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#61 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 12:40 AM
 
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My thoughts on the OP later

Please some men jump in here to answer that last one............
The way I understand it is that intact is more sensitive because they have fine touch receptors that are removed during circumcision and so they are more capable of receiving information regarding level of stimulation and so more capable of fine tuning
Circumcised is less sensitive and less capable ............
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#62 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 12:56 AM
 
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I heard the difference between intact and circed was similar to the difference we feel if we lightly brush our finger over the palm of our hand - then turn our hand over and brush over the back of our hand.

From personal experience, circed men are less sensitive.
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#63 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 01:05 AM
 
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Is there something with being circed that cause premature ejaculation or something?

Unassisted birthing, atheist, poly, bi WOHM to 4 wonderful, smart homeschooling kids Wes (14) Seth (7) Pandora Moonlilly (2) and Nevermore Stargazer (11/2012)  Married to awesome SAH DH.

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#64 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 01:12 AM
 
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Quote:
Circumcision Practice Patterns in the United States:
http://pediatrics.aappublications.or.../full/101/6/e5
great article but it was from a sample from 1995-1996 anything less than ten years old floating around?

Quote:
I have a friend who witnessed her oldest son's circ and all that was used for pain relief was a glucose dipped pacifier.
Okay that just defies logic to me... most adults want pain killers/gas for the smallest dental filling (usually so not needed I get mine done without freezing even my dentist thinks I am a nut...but the shallow ones do not hurt I digress) Where's the logic there? I mean thats beyond barbaric, I am not going to wade into the other stuff but if you are choosing to circ why not demand that it be done slightly more humanely with less trauma as possible..
okay I feel sick now.

I think if someone had done that to my son with such a callous disregard for their pain levels......you'd have had to tie me down.

8 might be enough
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#65 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 01:44 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharlla
Is there something with being circed that cause premature ejaculation or something?

There is a lot of speculation about it but I don't think it has really been established yet. That's because a person's primary sexual organ is not the genitals but instead, the brain. If you've had the experience, you know no matter how skilled the sexual partner, if you're not brain connected (attracted) to them, the sex is going to be less than stellar. I personally don't think the researchers will ever get past this stumbling block.

There has been research that shows both that circumcision causes premature ejaculation and research that shows that it delays ejaculation even to the point that it makes it almost impossible. The truth is that circumcision radically changes the mechanics of the sex act for men. Studies going back as far as 1916 confirm this. It is well known that circumcised men thrust harder, deeper and faster that intact men and this has been established by several studies. It is probably this harder, faster and deeper method that brings on the premature ejaculation. From my own experience, I know that intact men get a much wider range of sensations that negate the need for the more forceful sex and I believe that they get more sensory input that allows them to time their movements better to avoid premature ejaculation. For the circumcised man, he probably rushes toward his orgasm so hard and fast that he is unable to feel it coming on and therefore is unable to control and delay it. That's my experience at least. With a foreskin, I get a lot of subtle warnings and can slightly vary my movements to prolong the onset of orgasm without actually triggering it.



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#66 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 02:11 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiloh
great article but it was from a sample from 1995-1996 anything less than ten years old floating around?


Okay that just defies logic to me... most adults want pain killers/gas for the smallest dental filling (usually so not needed I get mine done without freezing even my dentist thinks I am a nut...but the shallow ones do not hurt I digress) Where's the logic there? I mean thats beyond barbaric, I am not going to wade into the other stuff but if you are choosing to circ why not demand that it be done slightly more humanely with less trauma as possible..
okay I feel sick now.

I think if someone had done that to my son with such a callous disregard for their pain levels......you'd have had to tie me down.
From what I understand, there are at least 3 different "pain relief" options for RIC:
(Please excuse my spelling tonight,folks.)
1) analgesic cream-- I think they rub some stuff on the penis before cutting. (a) it does not really provide adequate pain relief for the procedure. Babies still cry just about as much as they would without it. and (b) Some doctors don't feel like waiting for it to take full effect before starting the procedure.

2) Shots. From what I understand, 3 different shots at 3 different points around the base of the penis.
(a) The shots in themselves hurt almost or just as bad as the circumcision itself. We just had a lady post here, who had the same type of shot, I believe it was (correct me if I'm wrong) injected into her face for some type of cosmetic work. She commented on just how intensely these shots hurt and just how awful it was for her to imagine these shots being given to a newborn infant down in that area.
(b) Once again, some doctors do not feel like waiting around after administering the shots for the full relief to kick in before starting the procedure.

3) General anaesthesia.
(a) It is very dangerous for infants. Newborns have actually had brain damage and even died from being put under general anaesthesia for their circumcision.
What a huge unecessary risk just for some stupid cosmetic surgery.
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#67 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 03:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharlla
Is there something with being circed that cause premature ejaculation or something?
The reasons for why a circumcised man is more likely to be prone to premature ejaculation are explained on pages 175-180 in Sex As Nature Intended It.

But since premature ejaculation is something a man can "unlearn" (as revealed in pages 363-364), there's a more important issue here.

It's the discovery that Kristen O'Hara made from her survey of women who were sexually expereinced with both natural and circumcised men.

The survey revealed that even when circumcised men were able to prolong intercourse, 70% of the women surveyed indicated that "OFTEN they wished to just get it over with."

Whereas, with natural intercourse, the reverse was true: 91% of the women surveyed indicated that "they really got into it and wanted it to continue."

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#68 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 04:06 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Jeffrey O'Hara
The survey revealed that even when circumcised men were able to prolong intercourse, 70% of the women surveyed indicated that "OFTEN they wished to just get it over with."

Whereas, with natural intercourse, the reverse was true: 91% of the women surveyed indicated that "they really got into it and wanted it to continue."

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Oh WOW! I SOO identify with that! ^^ With all of my other partners, it seemed like i just wanted them to be done (usually because i had dried out down there) Whereas, with my fiance', I could quite happily go until we both are so exhausted that we can hardly even move.

I don't know if this has anything to do with being intact, or if it is just my fiance' own unique physicality, but he is able to remain erect for a while after he has climaxed, which makes relations with him all the better.

Karin, Wife to Dear Sweet English Husband~Soon to be Legally American. Mom to Zach~13, Lily~9, Alex~2, and Izzy or Zeke arriving July 2010! Living a life full of LOVE!
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#69 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 10:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffrey O'HaraThe survey revealed that even when [B
circumcised[/B] men were able to prolong intercourse, 70% of the women surveyed indicated that "OFTEN they wished to just get it over with."
THIS I can related to with my cut hubby
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#70 of 78 Old 03-12-2006, 12:55 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharlla
Is there something with being circed that cause premature ejaculation or something?
I think they are missing the special nerves that tell them how close they are to coming. And maybe the men who take too long have too few nerves left at all to get enough stimulation.

I think the difference in sexual response is b/c each penis is different and each circumcision is different so we can see a whole range of different effects.

DS1 2004 ~ DS2 2005 ~ DD1 2008 ~ DS3 2010 ~ DD2 due Dec. 2014
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#71 of 78 Old 03-15-2006, 01:25 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galatea
I think they are missing the special nerves that tell them how close they are to coming. And maybe the men who take too long have too few nerves left at all to get enough stimulation.

I think the difference in sexual response is b/c each penis is different and each circumcision is different so we can see a whole range of different effects.
I have heard from multiple women who have been with intact DH's that they have a tremendous amount of control with regards to orgasm...they can orgasm quicker, or delay it....the women experience a lot of simultaneous orgasm.

On a weird side note, I found out when I talked to my mom about my decision to not circ, I found out that my father was intact. Anyhow, she had told me her only bc method had been "pull and pray", etc. Apparently my father had a LOT of control . More information that I wanted to know, but it makes sense in a way.

I get so much out of sex here as an intact woman...like the others said, the nuances...DH needs a lot of rough stimulation to go. That is so sad for me....he can be tender and concentrate, or I can just take charge and do things with my own power to get the stimulation that I like, but he will never orgasm from the deep, slower and tender stimulation. Like many of you have said, the nuances...and there are so many. I try to imagine what it would be like if they weren't there, and it would be so sad .

My friends who have been with intact men tell me about the noises they make and that they are just in ecstacy in comparison. I think how unfair it was that nobody in this country stood up to protect DH and the other men out there so that they could enjoy the full pleasure that their bodies were meant to have. And, how silently the women have suffered through rough sex, and thinking that there was something wrong with them that their DH's weren't in tune with them sexually.

It is painful for me to think of what we lost, but more painful to think of what he individually has lost. And, it is difficult to imagine what he is going through when he thinks of it. Might it be that in this case, for the circ'd man, ignorance is bliss? But then again, if he does restore, which we are currently embarking on (very slowly for him...it is such an emotional endeavor) I think he will be more of an intactavist than I can imagine.

I wish I could have stood up for DH and told his parents to leave him alone.

Perpetually breastfeeding or pregnant ENFP mom to a lot of kids...wife to a midwestern nice guy...living in tropical paradise...pink cats and homebirths rock!

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#72 of 78 Old 03-15-2006, 02:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by phatchristy
It is painful for me to think of what we lost, but more painful to think of what he individually has lost. And, it is difficult to imagine what he is going through when he thinks of it. Might it be that in this case, for the circ'd man, ignorance is bliss?
I think, right here, is the reason why circ is so hard to fight. Circed men just do not want to even entertain the thought that they are missing something when it comes to sex. Who would?

You know, I tried to tell a friend of mine about this before she had (and circumcised) her son. She used to comment that I was the only one of her friends who really seemed to enjoy sex - that the rest of them (herself included) would look for excuses not to 'do the deed'.

I didnt' know all of the details then that I know now, but my intuition was that the difference was related to the fact that all of their husbands are circed, and mine is intact.

So, so unfair for a generation of American men and women. But then to perpetuate it on your children?
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#73 of 78 Old 03-15-2006, 03:39 PM
 
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Here is my response to "Why so anti-circumcision?"

Although I think I prefer to respond as one who is "so pro-intact".

My gut has its own response which feels the horridness of circumcision. Then I have a belief in the natural world and I do not believe that the human mind will ever come to know the big picture 100%. Then I learn about what is known about the function of the foreskin. And I am sad that I do not know sex as nature intended it. And when I close my eyes and feel............. what I feel is nausea, shock, ......... grief and despair.

Getting personal here......... when I birthed my son, some damage happened to my genitalia. I am sure that the damage is pale by comparison to circumcision. Yet, so far I have not been able to describe how devastating the affect has been on me and feel that I have been understood. That this sort of damage is done to babies or children or anyone on purpose is in my mind truely a violation.
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#74 of 78 Old 03-15-2006, 07:33 PM
 
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I don't believe in unecessarily irreversibly altering a child's body without medical reason. That would include piercings, tattoos and yes, circumcision. I believe it is part of everybody's basic human right to have their body not altered with. It is highly unethical.

One can make that decision him or herself when old enough.

It's not the parents' right.
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#75 of 78 Old 03-15-2006, 10:53 PM
 
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circumcision is violence against babies and little children...the fact that this is still done, and so often makes me sick....extreme? Yes, I tend have extreme opinions regarding violence against children. I am sure you would be against other, less mainstream, sexual violence against babies..why would circumcision be an exception?
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#76 of 78 Old 03-16-2006, 03:15 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiloh
Okay that just defies logic to me... most adults want pain killers/gas for the smallest dental filling (usually so not needed I get mine done without freezing even my dentist thinks I am a nut...but the shallow ones do not hurt I digress) Where's the logic there? I mean thats beyond barbaric, I am not going to wade into the other stuff but if you are choosing to circ why not demand that it be done slightly more humanely with less trauma as possible..
okay I feel sick now.

I think if someone had done that to my son with such a callous disregard for their pain levels......you'd have had to tie me down.
sadly, but some people still believe that infants don't feel pain. this is most often due to the fact that same babies will fall asleep during or after the procedure as a result of the shock they are in (because the piercing cries aren't proof enough)...

i was misinformed and scared when i had my first son at age 16. he was circumcised and given nothing for pain. the doctor told me i couldn't go in the room because 'most parents couldn't handle it' i can't change the past, but had i gone in that room or had the procedure been explained to me, i would not have let him continue.
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#77 of 78 Old 03-16-2006, 05:30 AM
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Or some will just retaliate with "I sure am glad I don't have a disgusting cock skirt" (yes, that's an exact quote).

LOL @ "cock skirt". Now I have a mental image I CAN'T get rid of. I hope I don't start laughing next time I have sex and see the "cock skirt".

I made the mistake of circ'ing my son. I regret it now and it will never happen again, but I try not to dwell on it. What's done is done and there's nothing I can do about it now. Maybe when he's older he can find a way to have it fixed.
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#78 of 78 Old 03-17-2006, 11:00 AM
 
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I am so anti-circ because I am from Chile. That's a country that belongs to the 80% of the world that doesn't circumcise their newborn babies. Circumcision just feels wrong all around.
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