!  Having nurses that are educated in this barbaric practice, may someday at least help along more education of the negative factors of cutting baby boys.  In my opinion, you both did the absolute right thing.  I think that circumcision (and every bit of information about it) should be routinely given to new parents of baby boys.  In child birth education classes, they should show a video to parents so they will know just what kind of barbaric surgery they would be putting their baby through.  Why not?  They show birth videos , why not educate them on the facts of circumcision? It's only right to fully inform parents to be.  I think that if they show a video of a circumcision, NO ONE in their right mind would allow that to be done to their precious baby boy!

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#27 of 30 Old 07-21-2011, 06:16 PM
 
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Nice work standing up to the Pedi. I am also an RN and have been treated with disrespect by physicians. You have set an example for your co-workers and perhaps given them the courage to not take any crap off other physicians. Health care is a team effort. More docs need to get on board with this mentality. I am curious, was he an older doc? I find the younger ones are much more team oriented and not so quick to jump down your throat. Either way, keep it up!!!!!!!!!!!!


A Mommy In Love!!!

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#28 of 30 Old 07-22-2011, 08:13 AM
 
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  In child birth education classes, they should show a video to parents so they will know just what kind of barbaric surgery they would be putting their baby through.  Why not?  They show birth videos , why not educate them on the facts of circumcision? It's only right to fully inform parents to be.  I think that if they show a video of a circumcision, NO ONE in their right mind would allow that to be done to their precious baby boy!


Many years ago I was chatting to an expectant Mom about prenatal classes while we were waiting for our cars in a tire shop. I asked her what the current sentiment was with regard to circumcision. She replied that they had been shown a video of a circ being performed, and "there is no way we are doing that to our baby".  I was so happy to hear that, and I am quite sure that a graphic video would put off all but the hardest of people.
 

 

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#29 of 30 Old 08-02-2011, 04:39 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hey all! Thanks for commenting on my post...I haven't been back on MDC in a while, obviously, so I'm just reading all your responses. love.gif


Just wanted to share with you RN students that I was never asked to assist with or observe a circ in a clinical rotation in OB or peds.  I did assist with several as a student in my role as a nurse's aide in a hospital OB unit.  Assisting with those few circs are what made me dig into this procedure and decide against doing it to my own kids, or helping with it. 

 

To answer Mommyshome's question, I don't share my personal details with clients unless they ask me a direct personal question. I am always careful (with many issues other than just circ) to say "this is what I decided was best for me" or "some people have found that..." or something along those lines. I think it's a fine line to talk about personal opinion when caring for folks in a medical setting; there's always a chance it could be used in a manner in which it was not intended, kwim? If they ask for evidence-based rationale for a procedure/intervention, that's a different story.  Hope that makes sense.


There's been no further fall out related to the incident.  The other nurses on the floor (all 12 of them) seem to have been informed by someone (I'm assuming my manager) that I don't do circs.  I haven't been asked to explain, or challenged in any way.  I haven't encountered the pedi again since the incident, but plan to continue with professional behavior and respond proactively to any unprofessional behavior aimed toward me.  He is an older pedi, to answer the question asked above, I believe in his early 60s and reportedly close to retirement.  A friend who uses him as her son's pedi revealed to me that he told her he didn't like doing circs.  Perhaps that's where a lot of this stems from? I don't know.  

 

At any rate, thanks again for all the support and encouragement.  thumb.gif


Married to P and mama to DS (1/09)blahblah.gifand DD  (09/13 babygirl.gif). I'm into friends and family, gardening, exercise, yoga, reading, knitting, photos, traditional foods, breastfeeding, home birth, babywearing, and much more. 
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#30 of 30 Old 08-02-2011, 08:41 PM
 
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That's great!  Where I live, only the hippie or new agey classes inform about the specifics of circumcision, and that's a shame.  I am going to find a way to inform parents in one way or another!

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