"Just a plane ride away" - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 04:11 PM - Thread Starter
 
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My mother said this to me one day when I was taking my unvaxed son to international airport with me to pick up my sister. What do you tell Pro vaxers that say this? I can't think of a good argument, or don't have the facts to start spitting out...
Thank you in advance.
I have done a lot of research on the subject, but when this "people bringing it from other countries" argument is brought up, I'm somewhat stumped. Help!
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#2 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 04:19 PM
 
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If you're saying that the illnesses that you vax for are "just a plane ride away" my response is; that's why it's just as important to understand the illnesses as the vaccine.

If you have the research/ knowledge to back up your position that X vax is potentially more dangerous then Y illness then there's no argument.

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#3 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 04:24 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I have researched all the diseases and the only one that scares me is Polio. So when someone (like my mother) hints that Polio could be in the airport, the logical side of me knows that is not likely, but the side that still hears all those fear tactics from society gets a little scared. Drives me crazy because I am 100% commited to NOT vaccinating. My son is only 8 months so my research hasn't been as long as others (I never even thought about vaccines until I was pregnant).
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#4 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 04:42 PM
 
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First I would tell my mother that her scaremongering, however well-intended, is not appreciated and that I wouldn't tolerate it anymore. Then I'd do as much reading on the disease(s) that scared me as possible.

The archives here are a good place to start, and Inside Vaccines has a ton of very useful information.

Try not to let people scare you. Make them face you with research and facts, not emotion. This is effective because a.) most people are too lazy to do the research, and if you frame the argument in this way they will drop it and b.) the research that currently exists does not seem to support the idea that vaccination is either safe or effective.

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#5 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 05:13 PM
 
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Where are all those people on planes going? Do they just stay in the airport forever? No! They go in to town and have meetings and play at the amusements parks and visit with their friends and family and eat at restaurants. I am sure you and your child has come in contact with someone from another country at some point in time, or will. If it was really a concern I think we would be seeing a lot more of these diseases.

It also brings up the idea that foreigners are dirty. The idea drives me batty! They are not carrying all sorts of diseases, and if they are I am willing to bet its not something we vax for (a disease for which you are a carrier but wouldn't necessarily know it like typhoid).

Further more if she believes vaxes work than she should have no fear of someone coming from another country bringing with them a case of a VPD - cause lots of countries have higher rates of vaccination than America.

And still how many of these people are actually traveling sick? Like with WC or Measles, or mumps or cp? Really? I think if you showed up covered in spots they might not let you on the plane.

And if you really want to put her mind at ease, in the last 30 years there have only been 8 cases of imported Polio (compare that to the number of cases actually caused by the vaccine).

But I personally would just tell her that I hope her vaccines are up to date cause you know adults can get diseases too. Hmmm like typhoid.

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#6 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 06:25 PM
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LOL, this is a popular topic these days

http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1021425

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#7 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 06:25 PM
 
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Originally Posted by sages View Post
My mother said this to me one day when I was taking my unvaxed son to international airport with me to pick up my sister. What do you tell Pro vaxers that say this? I can't think of a good argument, or don't have the facts to start spitting out...
Thank you in advance.
I have done a lot of research on the subject, but when this "people bringing it from other countries" argument is brought up, I'm somewhat stumped.
In an international airport, you have no clue who is bringing in what, and most respiratory viruses are shedding before the symptoms begin.

Measles, especially, is extremely contagious. Some cases have been reported where the infection source was known to have been in and out of an area before the victim by as much as half an hour.

The Tucson measles outbreak last year started when an unvaccinated Swiss woman became ill with measles a few days after her arrival and exposed a couple hundred people at the ER to her virus. Of the 17 known cases, three were sick enough to need hospitalization for fever, dehydration, and febrile convulsions.

The San Diego measles outbreak started when an unvaccinated American child caught the disease in Europe and became ill in the USA. The first generation (eight cases) included the boy's two siblings, two playmates from his school, and four children from the pediatrician's office. The second generation cases included a sibling of a child from the first generation and two friends of one of the boy's siblings. One infant was hospitalized for 2 days to treat dehydration.
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#8 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 06:51 PM
 
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The first generation (eight cases) included the boy's two siblings, two playmates from his school, and four children from the pediatrician's office. The second generation cases included a sibling of a child from the first generation and two friends of one of the boy's siblings.
How many of those kids were vax'ed? And if they were unvaxed I'm sure their parents are quite happy they got over measles and now have lifetime immunity?

As to your mom, pp, not to be standoffish, but I would ask when was the last time she had her yellow fever vax? Foreigners are not dirty and if they can bring polio here I'm sure they might as well be bringing malaria, kwim?
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#9 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 07:01 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Full Heart View Post
Where are all those people on planes going? Do they just stay in the airport forever? No! They go in to town and have meetings and play at the amusements parks and visit with their friends and family and eat at restaurants.
Give the same grandmother the chance to go do Disney World/land with same unvaccinated child, and they will jump on it, not even worrying about the illnesses exposed to!

At the rate of parents refusing to vaccinate in the US, there won't be any worry about the "dirty foreigners" one day. Then this stupid argument (I say stupid argument because my dear mother gives me a hard time too!) will be done!

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#10 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 08:55 PM - Thread Starter
 
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"In an international airport, you have no clue who is bringing in what, and most respiratory viruses are shedding before the symptoms begin.

Measles, especially, is extremely contagious. Some cases have been reported where the infection source was known to have been in and out of an area before the victim by as much as half an hour.

The Tucson measles outbreak last year started when an unvaccinated Swiss woman became ill with measles a few days after her arrival and exposed a couple hundred people at the ER to her virus. Of the 17 known cases, three were sick enough to need hospitalization for fever, dehydration, and febrile convulsions.

The San Diego measles outbreak started when an unvaccinated American child caught the disease in Europe and became ill in the USA. The first generation (eight cases) included the boy's two siblings, two playmates from his school, and four children from the pediatrician's office. The second generation cases included a sibling of a child from the first generation and two friends of one of the boy's siblings. One infant was hospitalized for 2 days to treat dehydration."

Thank you for your post, however I am not at all concerned about measles.
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#11 of 11 Old 01-09-2009, 09:32 PM
 
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I usually point out that India still has the plague, and that doesn't keep me up at night either.

I don't understand why some people believe that how vaccinating somehow protects you against *everything*. There are lots of diseases that are way scarier than any VADs, and don't have vaccines available. Like ebola. I would be much more concerned about my kid getting ebola, than measles.

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