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#121 of 130 Old 11-13-2007, 05:24 PM
 
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Two things about the episode bothered me as bad writing.

1) Bree got away with saying she didn't want her son to be in the minority. I'm surprised Orson didn't know the opposite is true in California.

2) NO MOHEL WOULD CUT anyone having been told there is a custodial parent who doesn't want it to happen.

-Ron
HIS body, HIS decision.
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#122 of 130 Old 11-13-2007, 06:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by alissakae View Post
Now that I've mulled this over a bit, I think there are a lot of positives about what happened on this show. First of all, regular viewers know Bree to be extremely controlling and superficial....which puts someone who would go to such lengths to get a baby cut in the same category. This is not where most moms want to be.

Orson is the product of a very abusive "Mommy Dearest" who has been a character on the show. The fact that THAT mother had him circumcised is another blow to the image of a woman who would get a baby cut.

Orson has been very damaged by his upbringing, and mentioned how traumatic his circumcision was to him. He also decided he wanted Bree when she was still married and was involved in her first husband's "accidental" death - so he is capable of anything. It would not be out of character for him to act mollified by Bree's words after the circ but come back later somehow to punish her for doing it. Since he was so opposed, I wouldn't be surprised if the issue DID come up later as something he exacts revenge for.

Stay tuned
I totally agree. The more I think of it in terms of a popular mainstream show, the more satisfied I am with the episode. Sure, I would have liked to have it been the entire focus of the show and would like to have seen Orson go to any length AT ALL to keep him intact, but that is not realistic to expect of a show. I am still pleased that on a show like this, they said, "mutilation, pain and decreased sexual pleasure" then mocked doing it just for conformity.
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#123 of 130 Old 11-13-2007, 07:23 PM
 
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Originally Posted by hollytheteacher View Post
I've heard of gay bars where there is no cover charge for uncut men!
I work the Chicago Gay Pride Parade every year, walking up and down the route handing out circumcision info to the spectators.

I think the proportion of people who
a) say they prefer a cut man for aesthetic reasons and
b) have no problem with infant circ
is only slightly lower among Chicago gays compared to Chicago straights.

-Ron
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#124 of 130 Old 11-18-2007, 08:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron_Low View Post
Two things about the episode bothered me as bad writing.

1) Bree got away with saying she didn't want her son to be in the minority. I'm surprised Orson didn't know the opposite is true in California.

2) NO MOHEL WOULD CUT anyone having been told there is a custodial parent who doesn't want it to happen.
1) This show takes place in a fictional East Coast state--depending on the exact location, an uncut man would be in the minority.

2) I totally 100% agree about the Mohel. That never, ever would have happened.

And as a Jew, I wasn't the least bit offended by any implications about Jews in the show. I thought Bree's attempt at a Jewish accent hilarious. "I should only have a nickle for everytime I heard that!"

And from Orsen's previous behavior, just because he temporarily lets something go doesn't mean its over. I don't think this is the last we've heard of the issue.

I just noticed though--you can hear the little jewish boy wailing in the background after the bris. They must have used a really sad baby for the sound track, because his little voice is wavering in such a sad way. :

Honestly, I found this show a really good voice in a sea that ignores the issue. Imagine all the people who never thought about it, listening to Orsen & Bree's arguement, hoping that Orsen would step in and save the baby, and then feeling let down when the baby was cut. Better for one fictional baby to go under the knife to prevoke thought among millions of people who "never really thought about it before."
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#125 of 130 Old 11-18-2007, 01:03 PM
 
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I thought it was set in California too.

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#126 of 130 Old 11-18-2007, 05:38 PM
 
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Did anyone hear the Mohel say, "the BIBLE says..." It should have been Torah. The writers didn't do their research. Bible is a Christian term, not Jewish.

Am I wrong about this?

Also, I missed the show the night it aired so I watched it from the networks website. (They have commercials sponsering the show) I thought it was ironic that viagra's drug company, Pfizer, was the one supporting DH!
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#127 of 130 Old 11-18-2007, 05:53 PM
 
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I'm surprised that no one else noticed that the show closely tied circumcision with emasculation.

In a previous episode, pregnant Danielle told Bree, "You emasculated Dad..."

After the circumcision, Orson angrily tells Bree, "Why didn't you just cut his testicles off too!!!"

Orson's mom was an emasculating woman, and circ'ing Orson at age five was part of her character.

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#128 of 130 Old 11-19-2007, 12:49 PM
 
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I finally watched it yesterday online (btw the sponsors are different each time to watch it online, even with the same show, so it's not planned or anything)

I am really pleased with the things that were said on network tv. I think it is just incredible that he was able to say the things he said.

SaharaRose, I agree with you

fruitful womb, I thought he said Torah, but maybe I was expecting it so that's the way I heard it. I actually remember it being kind of hard to understand, which I attributed to an accent. Maybe they dubbed it for the online version? No idea, just thinking.

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#129 of 130 Old 11-20-2007, 02:32 AM
 
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Originally Posted by christifav View Post
Uggghhhhh....

Another lost opportunity. Most of Hollywood seems to be pro-circ. Unlike the rest of CA.
DO you think it might be because of the amount of Jewish people in the entertaiment industry? I think it plays a huge roll. My bro is 25 and born in CA and is intact, thanks to my mom being a nurse and seeing through the BS when she saw her first circ board, and the OB said that why mess with perfection? ( Turns out he is one of the founders of NOCIRC!)

Living DAIRY AND GLUTEN FREE for my SPD and Aspergers Little Man.
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#130 of 130 Old 11-21-2007, 12:11 AM
 
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I was generally happy with the episode in that Orson brought up the pain and decreased sexual pleasure argument vs. Bree's desire for conformity and "unsightly" foreskin removal - and in a very popular mainstream show. I did find it to be a total flame out that Orson's anger with the sneaky circumcision was played out at the end as him just being unhappy that Bree wasn't considering him as a parenting equal, rather than him being angry about his son's mutilation. I hope the issue comes up again on the show.

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Married mom to Patrick (2004), Noah (2006) and Liam (2010) VBAC!!
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