She said, "please stop, you're scaring me..". *SAD UPDATE post 25* - Page 2 - Mothering Forums
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#31 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 05:46 PM
 
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Thanks so much for the hugs.. I really need them right now.

This was just my first REAL attempt at convincing someone not to circ. I poured my heart and soul into it and she just threw it all away without reading anything at all. And that baby boy will pay the consequences.

I KNOW how wrong it is, but I don't know if I can do this again. I'm the quiet, sort of shy, non-confrontational type. This is soooo why I usually keep my mouth shut and don't speak up. I feel so unbelieveably stupid and I don't even know why!!!

I just can't freaking believe she threw it all in the trash. It makes me want to hurl repeatedly.

Yet, I STILL LOVE HER!
I hate to say this, but a "friend" who lies to you, over something that is really important to you, AND throws something so important to you and which you personally made for her with such care out with the rubbish, really isn't much of a friend at all, it sounds exceptionally one sided.

Of course you feel hurt, anyone would feel hurt if they'd handmade a gift for someone and they then turned around and wrote a letter to say they'd just thrown it away, because they didn't want to look at it.

Liars make very bad friends, if I were you I'd drop her and go find some nice people to be friends with, who you can trust to tell you the truth.
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#32 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 05:56 PM
 
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So... she hasn't actually circed her son yet? Or has she?

If decomposition persists please see your necromancer.

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#33 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 06:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Daisy - I know.. I know that I should just say goodbye to her, but if I totally write her off, I'd be down to only one friend, who also lives out of state (both are over 900 miles away from me). I wish I had the option to get out and make more, but because I've got some medical issues and other crap to deal with plus no job, I have zero social life. As far as friends go, outside of the internet, I have my DH, my best friend in another state, and her. That's it.
She's my family and other than a couple years, we've been extremely close since early childhood.

I had pretty much accepted that there was a chance that she would circ anyway.. I knew that was possible. I had gotten myself to the point that I would probably be able to work through it and keep our relationship. But LYING to me over something so important to me?
I'm just so unbelieveably hurt and I know it's going to take me a long while to get over this, if I ever do.


Smokering - No, he hasn't been born yet. She is due in early April. They're going to do it.. that I have no doubt.
Maybe by some miracle, the ultrasound tech was wrong and it's not a boy, afterall. It's probably silly to even think that, but...

Wife and mother to 2 kiddos - 17 yr old DS jammin.gifand 13 yr old DD energy.gif.. and a cat that thinks he's a dog dizzy.gif
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#34 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 06:37 PM
 
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Her boy is still safe in her womb, intact; this isn't over yet. I can't help but wonder if you address the issue with her once more, even over the phone, open up a Bible and just read her the verses and just flat out tell her that if she does this you will not feel the same way about her as a person and you're not sure if you can maintain a friendship with *anyone* who would choose ignorance to avoid guilt or who would knowingly do something damaging and abusive to her child. Throwing away the information you sent wasn't just careless---it was negligent. Maybe if she realizes that it's not just your friendship but respect for her as a fellow civilized human being that's on the line it would cause her to reconsider.

I'm so sorry you're in this situation.

Jen
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#35 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 06:48 PM
 
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I have been through a very similar situation. Twice. It's very difficult and I know others on here have been through the same thing. It's a good place to come to vent about it though!

I am even going to attempt the intactivism again with my own brother and his soon-to-be wife. I am trying to now gather up the strength for the long battle ahead...

But anyway, I truly think that the absolute hardest thing for me to grasp is women who seem to be against circ but somehow cannot muster up the courage/energy/whatever to stop it from being done. I guess the whole male problem I don't totally get either, but I can guess I can grasp it in some way. They don't want to think that was done to them was wrong or that they are somehow not complete in some way. Yeah, I guess I can get that psychology on an objective level.

However, I fundamentally just DO NOT get women who can't stand up against it. How else can it be explained than they must have the belief that they are actually inferior to men?! Is any other possible explanation? Truly, I would love there to be one because that explanation makes me all kinds of angry and sad. I guess the only other reason could be that they want someone else to make decisions for them. That they want to somehow be excused from any sort of difficult situations and let someone else handle them--hide behind their husbands as it were.

But whatever it is, I have a VERY hard time getting over it. I just want to shake these women and say "wake up and stand up for yourself! If not for you, then do it for the rest of us."

Partner to DH geek.gif and Former WOHM, now SAHM dizzy.gif to Sensory & ADHD DD (9), with DD (4) and DS (2)nocirc.gif winner.jpghomebirth.jpg

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#36 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 06:54 PM
 
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she knows how very wrong it is. and she knows that you know that she knows. yet, she is still going to go through with it.

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#37 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 07:18 PM - Thread Starter
 
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pdx.mothernurture -

Thankyou, Jen..

I have been sitting here crying off and on for the last few hours. If I could get it out of my head, I could probably stop.. but I can't stop thinking about it!

It may not be, but I do feel like it's over.. but you're right. I don't know for sure that is. Maybe it's just my defeatist attitude I have right now talking, though.


MoonJelly and kidspiration -

I know that her husband is adamant over it.. that's where I thought I'd have the problem. Me convincing her and then her (and me) convincing him. But it never even got that far.

I KNOW that she knows it's wrong. Why else would she be agonizing over just opening the box? Because she KNEW what was inside. She knows deep down that it's wrong. She just didn't want to face it.

Hubby is circ'd, the first son is circ'd, and this one will be circ'd because, well...
I know that we can't get into religious discussions here, but, the religion thing is apparently THE main thing with her and her hubby (they are not Jewish, btw). In the packet of info that I sent her, there were multiple printouts regarding that aspect that an MDC member linked me to. All of it, tossed in the trash

I may try again once more.. but not for a while.

My INSANELY pro-circ brother and his girlfriend are also expecting a baby. I really hope that this one isn't a boy, too, or I just might lose it. There is no way whatsoever they would leave him intact

Wife and mother to 2 kiddos - 17 yr old DS jammin.gifand 13 yr old DD energy.gif.. and a cat that thinks he's a dog dizzy.gif
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#38 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 07:32 PM
 
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Oh...............

You didn't fail, you did everything you could have possibly done. The person who failed was your friend who couldn't be bothered to read the info you took so much time to get together.

Whats that saying??? You can lead a horse to water......
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#39 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 07:33 PM
 
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Oh...............

You didn't fail, you did everything you could have possibly done. The person who failed was your friend who couldn't be bothered to read the info you took so much time to get together.

Whats that saying??? You can lead a horse to water......
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#40 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 07:33 PM
 
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Oh...............

You didn't fail, you did everything you could have possibly done. The person who failed was your friend who couldn't be bothered to read the info you took so much time to get together.

Whats that saying??? You can lead a horse to water......
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#41 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 07:33 PM
 
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Have her read this. Don't tell her anything about it. She can't know what its about, only she has to find out for her self. This is just one more attempt. I know its hard. Please don't give up. Maybe a miracle will happen. Just maybe.
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#42 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 07:33 PM
 
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Oh...............

You didn't fail, you did everything you could have possibly done. The person who failed was your friend who couldn't be bothered to read the info you took so much time to get together.

Whats that saying??? You can lead a horse to water..........
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#43 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 07:34 PM
 
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Oooooooooooops.
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#44 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 08:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Frootloop View Post
I couldn't help it.. I had to call her. I told her that I was very hurt that she lied to me. I told her that I didn't want to cut her out of my life, but she really really really hurt me by knowingly lying to me the way she did.



I also briefly told her about the only half-assed acceptable forms of pain relief.. and I HATED doing that. It was like I was giving her my permission or something. But I had to tell her, right?

She was bawling on the phone almost as hard I was. I told her that I still loved her and that I had to think for a while..
I think you did the right thing. You did the best you could.
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#45 of 49 Old 01-22-2008, 09:03 PM
 
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I sent you a PM because we can't touch on religion here.

Blessed mama of four
::
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#46 of 49 Old 01-23-2008, 12:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Daisyuk View Post
I hate to say this, but a "friend" who lies to you, over something that is really important to you, AND throws something so important to you and which you personally made for her with such care out with the rubbish, really isn't much of a friend at all, it sounds exceptionally one sided.

Of course you feel hurt, anyone would feel hurt if they'd handmade a gift for someone and they then turned around and wrote a letter to say they'd just thrown it away, because they didn't want to look at it.

Liars make very bad friends, if I were you I'd drop her and go find some nice people to be friends with, who you can trust to tell you the truth.
:
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#47 of 49 Old 01-23-2008, 01:52 AM
 
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Dee, I'm sorry that after you went through all that work you weren't able to get through to your cousin. I agree with one of the PP's--this isn't lost yet! I've also PM'd you about some responses you can give her.

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#48 of 49 Old 01-23-2008, 04:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I hate to bump this back up, but I just wanted to thank you all for your suggestions and to let you know that I'm taking them ALL to heart.

A few of you have messaged me giving me advice, as well.. again, thank you so much!! You've all got me thinking.. I'm coming up with even more questions for her.

Once I can get my head totally straight, meaning.. without blowing up in a complete rage at her, I have every intention to give it another shot. I'm not about to go through re-mailing information again, but I plan on some heart to heart convos over the phone using much of the info you all have PM'd me with. I may eventually get hung up on but, I still have to try.

At this point, she isn't angry with me. My cousin has a heart, she really does.. I know that it doesn't seem that way, but it's true.

I really think that she truly believes that by doing this, she is 1) honoring her religion, and 2) honoring her husband. For her, there is no other path to take. She's not doing this with the thoughts of it's "unclean", "infectious", or "teasing".. I do know that. And she's genuinely concerned about his pain.

Ugh.. if I could only bypass her "this is out of my hands, I have to let them do this" spiel and get through to HER, I might have a chance.
I wish SO much that I could get her onto MDC, but they don't have internet access

Please don't think that I'm trying to make excuses for her, I swear I'm not. I'm still beyond furious with her.. but I have a renewed hope this afternoon. Maybe it's just because I know deep down that I will never be able to forgive her for it, and the thought of not having her in my life just breaks my heart... I don't know.

Wife and mother to 2 kiddos - 17 yr old DS jammin.gifand 13 yr old DD energy.gif.. and a cat that thinks he's a dog dizzy.gif
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#49 of 49 Old 01-23-2008, 06:00 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Frootloop View Post
I hate to bump this back up, but I just wanted to thank you all for your suggestions and to let you know that I'm taking them ALL to heart.

A few of you have messaged me giving me advice, as well.. again, thank you so much!! You've all got me thinking.. I'm coming up with even more questions for her.

Once I can get my head totally straight, meaning.. without blowing up in a complete rage at her, I have every intention to give it another shot. I'm not about to go through re-mailing information again, but I plan on some heart to heart convos over the phone using much of the info you all have PM'd me with. I may eventually get hung up on but, I still have to try.

At this point, she isn't angry with me. My cousin has a heart, she really does.. I know that it doesn't seem that way, but it's true.

I really think that she truly believes that by doing this, she is 1) honoring her religion, and 2) honoring her husband. For her, there is no other path to take. She's not doing this with the thoughts of it's "unclean", "infectious", or "teasing".. I do know that. And she's genuinely concerned about his pain.

Ugh.. if I could only bypass her "this is out of my hands, I have to let them do this" spiel and get through to HER, I might have a chance.
I wish SO much that I could get her onto MDC, but they don't have internet access

Please don't think that I'm trying to make excuses for her, I swear I'm not. I'm still beyond furious with her.. but I have a renewed hope this afternoon. Maybe it's just because I know deep down that I will never be able to forgive her for it, and the thought of not having her in my life just breaks my heart... I don't know.

~helen~ mama to 5 yo twins jonas and micah and my 2 yo baby boy eli
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