Need encouraging stories....dh's who were pro but turned anti - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 26 Old 06-26-2005, 07:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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A little background...this is our first boy after three girls. During my last pregnancy we discussed circ some b/c we didn't find out the baby's gender. At the time I kinda left it up to him...but no decision was ever made. Since my preg w/ her and before I was preg this time, I have become anti-circ.

Last night I was surfing around here and found the anti-circ celebs thread. I told dh about some of them I had seen on there. He wasn't terribly impressed...but asked me what I thought about circ. I told him I really didn't want it done. I asked him what he thought...he told me he's leaning towards the pro side.

So I've made it my goal to change his mind. :LOL I have read thru several of the sites listed in a thread here (some I have seen before)...which cements my beliefs even more. When the time is right, I'm going to present as much info as I can to him (mostly the stats since he's more that type of guy...rather than the story type stuff). However, I'm still nervous that dh will be very adamant about getting it done.

Encourage me please!!! Were you successful in changing your dh's mind??
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#2 of 26 Old 06-26-2005, 08:18 PM
 
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Yes, I was. This was years ago though, before the internet was as popular as it is now. (1994)

I just told my husband that I felt like it was no different than FGM. He eventually got my point. Unfortunately our 1st son was circ'd w/o consent. We were, however, able to protect our 2nd son.
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#3 of 26 Old 06-26-2005, 08:18 PM
 
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yes. I made my arguments against it (his reasoning was "locker room teasing" mostly...), and I also said "over my dead body". He knew I was serious, and now he's anti-circ.
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#4 of 26 Old 06-26-2005, 10:15 PM
 
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Heather, did he say why he was leaning to the "pro" side?

For my husband, it was the "a boy has to look like his father" thing. We argued multiple times before it finally occured to me to ask him about his own father's status. When he realized he had no answer for me, that was the end of discussion. That baby and the next were girls but on the third try I got my boy! There were no talk of circumcision either!

If I was going through this same thing now, I would have showed my husband this:

http://www.cafepress.com/cp/browse/N...6336_bt-1_nr-1

Good luck!
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#5 of 26 Old 06-26-2005, 10:54 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Pam ~ Not yet. He had just gotten home from working 11hrs and we were both super tired (which means I was SUPER emotional..lol). I just left it at that and knew it would be brought up later on. Of course, it's constantly on my mind now b/c I realize what side he's on. I think part of it might be to look like Daddy...but I'm not 100% sure. Until we do talk again, I'm trying to empower myself with info so I can show him how pointless circ is.

:LOL That mug is great!!!


Thanks ladies! Keep 'em coming!!
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#6 of 26 Old 06-26-2005, 10:55 PM
 
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I told mine, "if it ain't broke, don't let some idiot doc try to fix it." He's actually very anti-circ now, to the point of making fun of my foreskin-squeamish MIL.

But if he'd pushed the issue, I would have flat-out told him that he had no right to get damaging cosmetic surgery done on our son. None.

On another note, men with foreskins are more... ahem... fun. I've been down both roads; trust me on this one. I can't understand why this is still being done.
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#7 of 26 Old 06-26-2005, 11:11 PM
 
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My DH was initially for circumcision because he is. Not to 'look like him' but because he assumed that being circumcised is the best there is because he knows no different.

Once he learned that it's not medically recommended because it's riskier to do the surgery than to just leave that willy alone and that around fifty percent of the boys born in the US are not circumcised he immediately changed his mind.

Good luck! He sounds like he's going to be pretty easy to convince.
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#8 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 03:21 AM
 
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You should be able to hunt around and find some stats to show him.

There is a Pampers poll that shows that over 60% of parents either did not, or will not, circ. You can find it at

http://us.pampers.com/en_US/communit...=2488&type=102

This way, you can counter the "locker room" argument if he tries to use it.

Also, let him know that non-religious circ only started in 1870, and no one back then used the argument that you shouldn't circ because your dad wasn't. This is probably because it's not really an issue!

good luck!
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#9 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 07:57 AM
 
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My dh took one look at the dead penis link in http://www.circumcisionquotes.com/complications.html and that was it for him. (I had tried quoting stats at him, sending him articles, and explaining... but all it took was one picture and the case was clinched. Ironically, he saw the link by accident when he happened to walk in on me researching circumcision.)

Edited to add that I just realized that I answered this same question for you over at GCM. lol Sorry about the redundancy. Didn't realize you were the same Mom until after posting. :LOL
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#10 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 11:16 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thx for the pampers link! Added that to my list of links for him to look at.

Quote:
Edited to add that I just realized that I answered this same question for you over at GCM. lol Sorry about the redundancy. Didn't realize you were the same Mom until after posting.
:LOL No problem!!!


Well girls...I think this is going to be EASY! We talked more last night. I asked him if I gave him info, if he would read it and consider my side. He said yes. Then he asked me, "In 50 words or less, tell me why you don't want to do it." lol Sooooooo....I started talking and spewing info. Long story short....his reason for wanting to do it:

"I'm circ'd so it has never really crossed my mind NOT to do it. If I wasn't circ'd, it wouldn't cross my mind TO do it. I'm leaning on the pro side because of that...but I do see your point and would consider not doing it. It's just not something I've ever really thought of b/c for me, being circ'd, it just has always seemed like the thing to do."

And I totally get where he's coming from. I just have to reprogram him. :LOL He didn't know that they take 2/3 of the foreskin...HOW the procedure is done...how Biblical circ was different than modern circ...when modern circ orginiated here...etc. Oh...one thing he didn't understand was why there are Dr's allowed to practice circ in a malicious way (i.e. no pain meds)...why if people are doing that is it allowed to continue.

So I told him all the links I have that he can look and read thru. I have a feeling it's going to be an easy conversion. lol Cross your fingers and toes for me!!
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#11 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 12:03 PM
 
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My dh started in the same place (huh, you mean some people don't? hmmm, but I am and it's all good....) but it was an easy conversion.... A few conversations and some of the tamer links and I've got an intactivist on my hands.... fwiw he's never been able to watch the video even- I never had to pull it out and now he can't stomach it.

-Angela
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#12 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 12:14 PM
 
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With my husband, I just showed him the pic of the baby strapped to the board. It was in a book or something. He was like, yuck! I think it was the same thing that worked for me. Completely visceral - I can't imagine restraining a newborn baby that way, and it reminded both of us of a scary picture of monkeys being experimented on we've seen (we're vegetarians).
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#13 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 12:39 PM
 
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Dh has walked in on my showing of the circ video in my CBE classes. He can't watch it for long or else he gets woozy. At this point he's a bigger intactavist than I am, lol!

For us it wasn't really an issue. He's circ'd but ever since an old girlfriend mentioned it to him that he was (he had NO clue what a foreskin was at this point) he's questioned the procedure...and the number of nerve endings he's missing. By the time we had our 3 ds's making the decision to leave them alone was easy.

Also, I kind of think about it this way, especially when the decision is left up to the father...if a mama's dh felt like having their ds's healthy finger amputated would she let him? Of course not. She'd more than likely do anything in her power to keep her baby safe from harm, regardless if the dad thought it was in the baby's best interest. Why then would she let the dad's decision to amputate their ds's perfectly healthy and functioning foreskin prevail? IMO its up to the mother's to protect their children from harm- including unnessecary cosmetic surgery.

Best of luck in educating your dh...it sounds like you've almost got him!

Ashley~certified nurse-midwife mama to 6 little novaxnocirc.gifhomebirth.jpglotbirth.gif loves, including sweet Cordelia Jane born at home waterbirth.jpgon 11/12/10.
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#14 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 01:28 PM
 
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Wow I could have written your post a year ago! We had a son after 3 DDs and it was a similar scenario. My DH originally said he wanted to circ but only because 1)he is circ'ed himself and 2)it never occured to him NOT to I was pretty sure I wanted to leave my DS intact and all it took was several short conversations where I presented all the facts, I showed him some pics of an actual circ procedure, etc. That is all it took. He was extremely supportive of my decision, and in fact when our DS developed a bad UTI at 5 weeks I briefly considered circ'ing and he was the one who put his foot down and said no

It sounds like your DH is open to not circ'ing and I don't think you will have any problems getting him to see things your way.

Congratulations on your new baby to be.....I am finding out that boys are VERY different!
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#15 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 03:36 PM
 
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I'm in the same boat you are. (I'm expecting a boy in about five weeks.) At first I thought, "Well, I'd probably lean toward not circ'ing, but since DH feels pretty strongly about doing it I'll just let it go."

But then I started doing research and the more I learned the more horrified I was by the whole thing. So I started talking to DH and he agreed to read whatever I gave him and discuss it. I THINK I'm winning him over.

He has two boys from his first marriage who are circ'ed, so I think he just thought it was what you do. The funny thing is that he told me the other night that his own father is UNcircumcised. It surprised me that he felt so strongly about having it done when his own dad isn't circ'ed.

Formerly New Mama to Henry, born August 2005 and Silas, born November 2010.
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#16 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 03:56 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teachinmaof3
Oh...one thing he didn't understand was why there are Dr's allowed to practice circ in a malicious way (i.e. no pain meds)...why if people are doing that is it allowed to continue.
Well, simply because that's the way it's always been done.

You see, the first circumcisions were done as a punishment for being caught masturbating and the doctors felt that it was important that there be pain as in punishment by whipping. The signal to the boy was that if he was caught masturbating again, the doctor would cut more off until he quit masturbating. As the doctors made up excuses for continuing the practice, it became a health benefit and the procedure was moved to new borns. Pain relief was still not offered because "he won't remember it" and "it only hurts a second." the final deciet was that newborns are not fully developed and could not feel pain. All of this was nothing more than a pack of lies. Even when research showed that circumcision actually increased the urge to masturbate, they danced quickly and shifted to the health benefits although there was absolutely no proof that circumcision would cure or prevent any of the maladies stated. It is true that most newborns do not store a memory of the pain in a way they can bring up at a later date, therefore, they can not describe the pain to discredit the doctors statements that it only hurts for a second and that babies could not feel the pain.

Both of those statements don't jive with reality that they were observing with each procedure they were performing. Therefore, there has been a collusive effort to lie to parents about both issues. They heard the babies scream in pain and it is just impossible that a piece of skin the size of your hand could be cut away and there not be lingering pain for days or weeks.

Because of the pedestal of demi-gods that doctors erected for themselves in past years, people just didn't question them. If they stood there and screamed that it didn't hurt as the baby was screaming in agony, people believed it. If the doctor said it was because the baby was uncomfortable having it's diaper off, we believed it. Forget that that baby had never had a diaper on it's butt until the past 24 hours, we believed that the baby was crying because it's diaper was off!

Contrast this to the standards of care in veternairy medicine and you will see quite quickly that we have been had by the medical profession. A veternarian who circumcised a dog to confer "the benefits of circumcision" would quickly be brought up on charges and would most likely lose their license to practice. Any veternarian who performed a surgical procedure on a dog without pain relief would also be in big trouble. Dogs deserve those protections, humans don't!




Frank
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#17 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 04:54 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Shayla ~ Thanks so much for sharing! Our dh's sound VERY similar!!! I'm still in shock that this is a boy! :LOL

NewMama ~ I'll keep everything crossed that your dh changes his mind!!

Frank ~ Thanks for the info! I may copy/paste that into my info for him to read over.
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#18 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 05:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Desicion has been made. I just posted a new thread "OMG I'm going to be sick".

It WILL not happen. I have put my foot down.
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#19 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 06:09 PM
 
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I know I am not alone when I say I am so glad you have decided against! SO happy for you, I promise you will grow more sure of your decision every day that goes by and you look at your little guy and know you protected him from such needless pain and alteration.

GOOD FOR YOU MOMMA!

Im sure your DH will come around too, he might not become an outspoken intactivist but I bet when he sees how easy it is to "take care of" and how natural it is, he will be fine with it!

For the record, my hub was for it, I said no, that was that and now hes totally fine with not having done it, he doesnt look at his son and think "penis different than mine" he just sees a happy healthy normal little boy! even when he changes dipes.

*hugs to you*
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#20 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 06:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Oh, I was already against it. It was just a matter of getting dh on board w/o causing a huge arguement by me coming across as being defensive. After today tho...no question about it whether he agrees or not. BUT..I think after hearing that today about no pain meds, it pretty much changed his mind.
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#21 of 26 Old 06-27-2005, 10:02 PM
 
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So happy he came around!

Best wishes on the rest of your pg~

Pam
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#22 of 26 Old 06-28-2005, 01:08 PM
 
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My dh was very pro-circumcision. I wouldn't recommend our method of 'discussion' because it involved way too much drama, yelling, threatening, things we regretted saying, etc.,. It is an emotional issue, or can be.

We did finally come to terms, thankfully. But make sure your dh knows that the American Academy of Pediatrics doesn't recommend circumsion, nor does any other medical oganization.

Also, other than a general feeling of, "well, I'm circed and I'm ok - I never thought of not doing it" does he have any strong feelings one way or the other? His feelings are valid, but not as reasons for removing part of his son's genitals. If not, hopefully he'll see your side of it and not take it personally - which I think a lot of men do.

Two things that helped my dh think about it rationally (instead of emotionally) is that he couldn't come up with one good reason to do it, at least one based on fact or medical evidence. And also, as I pointed out, our son will always have the opportunity to choose to be circumcised if it's something he wanted to do. But it's not ours, so it's not our decision.

Good luck, no one wants to have these issues to think about during pregnancy. I hope it goes well!

Take care,

"Home is where the heart is, no matter how the heart lives." - PP&M
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#23 of 26 Old 06-28-2005, 01:14 PM
 
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I told him:
I really like the way you look (circ'ed). It looks normal to my eye. In fact, I think it's the best looking type. But that's cultural baggage for me.
It's wrong to circ, and I think it's wrong you were circ'd. I won't do that to any son of mine because it is wrong. His wife will not have the baggage I have. It will be fine.

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#24 of 26 Old 06-28-2005, 05:17 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
But make sure your dh knows that the American Academy of Pediatrics doesn't recommend circumsion, nor does any other medical oganization.
One of the very first things I told him!!

Quote:
does he have any strong feelings one way or the other?
He didn't share any with me. That was just his only reason...b/c he is, he never thought not to. I think that made it a bit easier to convince him. Well...the dr office telling me they use NO meds got to him too...b/c he did tell me the first time we talked that he thought it was TOTALLY wrong to do it w/o meds!
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#25 of 26 Old 07-01-2005, 02:45 PM
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Hi! I'm a "teachin' ma," too! Anyway, RUN, don't walk, to this link and read it yourself:

http://www.stopcirc.com/vincent/vuln...ty_of_men.html

It's not to show your husband; it's just for you to read and think about.

"Our task is not to see the future, but to enable it."
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#26 of 26 Old 07-04-2005, 01:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I had already been to that site and read it before I talked to him the first time.
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