Medical Circumcision??? - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 38 Old 03-31-2010, 08:19 PM - Thread Starter
 
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My one year old son is not circumcised and is having a problem with his foreskin allowing the urine to drain. Basically, the urine builds up in the foreskin like a water balloon and then drains slowly. It's only a few second process, but it's very noticeable. We saw a Urologist today and he recommended circumcision. The opening is so small, it can't really be located. He informed us that there is a steroid cream application that we could try, but when pressed for an answer he stated that because the opening is so small, it probably wouldn't work.

If we do have to circumcise him I would rather that he not remember it, but I am concerned about the anesthetic. Is it better to wait and see how it goes, or is it better to have it done now before he will remember it? Is there a possibility that it will stretch on its own? Has anyone had this experience?

Mommy to N (4/2/09) and expecting #2 June 2011
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#2 of 38 Old 03-31-2010, 08:23 PM
 
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I don't have a lot of time, and I'm sure someone will come along to give a better explaination and more detailed answer, but in short - your son does not need to be circumcised based on the info in your post. "Ballooning" while urinating is perfectly normal and not something that needs to be corrected.
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#3 of 38 Old 03-31-2010, 08:39 PM
 
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yes ballooning is normal. my ds had a very small opening at 3.5 it is just now starting to show that there is a hole there. even now it drips forever. when he was younger it looked closed it looked more like a little dimple in the skin not like a opening. even when he peed it would balloon then come out slowly and drip forever.

how old is your ds? i would say watch it and wait as long as pee is coming out it should be fine. he is not getting infections from the pee being backed up. before i ever did a circ i would do many other things but never a circ for that.
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#4 of 38 Old 03-31-2010, 09:02 PM
 
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i am a mama who circed and regrets it.

part of why i regret it is all the info i gathered here after it was too late. one thing i learned was that ballooning is normal, and possibly even necessary to help with natural retraction.

based on what you have written, your best bet is to never see that circ-happy surgeon again.

best wishes for maintaining your sons gential integrity!

Bring back the old MDC
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#5 of 38 Old 03-31-2010, 09:22 PM
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Circumcision is NOT medically necessary for your son, your urologist is dead wrong! A tight and small preputal opening is normal for infants and young boys. His prepuce / foreskin is doing its job of protecting his urethra from germs. Ballooning of some degree is normal for most boys at varioius stages and ages of development. Sometimes the ballooning and separation can be a bit sore and a bit painful for some boys but this stage is short lived. Steroid cream is totally not necessary for tolddlers and young boys since your son's penis including his prepuce (foreskin) takes 15 to 18 yrs. to Fully develop. If an adolescent boy who is past puperty has a tight prepuce with little or a very tight retraction upon erection, then and only then should steroid cream be used to widen the opening. Also, penile growth, erections, and manipulation / masturbation helps stretch the preputal oppening. Let mother nature and time do its job, just relax and don't worry.

Also, read up on why forced retraction is very harmful and causes unretractibility in boys. There's info. in the resources section of this circ. forum. Lastly, a small percentage of young men in real life (1 to 2%) in European countries that don't circ have a tight unretractable prepuce when they reach early adulthood. Even in these young men, circumcision is not necessary. A surgical procedure called a prepuplasty makes the preputal opening larger and the prepuce retractable WITHOUT anmputating any sensitive tissue. A few verticle slits are made on the prepuce and then stitched horizontally. Don't let any physician retract your son and tell all health care providers beforehand not to because it will cause pain, and possible damage to the tissue.

Call NOCIRC for expert advice and support. Their info. is listed below. Lastly, Bless you for questioning the urologist and for coming here. Remember the USA is a circumcising culture (50-60% of infant boys circed this yr.!) and many circumcised physicians were taught minimal or incorrect info. on the development and normalcy of the male prepuce including its protective, sensual, and sexual functions that last a life time. Don't forget to educate the Urologist on what you learn and why your son will Not undergo a prepuce amputation. Prepuce amputations are medically needed in very very rare cases of gangrene, severe frostbite causing tissue to die, cancerous tissue, or irrepairable damage (i.e. mauled by a dog).

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#6 of 38 Old 03-31-2010, 09:36 PM
 
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Hey there Nicolebug. Ballooning (which is what this is called) is pretty normal for an intact boy. The only real issue is whether or not he is urinating. If he is and he is doing so without significant effort or discomfort then he is in all probability just fine. There are a number of resources here including this:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=764732?

Which should get you started. You can also call Marilyn @ NOCIRC for a second opinion referral.
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#7 of 38 Old 03-31-2010, 11:29 PM
 
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What everyone else said what your ds is having is normal and it is a sign he is starting to retract. The tip of the foreskin is a sphincter like the anus and only opens when in use.

Please dont allow anyone to retract him that is a big because of the damage it can cause.

Please read the thread linked to in the pp and please run dont walk from that Dr. he is not up to date on foreskin issues at all. The steroid cream is for boys who are in puberty or adult males with phimosis and should never be used on boys younger than that.

Here are some other links on ballooning
http://www.cirp.org/library/hygiene/
Quote:
The separation of the foreskin from the glans penis Ballooning of the prepuce while urinating cannot occur until separation is underway. The occurence of ballooning indicates that separation has started.15 Babu et al. have proven that ballooning does not interfere with urination.21 Ballooning is a normal developmental stage and is not a cause for concern and does not require treatment.16 20 A child temporarily may report some discomfort or pain while urinating during this period. This occurs because the ballooning may tear at any residual connection to the glans. The discomfort will stop when separation is complete. The foreskin may still not be retractable at this point because the opening is still narrow. With increased growth and maturity, the ballooning will end when opening of the foreskin widens.


http://www.norm-uk.org/circumcision_alternative_treatments.html
Quote:
Ballooning of the Foreskin Ballooning of the foreskin while urinating can be a normal phase of development during childhood. It is not an indication for circumcision. Ballooning is a temporary phenomenon that arises when the foreskin begins to separate from the glans. It speeds the process of separation and disappears when the process is complete.

 
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#8 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 12:49 AM
 
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Ballooning is common and harmless. Many of our sons did it. It will last for some just a short time, but it will go on for a few years with others.

Steroid creams are for older teen agers and adults who wish to be able to retract more comfortably for grown up activity. It needs to be used in conjunction with certain exercises that are exceedingly inappropriate to do on a baby. The cream will at best be ineffective if use on a baby with out doing the stretching exercises and possibly harmful.

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#9 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 01:22 AM
 
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Ditto to what everyone else said. I'll add that my son is 5 and has ballooned since he was probably 10 months old. The dripping is annoying once they potty-train because it gets on their hands and the seat, but other than that, not an issue.
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#10 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 01:37 AM
 
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My brother is 7 and has ballooned for a couple years. We all know who used the toilet b/c there's little drops all over it lol. (He hates to raise up the seat).

It is very normal and a good sign that his body parts are working! Don't let anyone interfere with his body!

Some boys go through this stage quickly, others like my brother can take awhile. But without any pain or absolute prevention of urination, all is well.

Also, that steroid cream is for teens/adults. I wonder if the doctor had to be pressed to tell you more info b/c he was embarrassed? I mean, it's basically like he would have had to tell you to rub your son's penis. Blech.


And besides, even if your son was in the rare statistic that did not stretch, there's still another procedure to try before circumcision.

Mama to expecting Babe 2
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#11 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 11:21 AM
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Balloning is totally normal. there is nothing wrong with your son. it's just a normal part of the separation process.
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#12 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 06:49 PM
 
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Both my sons ballooned. They have had no problems whatsoever with their foreskins.

Regards
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#13 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 06:54 PM
 
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I'm so sorry you've gotten such poor information. Ballooning is normal - don't retract your son, and I'd be pretty mad that your urologist wants to do unnecessary surgery on your son. I'd be complaining and sending some info.

SugarMama to Chatterbox Zoe (almost 4) and Locomotive Miles (2)
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#14 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 07:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Was the opening in their foreskins extremely small??? That's what I'm worried about, it just doesn't seem as though it will ever be big enough to fully retract. It's such a tiny opening!

Mommy to N (4/2/09) and expecting #2 June 2011
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#15 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 07:34 PM
 
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It is a sphincter it is only meant to open when in use like the anus.

It will grow as he does and eventually relax to allow retraction. It is normal. Ds's was a pin hole as well he is 5 now and can retract easily about three quarters of the way.

 
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#16 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 07:41 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MCatLvrMom2A&X View Post
It is a sphincter it is only meant to open when in use like the anus.

It will grow as he does and eventually relax to allow retraction. It is normal. Ds's was a pin hole as well he is 5 now and can retract easily about three quarters of the way.
Yes to all of this. My ds just went thru potty training, so I've been watching him pee quite a bit lately . His foresking actually opens up to expel the urine. When he is done it is back to its normal self where you really can't see an opening. I have no idea how much my son retracts yet as I have never seen him pull it back before, but it can't be very much.

What you described sounds perfectly normal. Doctors here in the US don't know anything about intact boys(most of the time). If anything, get a second opinion from a doctor who knows how a natural penis functions. Surgery is not the answer.

Meghan : Kayla~ 10/19/04 Jack~ 5/27/07
Evelyn~ 10/9/10

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#17 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 07:49 PM
 
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Yes, the opening is tiny. When my DS messes with his and yanks it back, you cannot see the head at all, it's just like a pinpoint opening.

The skin loosens over time to allow it to stretch enough to retract. It's rare for an infant to have a large enough opening to retract.

Really, you have nothing to worry about, and like some others have said, even IF he has issues with it later, it does not warrant a circ.
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#18 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 08:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by nicolebug View Post
Was the opening in their foreskins extremely small??? That's what I'm worried about, it just doesn't seem as though it will ever be big enough to fully retract. It's such a tiny opening!
yes my ds's opening is very small just now at 3.5 can you see that there is a opening. up until he was 3 you could not see that it was a opening at all. dont worry about retracting because as he is a teen it will loosen enough. if it didnt and he was in pain at that time the worse case would be cream and streching or a slit in his forskin.

i see those 2 things as way way rare because i have been with 2 who can not fully retract when errect but we had not problems with sex the forskin does loosen after time so there was no problems with retracting after a while
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#19 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 08:40 PM
 
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Yes as others point out there is a sphincter. When DS was that age it would sometimes be really small, but it always opened up when he would pee during diaper changes you could see it open right up.

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#20 of 38 Old 04-01-2010, 09:40 PM
 
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http://www.mothering.com/health/prot...advice-parents

Love Dr. Fleiss's book "what your dr may not tell you about circumcision" as well

Melissa, wife to Brian, mommy to my home born, breastfeeding, sling-riding, sleep sharing, cloth diapered, intact kiddos Adam 11/09 and Leah 8/12.

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#21 of 38 Old 04-02-2010, 12:27 AM
 
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Ballooning and tiny opening are both normal.

DS(14) ballooned until around 11 years old, DS(10) ballooned until about 6.
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#22 of 38 Old 04-02-2010, 12:39 AM
 
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Here is a link that might help explain things.

http://www.cirp.org/library/normal/

Wife to DH, Mom to my Intact Boys DS1: Born 02 Pain Med Free Hospital Birth, BF'ed for 9 Months, Partially Vax'd DS2: Born 06 via UC, BF'ed 3 years 10 months, and UnVax'd
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#23 of 38 Old 04-02-2010, 01:34 AM
 
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Originally Posted by nicolebug View Post
Was the opening in their foreskins extremely small??? That's what I'm worried about, it just doesn't seem as though it will ever be big enough to fully retract. It's such a tiny opening!
Two things:

1) Quote from Sir James Spence, eminent British pediatrician: "What looks like a pin point opening at 7 months will become a wide channel of communication at 17."

2) My older son had an opening that was literally the size of a pinhead till he was about 8. Then very quickly the opening started getting looser and looser, and almost overnight he became completely and easily retractable. I don't think I would have believed it either if I hadn't seen it myself.

Trust the natural process! That urologist doesn't know much about foreskins, it would appear.

Gillian
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#24 of 38 Old 04-02-2010, 02:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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You all have been very helpful. I knew that there were other answers out there. It's my sons first birthday today and I am so glad that I have all of this great information! Thanks again!

Mommy to N (4/2/09) and expecting #2 June 2011
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#25 of 38 Old 04-03-2010, 08:23 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Mama2Kayla View Post
Yes to all of this. My ds just went thru potty training, so I've been watching him pee quite a bit lately . His foresking actually opens up to expel the urine. When he is done it is back to its normal self where you really can't see an opening. I have no idea how much my son retracts yet as I have never seen him pull it back before, but it can't be very much.
This.

I never knew about this sphincter action until I saw it in person watching my son pee. It's amazing. Have you tried to watch when he pees? Watch for his foreskin to dilate like my son's does.

Finally, if it was my son, I would only be concerned if it caused my son pain or infections.
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#26 of 38 Old 04-04-2010, 09:21 PM
 
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Honestly, mama, I wouldn't even bother with the time and trouble of a second opinion as long as he is peeing normally. Ballooning is normal, and having a sphincter that looks like a pinhole when it is not in use is normal.

Going to a US-educated doctor is a risky thing to do when it comes to the intact penis, because most of them are never educated on the structure and function of the intact penis, but rather got their education in a system that was heavily biased towards circumcision. To the point that many medical textbooks show circumcised males as if that is normal anatomy, and the most experience many doctors have ever had with a foreskin was cutting one off.

To flip it around, it would be like taking your daughter in for labial adhesions to a doctor in a country where the vast majority of girls are circumcised....you'd get a medical 'opinion' that the labia are dirty, prone to problems, and are best removed. The opinion in either case doesn't reflect medical reality, but cultural bias and medical myths.

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#27 of 38 Old 04-04-2010, 10:22 PM
 
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To flip it around, it would be like taking your daughter in for labial adhesions to a doctor in a country where the vast majority of girls are circumcised....you'd get a medical 'opinion' that the labia are dirty, prone to problems, and are best removed. The opinion in either case doesn't reflect medical reality, but cultural bias and medical myths.
So very true.

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#28 of 38 Old 04-09-2010, 09:37 AM
 
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Yep, and adults can choose. It's his body and his penis -- why shouldn't it be his choice? Just as it should be a woman's choice to augment or reduce her breasts, or have her clitoral hood (her prepuce = foreskin) removed.

The "do it now because it's so much worse as an adult" argument just doesn't hold water -- my father was circumcised as an adult (for his own reasons, no medical necessity at all) and it was an outpatient procedure, with pain relief during and after the procedure. Nor was he peeing and pooping on an open wound.

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#29 of 38 Old 04-09-2010, 01:33 PM
 
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Just a reminder that religious discussion of circumcision does not belong in TCAC, as per the forum guidelines:

Quote:
The discussion of or reference to religion is outside of the scope of this forum. Any posts which bring any aspect of religion into the discussion are not appropriate and will be removed. Respectful discussion of a religious nature regarding circumcision, alternatives, etc. may be hosted in the Spirituality forum. The Spirituality forum is a debate-free zone. Members maintain a list of helpful websites in a Web Resources thread for further information about religious issues.
Carry on.

Have you seen the updated user agreement yet?
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#30 of 38 Old 04-09-2010, 05:43 PM
 
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Yep, and adults can choose. It's his body and his penis -- why shouldn't it be his choice? Just as it should be a woman's choice to augment or reduce her breasts, or have her clitoral hood (her prepuce = foreskin) removed.

The "do it now because it's so much worse as an adult" argument just doesn't hold water -- my father was circumcised as an adult (for his own reasons, no medical necessity at all) and it was an outpatient procedure, with pain relief during and after the procedure. Nor was he peeing and pooping on an open wound.
Really? I've read that guys also need meds to prevent erections during the healing time (4 to 6 weeks) as well - is that true? (Or was it true for him, actually.) I'm a bit scared of the potential for those meds to mess EVERYTHING up - like as a WAY rare side effect, they'd cause permanent impotence or something.

I want my future sons to have the option if they decide to get it done. But I don't want them to need meds that could make what SHOULD have been a simple procedure turn into a lifetime of ED. Are the meds essential? Would pain (if he's not healed enough and starts to get an erection) be enough to protect him without them? Because frankly, if it doesn't hurt, he's healed enough. But if he's on pain meds, will that be blocked?

And I can't ask how long he'd need the serious meds, because that's like asking "how long will I need to be on Percocet after a C Section?". For some women, the answer is "about 4 hours" and for others, the answer is "six weeks". UGH! SO many things to think about!!!!!!
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