Where to get it done - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

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Old 08-14-2005, 09:58 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Jill0905
well i told him if he wanted it done he had to be in the room with him. my thinking is that he will back down if he has to witness it. does that make me evil?
Not evil, but it's not much of a stand either. What if he DOESN'T back down? Are you willing to go through with this? It sounds like you're not truely against circ. and your dh probably sees this as well. I mean, how strongly can you really feel about it if you're researching places to get it done and telling him you'll okay the circ if he witnesses it?

If you really don't want this done, I think you need to take a stronger position. Show him some video of the proceedure. Inform him of the risks, both short-term and the long-term damage. Tell him to convince you why he feels it should be done. And when all that is done, protect your child.

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Old 08-14-2005, 10:21 AM
 
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i told him if he wanted it done he had to be in the room with him. my thinking is that he will back down if he has to witness it. does that make me evil?
I'm sorry to be harsh ... but yes. If your husband wanted to sexually assault your child in any other way and you stood back and let it happen, even though you didn't think it was right but he called your bluff, you'd be sent to jail Please protect your son against this mutilation - your husband and yourself may not think it's 'evil' but your son might. Good luck convincing your husband!
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Old 08-14-2005, 10:26 AM
 
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My husband would circ if it were solely up to him. It's not. It's my job to protect my baby. I made enough noise that DH realizes this and isn't arguing with me over the circ decision now.

There is simply no way I'd let someone cause unnecessary pain and harm to my newborn infant.
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Old 08-14-2005, 11:06 AM
 
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This was posted above, but just to make sure it's easy for you to see -

both you and your DH MUST WATCH the video at www.intact.ca

Circumcision is torture, plain and simple. Why else do you think the hospital won't let you watch it? Your dh could be in the room with you if you had a c-section - but they hide the circ. Because if people saw the truth, no one with a heart would allow this torture to happen to their newborn baby boys.

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Old 08-14-2005, 01:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Quirky
This was posted above, but just to make sure it's easy for you to see -

both you and your DH MUST WATCH the video at www.intact.ca

Circumcision is torture, plain and simple. Why else do you think the hospital won't let you watch it? Your dh could be in the room with you if you had a c-section - but they hide the circ. Because if people saw the truth, no one with a heart would allow this torture to happen to their newborn baby boys.
:
Please...watch it with him today. Let us know what he says; what his pro-circ arguments are...
If you stand up and protect your baby, you will never, ever regret it. If you let this happen, you will have a very hard time forgiving yourself.
You can protect your baby from this....all you need to do is decide to.
Ask us any questions you have...any fears about leaving your baby intact, any worries about infections, teasing in the locker room, etc.
A lot of us have been in your shoes, more or less. A lot of us (I know this is true for me, at least) feel so strongly about this because we were so close to allowing it to happen to our babies. Some mamas here didn't "get it" till it was being done to their babies, and wish someone had stopped them, somehow.
Please keep us updated.
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Old 08-14-2005, 01:52 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Jill0905
well i told him if he wanted it done he had to be in the room with him. my thinking is that he will back down if he has to witness it. does that make me evil?
The problem with this approach is that most people, even men have no idea what a foreskin is. It's portrayed as "just a little snip" and it certainly is not that. That makes it sound like he's getting his fingernails clipped or his hair cut. The foreskin is one of the most highly enervated areas of the body and has sensitivity similar to the lips. Imagine getting your lips cut off and you can imagine the sort of pain the baby experiences. But, it's even worse. The medical profession has lied to us for almost a hundred years saying that infants don't feel pain and that circumcision doesn't hurt them. If you've looked at the links of circumcisions, it's plain that is not the case. These babies are in extreme and exquisite pain. The latest research shows that infants from 8 weeks before birth to 8 weeks after birth are the most sensitive to pain of any time in their entire lives. The pain is so severe that many of them pass out or go into shock. Wisconsin Pediatrician, Dr. Robert Van Howe reports seeing infants bursting their bladders and intestines from straining against the pain. Is that something you would allow for your son?

What if he doesn't back down? What if he sees your son in such pain? He can't stop it. Once it's started, there is no stopping. The first step is the separation of the foreskin from the glans. This is like pulling fingernails off and it only takes a moment Once that's done, there is no stopping it no matter how hard the child cries. The next step is making a cut in the foreskin with scissors and the next step is putting a clamp on the foreskin that would be the equivalent of clamping down on his penis with a pair of pliers with enough force to stop the blood flow and crush the blood vessels enough that blood will never flow through them again. There is simply no stopping point once the initial damage has been done.

If this is something that is so good, consider if he would have his dog circumcised? If he wouldn't do it to his dog, why would it be an appropriate thing to do to his own flesh and blood?




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Old 08-14-2005, 02:33 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Jill0905
i guess i didnt!! well let me rephase my statments. i am completely against doing anything to my child. i have yet to understand why remove something that obvilious God put there! it is my husband that is giving me problems. he just wants it done!!! (good reason, huh? ) well i told him if he wanted it done he had to be in the room with him. my thinking is that he will back down if he has to witness it. does that make me evil?
Like Frank said once they start there is no turning back. Do you really want to mutilate your child to try and convience your DH that circ is wrong? That's like cutting off your leg to convience him that legs are important. It doesn't make a whole lot of sence to me. Also, in my area the dads have little to no rights as far as procedures go on a newborn. My DH wasn't given a wrist band at the hospital, he wasn't allowed to get the baby from the nursery, he wasn't allowed to sign any paper work concerning our son. Every decision made for those 3 days was my decision that I am responsible for.

Coming from a momma who had her DS circ 'just because' when he was 1 day old, don't do it. Don't let your DH do it. Don't let anyone near your DSs penis with a pair of sissors and all the barbaric equipment used in a circ. Don't put your self through the pain, guilty and many sleepless nights because of a mistake you made. You have the right to stop your DH from having a circ performed on your DS, excercise that right.
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Old 08-14-2005, 03:12 PM
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Do you know when my brother finally realized how brutal circumcision is? When he was in the middle of watching it happen to his son, and then he was powerless to stop it. Don't let your dh (nor your son) get to that point.

There is a good article titled "The Vulnerability of Men" at www.stopcirc.com which talks about how to deal with your dh.

But, ultimately, you need to stand up for your son and protect him, no matter what.

"Our task is not to see the future, but to enable it."
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Old 08-14-2005, 06:13 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Frankly Speaking
Wisconsin Pediatrician, Dr. Robert Van Howe reports seeing infants bursting their bladders and intestines from straining against the pain.
Hey Frank, FYI: Dr Van Howe now practices in Marquette, Michigan. (about 1 hour from my home) I don't know how he is doing there but I hope he's making progress as the circumcision is really high here in the Upper Peninsula.

Pam
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Old 08-14-2005, 06:20 PM
 
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Hey Frank, FYI: Dr Van Howe now practices in Marquette, Michigan. (about 1 hour from my home) I don't know how he is doing there but I hope he's making progress as the circumcision is really high here in the Upper Peninsula.

Pam
Hiya Pam. Van Howe was at the dinner after the Art Fair two years ago, I think. Hmm... Maybe three years ago now. Noah was little and my ex was there with us. (I guess it has been a while since I've heard about Van Howe!)
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Old 08-14-2005, 09:41 PM
 
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Maybe you should read the sticky thread at the top of the forum written by Mommas who regret letting their little one get circed. Some pressured by their dhs, dps, parents pressure, some just thought it had to be done. All of them though grew to regret it and can never take it back now.....I really don't think I could handle being one of those poor Mommas. Why would you want to if you don't have to?

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Tara

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Old 08-15-2005, 12:43 AM
 
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My dh is intact and very happy that he is! He never once got teased in a locker room and neither one of us has ever had an infection (I've had UTIs but they were birth control pill and pregnancy related). He never has had any cleanliness issues either. We don't know if he looks like his father or not so that's how important that argument is (we're 22 and his father is in his early 60s. We'd rather not know - honestly).

Remember, it's your son's body, not yours or your dh's. Your ds should have the opportunity to make this important decision for himself and not have it made for him by someone who was mutilated as an infant himself. And remember also to be sensitive to the fact that he WAS mutilated as a baby and that he will probably need reassurance that you're not attacking his manhood and that you're happy with him the way he is, but that your ds deserves a chance to decide for himself when he is of an appropriate age. Also, you will probably (I apologize for assuming if I'm incorrect ) be the one changing most of the diapers and having to deal with a serious wound that routinely comes into contact with excretion. Then there's comforting your screaming baby afterwards and feeling sorry about it forever.

I have a friend who had all three of her sons circ'd and they wouldn't let her watch till the third when she insisted that she be allowed to witness it. She has never gotten over the fact that she didn't insist to be there with the first or even the second so that she could have saved at least one of her boys from the trauma. And she didn't have any idea it was harmful beforehand so she didn't have an informed choice. If she had, I'd be willing to bet that she would feel even worse about it.

I know this thread was really intense at the beginning, but as a couple others have mentioned, all of us are only posting in love and care for you and your ds. We know what we know and with knowledge comes responsibility so we have to share or else we have the knowledge that we could have made a difference and didn't.

Best wishes and many 's

love and peace.

mama to two girls and due in November!
: Circumcision can never be undone :
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Old 08-15-2005, 01:48 AM
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I recall reading a medical study (the study itself, not a reporter's interpretation of it) about a baby boy who screamed so hard & so long during foreskin removal, that his stomach burst, and there was puke all over. [Our dedicated medical professionals now make sure that the baby is starved for several hours before being circumcised, to prevent such messes.] I don't remember all the details, mainly I remember how lurid this report sounded, no emotion by the writers, all nice and technical. They described how the stomach had to be patched up and said that everything was now fine and the baby would be just fine.

Right.

Isn't that a great way to start your life. Don't we all know men who are just sort of, well, strange; they keep to themselves, they have a weird, haunted look in their eyes, they have never gone out with a woman (or a man, either). When I meet someone who fits this description, I wonder,what happened when he was a day or two old? It is not outside the realm of possibility.
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Old 08-15-2005, 03:12 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quirky
This was posted above, but just to make sure it's easy for you to see -

both you and your DH MUST WATCH the video at www.intact.ca

Circumcision is torture, plain and simple. Why else do you think the hospital won't let you watch it? Your dh could be in the room with you if you had a c-section - but they hide the circ. Because if people saw the truth, no one with a heart would allow this torture to happen to their newborn baby boys.
OMG I had not seen the video until just now. I have never been so happy about a desicion I made for my sweet son. I am so glad I did not allow that to be done to him. I was lucky DH supported the desicion not to circ. He often says he wishes he was not circ'd because he feels like being circumcised is unnatural and it feels "tight" when he has an erection and is sometimes painful for him.
Please Please don't let them do this to your son. If anything tell your DH to at least give your son the right to make that desicion for himself. It is his body and he should at least have to opportunity to choose what he wants done to it.
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Old 08-15-2005, 11:27 AM
 
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i just found out that the hospital does not allow anyone to be with the baby while the procedure is being done. I DONT THINK SO!!! can our ped do it? i am so lost due to being in the navy and getting 15 different answers from people. i hope someone on here can help me!!!
Mmmm, seems to me that FL is where I heard this story from an RN; Many, many years ago, at a Military Hospital in FL, they kept all the removed foreskins for... a Doctor to use as bait when he went FISHING!

Maybe you should not only question not being allowed to watch the procedure and request pain meds for your son (before, during AND after), but WHAT EXACTLY is done with the discarded tissue!

I know of another hospital that is using the cut foreskins to make bandages...and yet many other hospitals SELL them for research! $$$$

Sorry to be so explicit - but these are just SOME of the things I KNOW that have gotten me so upset and
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Old 08-15-2005, 05:52 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Jill0905
i guess i didnt!! well let me rephase my statments. i am completely against doing anything to my child. i have yet to understand why remove something that obvilious God put there! it is my husband that is giving me problems. he just wants it done!!! (good reason, huh? ) well i told him if he wanted it done he had to be in the room with him. my thinking is that he will back down if he has to witness it. does that make me evil?
Oh, your DH sounds just like mine!!! I was against, he was for, so I told him HE had to make the appointment, HE had to take the baby, HE had to take care of it afterwards, and HE had to do some serious research and present me with his reasons for going forward before I'd ever sign the consent form. He never got it done. His reason? "Well, if you're SO against it, I won't get it done then". Yeah, right, since when have you ever changed your mind about anything just because I was passionate about it, you're just too lazy to fulfull all of my requirements!

Anyhoo, I completely understand what you're doing because I did the same thing! Hopefully it works, but if not just put your foot down and say no way!

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Old 08-15-2005, 06:18 PM
 
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As Nike says, "Just Say NO"

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Old 08-15-2005, 06:31 PM
 
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please do watch that video.......being pregnant with my first son, and only very recently getting my dh to see the light and agree to keep our son intact.......when i watched it my whole body ached at the thought of that being my brand new little son crying in pain.....i could never do it. not after watching that.

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Old 08-15-2005, 08:23 PM
 
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As Nike says, "Just Say NO"
LOL!! Nike says Just do it - let's not go with that!

It was Nancy Reagan who said "Just say no." That campaign wasn't terribly effective in reducing drug use but maybe we can get it to work against circs!!

Take care -- oh and to the OP ---- Just say NO!
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Old 08-16-2005, 05:19 PM
 
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My son's circ was botched. He had to have it fixed when he was 5 months old, which meant being put under general anethesia. I consider his circ to be one of the biggest and most ignorant mistakes I ever made. Would never ever consider doing it again.
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Old 08-16-2005, 08:38 PM
 
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I don't think going the passive way is a good road to take. What if he says yes? Then you're stuck mutilating your child. JUST SAY NO! Why is it so hard for mothers to understand that their number one job is protecting the child. How is letting your husband mutilate your childs penis and alter his future sex life for marital harmony, pretecting your child? How?

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Old 08-23-2005, 03:21 AM
 
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Thinking of you Jill.
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Old 12-09-2005, 07:33 PM
 
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Me, too, wondering what happened to her son.
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Old 12-09-2005, 08:19 PM
 
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I'm glad this was brought up because I too am wondering what happened w/ your son. I hope all is well.
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Old 12-09-2005, 08:46 PM
 
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I'm going to assume they didn't since she posted in another thread in this forum when her little boy was 1 1/2 months old. I hope I don't get proved wrong though.

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Old 12-09-2005, 09:44 PM
 
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I won't lecture here. but just wanted to let you know my poor dh saw someone else's baby get circ'd. He has be horrified since. If you'd like to speak with him, please let me know and I'll have him write under my name...
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Old 12-09-2005, 09:54 PM
 
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OOPS! I guess I should have looked at the dates before I posted...I'll leave my belated response here anyway...

Only read to where poster said it was her DH, not her, who wants the circ, so sorry if this is irrelevant at this point...

My DH was firm about the decision to circ until he watched a video. It was a short film which discussed the function of the foreskin, the operation, trends in circ, etc. It ended with a baby boy being circ'd.

My DH has been vehemently AGAINST circ since then. Please make your DH research and WATCH A VIDEO. Tell him he has to convince you that circ is worth the risk, pain, and scarring that your son is guaranteed to experience.

Besides, it's not really your or DH's decision, it's your son's penis, so it's HIS decision.

Good luck. I pray that you are strong enough to prevent the mutiliation of your son. He'll thank you for it later.
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Old 12-09-2005, 10:16 PM
 
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Interesting - I just had an email say this about the circumcision decision;

"Sure, the father has the penis - but the mother has the intact genitals"

so speak up and protect that baby boy!
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Old 12-10-2005, 06:10 AM
 
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Originally Posted by mighty-mama
I won't lecture here. but just wanted to let you know my poor dh saw someone else's baby get circ'd. He has be horrified since. If you'd like to speak with him, please let me know and I'll have him write under my name...
I would.

~Nay

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