Forskin stopped growing?!? - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 13 Old 01-07-2007, 05:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I've recently made a new friend. We both have ds age 6 and dd age 2. We click on a whole bunch of diferant levels. I realy like her and our kids get along realy well.

I had assumed that she would have left her ds intact, here in Canada most boys his age are. It came up the other day that she'd had him circed.: Her reason was that her dh had been left intact and "had" to be circed at age 2 because his forskin had stopped growing. It had been painful for him, he still remembers. She thought it might be something genetic and didn't want her ds to have to go through it.

She made sure that he was given anisthetic and was with him during the procedure.

I'm not sure how much I want to get into this with her. She's not likely to have anymore kids. She's not advocating circ to everyone. She simply felt that her families personal medical history warented it. I have a hard time faulting someone who does what they truly belive is in the best interest of their child given the information they have at the time. Even if I deeply disagree with what they have done. If I had been around when her ds was born I would have done everything in my power to talk her out of it. If I thought she was likely to have any more children I would be doing my best to educate her. If she ever does get pregnant you better belive I'll be trying hard to educate her. Right now though I'm not sure it's worth getting worked up about. I'm still thinking about it.

This idea of a forskin not growing seems bizar to me though: Anyone ever heard of that one before? Any idea of what might have realy been going on? I may try to educate her more in the future and I'd like to have my facts straight. Aparently he was in a lot of pain before the circumcision

My first instinct is maybe repeated retraction, to clean underneath, caused trama to the forskin. Scar tissue build up. Something like that.

Let there be beauty and strength, power and compassion, honor and humility, mirth and reverence within you.)0(
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#2 of 13 Old 01-07-2007, 05:41 PM
 
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I wouldn't get into it at all with her. I'd just forget about it.

Her DH probably endured improper care, or just wasn't retractable yet and some @#$%^& doctor thought it was a problem.

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#3 of 13 Old 01-07-2007, 05:41 PM - Thread Starter
 
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As I think about this more, I know that I do want to educate her. I don't want her grandsons being circed because grandpa's forskin wouldn't grow.

Let there be beauty and strength, power and compassion, honor and humility, mirth and reverence within you.)0(
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#4 of 13 Old 01-07-2007, 05:55 PM
 
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Yeah, sounds to me like he wasn't retractable and somehow they equated that with "his foreskin didn't grow."

If you decide to educate her, I would just say something very non-chalant like "I heard of someone else say they had problems because their foreskin didn't grow, but it ended up being that he wasn't retractable and some medicine and stretching fixed the problem."

: Robyn : Increasingly crunchy Mama to Kya (8) , Makena (7) , and Keegan (4) :
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#5 of 13 Old 01-07-2007, 06:23 PM
 
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I had to roll my eyes and half laugh at cutting something off because it isn't growing. If you think of it literally, it doesn't even make sense. If it truly wasn't growing why would they cut the foreskin off, they would just remove more of this mysteriously none growing foreskin.

As a pp mentioned I would educated her. Save some future foreskins. Imagine if her sons have their children circ for the same insane reason.
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#6 of 13 Old 01-07-2007, 06:27 PM
 
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Are there any other maladies her dh has suffered which they might be able to give her ds preventative surgery for? I truly don't mean to be snarky about your friend, but I guess I'm getting a little weary of the leaps of logic and reason people go through to justify circ'ing a child. Whatever her dh's true problem was, I suppose that just made it a shorter leap for her than most.
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#7 of 13 Old 01-07-2007, 08:58 PM
 
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I think you should still educate her, gently and respectfully. She told her story to you, no doubt she's told it to others. Many people circumcise based on rumors-that friend of a friend of a friend-and you're right, even if she doesn't have any more children of her own her grandchildren will be at risk of this tale of genetic deformity being handed down.

I've never heard of a case where skin refused to grow over a growing body part (like a penis) unless it was scarified. That doesn't happen to a child's foreskin unless improper care is going on.

If it's possible I would strongly encourage having your friend or your friend's husband talk to his parents and find out how they were caring for his foreskin before he was circumcised and the actual diagnosis that was given. The story usually goes, "Oh, honey...we did everything right, we were very careful and pulled the skin back every time we chanaged you and washed under it really well and it still got infections/was always sore..." in a somewhat defensive tone...or maybe simply that that he wasn't retractible by age 2 and they were (wrongly) told that necessitated immediate circumcision.

Let her know that a tight foreskin is normal; there are many good resources on retractibility of intact boys. Chances are, he was a.) inadvertantly given improper care by loving, well-meaning parents, b.) inappropriately diagnosed with phimosis, c.) subsequently circumcised unnecessarily or for reasons easily preventable with proper care.

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What Is Foreskin Retraction?

Sometime during the first several years of your son's life, his foreskin, which covers the head of the penis, will separate from the glans. Some foreskins separate soon after birth or even before birth, but this is rare. When it happens is different for every child. It may take a few weeks, months or years.

After the foreskin separates from the glans, it can be pulled back away from the glans toward the abdomen. This is called foreskin retraction.

Most boys will be able to retract their foreskins by the time they are 5 years old, yet others will not be able to until the teenage years. As a boy becomes more aware of his body, he will most likely discover how to retract his own foreskin. But foreskin retraction should never be forced. Until separation occurs, do not try to pull the foreskin back — especially an infant's. Forcing the foreskin to retract before it is ready may severely harm the penis and cause pain, bleeding and tears in the skin.

American Academy of Pediatrics
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Retraction of the Foreskin

At birth, the foreskin is usually attached to the glans, very much as a fingernail is attached to a finger. By puberty, the penis will usually have completed its development, and the foreskin will have separated from the glans.8 This separation occurs in its own time; there is no set age by which the foreskin and glans must be separated. One wise doctor described the process thus, "The foreskin therefore can be likened to a rosebud which remains closed and muzzled. Like a rosebud, it will only blossom when the time is right. No one opens a rosebud to make it blossom."9

Even if the glans and foreskin separate naturally in infancy, the foreskin Ups can normally dilate only enough to allow the passage of urine. This ideal feature protects the glans from premature exposure to the external environment.

The penis develops naturally throughout childhood. Eventually, the child will, on his own, make the wondrous discovery that his foreskin will retract. There is no reason for parents, physicians, or other caregivers to manipulate a child's penis. The only person to retract a child's foreskin should be the child himself, when he has discovered that his foreskin is ready to retract.

Mothering Magazine: The Case Against Circumcision
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The tightness of the foreskin is a safety mechanism that protects the glans and urethra from direct exposure to contaminants and germs. The tight foreskin also keeps the boy's glans warm, clean, and moist, and when he is an adult, it will give him pleasure. As long as your son can urinate, he is perfectly normal. There is no age by which a child's foreskin must be retractable. Do not let your doctor or anyone try to retract your child's foreskin. Optimal hygiene of the penis demands that the foreskin of infants and children be left alone.

Mothering Magazine: Protect Your Uncircumcised Son: Expert Medical Advice for Parents
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Avoidance of premature retraction. Care-givers and healthcare providers must be careful to avoid premature retraction of the foreskin, which is contrary to medical recommendations, painful, traumatic, tears the attachment points (synechiae), may cause infection, is likely to generate medico-legal problems, and may cause paraphimosis, with the tight foreskin acting like a tourniquet. The first person to retract the boy’s foreskin should be the boy himself.3

The Development of Retractile Foreskin in the Child and Adolescent
A guidance for healthcare providers from Doctors Opposing Circumcision

Also available in a PDF leaflet.
See Also: Intact Care Agreement

The #1 rule for intact care is to leave it alone.

The first person to retract a boy's foreskin should be the boy himself.

Until then, just wipe it off like you would a finger or give it a swish of plain water in the bath.

Once he can retract it himself, all he needs to do is "RETRACT, RINSE, REPLACE" in the shower or bath.
Knowledge is power, and educating someone-even if they may never be in the position to make such a choice (again) is still important and valuable. We need to help ensure that even casual conversations among friends and aquaintances are accurate, and that people are spreading the truth about circumcision rather than continuing to perpetuate myths

Anyone can be(come) an intactivist.

HTHs,

Jen
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#8 of 13 Old 01-07-2007, 11:20 PM
 
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I will never, ever understand doing surgery on person "A" because person "B" has/had a problem!!! Where is the freaking logic in that?! :

Momma to three fine children, one that lives in my heart and two that live in my arms.
Circumcision is wrong, regardless of gender
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#9 of 13 Old 01-08-2007, 12:01 AM
 
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Yes, I should get my right breast cut off because my mother had cancer in that breast which resulted in a full mastectomy. Additionally, I should remove my DD's (at least) right breast nodules (is that the correct term?) just so she doesn't go through what her grandma went through.

:
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#10 of 13 Old 01-08-2007, 12:59 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Rhiannon Feimorgan View Post
She thought it might be something genetic and didn't want her ds to have to go through it.
Uh ... instead, she ensured he would go through it, that the chances of him going through a painful amputation were 100%.

I suspect there is something else going on here ... a father/son lookalike wish or ???
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#11 of 13 Old 01-08-2007, 04:29 AM
 
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I would say, my daughter didn't grow big enough breasts, so we got them cut off when she was 14. Then I would wait for the response :

(only kidding)

I would say actually I spend alot of time researching this and I've found out that alot of circumcisions happen for that reason but really it isn't true....and then go on to list resources etc. Or I would find a pamphlet with the info, or make one, and give it to her.
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#12 of 13 Old 01-08-2007, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by ndunn View Post
I would say, my daughter didn't grow big enough breasts, so we got them cut off when she was 14. Then I would wait for the response :

(only kidding)

I would say actually I spend alot of time researching this and I've found out that alot of circumcisions happen for that reason but really it isn't true....and then go on to list resources etc. Or I would find a pamphlet with the info, or make one, and give it to her.
It's worse than that. You need to say you didn't grow big enough breasts, therefore, you got your daughter's breasts cut off when she was 14.:
Thats the analogy with the father's not growing foreskin..
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#13 of 13 Old 01-08-2007, 01:51 PM
 
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MelKnee, You hit the nail on the head - there is absolutely no logic in performing ("preventetive") surgery on one person just because someone else in the family had a problem. And for some wierd reason foreskins are about the only body part that are subjected to this insane way of thinking.

It happened to me - I was circumcised as an infant because my grandfather persuaded my mother that it was better done then than later. He told her that he had been circumcised at the age of 12 because his "foreskin got so tight that he could not pee". His explanation made no sense, and all I can think of is that he suffered a paraphimosis. Unfortunately many doctors would circumcise for that.
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