Non vaxer contemplating vaccination - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 11:18 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Ok I have never vaccinated my children 5 yrs and 13 months, they have had not one!!!! I have always been against them and not necessarily because I'm worried about autism because I notice that is what a lot of people who do vax think nonvaxers primary reason is! I just don't want to pump them full of chemicals or damage their immune system or give them a shot for a totally treatable disease! With that said ( I never thought this would happen) I have been thinking about getting them the Dtap shot.
I am constantly worried about them getting whooping cough or tetanus. It really started to worry me about a month ago when my ds got a severe case of croupe where he almost stopped breathing! I didn't even know croupe could get that bad! Then today we had a play date and the kids had sneezing, runny nose, mild cough, and runny eyes.... All I can think about now is what if it was the beginning of whooping cough?!? The mom said they have no fever and she thinks they just have allergies. Before she came over she said that the girl had a slight cough and stuffy nose and asked if we wanted to wait on the play date and I just figured my daughter and her plat at school so if my daughter catches anything she would get it at school and bring it home anyway! But when they were here and I noticed sneezing and runny eyes I started to get scared!! I'm just so sick of worrying all the time. I know having the shot may not prevent pertussis anyhow but my worry is overtaking all I have educated myself and I need some support ladies!!

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#2 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 11:35 AM
 
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I can understand where you are coming from.  Hugs to you mama, you just want to do your best by your kids.  I have never had my kids vaxed, they are 8 and 10, but with the new baby, I'm not so sure that she will be 100% non-vaxed.  Her big brothers are so integrated into the community with school, and they frequent the gym their dad owns, and they are just out there getting exposed to every darned thing and bringing it home.  I don't worry about them, because they are so healthy and strong, and ...big!  But I worry about the newborn and what she may get exposed to before she can handle it well.  Pertussis is the main one.  I didn't worry about it when the first two were babies and home with me full time, because they were breastfed for years and they didn't really mix with society(no daycare, etc) and get exposed to a lot, so I figured they were pretty safe.  But with big siblings and neighborhood friends of theirs coming in and out of the house...it's a different story.


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#3 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 12:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I know and I think that's why I have started to worry bc my oldest is In school now bringing stuff home!! And we are going to start trying for another soon! I want more kids but I fear worry will destroy me!! Well that's another thread right? Lol

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#4 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 01:03 PM
 
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Hmmm…..I am not sure this is the right forum for you.  Perhaps selective and delayed?  I am not trying to kick you off - just saying you might get more of the type of feedback you want there.

 

That being said, do not vaccinate, or remained unvaccinate for that matter, over fear.  If something goes wrong (and it probably won't, but it can) you do not want that hanging over your head.  It is one thing to make the most informed decision you can, roll the dice and have it not work out in your favour…it is another to do it to assauge your fears.  The guilt if something goes wrong would be awful!  You want to base the decision on what is best for them, and not on your anxiety.

 

Get really comfortable with the numbers and then decide.


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#5 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 05:11 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm sorry I have never vaxed my kids and was looking for support to ease my fears! If I went on a forum that supports vaccinations they would just tell me to do so, I think I'm exactly in the right place!!!

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#6 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 06:42 PM
 
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I'm sorry I have never vaxed my kids and was looking for support to ease my fears! If I went on a forum that supports vaccinations they would just tell me to do so, I think I'm exactly in the right place!!!

 

Not necessarily. There's a few of us who could be called "reluctant" vaxers who look at the whole issue and our available options with a very critical eye and then proceed according to our own risk assessment of our circumstances. From your original post, you'd be more than welcome to come and discuss it with us in the S&D forum. FWIW, my kids will be getting a fraction of what's on the schedule and I'd never tell anyone to just go ahead and vaccinate, especially when my default is to abstain from certain vaccines altogether. 

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#7 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 06:49 PM
 
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Pertussis sucks but at their age it shouldnt be dangerous. Tetanus is extremely rare, especially with proper wound care. I too have been reconsidering, but decided to keep vax-free for now. I will steer clear from DTaP because my DDs reaction at 2 months, but I may do MMR before she goes through puberty. 


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#8 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Well I also worry about my dd who is five bc she has struggled with low white blood count and the des don't know why! I worry about her fighting off sickness but I also think that coaxing could damage her for this same thing! If she has a weak immune system I don't want to damage it with vaccines

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#9 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:34 PM
 
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Well I also worry about my dd who is five bc she has struggled with low white blood count and the des don't know why! I worry about her fighting off sickness but I also think that coaxing could damage her for this same thing! If she has a weak immune system I don't want to damage it with vaccines

 

If you are immuno-compromised it is hard to have a proper immune response to the vaccines. She may need more boosters than normal to get the proper titers. That is another thing to consider. Are you willing to A. Do more shots, and B. Check the titres to see if she has even responded to the vaccine. 


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#10 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Well she has never had any vaccines...

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#11 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I guess I would not give her any at this point I'm more thinking for my one year old or if I have another baby!

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#12 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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But I really dont think I could ever go through with it.... I guess I'm just working stuff out in my mind and thought I'd throw it out there for others input! Especially others who have not vaxed! Do you think by the symptoms of the kids that came over today that I'm over reacting or do you think that I'm justified in worrying they have the beginning of pertussis?

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#13 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:42 PM
 
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I have considered vaxing as well, but I thought I'd let you know that the 2 biggest concerns for you are 2 things I wouldn't worry about. The vaccine isn't very effective for whooping cough, up to 90% of kids who get it are vaccinated. For tetanus, it's so very rare. If there is a wound just make sure it bleeds and clean it well.


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#14 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thank you and I gave heard these things and just needed some reassurance !!

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#15 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:54 PM
 
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I think its good to always know what your options are and be open minded, then you can be really comfortable in your choices. 


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#16 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 07:56 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Yes and that is what scares me the most is I was always confident in my decision to not vax and I don't know what happened! :/

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#17 of 50 Old 11-30-2013, 09:12 PM
 
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Hi! I have written this before but am going to repost it. Hope it might help!

 

http://www.smh.com.au/national/health/whooping-cough-beats-vaccine-20120320-1vibp.html

Australia also showed that vaxing moms and cocooning babies didn't help so they have abandoned it.

 

NEXT:

You have to understand what whooping cough is. If you have ever had the DTP or DTaP... your body already has "original antigenic sin:"  

Also, WC It is a MUCOSAL infection.

 

In adults, booster shots don't work.  Why?The original exposure to the disease through immunization "locks in" as they say the way the body will respond to it.Which is why vaccinated people can't clear the bacteria from the bronchi and therefore become carriers if infected, and THEN can act as a reservoir to infect others.  They do not respond to the key toxins which arise as A PROCESS of infection. 

 

Natural mucosal immunity specifically targets the infection process - how the bacteria sets up shop - and the specific toxins the bacteria switch on and then start once their little claws attach to the cilia in the bronchi at "ground zero". 

Another words,  the current whooping cough vaccines create antibodies at the "back-end", to antigens which come later in the infection.  Vaccines MIGHT reduce disease severity for the few months those antibodies exist, but the current whooping cough vaccines don't create the powerful "front end" protection which will immediately clear the bacteria on re-infection. Does that make sense?

The vaccine antibodies, if they are around, might ... lessen the effect of pertussis toxin when it Finally hits the blood supply. 

 

Again: The vaccine creates back end antibodies, BUT natural infection requires a specific bronchial immunity not made by the current vaccines, and not provided by the antibodies detected in antibody tests. 

 

This is WHY scientists have been searching and testing for an intra-nasal vaccine, starting in 2000. BPEZ1 has been tested and should it work, should be the only "vax" given for WC.  It is to finally confront "front end" defenses in the mucosal area where they need to be. This should also help against parapertussis as well.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21430219

 

However: The intra-nasal vaccine will be of no use to adults, whose immunity - as a result of "original antigenic sin" was primed for "back end" immunity and whose immune system will no longer respond in any other way - so an intra-nasal vaccine won't give front end immunity to adults, any more than re-exposure to whooping cough would, or booster injections will. In fact, adults will continue to be the main source of carriage and spread in the community because of this.

 

Given that booster shots don't increase the bactericidal qualities in the blood why recommend them?

The shot will never stop transmission to anyone else.

The shot will not help you not get it.

The shot might lesson severity (which is a crap shot to say what percentage-some seem to have no symptoms while others get horrible cases).

 

So all of that to say, yes, I would skip the DTaP. It really won't help you or your baby.

 

And Kathy just posted a link to a website with a lot of really good info about Tetanus:http://www.beyondconformity.co.nz/resources/tetanus

 

 

S

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Those who are brave grow greater.
Never fear, always grow."

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#18 of 50 Old 12-01-2013, 08:41 AM
 
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But I really dont think I could ever go through with it.... I guess I'm just working stuff out in my mind and thought I'd throw it out there for others input! Especially others who have not vaxed! Do you think by the symptoms of the kids that came over today that I'm over reacting or do you think that I'm justified in worrying they have the beginning of pertussis?

Probably not.  When a cold presents as a cold - it is typically a cold.  I think anyone who has a cold/cough that has lasted more than 10 days might be cause for concern - but even then it probably isn't pertussis.

 

I remember doing the math a few years ago on pertussis in my province - and my chance of getting pertussis in a given year were 1/ 14 000.  I found this somewhat reassuring.  

 

Honestly, the only time I would worry about someone with a cough/cold possibly having pertussis is if I were pregnant or had an infant under 4 months.  I don't want to get pertussis - it does not sound fun - I would survive it though, as would my kids.  They when then be immune for the next 12-20 years, and hopefully, in the case of my daughters, be able to pass on that immunity to their babies when they need it most through breastmilk and birth.  It is typcially only fatal in newborns.  


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#19 of 50 Old 12-01-2013, 10:02 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thx this makes me feel better!!

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#20 of 50 Old 12-01-2013, 11:54 AM
 
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I had pertussis when I was 7 and I was fully vaccinated, and probably with DTP and not DTaP. It sucked but I got through it, and I am probably stronger for it. At least when we skip it, I know exactly what it feels like. 


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#21 of 50 Old 12-01-2013, 06:28 PM
 
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Well we started off vaxxing DD but stopped after her 4mo round bc of the reactions she was having.  She's 2 now, and while she's always been pretty darn healthy in term of fighting off illness, she's had some food/digestive issues that we've been working through for over a year and are finally seeing a light at the end of the tunnel.  I would certainly never vax her again (even our ND highly pushed for that and really helped me to finalize my own decision) and with her hopefully starting pre-school next fall, and me hopefully getting my issues resolved, we'll think about having more.  So even with her being in school and exposed to what have you, I wouldn't even hesitate to say no to vaxxing any future kiddos.  Having been on the reaction side of things, and knowing it was something I absolutely could have prevented by not vaxxing, whereas the diseases themselves are fairly low risk in terms of likelihood of getting them...I've done my fair share of kicking myself in the rear for that.  Also, DH works as a firefighter/EMT in the city here and gets exposed to plenty of nastiness (TB is constantly circulating the hospitals, so I guess in that respect maybe we are more likely to be exposed to diseases than most!) BUT...even when DD was an infant it still never bothered me or kept me up at night.  We do what we can to support our immune systems with good food and supplements and sort of let it be.  Between the 3 of us, DD is by far the healthiest and always the first to kick any cold that passes through.  She's still nursing, so that totally helps her and probably drains me just a bit thus I take a day or two longer than her, and DH, well, I still have to hide the Nyquil and force my "crunchiness" on him and since he's not as vigilant he suffers longer.  Whooping cough and tetanus would be at the bottom of my worry list though.

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#22 of 50 Old 12-01-2013, 07:52 PM
 
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If it makes you feel any better, my son had all the vaccinations. He was born in 2002, so probably not as many vaccines as babies born today, but still a lot. In any case, he got croup pretty bad. He stopped breathing, and we took him to the ER. So, vaccinated or not, you can get croup. He always got croup after that. He hasn't had it in a couple of years but he is 10 now. He has asthma now. I think his troubles all began when he had RSV as an infant. He may have had it twice, back to back at age 4 mos and 6 mos. They didn't test him the second time, because it is invasive (swab up the nose). 

 

My daughter was a premie, and I had a choice to do monthly RSV vaccines for 6 months when she was born. I chose to do it. I did decline some other vaccines, like rodovirus and I also occasionally skip flu shots. The good news is, my daughter has no respiratory issues. I am glad I chose to vaccinate for RSV. I can't imagine what that virus would do to a premie, after what it did to my son. He was never the same...even his 6 yr molars came in soft and decayed. They say that happens when your baby is sick when those teeth are forming under the gums. In this case, it was 0-6 mos...right when he had RSV.

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#23 of 50 Old 12-02-2013, 10:59 AM
 
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I had Pertussis when I was 5 and I was fully vaccinated.  I was not, however, breastfed.  I truly believe that breastfeeding until the minimum age of 2 (as recommended in the Dr. Sears Vaccine Book) is key to not worrying about illnesses in our babies and kids.  It's not a magic bullet, but it is the best way to build natural immunity for our small fry.  Not only does it make getting illnesses less likely, but it also improves outcomes and recovery when kids do get sick. 

 

If I lived on a cow farm and was in the habit of leaving pitchforks tines up, I might consider Tetnus shots. But I don't :)

Have faith, mama :)  Please don't let fears take you down a path you aren't comfortable walking. 

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#24 of 50 Old 12-02-2013, 12:05 PM
 
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FWIW,Ds1(6)apparently stepped on something last summer and ended up in the hospital with STAPH.Long story short,I didn't see a wound thus didn't clean it and he didn't get tetanus.He has only had 2 hepb vaxes.

 

I worry 2 but know that breastfeeding helps and we homeschool.When it comes down to it,I feel better NOT vaxing.

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#25 of 50 Old 12-02-2013, 12:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thx ladies!!! This is just the stuff I needed yo here!!!

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#26 of 50 Old 12-03-2013, 12:05 PM
 
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Wrong forum for that posting fyi, this is I'm Not Vaccinating.

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#27 of 50 Old 12-03-2013, 12:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Wrong forum for that posting fyi, this is I'm Not Vaccinating.
I am a non vaxing mom!! I was looking for reassurance from other non vaxing moms!! If the mods had a problem then I guess they would have moved it .

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#28 of 50 Old 12-03-2013, 12:33 PM
 
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I am a non vaxing mom!! I was looking for reassurance from other non vaxing moms!! If the mods had a problem then I guess they would have moved it .

i am not sassyfirechick, but I would bet money she was addressing jennguitart, not you :)

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There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

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#29 of 50 Old 12-03-2013, 12:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm sorry!!! I feel really bad now.... I'm jumped the gun...

DH 31; Me 30; DD 5; DS 1; Baby boy due Dec 17th

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lbdf.lilypie.com/NtPdm4.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Pregnancy tickers" /></a>
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#30 of 50 Old 12-03-2013, 12:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Sorry@sassyfirechick

DH 31; Me 30; DD 5; DS 1; Baby boy due Dec 17th

<a href="http://lilypie.com/"><img src="http://lbdf.lilypie.com/NtPdm4.png" width="400" height="80" border="0" alt="Lilypie Pregnancy tickers" /></a>
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