How much foreskin removal is enough? - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

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#31 of 50 Old 09-22-2005, 08:51 PM
 
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This is a great post....really points out how absurd it all is!!

I guess you could say I tried one of each (of course without my consent)...too loose....too tight....and I can definitely say they're ALL bad!
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#32 of 50 Old 09-22-2005, 08:51 PM
 
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I thought it was great. Really well-done. I will share it with any potential parents.

DS1 2004 ~ DS2 2005 ~ DD1 2008 ~ DS3 2010 ~ DD2 born at 31 weeks Oct. 2014
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#33 of 50 Old 09-22-2005, 09:02 PM
 
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Ooooh, I know, I know!! Let's make it a sticky! We have a lot of stickies already, but I think this one will really draw attention and make people think.

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#34 of 50 Old 09-22-2005, 11:56 PM
 
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(I've always wondered if those men who feel so strongly about matching their sons shave their pubic hair and wear ice in their shorts for 10 years).
:LOL You just made me choke on my tea. Thanks a lot!
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#35 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 12:05 AM
 
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The OP is great!!! I really want to direct a few mamas-to-be to it.
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#36 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 01:23 AM
 
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I LOVE the OP. I caught on instantly also.
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#37 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 04:03 AM
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The OP was great, I thought of it as satire. May I repost it somewhere else? I'll give credit of course and drop a link back here if you'd like. It's a circ debate forum.

Long distance Mom to boarding school superstars E (9) and Layne (6).
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#38 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 10:17 AM
 
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Please don't place a link to MDC at another board. We prohibit that sort of thing here as it causes an influx of people to debate and harass who have no intention of joining our community.

This is from the User Agreement:

Quote:
5. Posting to invite members to other boards for debate purposes or posting about discussions at other boards. This is to maintain and respect the integrity of our own and other communities.

"To err is human, to forgive, canine." - Unknown
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#39 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 11:29 AM - Thread Starter
 
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PLEASE use it as much as you like! You've all made me blush this morning. No need to give me credit - just spread the word!! Thanks especially to you, Frank, for sending me over here.

I posted this on a circ debate board yesterday morning as well, and received not ONE reply! Funny how no one who wants to do it can answer the questions? I just hope I made some people stop and think.

njeb, I know very few people IRL with intact older sons. The older my kids get, the more I appreciate that they are whole. They learned about circumcision when they were 8 years old - heard the word in a church sermon, of all places! (we're Lutheran). They asked what it meant, so I explained (in clinical, non-judgemental terms) that it meant cutting off the foreksin. Their first reaction was "OUCH!" (because even a child can understand that it has to hurt). They asked why in the world would anyone want to do such a thing, so I further explained that most people don't choose it for themselves - their parents do it to their babies. Our nanny at the time had a circ'ed baby - upon hearing of his plight, my boys said "Oh, that poor baby!"

When they learned that their Dad was circ'ed as a baby, a light bulb went off. One of my sons said "I thought he just kept his foreskin back all the time". Obviously it had never occured to them that it was actually cut off. Their reaction was one of sympathy - one said "Poor Dad - he's missing the best part!" This from a very wise 8-year-old! Neither one asked if they could be circ'ed to match their Dad - weird, huh?

When I read all the BS about circumcising infants "to look like Daddy" or to fit in with the other boys, it makes me sick. My kids don't have their father's hair color, eye color, nose, ears, or chin. If none of those obvious differences matter to them, why should they care what his penis looks like?

I'd better quit now before I blow all my favorite rants in one thread!

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#40 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 02:24 PM
 
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Ann--the only reason my sons are intact is that they were born at home. I had very savvy midwives who educated me on how painful circ. is. If I had had them in the hospital, chances are they would have been cut like 85% of their generation. I can just see the doctors and nurses talking the very young, unsure, postpartum mother that I was into circ'ing. That's why I can't condemn anyone in the U.S. for having it done. There but for the grace of God goes me.

Unfortunately, after having my sons and leaving them intact, I forgot about this issue. I was a LLL leader in the 80's, and LLLI has very strict rules about not mixing causes at meetings. I devoted my time and energy to bf and helping mothers nurse their babies. Well, I'm retired now, and I started lurking on this board a year ago. I first posted in January, and now I'm on this board every day.

How did you become an intactivist IRL?
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#41 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 02:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeartsOpenWide
:

I got a video on circ from a midwife that has retired. Watching it reminded me why my baby will never get one. Its horrible. And leaving the room so you do not have to witness it or hear your baby cry does not take you off the hook IMO.
Well, I don't know where that happened. When my son was circumsized, they had my hubby and I go in the room with him to hold his hand and comfort him. He was fine though, he cried when he got the anaestetic but hardly cried at all during the actual circumsision. Afterwards (that day and the next few days), he didn't cry from the pain at all or anything like that. He was himself, just like any other day. I don't know why they would have the parents not there with the child.
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#42 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 02:31 PM
 
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Our ped said they don't allow parents in because if they saw what happened they would freak.
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#43 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 02:51 PM
 
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OP I like your sense of humor.

I hope you will rethink the 'if it has to be done' line of thought although I suppose that could be for the .01% of medically necessary procedures.

When I saw the thread name I thought "everyone is jumping on this one!" I am still surprised to see how many responses are here already.

Must shower now .........I'll read the rest later
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#44 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 03:58 PM
 
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I love this! I can hardly wait to print it off and show my sil who circs for "appearance".
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#45 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 05:07 PM - Thread Starter
 
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njeb, I'm not much of an intactivist IRL. I do try to send some good links to co-workers who are expecting, but I try hard not to be pushy. I live in North Dakota, where practically everyone circs, and change happens slowly!

I discovered a circ debate board several years ago, and was intriqued. I had no idea this even WAS a debate! At the time my stance was "We didn't do it, but I don't care what everyone else does". I actually went looking for reasons TO circumcise my sons - after all, I wanted what was best for them, right? Naturally I didn't find any, and the more I learned about the procedure itself, the risks involved, and the functions of the foreskin, the more secure I became in the knowledge that we had done the right thing in leaving them intact.

When Dustin Evans died, I fell hard off the fence and firmly into the anti-circ camp. It had NEVER occurred to me that a baby could actually DIE from circ complications! I have been involved in the circ debate on-line off and on ever since.

BTW, I nursed my twins for 9 months. My MIL was convinced that they would starve to death because I'm so flat-chested (I grew into an A-cup while nursing). I showed her - the boys doubled their birthweight (from 8 to 16 pounds) in 4 months.

If the chips are down, the buffalo is empty.

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#46 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 06:20 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k mama
Well, I don't know where that happened. When my son was circumsized, they had my hubby and I go in the room with him to hold his hand and comfort him. He was fine though, he cried when he got the anaestetic but hardly cried at all during the actual circumsision. Afterwards (that day and the next few days), he didn't cry from the pain at all or anything like that. He was himself, just like any other day. I don't know why they would have the parents not there with the child.
Your baby is lucky to have had anesthesia. In this country, most babies don't get any.

Of course, even having your parents with you for the surgery doesn't really make up for losing half of the nerve endings in your penis.

I hope you will educate yourself about circumcision here on this board. Even when circumcision is relatively painless, the damage is lifelong. Read the links in my signature. If you're going to bring your baby into the world by home waterbirth (the best way to go! ) as a gentle introduction to life outside the womb, and for respect for the natural birth process, you owe it to him to leave him natural and intact.

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#47 of 50 Old 09-23-2005, 08:59 PM
 
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nd deadhead, I had to laugh at your post; some of that old mythology dies hard. My mother came around and finally understood the error of her choices with the circ's a few years ago. But she was more immediately contrite about not bf'ing us kids. I guess both her doctor and my grandmother had her convinced she would "starve us to death."
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#48 of 50 Old 09-24-2005, 01:23 AM
 
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nd deadhead,

I just wanted to say that I replied to your post on one of the bboards. I think you finally attracted a pro-circer (a nurse) to respond. I don't think I can actually post WHAT board though (starts with a vowel).

Oh, and I recognized it as sarcasm and really enjoyed the approach you took.

Jessica

Jessica..lady.gifintactlact.gif Falling in love all over again..... 
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#49 of 50 Old 09-24-2005, 10:08 PM
 
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I posted this on a circ debate board yesterday morning as well, and received not ONE reply! Funny how no one who wants to do it can answer the questions? I just hope I made some people stop and think.
I posted a similar sort of question once, directed to parents who circumcise - ie, how do they decide what 'type' is right for their sons, and also how they decide which sort of circumcision is best for their daughters. They didn't like it, but I hope I prompted some of them to see that it's just as appalling to do it to boys as it is to do it to girls.
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#50 of 50 Old 09-25-2005, 03:37 PM
 
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I got it and I think its great at pointing out the ridiculousness of the reasons people give to circ. Now I'm hoping someone will bring up the 'to look like dad' argument because I'm going to ask them when they will start shaving their pubic hair and whether they will shave male balding patterns into their little boys heads!

Mightymoo - Mom to DD (6) and DS (4)
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