Are you really anti-vax? - Mothering Forums
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 25 Old 08-16-2012, 06:26 PM - Thread Starter
 
MountainMamaGC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,043
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)

I really hate being looped into that group. I mean as of now I dont, because I havent found any information to compel me to do so. I dont care what other people choose. I consider myself pro-informed choice. If you did the research, and you choose to vaccinate, then I respect that. I dont care what you read to research, if you trust that source thats good enough for me. Just as I dont like people telling me what to do with my child, I dont profess to know whats best for yours.  I just want the right for parents to choose to be preserved, and I think that is something we can all agree on. I think if we focus on that we would be alot farther ahead than setting up all these anti vax sites. It makes people feel judged and on edge and takes away from the real issues. IMO its better to be pro-parent and pro informed consent, than anti-anything. 


Me(33), Mama to a crazy DD (6), Wife to a wonderful mountain man(32) BF my babe for 2 years.
MountainMamaGC is online now  
#2 of 25 Old 08-16-2012, 07:25 PM
 
Jennyanydots's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,380
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I tend to be, yes, more and more as I continue to read and research, although a year ago I would have said no, I'm pro choice. Vaccine propaganda is increasingly difficult to avoid and I fear the day is coming when it will be compulsory.

That's not to say I don't respect someone else feeling differently, I just feel that, for my family, I have gone from being concerned, to skeptical, to against vaccinating as I have learned more and become increasingly dissatisfied with the available information.

chicken3.gif mama to two teens and two tots partners.gif madly in love with DP guitar.gif

Jennyanydots is offline  
#3 of 25 Old 08-16-2012, 07:50 PM
 
MissMuffet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 55
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hum.. I think it's a gradual process, like what happened to Jenny. You start of thinking - ok let's examine these things one by one and then you reach a point where you're like good lord the whole lot of em are evil.
MissMuffet is offline  
#4 of 25 Old 08-16-2012, 08:51 PM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,870
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 91 Post(s)

No.

 

Anti-vax means against vaccines.

 

I think they might be the best choice in some (rather dire) circumstances, ergo I am not anti-vaccine.  

 

I am very unlikely to choose vaccines for myself or my family.  There are just too many unknowns when it comes to safety and reactions, IMHO.  If I were in an area where a serious VPD was rampant, and there was poor diet, sanitation, medicine, etc…I might feel compelled to make a different decision.


There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is offline  
#5 of 25 Old 08-16-2012, 09:00 PM
 
Bokonon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Diego
Posts: 2,975
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post

No.

 

Anti-vax means against vaccines.

 

I think they might be the best choice in some (rather dire) circumstances, ergo I am not anti-vaccine.  

 

I am very unlikely to choose vaccines for myself or my family.  There are just too many unknowns when it comes to safety and reactions, IMHO.  If I were in an area where a serious VPD was rampant, and there was poor diet, sanitation, medicine, etc…I might feel compelled to make a different decision.

 

My feelings exactly.


A, jammin.gif mama to a boy (2005) and a girl (2009)
Bokonon is offline  
#6 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 12:07 AM
 
Bronwen13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 142
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
No, not anti-vax, just informed enough to say no thanks!! wink1.gif
applejuice and MrsKoehn like this.
Bronwen13 is offline  
#7 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 02:20 AM
 
katelove's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 3,778
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
No, I'm not anti-vax. I think the current evidence is such that one can research the decision and reasonably decide to vaccinate or not to vaccinate. I can think of a number of circumstances in which we may have gone down the vaccination route and I think we will do some vaccinations in the future.

Mother of two spectacular girls, born mid-2010 and late 2012  mdcblog5.gif

katelove is online now  
#8 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 05:27 AM
 
leafylady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Southeastern Illinois
Posts: 1,965
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'm not anti vaccine but I completely want to maintain the right to educate myself, question, delay, and/or refuse vaccines.
applejuice and kathymuggle like this.
leafylady is offline  
#9 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 09:36 AM - Thread Starter
 
MountainMamaGC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,043
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)

When I first began researching I became very angry with some of the information or lack of information out there. I was of the mind that no one should do it ever, but now I realize that you cant win with that mentality. Its like when Mother Theresa said something along the lines of; I will not attend an anti-war rally, but I will go to a peace rally anytime. I just think we will get a lot more support from parents if we go it it from a pro-parent pro informed decision front. As long as we remain divided and the minority, change will never happen.

rachelsmama likes this.

Me(33), Mama to a crazy DD (6), Wife to a wonderful mountain man(32) BF my babe for 2 years.
MountainMamaGC is online now  
#10 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 10:28 AM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,870
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 91 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainMamaGC View Post

When I first began researching I became very angry with some of the information or lack of information out there. I was of the mind that no one should do it ever, but now I realize that you cant win with that mentality. Its like when Mother Theresa said something along the lines of; I will not attend an anti-war rally, but I will go to a peace rally anytime. I just think we will get a lot more support from parents if we go it it from a pro-parent pro informed decision front. As long as we remain divided and the minority, change will never happen.

 

I like this post.

 

I don't really see the bolded happening.  I don't think non-vaxxers are divided.

 

I don't agree with everything every non-vaxxer says, and while I will state my POV, I try to do it in a way that will not divide us.  I have rarely felt any "dividing behaviour" amongst non-vaxxers.


There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is offline  
#11 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 12:37 PM
 
Jennyanydots's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,380
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Here's an analogy that makes sense to me: I am not in favor of the death penalty, not because I don't think there are crimes that can be appropriately punished by death, but because I don't trust our flawed system to implement it fairly, and the stakes are too high for mistakes to be acceptable. Likewise, I am not in favor of vaccines (for my family, specifically) not because I don't like the concept of vaccination, but because I don't trust the delivery (components, potential reactions, etc), and the stakes are too high (my children's health) for me to take that risk. I am not "anti vax" if you are talking about the abstract idea of vaccination- I honestly don't understand the different theories of how our immune systems work and develop well enough to make that declaration. I am, however, firmly against injecting vaccines into my children or myself at this time, and will remain so until such time as my safety concerns are adequately addressed.

chicken3.gif mama to two teens and two tots partners.gif madly in love with DP guitar.gif

Jennyanydots is offline  
#12 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 01:00 PM
 
Taximom5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,097
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post

 

I like this post.

 

I don't really see the bolded happening.  I don't think non-vaxxers are divided.

 

I don't agree with everything every non-vaxxer says, and while I will state my POV, I try to do it in a way that will not divide us.  I have rarely felt any "dividing behaviour" amongst non-vaxxers.

I like that post, too.

 

Unfortunately, I HAVE seen "dividing behaviour" amongst non-vaxxers.

 

There are some who really do think that vaccines are part of some kind of nefarious plot to rule the world or something.  If even a non-vaxxer tries to point out any flaws in their presentation of the dangers of vaccines (let alone flaws in their conclusions), they accuse that person of being a pharma-shill. (I've been the pointer-outer, in that little scenario, and I was truly shocked.) They will tolerate NO criticism of their points, their presentation, their spelling, nuthin'! In their perspective, either you're on board with their ideas 100%, or you are The Enemy.

 

There is also a bit of a chasm between those who do a few delayed vaccines and those who refuse to do a single vaccine, ever, no matter what.

 

There are those of us who cannot be called anti-vaxxers or even non-vaxxers, because we DID follow the recommended vaccine schedule, causing injury to ourselves and/or our children.  We no longer vaccinate--but if my children have received a total of 60-something vaccines before the doctor decided to stop, that hardly makes me a non-vaxxer, even if I refuse all further vaccinations for my children.

 

We even see that some of our more famous pro-vaxxers here on MDC admit (especially over on other boards) to delaying or even refusing some vaccines.

 

It's not as simple as we might think.

Taximom5 is online now  
#13 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 02:15 PM
 
Mirzam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Outside the hive mind
Posts: 7,302
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)

I hope as non-vaxers we are able to put aside our differences because we are all at different places in this journey towards clarity. I am most definitely anti-vax for me and my family and I will do all in my power to keep their physical integrity intact, but I completely respect that others have a less radical views which are totally valid for them. 


Rainbow.giftstillheart.gifsmile.gif

 

"If you find from your own experience that something is a fact and it contradicts what some authority has written down, then you must abandon the authority and base your reasoning on your own findings"~ Leonardo da Vinci

Mirzam is online now  
#14 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 07:49 PM
 
MamaMunchkin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 355
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)

Nope - neither anti nor pro.

 

However, everytime some pro-vaxer implies that those who aren't convinced about vaxes as ignoramuses who put others at risk so they can leech on others for herd immunity because they're uneducated, unscientific, non-evidence-based crackpots who cannot possibly have any pertinent questions and even if their kids are vax-injured they're making it up because vax injuries are so rare so they're blaming vaxes because, you see, they're ignoramuses who put others at risk ... ad nauseam - I'm inching closer to be anti-vax, or rather, anti pro-vax ...

 

But, then again, I don't care what faction to belong to - it's about my kids ...  And, with regards to other parents, I respect their vax decision no matter what.

Neera, Bokonon, Taximom5 and 1 others like this.

Pro rights (vaxes).
MamaMunchkin is offline  
#15 of 25 Old 08-17-2012, 08:43 PM
 
Taximom5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,097
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaMunchkin View Post

Nope - neither anti nor pro.

 

However, everytime some pro-vaxer implies that those who aren't convinced about vaxes as ignoramuses who put others at risk so they can leech on others for herd immunity because they're uneducated, unscientific, non-evidence-based crackpots who cannot possibly have any pertinent questions and even if their kids are vax-injured they're making it up because vax injuries are so rare so they're blaming vaxes because, you see, they're ignoramuses who put others at risk ... ad nauseam - I'm inching closer to be anti-vax, or rather, anti pro-vax ...

 

But, then again, I don't care what faction to belong to - it's about my kids ...  And, with regards to other parents, I respect their vax decision no matter what.

I was going to say something similar, but MamaMunchkin put it into words far better than I could!

Taximom5 is online now  
#16 of 25 Old 08-18-2012, 10:25 AM - Thread Starter
 
MountainMamaGC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,043
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post

 

I like this post.

 

I don't really see the bolded happening.  I don't think non-vaxxers are divided.

 

I don't agree with everything every non-vaxxer says, and while I will state my POV, I try to do it in a way that will not divide us.  I have rarely felt any "dividing behaviour" amongst non-vaxxers.

 

Really. I have seen anti-vax agenda spout "Dont vax your children unless you want them to get sick and die." and then the pro-vax agenda spout, "vax your children unless you want them to get sick and die." It really seemed dividing to me. I found a lot of that in my researching.


Me(33), Mama to a crazy DD (6), Wife to a wonderful mountain man(32) BF my babe for 2 years.
MountainMamaGC is online now  
#17 of 25 Old 08-18-2012, 10:29 AM - Thread Starter
 
MountainMamaGC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,043
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaMunchkin View Post

Nope - neither anti nor pro.

 

However, everytime some pro-vaxer implies that those who aren't convinced about vaxes as ignoramuses who put others at risk so they can leech on others for herd immunity because they're uneducated, unscientific, non-evidence-based crackpots who cannot possibly have any pertinent questions and even if their kids are vax-injured they're making it up because vax injuries are so rare so they're blaming vaxes because, you see, they're ignoramuses who put others at risk ... ad nauseam - I'm inching closer to be anti-vax, or rather, anti pro-vax ...

 

But, then again, I don't care what faction to belong to - it's about my kids ...  And, with regards to other parents, I respect their vax decision no matter what.

 

I kind of have a chuckle, because before I was a SAHM I was a chemist at a pharmaceutical plant. No, I dont know anything about science.

Bokonon likes this.

Me(33), Mama to a crazy DD (6), Wife to a wonderful mountain man(32) BF my babe for 2 years.
MountainMamaGC is online now  
#18 of 25 Old 08-18-2012, 11:09 AM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,870
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 91 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainMamaGC View Post

 

Really. I have seen anti-vax agenda spout "Dont vax your children unless you want them to get sick and die." and then the pro-vax agenda spout, "vax your children unless you want them to get sick and die." It really seemed dividing to me. I found a lot of that in my researching.

Got it.

 

I thought you were talking about divisiveness amongst non-vaxxers only.

 

Indeed,  I would offer up this subforum as evidence.  It is not a heavily divided subforum.  

 

There is definitley a lot of divisiveness on the spectrum of vax beliefs as a whole, though. 


There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is offline  
#19 of 25 Old 08-19-2012, 06:05 AM
 
campbellsoup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bishop Hill, Illinois
Posts: 215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)

Being able to make these decisions for your child is one reason I think it is very important to have a parental rights amendment.

 

http://www.parentalrights.org/


Baker's Wife and Catholic Unschooling Mama to Simeon (12), James (9), Amos (7) and Annie (4) and Jonah (2)
campbellsoup is offline  
#20 of 25 Old 09-05-2012, 09:59 AM
 
Blt178's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 93
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I Thhink Mountain Mama GC said it well... People shut down in the face of negativity, better to be FOR something than against. It is easy for them to write it off as 'crazy conspiracy theories' but harder for them to argue against 'pro-parent' or informed choice...
Neera likes this.
Blt178 is offline  
#21 of 25 Old 09-07-2012, 12:21 PM
 
amyknits1076's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 54
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennyanydots View Post

Here's an analogy that makes sense to me: I am not in favor of the death penalty, not because I don't think there are crimes that can be appropriately punished by death, but because I don't trust our flawed system to implement it fairly, and the stakes are too high for mistakes to be acceptable. Likewise, I am not in favor of vaccines (for my family, specifically) not because I don't like the concept of vaccination, but because I don't trust the delivery (components, potential reactions, etc), and the stakes are too high (my children's health) for me to take that risk. I am not "anti vax" if you are talking about the abstract idea of vaccination- I honestly don't understand the different theories of how our immune systems work and develop well enough to make that declaration. I am, however, firmly against injecting vaccines into my children or myself at this time, and will remain so until such time as my safety concerns are adequately addressed.

This is a great analogy!!! I'm going to have to use it the next time I need a good one in a vax discussion. Very succinctly and well put!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaMunchkin View Post

Nope - neither anti nor pro.

 

However, everytime some pro-vaxer implies that those who aren't convinced about vaxes as ignoramuses who put others at risk so they can leech on others for herd immunity because they're uneducated, unscientific, non-evidence-based crackpots who cannot possibly have any pertinent questions and even if their kids are vax-injured they're making it up because vax injuries are so rare so they're blaming vaxes because, you see, they're ignoramuses who put others at risk ... ad nauseam - I'm inching closer to be anti-vax, or rather, anti pro-vax ...

 

But, then again, I don't care what faction to belong to - it's about my kids ...  And, with regards to other parents, I respect their vax decision no matter what.

This. I am pro-parental choice. We have friends from all over the spectrum, vaxxing, delayed vaxxing, partial vaxxing, and non vaxxing. And I respect each of those women to know what is best for their children, just like I hope everyone else will respect my husband and I for knowing what is best for our children. And informed choice too, I'm for that also. I think as long as a parent has adequately weighed the risks vs. benefits and answere dthat *for themselves* who am I to question that?

amyknits1076 is offline  
#22 of 25 Old 09-16-2012, 07:11 PM
 
Shanesmom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 202
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Nicely put MM. smile.gif

Crunchy Christian mama to my home birthed, unvaxed, uncirc boys Shane and Cody!!joy.gif
Shanesmom is offline  
#23 of 25 Old 09-19-2012, 11:07 AM
 
lj 2010's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 7
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I try to be PRO-Parent and not Anti-Vax but it is hard for me to respect other parents decisions when they havent done the research. I am not anti-vax if a parent has done the research and feel that vaccinating there children is the childs best interest. Then I respect your decision. I just can't stand it when parents just put the trust in there Dr's and let them inject whatever the hell they want in there children. I'm actually really angry at some of my friends when you ask them if there child got this shot or that shot and they're like; idk, they are up - to - date on there vaccines so if it's in the time frame then yes. So, you don't even know what your child is being injected with??? and that's not careless??? Or when there child gets really sick within days after the shot, they don't even question if it is an adverse reaction or not. I swear my friends son sounded like he had whooping cough right after the 4th dtap shot. This is what is making me Anti-Vax........careless parental decision!!

applejuice likes this.
lj 2010 is offline  
#24 of 25 Old 09-19-2012, 05:02 PM
 
Chloebelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 283
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I am anti-vax, but I would never say that to someone I know who vaccinates. I keep my opinions to myself unless asked. I respect their decisions, and also respect that they might be completely against my vaccination choices. 


Non-vaxing, vegetarian, green lovin' mama to two little divas.
Chloebelle is offline  
#25 of 25 Old 09-20-2012, 01:45 PM
 
begoniamama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 143
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

well said ladies. i think it just has to be up to what is right for the parent. i foolishly (not the first time) got into a vaccine debate on a facebook thread. i didnt say what side of the line i lie on, but i couldn't help commenting when a few ladies made comments like mamamunckin mentioned. "why wouldn't you vaccinate, it's so careless not to!" and then one girl made a comment saying "my friend is deaf in one ear because her hippie parents didnt give her one".

 

i had to unfollow the post or else it will just get to me. as soon as i started commenting i regretted it. but if i hadn't, i probably would have wished i did. well, sorry for hijacking this thread to vent - back to the topic:

 

neither anti or pro vaccine here, just educated and informed. 

rebecca_n likes this.

homebirth.jpg intactlact.gif love of DH and mama to DS born 1/12

begoniamama is offline  
Reply

Tags
Vaccinations

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off