Spinoff: Would you distance yourself from (or disown) your child for circumcising? - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 04:58 AM - Thread Starter
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This is a spinoff from the thread about talking to your daughter about cut men. Well, the thread title says it all - would you distance yourself, or even disown, a child of yours for circumcising?

I'll post my opinion when I'm not on my way to bed

Long distance Mom to boarding school superstars E (9) and Layne (6).
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#2 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 10:16 AM
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My children have my unconditional love.

"Our task is not to see the future, but to enable it."
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#3 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 10:24 AM
 
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My children have my unconditional love.
I totally agree, but I remain friends with people who circ, so yours is a very easy question for me.
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#4 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 10:25 AM
 
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My children have my unconditional love.
ITA.
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#5 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 10:33 AM
 
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I do hope that I raise my children so that they would never ever abuse their children.

The possibility that my children would start to mutilate their own children is quite impossible to even imagine, since both FGM and MGM are not done here.

Ofcourse I love my children , and I would never disown them or stop loving them.
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#6 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 10:33 AM
 
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Oh gawd! It would tear my heart out...but of course my love is unconditional.
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#7 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 11:21 AM
 
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Yeah, it's kind of a weird question to me. When you've mass-murdered your way across a continent, your momma is supposed to come visit you on death row. I wouldn't stop loving my kids, it's not a button I turn on & off.

I'd be angry (& oh, would I express it) & disappointed, but I would continue to be there (who is there for you when you are contrite that you didn't listen to your mama & made a huge mistake with lasting repercussions? Mama! By 20 I've got this part down pat, & hardly ever say 'I told you so'. Well, more than once.)
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#8 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 12:55 PM
 
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It would really make me wonder, since right now I only have one dc and he's an intact male.

Expecting a boy? Be sure to check out MDC's Case Against Circumcision!
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#9 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 01:04 PM
 
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I would be very upset, but my love is forever.
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#10 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 01:41 PM
 
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Honestly, I don't know how I would feel. If my son or daughter grew up to be the kind of person who could cut their baby's genitals, I'm not sure if I could get over it. I think it would hurt so deeply I'm not sure I could recover, and I know for sure I'd never feel the same way again. I might still love them and want to be a part of their lives, but it would be tough.

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#11 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 02:02 PM
 
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Absolutely NOT!!! My love for my child is unconditional.
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#12 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 02:04 PM
 
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No way. When I decided to have children it was forever and no conditions were put on that.
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#13 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 02:05 PM
 
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No, I would not disown my child for making a decision they felt in their heart was the best course of action for their child and though I would disagree with it, I would still love and honor their decisions, which are personal and none of my business.
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#14 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 02:10 PM
 
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It would sadden me , however I do hope that when the time comes they do their OWN research on the topic, and voice their own opinions. I only have a son (right now) and I would be more disappointed to hear him say " I won't cut my son because I want him to look like me".

My MIL and I had this talk once because she has been disappointed in a lot of things her children were doing and she felt like a failure. My reply...no actually you raised independent thinking childen, you are a huge success.
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#15 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 02:10 PM
 
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No, I wouldn't do either. I would not be able to keep quiet about it, of course.

My ds's are intact, however, so is dh, and if my ds's find a partner in life she would have to accept their wholeness, so it's hard to imagine them deciding to circumcize a child.

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#16 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 02:12 PM
 
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Tricia, or your ds' new love interest might be able to convince him to be circéd as an adult, ya never know.
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#17 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 02:18 PM
 
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True! At least it would be his choice though, so I would have to respect that, just like if he decided to get a nose job or calf implants.

I really believe RIC will be illegal though, in Canada anyway, by the time my ds's are procreating.

SAHM mom of 3 beautiful boys - Aug/02, Jan/05, Mar/07.
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#18 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 02:25 PM
 
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I would still love and honor their decisions, which are personal and none of my business.
I'd love & honor THEM, but I fart in the general direction of any decision to genitally mutilate a child! It's not 'personal'; the child's genitals are personal. To the owner.

The rhetoric of 'it's a personal decision' galls the living hell out of me. Horsefeathers, I say. You can't even 'decide' whether your kid will eat their bowl of farina in the morning, how do you have the right to decide to cut off part of their genitals?
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#19 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 03:14 PM
 
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I'd love my children unconditionally, but that being said I could never sit by and approve of them abusing their children. And circ is abuse. So yes, there would be some ramifications to our relationship if they were mistreating their children in any way.

Happily married to my dh, mama to ds1 (01/2005), ds2 (07/2007)  and dd (07/2009).
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#20 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 03:15 PM
 
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If my DDs choose to do that to their children, I would be flabbergasted. They will grow up KNOWING that it is wrong and harmful(The older 2 already know about it.), so I just can't imagine it. I can think of 100 mistakes I would rather watch them make than that one. I would feel crestfallen and dejected, but I could never disown my children.

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I'd love my children unconditionally, but that being said I could never sit by and approve of them abusing their children. And circ is abuse. So yes, there would be some ramifications to our relationship if they were mistreating their children in any way.
I agree w/ this. Child abuse is something I couldn't sit back and watch my children do to my grandchildren, and I do view this as legalized child abuse.
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#21 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 03:22 PM
 
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Speaking as a disowned child, OF COURSE I could NEVER inflict such hurt on my child! I hope they make the right decisions, especially when itcomes to other people's genitals (where it isn't really making a decision, but respecting the right of the owner of the genitals to make the decision), and they will definitely know I strongly disapprove, but I cannot imagine ever being that hurtful to my children.

A parent's love and affection is a birthright. Nothing should be able to negate that.
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#22 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 03:32 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm confused with all of these replies saying "My love is unconditional"

My question had nothing to do with how much you love your children or if you'd stop loving them.

I'd ask if you'd distance yourself from them. You can still love someone you distance yourself from.

Honestly, while I would still love them, I'd never look at them the same way again and I would lose all respect I have for them because I know they would be well educated on the subject. And that's how I feel about anyone who is educated and chooses to do it. Because they KNOW what they're doing is cosmetic and doesn't benefit the baby, it benefits THEM. And doing something surgically to your kids because you think it's aesthetically pleasing is horrible. And not something I'd respect you for.

I would still love them and see them and visit with the kids, but all those nice parent things you do for your children when they have kids? I'd never do them. Those are reserved for someone I respect, not someone who hacked off a piece of someone else's body because of THEIR sexual preferences. And I won't lie, I'd leave them significantly less in my will than I'd originally planned. I'd donate it to NOCIRC or DOC and I'd leave in the will exactly why.

And just out of idle curiousity, I wonder if these answers would be the same if I asked "Would you distance/disown your child for circumcising your granddaughter". I'm hoping not.

Long distance Mom to boarding school superstars E (9) and Layne (6).
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#23 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 03:40 PM
 
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Just wondering, seriously wondering here....what if anything could your child do to undermine your unconditional love? Speaking to anyone who wants to answer here.

Personally, I can think of any number of things that my children could do that would seriously affect the way I feel towards them. For example, if my child murdered someone, or became something horrible like a drug dealer or terrorist, or became abusive towards a partner, or a child molester, or raped someone, or sexually molested their sibling....at that point, I'm fairly certain I can say that my love would no longer be unconditional. I could easily see cutting such a person out of my life if it was clear to me that s/he was not capable of repentence and reform.

Say you're the mother of the son who recently killed his father and stashed him in the trunk of a car -- you really think you're still going to love and support your child unconditionally at that point? If so, you're a much bigger and stronger person than I am.

And bringing it back on topic....say your child marries someone from a cultural tradition that insists on FGM, and takes your granddaughter out of the country to be circed. Still feel the same way? Unconditional love and support?

My love for my children now is unconditional, but at some point children become moral actors who have responsibility for the consequences of their own decisions, and sometimes the consequences of those decisions affect the feelings of the people closest to them.

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#24 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 03:43 PM
 
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I'm confused with all of these replies saying "My love is unconditional"

My question had nothing to do with how much you love your children or if you'd stop loving them.

I'd ask if you'd distance yourself from them. You can still love someone you distance yourself from.
I answered your question. I believe that a necessary component of parental love is affection. I believe that real love is a two-way thing. My parents insist they still love me, but they limit contact severely and insult me, my marriage and my family whenever there is contact. That is not love. That is manipulation. To say you love someone but to withold affection because they made a bad (wrong, evil, whatever) choice is to turn that being a loving relationship into being a coercive and/or manipulative relationship. And ultimately, in many cases, it becomes a non-existant relationship.

I'm sorry if this is too blunt or too off topic, but trust me, I know what I'm talking about here.
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#25 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 03:46 PM
 
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No, I would not disown my child for making a decision they felt in their heart was the best course of action for their child and though I would disagree with it, I would still love and honor their decisions, which are personal and none of my business.
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I'd love & honor THEM, but I fart in the general direction of any decision to genitally mutilate a child! It's not 'personal'; the child's genitals are personal. To the owner.

The rhetoric of 'it's a personal decision' galls the living hell out of me. Horsefeathers, I say. You can't even 'decide' whether your kid will eat their bowl of farina in the morning, how do you have the right to decide to cut off part of their genitals?
Thank you, TigerTail, for making this important distinction!

I will always love my son, but if he abuses his children I will loose a great deal-if not all-respect for him. I'd feel the same way if he took a kitchen shears to his daughter's labia.

Jen
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#26 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 03:56 PM
 
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I might have to emotionally distance myself for a period of time while I grieved for what my grandchild lost, but I would try to understand the decision so that I could heal that rift that I'd feel. I'd never disown my child for any decision, and my love for my child is absolutely unconditional. Even if my child became a "monster." I've had to think about this a lot, considering the things that people in my family have done to me and others - often at least in part due to severe mental illness. My children may also end up mentally ill, and I had to come to terms with the possibilities that they would commit the same atrocious acts as others in my family have. I wouldn't have given birth if I didn't know that I would love my children no matter what they did.

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#27 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 04:26 PM
 
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And being an old AlAnon 12 stepper, I also know that I can distance myself from someone's abusive actions if necessary & still not stop loving them. It was the 'disown' part I suppose I was answering more- sometimes distance is necessary.

If my child grew up to steal from me, I'd put physical distance there & protect my own interests- I've no desire to allow abuse; but I wouldn't stop loving them or hoping they had a moral turn-around.

I'd do what I legally could do to protect my grandchildren. And I'd be the consoling arms if they were not strong enough to oppose a mutilating partner, & needed to cry their regrets.
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#28 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 04:31 PM
 
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Of course your post has a lot of wisdom, TT, I'm just not sure how it translates to the circ context. I guess I would certainly not be emotionally available to my daughter during labor/birth/PP if she intended to circ her son--I'd really be more concerned with preventing the circ from occuring than with supporting her. But on a long-term level, I'm not sure how distancing oneself (other than refusing to support the circ) would be helpful, or even what formit would take?

If my DD is stealing from me, then distance, or meeting places other than my home, or other measures would be justified, but with circ--well, once it is done, sadly, it is done. :
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#29 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 04:44 PM
 
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Yeah, it was not a perfect analogy (I seem to be doing that lot these days!)

I hope it is never something I need to pursue my feelings about.
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#30 of 106 Old 01-16-2007, 05:06 PM
 
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I would be incredibly disappointed in my children if they circumcised their children. Very, very disappointed and surely very, very saddened. But I wouldn't distance myself from my child, they're still my child regardless of the bad choices they make, and that would be my grandchild and I wouldn't want to lose either.

- Emy . Single mom to DS nut.gif Ezra (15.12.05), angel2.gif Thames (reincarnated 18.04.08) and DD rainbow1284.gif babyf.gif Allora (11.02.11) and dog2.gif Hoppylactivist.gif  novaxnocirc.gif  waterbirth.jpg fambedsingle2.gif bfinfant.giffemalesling.GIFcd.gif

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