If you could present reasoning for non-vaxxing from a Christian perspective.... - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 08:53 PM - Thread Starter
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What would you say? There is someone who I may speak to about vaccinations from a Christian perspective (we are Christians as well, and are similar to this person in our religious views). I have the data/facts, however, what if you had to explain your reasons for not vaccinating from a Christian perspective?

What would you say?

(please no debating, and I don't intend to insult -- I understand there are many non-Christians here who have valid reasons for not vaccinating. I don't want to debate religion either, please.)

(Also, we don't vaccinate at all and our dd is almost four)

Thank you in advance
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#2 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 09:14 PM
 
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God created childhood illnesses so we would learn His healing. We would learn to pray and depend on him, through sickness. When we recovered we are more mature, spritually and physically. Our immune system is stronger and we are protected from those diseases for life, and our faith is stronger, experiencing it first hand. When my lo's are ill, we always pray and ask for strength and healing.

I remember feeling dispair as a child when very ill, and then being renewed when I was better, kind of like a cleansing....

just my two cents....

Busy wife to dh for 5 years and mama to ds1 (11.09.04), ds2 (7.17.06) and ds3 coming Aug 09. :::
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#3 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 09:26 PM
 
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A biggie for me is the fact that certain vaxes were made w/ aborted fetal tissue.
The rest of it really has to do w/ the fact that I don't feel that the benefit outweighs the risk- adn God has entrusted me w/ these children and it's my job to protect them when I can and trust Him for their protection as well.

I am by no means anti-doctor and I think that God uses doctors and modern medicine to help heal- but this is just one area of medicine that I don't find to be as safe/effective as many others do.

For me the decision has always been based on prayer and leaving it up to peace and needing to live w/ my decisions.
Looking at the worst case scenarios- 1 being my child is injured/badly affected by a vaccine and 2 being injured/badly affected by an illness that there is a vaccine for- in which case woudl I be able to have peace that I trusted in God to do what is right for my children.
For ME that means not vaccinating- but I have many many close Christian friends that choose the exact opposite.

I'm kicking myself cuz i can't find the verse in Romans that I wanted to post- but basically it says something to the effect of - If I feel that something is sin, then it is sin for me to do that. It's used a lot in discussing things that are not clearly defined in scripture (such as drinking (not getting drunk) and such- if I feel that drinking is wrong, then I shouldn't drink- but for another Christian they may feel differently- etc).
For me- this falls into that category. Afte rmuch prayer and research on the possible side effects of vaccines- I don't feel that God would want me to vax. And for to do so would feel like sin for me.
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#4 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 09:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you mamas

Any more input is greatly appreciated!
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#5 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 10:07 PM
 
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I agree with what has been mentioned.

I truly do not feel like my decision is "more Christian" but my faith and trust in God played a huge part in choosing not to vaccinate.

God created our immune systems right? I'm pretty sure he made them correctly and if I make choices that don't undermine the immune system, I'm confident that our bodies were created to heal themselves.

Hopefully that made sense;0!
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#6 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 10:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, I agree.

To clarify, I am not going to debate with this person about who is "more" Christian. I just feel that perhaps coming to them from a Christian perspective because we both share a deep faith, would help.

Keep it coming mamas
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#7 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 10:42 PM
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Romans 14:23 is the verse that brendaziz was speaking of I believe:
Quote:
23But the man who has doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin.
My reason stems from Psalms 139 (the whole thing really):
Quote:
13For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother's womb.

14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.

15 My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place.
When I was woven together in the depths of the earth,

16 your eyes saw my unformed body.
All the days ordained for me
were written in your book
before one of them came to be.
I don't take this to mean that all medicine is wrong (far from, I conceived through IVF) but I really believe in the balance of pathogens in the environment to our immune system is perfect. God made these things in a wonderful and specific way. I think it is human arrogance to think we can "control" this balance and "eradicate" the entire concept of illness.

Proverbs 3:7-8 also works for me
Quote:
7 Do not be wise in your own eyes;
fear the LORD and shun evil.

8 This will bring health to your body
and nourishment to your bones.
I think vaccinations being preemptive are very fear based (as opposed to a reactive response to an illness) and we are not to live in fear. 2 Timothy 1:7 "For God gave us a spirit not of fear but of power and love and self-control."

Ok, this quote isn't biblical but I think it nicely sums up how I feel (please don't be offended by a secular quote). It is from H.G. Wells War of the Worlds
Quote:
From the moment the invaders arrived, breathed our air, ate and drank, they were doomed. They were undone, destroyed, after all of man's weapons and devices had failed, by the tiniest creatures that God in his wisdom put upon this earth. By the toll of a billion deaths, man had earned his immunity, his right to survive among this planet's infinite organisms. And that right is ours against all challenges. For neither do men live nor die in vain.
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#8 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 10:57 PM
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#9 of 19 Old 05-10-2009, 11:39 PM
 
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I once had someone put it to me this way:
God made us with immune systems designed to protect our bodies. To inject something into the body that bypasses the immune system completely shows a lack of faith in His design. Vaccines ignore the body's immune stystem, certainly not something He intended.

''''

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#10 of 19 Old 05-11-2009, 03:10 PM
 
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For me some of the reasoning for not vaxing is because of the way the vaccine is made from aborted fetus cells. I think that got me started on what else was in vaccines and the ball started rolling from there.
I also trust God with my child, more than a vaccine. God is never failing, vaccines do fail.
I go back to Acts 17:25 ~ "nor is He served by human hands, as though He needed anything, since He Himself gives to all people life and breath and all things;"
I have to say that I am a lot more into natural ways of keeping myself healthy. I have a lot of friends who are believers that are very much into modern medicine. For me I am ok with my child getting a disease that may have been prevented with a vaccine. I would rather them have natural immunity and get them through it.
I also am very much against industries that are out to make money and will cover up issues to continue making money. I feel the vaccine industry does this and I don't want to support it.
My last two paragraphs could me tied in with a Christian theme, but they are more personal convictions about vaccines.
Hope this helps. Please keep us updated on how this goes.

Rebekah married to Justin Mama to Jonah and Josiah
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#11 of 19 Old 05-12-2009, 04:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks mamas -- your insights are very helpful indeed, and I agree. I am going to be speaking to this person in a couple of weeks about it
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#12 of 19 Old 05-13-2009, 02:46 AM
 
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I don't believe God would want me to inject chemical preservatives, some classified as neuro-toxins, others as carcinogens, into my child's body in an attempt to induce artificial immunity.

Loving mother, Devoted Wife
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#13 of 19 Old 05-15-2009, 12:05 PM
 
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For me it boils down to Absolute trust in the Lord.

This is my conviction: If you get vaccinated you are trusting in man to protect you.
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#14 of 19 Old 05-16-2009, 02:26 AM
 
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For me it is the mixing of humans with animals, in the cases of vaxes it's completely avoidable and not a livesaving immediate action.

I have a problem injecting this concoction into my child's body. Just to name a few: cultured on chicken eggs, add some monkey kidney (!!) and then we have loosely flying around animals viruses- no vaccine is 100% clean. ANybody remember SV40? Or remember the Baxter "incident" in which Europe was almost flooded with an "accidental" mix of avian bird flu virus by combining it with a flu shot?

Sounds like a big nono to me. Heck, bestiality is out of the question- injecting monkey kidney and bird flu is not a great idea either.

And speaking from a catholic viewpoint- human "leftovers", fetus cell lines for an assumed preventive effect- no way. As catholic I am expected to be open to family additions and use my own free will and discretion in that matter- so I am certaily not injecting these things.

Another thing is the "keeping your body" whole. Yes, there are catholics out there who cremate-and cremation is not the nogo anymore it used to be be- but I still would like to keep our bodies whole and I have the feeling vaccination would go against that.

God entrusted me with this child to keep him as much in the original "state" that he showed up in. I don't cut things off and I don't add things that don't belong.

Catechism:
2288 Life and Health are precious gifts entrusted to us by God.
2295 Research or experimentation cannot legitimate acts that are in themselves contrary to the dignity of persons and to the moral law....
...EXPERIMENTATION ON HUMAN BEINGS IS NOT MORALLY LEGITIMATE IF IT EXPOSES THE SUBJECT'S LIFE OR PHYSICAL AND PSYCHOLOGICAL INTEGRITY TO DISPROPORTIONATE OR AVOIDABLE RISK.

Living and with the knowledge I have I deem vax an avoidable risk and thus feel it is my duty to protect my children from that risk. I also view vax as a giant experiment and have huge issues with the missing consent of a child who is injected with god knows what substances.

Last but not least God also gave me the free will to walk away from the vaxes. We were given free will, I am exercising my free will.

And to personally vax in the year 2009 is a desperate measure to try and prove, see, we can trick nature. We can trick God. We're better than Him. No, we're not. Shortcuts rarely work.
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#15 of 19 Old 05-16-2009, 07:43 PM
 
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Hi: I dont have anything good to say, but I'll steal my chiropractors line:
The power that made the body will heal the body
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#16 of 19 Old 05-16-2009, 07:59 PM
 
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1 Corinthians 6:19-20 (NIV), "Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body."

I don't believe shooting toxins and foreign DNA into my (child's) bloodstream to fend off unlikely diseases is honoring to God.

Amy loving DH 5/04, raising DD 2/05 and DS 11/09; missing my mom& my babies 6/07, 12/07; and on the side
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#17 of 19 Old 05-17-2009, 09:07 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wifeandmommy2-4 View Post
For me it boils down to Absolute trust in the Lord.

This is my conviction: If you get vaccinated you are trusting in man to protect you.


Have not these evils come upon us because our God is not among us? (Deut 31:16–17)


 

 

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#18 of 19 Old 05-21-2009, 01:00 PM
 
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BIBLICAL SUPPORT FOR NOT VACCINATING
OUR CHILDREN OR OURSELVES

Public law 97-280 passed by Congress of the United States of America declares the Bible to be the “Word of God” and directs citizens to
“Study and apply the teachings of the Holy Scriptures”.

The Bible teaches that the truthfulness of an issue is to be sought and should stand on no less than two or more witnesses. (Deuteronomy 19:15) The following is the result of a study on biblical parental responsibility in regards to the practice of unclean, unsafe vaccines.


A diligent study on vaccine safety and effectiveness reveals that there are many informed and qualified researchers and doctors who have found and teach that there are many serious health risks involved with vaccines. The Comprehensive Child Health Immunizations Act of 1993 made known the fact that there are risks to vaccinations by stating “Vaccine information should be simplified to ensure that parents understand the benefits and risks”. Congressional Records (2000 – 2003) have shown that the pharmaceutical companies are more concerned with profit than they are with safety and have knowingly used toxins in the manufacturing of vaccines regardless of the risks.
The Bible teaches us that children are a gift from God (1 Timothy 5:8). Some vaccines are produced using aborted baby lung tissue, which is man and government profiting from the murder of our innocent children. To partake in vaccines is to support those individuals/government who no longer have respect for the sanctity of human life.
The Bible teaches that the parents are entrusted with the care and welfare of the child. (1 Timothy 5:8). Parents, not the state, are responsible to make health care decisions on behalf of their children.
The Bible also teaches that there have been times in history when evil government and government employees have attempted, through force or color of law, to intimidate, harm or destroy the children of God’s people. (Exodus 1 and 2 and Matthew 2). Therefore, if a parent feels that vaccines are not safe, it is their responsibility to defend our children from and individual or government who is attempting to subject our children to those vaccine risks.
The Bible teaches that the body is “The temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own. For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God’s.” (1 Corinthians 6:19-20) To inject known neurotoxins into our children or ourselves, which have known health risks, would be a violation of these biblical teachings.
The Bible teaches that there are clean and unclean animals and that God’s people are not to put the unclean into their bodies. Many vaccines are made from the blood of diseased animals, decomposed animal parts and are not sterile.
The Bible teaches that when man’s law contradicts God’s law, His people must obey God over man. (Acts 5:29). Therefore, be it known, should any policy, edict or legislation of man decree our children must be vaccinated, we must obey God rather than man just as Moses’ parents of old, we will do so without fear. (Exodus 2)
The Bible teaches us that we are not to harm or wrong our neighbor. (Romans 13:10 and James 2:8) Our decision to decline vaccines does not wrong or threatens our neighbor. If vaccines were truly effective, the neighbor would not be in danger from someone who is not vaccinated.



Therefore, be it known, that based upon the teachings of the Holly Bible,
it is our religious conviction not to have our children our ourselves vaccinated.
We desire to be at peace with those who may feel or think differently than we do
on this issue and that is why we humbly explain the choice we have made.

We will protect our bodies and our children from the injection of neurotoxins,
retroviruses and foreign animal proteins that are in vaccinations.

For more information and documentation visit
HYPERLINK "http://www.marytocco.com" www.marytocco.com or call 231-642-7984
Hope this helps
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#19 of 19 Old 05-21-2009, 03:10 PM
 
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My children were created in His image and are perfect, I do not need medicine to improve on perfect God-given health. I am not anti-medicine and will seek medical help if we are in need of it, but to inject my children with something to preserve their health? That to me shows distrust of the Lord. He has already shown the folly of over-use of medicine through the development of super-bugs and antibiotic resistant strains of disease. The Lord shall provide through our immune system and though we do sometimes have a use for man made medicines we tend to rely all too much and too often on man's pride and have too little use for faith in God.

And God given immunity is life long and can happen passively, which to causes me to state that God's immunity is superior to medicine's "immunity" (I'm not convinced that vaccines actually work) which comes with an expiry date and involves the exposure to toxic chemicals.

Austin June 2006; Xander March 2008; Shay Nov 2009; 5 babies gone to heaven.
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