In talking to intact/circ'd men about orgasm something I seem to notice... - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 11:01 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I had a peculiar discussion with my DH about orgasms. I shared with him what mine are like, the fact that they are nearly always full body orgasms (to the extent that sometimes I swear I am floating above my body in ecstacy ). I feel it in my arms, back and incredibly in my face among other places. And, his response was "I feel it on the penis or it feels good on the penis." He didn't really have a concept exactly of what I meant by full body orgasms.

You know those fluttery/shivery sensations that you can have when you run your fingertips over someone lightly on the back/arm/thigh...well, he thinks those sensations are more "sensitive" than what he experiences during direct sexual stimulation. That really got me to thinking/worrying that sex for him sounds more like satisfying an urge and that it feels good, but isn't the "blissful dance of love" that it is for me.

In light of that conversation, I have opened up a bit of conversation IRL with some men who are intact and others who are circ'd. It seems that all the intact men KNOW what I am saying when I describe the sensations that I feel. They seem to have the "full body sensations" the way that I do. On the other hand, it seems like nearly every cut guy is saying that things are centered on the "penis" and they don't have a mental concept of a full body orgasm.

I don't have a big sample to go from, so I thought I might ask some opinions on this? Also, I know we have restored/restoring men here. Might they comment on the differences before/after with regards to this?

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#2 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 01:14 PM
 
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#3 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 01:59 PM
 
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You are exactly, 100% and unequivocably correct. Circumcised men do NOT have anywhere close to the sensation that women and intact men do during orgasm. It IS just the satisfaction of sexual tension. The sensation of a backrub IS more intense than the sensation one feels on a circumcised penis. Cut sex does feel good, and it is a relief of tension, for circed men... but it is not transcendental or overwhelming. You know that sense of relief you feel when you empty an overfull bladder? That's just a little shy of a circumcised orgasm. Feels just a tad better than that... sadly.

One thing that bothered me and got me on the road to restoring several years ago was the realization than I could feel more intensely with my fingertips and other parts of my body than I could with my penis. It didn't seem fair. Now, after restoring for over two years, the glans of my penis is so sensitive I cannot stand to have the shower spray hit it. Sex, after I achieved coverage, became something magical... romantic, intimate, transcendental, powerful, pleasurable... basically, every way that my wife had described our lovemaking all through our marriage (things I did not understand because I never felt them) became true for me to.

I came to love her in a very romantic, intimate and bonded manner... the two become one... the ways you read about in romance novels... those ways that do not exist for cut men because there is no physical way for them to feel it. Their capacity for it was snipped off along with a good portion of their penis skin.

Circumcision is not just a great loss for men... it is a loss for women too... because it partners you all with incomplete men who are not going to understand the finer points of sexuality and intimacy. Wouldn't it be nice to have a man you can drive over the edge of overwhelming pleasure and passion, make insane with lust and sexual stimulation, bond completely with you body and soul?

You can if you convince them to restore.

All that romance and sexual feeling... I thought it was all made-up crap until I restored and realized that it was all real... all true... it was like I hit puberty at the age of 34. I had my first real orgasm. I felt a true bond with my sexual partner and understood the things she said for the first time in my life. I know this all sounds rambling and broken, but there is just so much and it is so complex I can't describe it in a whole way.
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#4 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 03:23 PM
 
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Wow, DaddyJoe, that was beautiful. I wish people who claim there's no difference in sensation could read that.

I'm SO tired of reading articles that claim that there's absolutely no difference whatsoever because they did a survey of intact men and RIC'd men. If I had my clitoris removed in infancy, I would probably be perfectly happy with my sex life because I would have no idea what I was missing. I'd be thrilled that all that "redundant, dirty flesh" was gone before I could remember having it.

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#5 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 03:35 PM
 
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hmmm. I'll have to ask my cut dh what his are like. I'm curious now.

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#6 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 04:08 PM
 
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Wow the moment I started to read this I started to think. Hmm I have full body orgasms to and I am a guy and intact too! Then I got to the end of it surprised to find that most intact men feel this. This is very interesting.
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#7 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 05:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MatrionsRevenge
Wow the moment I started to read this I started to think. Hmm I have full body orgasms to and I am a guy and intact too! Then I got to the end of it surprised to find that most intact men feel this. This is very interesting.
I have talked to several intact/cut men so far about this, including where and how they feel the sensation and so far it's only the intact men who appear to relate to what I describe as the feelings I have during orgasm. And, well if that is the generalization then that just sucks! I described my sensations to the cut men and they just couldn't understand the sensations/feelings I was describing .

Now, if that isn't yet another thing that pisses me off about my inlaws having my DH cut .

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#8 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 05:16 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phatchristy
I have talked to several intact/cut men so far about this, including where and how they feel the sensation and so far it's only the intact men who appear to relate to what I describe as the feelings I have during orgasm. And, well if that is the generalization then that just sucks! I described my sensations to the cut men and they just couldn't understand the sensations/feelings I was describing .
Yup. I remember one partner I had (circ'd) who could NOT for the life of him understand the meaning of "nuance"!
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#9 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 05:59 PM
 
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How very true this is. Being intact I can attest to it. Orgasms are experienced throughout the body. It seems muscles tighten, you get tingling sensations and you lose control of your breath, amongst other things. With the girlfriend I once had (the only one I had sexual relations with), it was even better having an orgasm as you share the experience. She did comment on how she thought I must be tremendously experienced or read books on love-making. Very flattering, but I thought there was more to this opinion of hers. I just laughed and suggesteed that maybe what the case was, was that she must not have had sex with someone who wasn't cut. And guess what, that's exactly what it was (her first boyfriend in fact).

It dawned on her and she said "oh no wonder it doesn't hurt at all with you. I don't feel like I'm being drilled to death." LOL, yeah it was funny. Didn't hurt that she thought her 1st BF was a total jerk anyway. We're just friends now (after a couple of years to get over breaking up but that's irrelevant stuff) but I hope going forward she knows intact is the way to go. I guess the pleasure enjoyed by the predominately intact number of men around the world gets taken for granted, but with my knowledge of the effects of circ I will always be grateful for being spared the cut. It's nature's way and yet if you only knew a circ'd penis throughout life (whether you are male or female) you'd think such details I read off (as well as Daddy Joe's, which sound very familar to me although I'm not a married man), could only be caused by a miracle drug or herbal remedy.

But it's simply just in the way the human body is constructed at birth. Knowing all this, I will never let any sons of mine face the ridiculously pointless threat of circ. Whomever my wife will be, she'll have to know it's not even an option (and shouldn't be for any parents) to do such a cruel and barbaric thing. I will always try to make sure no sons of any friends and relatives are deprived of a foreskin too. I feel a bit sorry for men and women who can never truly experience great sex, but what's done is done and it's no reason not to love someone. But it should serve as a reason to break the cycle of abuse so future generations will never have to deal with the grief. Then maybe finally Americans can be seen as great lovers like all those Europeans have the reputation of being.
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#10 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 07:38 PM
 
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This thread is discussing some very inportant aspects of the damage of circ. Posters, so far, have done a wonderful job of describign their feelings and conversations with others in a very tactful manner. It is important that discussions we host are of a graceful, not crass manner. Descriptions of a clinical manner or personal nature need to remain tactful and not contain gratuitous sexual content. So far, you're doing great. Just a reminder to keep this discussion on track and on the forum!

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#11 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 09:42 PM
 
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I always thought it was funny how people would say someone was a "passionate Spanish lover" or "passionate French lover" or "Hot Italian lover". Yet, you never hear of a "passionate American lover" or "Hot Jewish lover". Somehow, people never make the connection to this disparity and the effects of circumcision on a culture's male population.

I know, after restoring, the sensations with orgasm became very overwhelming, and were no longer centered on the phallus. I would feel pleasure in my face, the back of my head if my wife touched my hair, my nipples and my entire pelvic region. There was a sensation of coming up out of my body, and my muscles constricted much harder and for a longer period of time-- not just in my genital area but throughout my entire body. There was a greater and longer lasting rush of sensual pleasure and emotional release, and afterwards a very great sense of relief and relaxation, almost like being high. The actual act is more intense as well... actually, since restoring, the sensation of simply entering my wife is better than my pre-restoring orgasms.

Intact men, if you want to know what a circumcised orgasm feels like, just imagine that nice sensation you feel during the initial penetration at the start of the act of lovemaking. That's it. That's the most a cut man feels. If that hurts anyone's feelings, I apologize. I've had it both ways. I have the right to give my opinion.
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#12 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 10:18 PM
 
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I can't even begin to imagine a conversation with my male friends about the intimate details of their orgasms. And that's even if I did have a clue as to which ones had which kind of penis.

If these guys you've questioned have wives/girlfriends/boyfriends, how do they feel about these conversations? I can just see my girlfriends' faces when I asked their husbands, "So, Jim, tell me about your orgasms. And could you please pass the rolls?"
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#13 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 10:26 PM
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He's right. You always hear the tales of the hot European lover, or the hot lover from South America.

I've said to people many'a'times, "Haven't you ever stopped to think about why women rave on and on about their European lovers and European women VERY RARELY go on and on the same way about American men?"

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#14 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 11:15 PM
 
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I never pop into discussion here, but I felt the need to add (maybe in defence for some weird reason) that DH is cut and has those "full body orgasms" that the OP describes. It's obvious his whole body is "into" it. They last forever and he's wiped out afterwards. Well for a few minutes. Then he's ready to go again

NOT defending circ'ing FYI. Just wanted to post my (DH's) side of things.

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#15 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 11:19 PM
 
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When we lived abroad yes my female friends would tell stories about affairs w/ American soldiers. Maybe we just don't hear about it because we live in America. No need to say American when everyone's American.

My point is, this discusson is not saving penis's.
This discussion is putting circed men who had no choice in the matter down and it offends me. It is also a good way to put circed men on the deffensive side of things.

and with the Jewish thing I'm sorry but it just comes out as rascist to me. You are for one assuming that all American's and all Jewish are circumcised which we know from here not to be true. And also saying "hahaha people of your race make lousy lovers" is going to send any prospective circ'ers off this forum more convinced than ever that they're right.

Edit my post again if you need to Puppyfluffer but if your going to edit out references to Jewish people again please do so in DaddyJoes post as well. Thanks.
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#16 of 82 Old 04-28-2006, 11:20 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthea™
I never pop into discussion here, but I felt the need to add (maybe in defence for some weird reason) that DH is cut and has those "full body orgasms" that the OP describes. It's obvious his whole body is "into" it. They last forever and he's wiped out afterwards. Well for a few minutes. Then he's ready to go again

NOT defending circ'ing FYI. Just wanted to post my (DH's) side of things.
See this is what I mean. How many parents considering circ are going to read this thread and say "But my DHs orgasms are just fine, these people are wrong, about everything." And go and cut their kids.
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#17 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 12:57 AM
 
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My comment was not an insult. It was an observation. I think arguing about what is and is not politically correct is pretty stupid. Since culture and religion are two reasons people give to PROMOTE circumcision, why should we shy away from the subjects? That's just my opinion, and you are free to agree or disagree. I really don't care. My observation is that I have never heard the phrase "my passionate Jewish lover" or "my hot American lover" either in real life or in any form of media. If you have, please share the reference. I do recall hearing, in one movie, a woman raving about her Jewish lover's beautiful penis, if that makes you feel better. The point is, why censor ourselves in honest and thoughtful debate when we are contending with a culture that is soooooo heavily biased toward the natural way of living? In a society where the popular media constantly makes jokes about severed foreskins falling into soup (Meet the Fockers) men being accidentally circumcised (Married with Children), it seems self-defeating to bicker about what is PC and what is not. They are not playing by our rules.

That being said, I apologize for hurting anyone's feelings, and I don't mind one bit if someone can present any evidence to the contrary. And Synthea, I would venture to say that you seem a little overly defensive. I'm glad YOUR husband is fine... not like all us other poor, cut guys who have sexual issues. Then again, maybe he just got lucky. I don't know.
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#18 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 12:59 AM - Thread Starter
 
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[QUOTE=Minky]
My point is, this discusson is not saving penis's.
This discussion is putting circed men who had no choice in the matter down and it offends me. It is also a good way to put circed men on the deffensive side of things.

QUOTE]

I think what this is getting at was that circumcision reduces the sexual pleasure for the man. I do think that this discussion COULD in fact help save foreskins...or do you think that a mothers and fathers just don't care if their sons have less pleasure from sex than nature intended? Also, if anything, it also is depicting a strong argument for restoration. Two other guys off these boards who have restored have also told me that their orgasms went from penis centered to full bodied. So, if there were circ'd men who were upset by the idea of having less sensation apparently there are ways to help gain a lot of it back!

I think that was the point of it, and the point was too that I had not realized that the orgasm itself was so different...before I had thought that the actual sensations during the sex act were the main difference. Get what I am saying.

Please people just don't start attacking eachother! UGH! All of these are sensitive issues.

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#19 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 01:08 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthea™
I never pop into discussion here, but I felt the need to add (maybe in defence for some weird reason) that DH is cut and has those "full body orgasms" that the OP describes. It's obvious his whole body is "into" it. They last forever and he's wiped out afterwards. Well for a few minutes. Then he's ready to go again

NOT defending circ'ing FYI. Just wanted to post my (DH's) side of things.
My cut DH is the same as yours.

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#20 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 01:20 AM
 
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For silvercrest and sythea: Do your husbands have loose circumcisions? A loose circumcision is the least damaging. If you can pull the skin at least partially over the glans when they are erect, it is a loose cut. There IS variation between circumcisions-- tight is the most damaging, loose is the least damaging-- just like there are variations in female forms of circumcision, with some being very mild and some horrific. There is a difference between contributing to a debate and just bickering. Give us more info so that we can understand WHY you DHs seem to be in better working condition than others, okay?
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#21 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 01:21 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heffernhyphen
I can't even begin to imagine a conversation with my male friends about the intimate details of their orgasms. And that's even if I did have a clue as to which ones had which kind of penis.

If these guys you've questioned have wives/girlfriends/boyfriends, how do they feel about these conversations? I can just see my girlfriends' faces when I asked their husbands, "So, Jim, tell me about your orgasms. And could you please pass the rolls?"
I don't have anything to add but this post just made me I couldn't imagine having these conversations either but if people can, more power to them!

Also, American men seemed pretty popular with European women when I lived there so maybe novelty is an issue?
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#22 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 01:42 AM
 
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My Dh's is loose, he has plenty of skin to pull way over the end when erect. When flacid you'd never know he was cut.

Maybe that is the key. *waiting on sythea's response*

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#23 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 01:48 AM
 
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That is exactly the key.

Before I restored, I didn't even know the skin was supposed to move. I thought it was just supposed to be stuck there, like the skin of the fingers or toes. When I restored to the point that the skin was loose and stretchy, I thought I had damaged myself.

Aren't you and your husband lucky he didn't get skinned alive, like some of us did. It's not something to brag about... because we're not all that lucky... it something about which to say, "Whew! Guess we dodged a bullet!"
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#24 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 02:53 AM
 
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This hits close to home for me. DH & I don't make love very often, and he has admitted to me that he does it more for my pleasure than his. Half the time he doesn't reach orgasm, either he tires out or it becomes too painful for me. He has said that it seems like alot of work for just "two seconds of pleasure." (His words.)
He is tightly circed, with little skin movement when erect. I've wanted to bring up restoration for a while now, but for the life of me, I can't think of how to talk to him about it without making it sound like I'm not satisfied with him. Or sounding like I'm nagging him into it.
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#25 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 03:28 AM
 
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Sorry, there are so many forums here at mdc it takes me a while to check back on all the ones I've posted to.

I think DH's is "looser" then most...he can pull enough of the shaft skin over the head to cover it. But normally, he looks completely cut. Completely hard, he can barely move the skin.

I didn't make my post to cause a debate. I highly doubt anyone is going to see my post and decide that it, instead of all the other posts here, will sway them one way or the other in reguards to circumcising their boy. I'm not propagating circ'ing, merely pointing out that there are many reasons a man might not being reaching the orgasm he thinks he should be having (or actually should be having). And I wholeheartedly agree that being cut can definitely cause problems. Hard to convey what I mean in typed words, sorry.

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#26 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 03:51 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moonmama7
Also, American men seemed pretty popular with European women when I lived there so maybe novelty is an issue?
Just curious - what part of Europe you where and when? I know here in Scandinavia we get lot of exchange students from USA and since our naughty sauna culture Americans quickly learn that they are different on penis department - this is comes often as a shock to them(obviously lot of young Americans still think that circ is done everywhere). Scandinavians mostly feel pity - just like they would feel pity to circumcised woman.

I also do know a finnish woman who is married to circ American guy and she told me she is absolutely devistated and don't kno what to do. I talked about foreskin restoration but she is afraid to bring it up.
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#27 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 04:08 AM
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Originally Posted by bravofrenchie
but for the life of me, I can't think of how to talk to him about it without making it sound like I'm not satisfied with him
Tell him you're sick of the fact that he doesn't/can't enjoy sex. Tell him you WANT him to enjoy sex with you and that you want to share that with him. Make it about him, because really it is - the benefits to you are only secondary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by moonmama7
Also, American men seemed pretty popular with European women when I lived there so maybe novelty is an issue?
Dunno, but my friends in the UK seemed to have the same attitude that kxsiven's friends have. They wouldn't necessarily turn down a cut guy over being cut but it'd probably be a bit of a dissapointment. The way guys are cut over there (for medical reasons) is a lot looser and saves as much of the skin as possible, as opposed to the stripped barren way here so encountering a cut British bloke isn't as bad to them as say, an American.

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#28 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 09:23 PM
 
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Ok now what happens' when someone comes on like alot of my DH's friends and was stationed in Germany or where ever before Desert Storm or went to a foreign hospital after being injured in this war, and they were popular with the girls there?

They read these posts, say "Well thats not true, nobody said anything bad about me being cut" and go on and cut their kids, that's why I think this sortof disucssion isn't productive.
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#29 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 09:39 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Minky
Ok now what happens' when someone comes on like alot of my DH's friends and was stationed in Germany or where ever before Desert Storm or went to a foreign hospital after being injured in this war, and they were popular with the girls there?

They read these posts, say "Well thats not true, nobody said anything bad about me being cut" and go on and cut their kids, that's why I think this sortof disucssion isn't productive.
This whole post has to do with is the general trend I have been noticing in questioning men that typically circumcised men appear to have orgasms which are penis centered. And, men who are intact have orgasms which are experienced as more full bodied. That was the whole point of this. And, I WILL point out, that a couple of the men I talked to who were cut were absolutely intrigued with the concept that there are men who experience orgasms with their full bodies...not only on their penis. Seriously, they thought that their experience of the penis centered orgasm was normal and that women were just built "completely different."

I would have to say, that I think it is VERY possible for a woman to have good sex with any man...hey, if a woman has all her genitals I think she is able to get a lot of pleasure out of a cut man, intact man or sex toy for that matter. But, that is not the point of this post. It is focusing on the man and what they were robbed of, and what they DON'T even know they should be able to experience.

Plus, as several people I know have eluded to this idea...."sex is like pizza... even bad sex, is ....errr....still sex." And, I think a lot of this will hold true for women, at least while we have higher levels of lubrication and are young (but that is a whole other matter). Enough women who have been with cut men long term have told me that often they don't notice the issues in the relationship until deep in the relationship when the mental "newness" and excitement of a new partner wears off. But that is a whole other concept...

Perpetually breastfeeding or pregnant ENFP mom to a lot of kids...wife to a midwestern nice guy...living in tropical paradise...pink cats and homebirths rock!

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#30 of 82 Old 04-29-2006, 10:32 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Minky
Ok now what happens' when someone comes on like alot of my DH's friends and was stationed in Germany or where ever before Desert Storm or went to a foreign hospital after being injured in this war, and they were popular with the girls there?

They read these posts, say "Well thats not true, nobody said anything bad about me being cut" and go on and cut their kids, that's why I think this sortof disucssion isn't productive.
Personally, I feel that argument is pretty pointless. I mean if you have an individual who is so open minded enough to be here, hopefully they will not take this argument as the only reason for not circumcising their son. I would hope that they look at this whole reasoning, as a POSSIBILITY, a very likely possibility that perhaps their son's sex life will not be all that it could be.

I mean if you have somebody as close minded enough to do what you say, "Oh, that's not true, because overseas I was popular with the ladies and I'm cut" and goes on to cut their son anyway, they will probably not be open to any of the other reasons not to cut their son anyway.
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