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#1 of 101 Old 11-26-2009, 10:39 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Big Pharma Wants to Make You Sicker from the Journal of Natural Food and Healing.

This is EXACTLY it!


Eat whole food probiotics!!


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#2 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 10:47 AM
 
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Big Pharma Wants to Make You Sicker from the Journal of Natural Food and Healing.

This is EXACTLY it!


Eat whole food probiotics!!


Pat
Nice article
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#3 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 01:47 PM
 
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Thanks for posting this Pat!

This bears repeating:

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So, the industry works to create myths that keep the public anxious.

You are just lucky to be healthy (so far);
You have only avoided disease “somehow”;
You are vulnerable at every moment;
You are harboring disease you just don’t know about yet;
Your genetics have condemned you to whatever you may “get”;
Infectious diseases are terrifying and deadly, can crop up at any time, and are getting worse by the year;
Natural food supplements are not only worthless but dangerous;
Staying or getting well is terribly complex, dependent on extensive testing and medical expertise; and
You can’t live without industry’s expensive drugs and vaccines.

Rubbish. Nonsense. Hogwash. Fiddle-faddle.


I do have some issues with the article.

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But it is the shift that allows people to see that they don’t need to be afraid and that chronic and infectious diseases are not some random attack from outside but are related to a weakening of the immune system (or a threat to the good little bugs inside).

I fell the paradigm shift he talks about doesn't go far enough, This isn't just with the article, because it is a relative truth that is held by both orthodox and alternative medicine alike, is that which views the human body as a battleground and the immune system as a defense system. I do think the writer has a better understanding but still falls into the good bacteria/bad bacteria trap.

The immune system does not in fact exist, it is a myth. What it is, is a support system in which microbes, fungii, etc, play a supportive role to help us to heal. The perfect diet, probiotics and supplements, etc, cannot boost a non existent immune system but can boost a healing support system. If we embrace the understanding that all disease has meaning and is not a random act of a malevolent Mother Nature, but is a special biological program of nature and that all disease (with the exception of malnutrition, poisoning and trauma) begins with the psyche and it is therefore with the psyche that healing begins. You cannot prevent that with probiotics, vitamin D, C, or anything else for that matter. However, a strong well nourished, fully functioning body will make us less susceptible to conflict shocks which can initiate a disease (program) cycle, and a strong body will generally make the healing process less problematic for us.

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#4 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 02:05 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Yes, there is a *reason* for "bad microbs" which seek to rebalance our system. Attacking them certainly does not equal "healing".

The concept of an "immune system" is an interesting one. Western medicine compartmentalizes everything into a discrete box with a label.

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#5 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 03:49 PM
 
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My son has a DNA mutation that affects mitochodrial function.

I don't think it's as simple as one might like to believe.

He picked up a nearly impossible to get rid of parasite (blastocystis hominus) that eats and thrives on probiotic foods, wrecks havoc on the gut, lowers IGA (important part of your immune system, especially in the gut), etc. No one has ever had success with natural anti-parasite approaches with this parasite and even the naturopaths use big pharma to attempt to get rid of it. Nasty, nasty bug. If I had it to do over again I would have been much, much more careful about preventing his exposure to those parasites (ie things like I would not have let him dig in dirt outside without gloves). Things you pick up can indeed hurt you. And he had a great gut prior (no candida, healthy bacteria balance etc.) He no longer has that.

Beyond that, as someone who has seen first hand (with the mitochondrial stuff) what a genetic difference does to body functions I don't buy the "black and white" thinking.

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#6 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 04:10 PM
 
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I
The immune system does not in fact exist, it is a myth. What it is, is a support system in which microbes, fungii, etc, play a supportive role to help us to heal. The perfect diet, probiotics and supplements, etc, cannot boost a non existent immune system but can boost a healing support system. If we embrace the understanding that all disease has meaning and is not a random act of a malevolent Mother Nature, but is a special biological program of nature and that all disease (with the exception of malnutrition, poisoning and trauma) begins with the psyche and it is therefore with the psyche that healing begins. You cannot prevent that with probiotics, vitamin D, C, or anything else for that matter. However, a strong well nourished, fully functioning body will make us less susceptible to conflict shocks which can initiate a disease (program) cycle, and a strong body will generally make the healing process less problematic for us.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding - are you essentially saying people manifest their own illnesses?
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#7 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 04:26 PM
 
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What part of immune systems do people not believe in?

I am a bit confused what the basis might be for this phenomenon. Why don't you believe in an immune system? How do you think you body fights things off?

Do you believe that all the science, research, and facts are all a lie? Do you have proof of this?

I don't think the point is that Mother Nature is malevolent, but that she isn't necessarily on our side, KWIM?

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#8 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 04:31 PM
 
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What part of immune systems do people not believe in?

I am a bit confused what the basis might be for this phenomenon. Why don't you believe in an immune system? How do you think you body fights things off?

Do you believe that all the science, research, and facts are all a lie? Do you have proof of this?
I'll just second what Abimommy wrote, since my last response was seen as a smidge too sarcastic

Mother Nature is all about equal opportunity, yo.

Oh - 'unsarcasticated' version of my post: I'm pretty sure T-cells are for real, and to suggest that it's a 'myth' or 'made up' seems a bit silly if you don't have the research background to back up the claims, which, if you don't have a degree in immunology, you don't.
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#9 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 04:51 PM
 
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So, if the immune system doesn't exist, what exactly happens to people with AIDS, or people on chemo/radiation? We all know that people who are suffering from AIDS or receiving treatment for cancer have compromised immune systems- that's not a myth.
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#10 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 05:09 PM
 
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The immune system doesn't exist because it is a healing support system not a defense system. Antibodies, white blood cells and the many other chemical processes are part of this healing support system.

And yes, there is "good" science to support this, just not popular science because it threatens everything that current medical science is based upon.

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#11 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 05:20 PM
 
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Originally Posted by katheek77 View Post
Maybe I'm misunderstanding - are you essentially saying people manifest their own illnesses?
Yes, you are misunderstanding. I am not saying people are responsible for their own illnesses, that would make them victims and I am not about to say that. All I am saying is disease, which actually isn't -- its a biological program of nature, begins with the psyche. How a disease/illness manifests, ie what symptoms are experienced, is determined by how a person perceives these shocks.

To all the other posters, I am not posting this to be attacked, I am merely posting my opinions which may be of interest to some exploring alternative truths. If this doesn't resonate with you, that's fine. Disregard and stick with what you believe.

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#12 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 05:24 PM
 
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So, if the immune system doesn't exist, what exactly happens to people with AIDS, or people on chemo/radiation? We all know that people who are suffering from AIDS or receiving treatment for cancer have compromised immune systems- that's not a myth.
I am not getting into AIDS because it is too controversial a topic for this forum and I am not willing to subject myself to the vitriol it engenders. But those suffering from chemo/radiation poisoning have damaged healing support systems.

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#13 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 05:38 PM
 
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Originally Posted by uccomama View Post
The immune system doesn't exist because it is a healing support system not a defense system. Antibodies, white blood cells and the many other chemical processes are part of this healing support system.

And yes, there is "good" science to support this, just not popular science because it threatens everything that current medical science is based upon.
I am not sure I agree, the immune system also fights off allergens..which would not necessarily involve it being only a healing system.

I have an autoimmune disease, so I guess I am a bit more familiar with the "attack!" part of the immune system.

There is a lot about the immune system that isn't *known* for certain.

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#14 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 05:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by uccomama View Post
The immune system doesn't exist because it is a healing support system not a defense system. Antibodies, white blood cells and the many other chemical processes are part of this healing support system.

And yes, there is "good" science to support this, just not popular science because it threatens everything that current medical science is based upon.

Can you cite some of these "good" science studies that show this?
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#15 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 06:13 PM
 
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Can you cite some of these "good" science studies that show this?
I would if I truly believed someone was open to these ideas. I have yet to be convinced though.

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#16 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 06:35 PM
 
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I am not sure I agree, the immune system also fights off allergens..which would not necessarily involve it being only a healing system.

I have an autoimmune disease, so I guess I am a bit more familiar with the "attack!" part of the immune system.

There is a lot about the immune system that isn't *known* for certain.
I have one or two of those myself (call me crazy but I'm sure that there are 2 which haven't been named for me yet).
I believe that if you carefully read the literature on autoimmune illnesses, it does somewhat support what uccomama is saying. I think that they use the word "attack" simply because it's the easiest way to get the point across to laymen. From what I've read on the subject, the issue ends up being that the immune system overcompensates for the original imbalance causing a shift in the opposite direction. (oversimplifying but..)
I'm not sure that I'd entirely agree with the psyche part of the argument but I think I do agree with uccomama that disease is basically the will/thoughts/whatever of the person manifesting in unexpected and undesireable manners.

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#17 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 06:59 PM
 
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I have one or two of those myself (call me crazy but I'm sure that there are 2 which haven't been named for me yet).
I do feel there is generally a "cause" which can lead to what are additional conditions. If you don't have an "explanation" then maybe you haven't found it yet?


Quote:
I believe that if you carefully read the literature on autoimmune illnesses, it does somewhat support what uccomama is saying. I think that they use the word "attack" simply because it's the easiest way to get the point across to laymen. From what I've read on the subject, the issue ends up being that the immune system overcompensates for the original imbalance causing a shift in the opposite direction. (oversimplifying but..)
But what would be the explanation for the immune system fighting off allergens or even a pregnancy? There are so many situations in which the immune system fights things off for it to be explained as the result of a faulty system. It is a simplistic explanation but I do not believe it is incorrect in essentials.


Quote:
I'm not sure that I'd entirely agree with the psyche part of the argument but I think I do agree with uccomama that disease is basically the will/thoughts/whatever of the person manifesting in unexpected and undesireable manners.
I do think to get well someone has to *want* to get well (which I think is what uccomama was saying??) but I don't believe anyone manifests an illness onto themselves.

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#18 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 07:04 PM
 
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I am not posting it because:

1. I have posted it before and it has caused anger, UA violations and threads to be closed.

2. It requires a poster to be really open to a new paradigm of health and healing, if someone is genuinely interested they can pm me.

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#19 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 07:06 PM
 
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I do feel there is generally a "cause" which can lead to what are additional conditions. If you don't have an "explanation" then maybe you haven't found it yet?

But what would be the explanation for the immune system fighting off allergens or even a pregnancy? There are so many situations in which the immune system fights things off for it to be explained as the result of a faulty system. It is a simplistic explanation but I do not believe it is incorrect in essentials.

I do think to get well someone has to *want* to get well (which I think is what uccomama was saying??) but I don't believe anyone manifests an illness onto themselves.
You misunderstood what I was saying and I can't presently think of a better way to say it but I want you to know I'm not ignoring you.

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#20 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 07:11 PM
 
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You misunderstood what I was saying and I can't presently think of a better way to say it but I want you to know I'm not ignoring you.
Ok

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#21 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 07:23 PM
 
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I do think to get well someone has to *want* to get well (which I think is what uccomama was saying??) but I don't believe anyone manifests an illness onto themselves.
Nope, I am not actually saying that, but I agree with you. I am saying every disease with the exception of malnutrition, poisoning and trauma, has its basis in the psyche. The psyche, brain and body function as one system which has the brain at its control center. Depending on the conflict shock, different areas of the brain and therefore different parts of the body are effected . How a person feels about the shock will determine the symptoms (disease). The intensity of symptoms will be determined by the intensity of the conflict.

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#22 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 07:34 PM
 
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Nope, I am not actually saying that, but I agree with you. I am saying every disease with the exception of malnutrition, poisoning and trauma, has its basis in the psyche. The psyche, brain and body function as one system which has the brain at its control center. Depending on the conflict shock, different areas of the brain and therefore different parts of the body are effected . How a person feels about the shock will determine the symptoms (disease). The intensity of symptoms will be determined by the intensity of the conflict.
Ok, I just have a different word for what you call psyche, I think... I just don't quite get what you mean by conflict shock... conflict between the psyche's ideals and the brain's personality? something like that?

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#23 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 07:41 PM
 
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Ok, I just have a different word for what you call psyche, I think... I just don't quite get what you mean by conflict shock... conflict between the psyche's ideals and the brain's personality? something like that?
Would emotional shock be easier? The types of shock could be for example, territorial, powerlessness (this would relate to thyroid for example), separation, loss, fright-scare, attack, anger, fear-disgust etc. All would effect different parts of the brain and therefore different parts of the body. When the conflict is resolved the body goes into healing, that's when you get the symptoms of disease.

Okay, I am going to pm you!

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#24 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 07:53 PM
 
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Would emotional shock be easier? The types of shock could be for example, territorial, powerlessness (this would relate to thyroid for example), separation, loss, fright-scare, attack, anger, fear-disgust etc. All would effect different parts of the brain and therefore different parts of the body. When the conflict is resolved the body goes into healing, that's when you get the symptoms of disease.

Okay, I am going to pm you!
This seems to be showing me how FEs can go beyond emotional healing to physical healing. I had always thought of FEs as an emotional thing. But Panser created a blend for me that was also for physical.

Children deserve the respect of puzzling it out.
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#25 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 07:59 PM
 
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This seems to be showing me how FEs can go beyond emotional healing to physical healing. I had always thought of FEs as an emotional thing. But Panser created a blend for me that was also for physical.
Yes! FE can definitely assist with physical healing. The problem is FE manufactures aren't permitted by law to make those kind of claims, unless of course they want to end up in jail.

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#26 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 10:02 PM
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The immune system does not in fact exist, it is a myth. What it is, is a support system...
This is simply incorrect.
Yes, our immune system does support healing when illness or injury have already taken place. But the entire system does so much to PREVENT illness before it can take hold -- and this prevention is well-documented over decades of observation and research -- that it is a bad mistake to discount those functions and declare that it only supports healing. It is LARGELY preemptive, and effectively reactive when necessary.
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#27 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 10:19 PM
 
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This is simply incorrect.
Yes, our immune system does support healing when illness or injury have already taken place. But the entire system does so much to PREVENT illness before it can take hold -- and this prevention is well-documented over decades of observation and research -- that it is a bad mistake to discount those functions and declare that it only supports healing. It is LARGELY preemptive, and effectively reactive when necessary.
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#28 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 10:40 PM
 
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So based on the conflict/emotional shock disease theory how do we then prevent disease because trauma, emotional shock or conflict is a fact of life as far as I can tell, especially the things you listed. I would love to know how my nephew could have avoided getting cancer when he was 2.5 yrs old (he's 3 now). Or why some people who experience more than their fair share of trauma, emotional shock and conflict stay disease free?

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#29 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 10:47 PM
 
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Wow just wow, I mean I don't even know where to start.

Honey the big pharma does not want to make you sicker they save millions of lives. Do they make money at it YES are there things that need improvement yes.

You don't manifest diseases.

The immune system does exists.

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#30 of 101 Old 11-27-2009, 10:49 PM
 
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disease is basically the will/thoughts/whatever of the person manifesting in unexpected and undesireable manners.
So you think babies manifest cancer, HIV, and other life threatening diseases?

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