toddler drank from a puddle and now has diarrhea, help - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 12:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
moon mountain mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Catskills
Posts: 185
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
My two year old drank some standing water outside. and in a week or so got diarrhea. It has been about 5 weeks now and I can't get rid of it. Coconut oil and probiotics, elderberry syrup, vitamins have not helped. I took him to his doctor and he didn't seem too concerned. He wrote a prescription for a stool sample for my boy to take in a couple of weeks if it doesn't go away. But if the stool sample comes back positive for parasites such as giardia or something like that. Even though I know those tests are very inaccurate. He will perscribe him some sort of very toxic strong poison to get rid of it. ANy suggestions of what I could be doing naturally to combat this infection?
Thank you.
moon mountain mama is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#2 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 12:32 PM
 
deditus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In the LandOLakes missin the mitten
Posts: 2,978
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
5 weeks - wow that is a long time! I would just wait and see what the stool sample shows. I agree that I would not give Flagyl (what is prescribed for giardia), I took it for chronic giardia and I regret it. What kind of probiotics are you giving, how many times a day, how many cfus? Also, have you pulled dairy during this? Many diarrheal infections will leave you temporarily lactose-intolerant and this could lead to the symptoms continuing.

Emily, cooking allergen free, knitting, reading, gardening Mom to 1 beautiful girl, born in the water on July 1, 2006 Wife to 1 handsome man since September 10, 2005
deditus is offline  
#3 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 12:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
moon mountain mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Catskills
Posts: 185
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
wow really, I didn't know about the lactose intolerance. That could explain alot for me. I think during the summer I got some kind of intestinal infection from our well water while I was pregnant and I have been dealing with it ever since. All stool samples came back negative maybe because I have fought it off but, I still have digestive issues such as way too much gas so I know I am just not right. I have been suspecting lactose intolerance at this point. PLease tell me more or where I can read about this lactose intolerance brought on by infection. As far as probiotics for the little one goes. I have been giving him powder infantus probiotic like 1/2 teaspoon a day plus animal parade probiotics. I am trying to up the dosage on it. He is also a toddler and is being difficult with food so my opportunities to get it in him are hard to come by. I am really trying to be persistent though.
moon mountain mama is offline  
#4 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 01:13 PM
 
deditus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In the LandOLakes missin the mitten
Posts: 2,978
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Here's one link:

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/930971-overview

Emily, cooking allergen free, knitting, reading, gardening Mom to 1 beautiful girl, born in the water on July 1, 2006 Wife to 1 handsome man since September 10, 2005
deditus is offline  
#5 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 01:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
moon mountain mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Catskills
Posts: 185
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thank you, I will read it.

I am nursing my 2 year old and 3 month old and because of this unknoiwn infection my toddler has, I have been washing my nipple with hydrogen peroxide and then water after he nurses. Do any of you know if this is effective or should I be taking other measures to ensure the 3 month old doesn't get what my toddler has?
moon mountain mama is offline  
#6 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 01:23 PM
 
deditus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In the LandOLakes missin the mitten
Posts: 2,978
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Lactobacillus GG (Culturelle - available at CVS, Walgreens, Walmart, GNC) and S. boulardii are generally the most widely used probiotics for diarrhea, with the effective dose being a minimum of 10 billion cfus/day. My dd will take Culturelle dumped right from the capsule into her mouth.

Emily, cooking allergen free, knitting, reading, gardening Mom to 1 beautiful girl, born in the water on July 1, 2006 Wife to 1 handsome man since September 10, 2005
deditus is offline  
#7 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 01:28 PM
 
WuWei's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: In the moment
Posts: 11,071
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Here are some links for natural and alternative treatments for giardia.

Are you doing lactobacillus and s. boulardii?


Pat

I have a blog.
WuWei is offline  
#8 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 02:41 PM
 
deditus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In the LandOLakes missin the mitten
Posts: 2,978
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by moon mountain mama View Post
Thank you, I will read it.

I am nursing my 2 year old and 3 month old and because of this unknoiwn infection my toddler has, I have been washing my nipple with hydrogen peroxide and then water after he nurses. Do any of you know if this is effective or should I be taking other measures to ensure the 3 month old doesn't get what my toddler has?
*In general* diarrheal illness are spread from fecal-oral contact, and this is true of giardia. So it would only be spread by your nipple if you got feces on it! Just wash your hands well after cleaning up poop.

Emily, cooking allergen free, knitting, reading, gardening Mom to 1 beautiful girl, born in the water on July 1, 2006 Wife to 1 handsome man since September 10, 2005
deditus is offline  
#9 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 03:12 PM
 
Naturalyst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 718
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The stool test for ova and parasites is not going to yield a false positive. They look for ova and parasites under a microscope - and, either they see them or they don't. While it's possible the person viewing could "miss" a finding, if your DC has been incubating something for five weeks and it's parasites, there should be an abundance to see under a scope.

More than a few intestinal parasites can migrate out of the intestine, to other parts of the body where they cause bigger problems. You could succeed in killing off parasites in the intestine with home remedies that target the gut, but fail to get to those that have migrated outside.

IMHO, it's time to bring in a stool sample and, if there's a positive finding, don't try do-it-yourself.
Naturalyst is offline  
#10 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 04:57 PM
 
katelove's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 3,884
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by deditus View Post
*In general* diarrheal illness are spread from fecal-oral contact, and this is true of giardia. So it would only be spread by your nipple if you got feces on it! Just wash your hands well after cleaning up poop.
That could easily happen with toddler hands touching breast/nipple though.

If possible I would suggest feeding the 3mo first then washing with soap and water, rinsing and drying well after the todddler feeds. The peroxide isn't any more effective than soap and water but will probably still do the trick if you prefer it.

Mother of two spectacular girls, born mid-2010 and late 2012  mdcblog5.gif

katelove is online now  
#11 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 05:30 PM
 
sbgrace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 9,143
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
We have been dealing with parasites since my son got some contaminated water (slip and slide into mud) in June. The typical stool sample parasites usually go away shorter than five weeks though you do need to get rid of all dairy to see if it's just residual lactose intolerance. We didn't find anything with typical stool samples. We did with metametrix stool. He has six parasites (most related to each other/go together) and they aren't the type that you get rid of on your own. He is on Alinia now and we're hoping it gets it. He does a lot of the probiotics mention above and I do recommend them. Do dairy free versions (Klaire labs does bouldari dairy free and culturelle makes a dairy free strain). But if this goes on try to get a metametrix stool as there are a number of relatively common parasites the body (and probiotics and natural alternatives too) can't get rid of. Others you can do something like oregano oil and beat. But you have to know what you're dealing with to know how to proceed. Another thought is a bacterial infection. Some of those don't clear but all but one (an unlikely one given his probable source) can be treated with natural antibiotics. My kid got a bunch of them too (and we know they were all new).

It's funny (but not). Now every time I see pictures of kids playing in mud puddles or creeks I think "I wonder if he's eating a parasite"!


Quote:
Originally Posted by moon mountain mama View Post
Thank you, I will read it.

I am nursing my 2 year old and 3 month old and because of this unknoiwn infection my toddler has, I have been washing my nipple with hydrogen peroxide and then water after he nurses. Do any of you know if this is effective or should I be taking other measures to ensure the 3 month old doesn't get what my toddler has?
No one else in our family has gotten my son's parasites. All parasites are spread via poop. So what I would recommend is that you wear gloves and wash hands well after diaper changes or toileting clean up. I'd wash his hands too after diaper changes/toileting (obviously). Be careful about the surface you're using for diaper changes (I'd do a towel you can wash on hot). Do not let him put his hands in his diaper or underwear. Use over-alls if you have to to prevent that. Wash hands well after he wakes up in case he's itching at night (some parasites cause anal itching). If he's in cloth diapers be very careful with his in terms of washing and drying on hot. I hot wash of my son's underwear and hot dry apart from the rest of the family for extra protection. Wash his bedclothes on hot/dry on hot away from other family members sheets and stuff. I read that some people wash everything on cold. You certainly don't want that when you're dealing with a parasite. If he's potty trained be careful about the potty cleaning (gloves, thorough cleaning etc.) The worst kinds of parasites (and most of them really) aren't killed by disinfectants but by physical removal or boiling (which obviously you can't boil a toilet!) So washing is more effective than hydrogen peroxide but I don't think you need to worry about breastfeeding transmission unless his or your hands have stool on them. Maybe wash his hands and yours prior. I do a bath every night.

Most important is that the kids shouldn't share a bath, preferably not even a tub. We started showering my kids but if the baby can bathe in his own tub or the sink or whatever that should be good enough. You don't want him swallowing water that has been on your other son's bottom basically.

The thing about parasites is they wreck havoc on the body. Some of them lower gut IGA (immune system) levels which have tons of effects (autoimmune, food allergy, resistance to other bugs, etc.). Chronic diarrhea obviously isn't good in terms of nutrition and growth. I guess I'm saying I understand your concern about medications. But you really, really need to know what this is and treat it because not treating has it's own problems. I'd do metametrix stool if you can. They do DNA testing so are much more likely to find something than a typical culture and they look for any and all parasites (vs. just giardia or just crypto) and all bacterial overgrowths as well. They will find what is causing the diarrhea. Our insurance reimbursed most of the cost of the stool but we did have to pay metametrix up front. Then if you let me know I can tell you how to treat. Chances are my son has it whatever it is!

Rachelle, mommy to 8 year old boys! 

My Blog-free homeschooling finds and my lesson plans and link to the new User Agreement

sbgrace is offline  
#12 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 10:43 PM - Thread Starter
 
moon mountain mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Catskills
Posts: 185
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Do I ask his regular doctor about a metametrix test?
moon mountain mama is offline  
#13 of 14 Old 12-16-2009, 10:58 PM - Thread Starter
 
moon mountain mama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Catskills
Posts: 185
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yes I am very skeptical of the tests that culture stool samples/ In the summer I think I was infected with something also and I took probably 20 different stool sample tests and nothing came back positive. However, I had symptoms of some sort of infection whether it be bacterial or parasites in my intestinal tract. It is now 3 or 4 months later and I am still dealing with issues such as too much gas/bloating. It seems that I am either still infected or dealing with the havoc that a parasite took on my body. Either way I have not been diagnosed and gave up on traditional doctors and their diagnosis and still not sure what to do about it. I definately do not want this to happen to my son.
I am at a loss on what to do for him? I am very interested in this test Metametrix. How do we get it?

Any other advice from parents who have dealt with similar issue will be very helpful, thank you.
moon mountain mama is offline  
#14 of 14 Old 12-17-2009, 02:33 AM
 
sbgrace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 9,143
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
If you can do metametrix I bet you come back with one of the nasty parasites too. One is very consistent with what you describe (well two are really--d. fragilis and b. hominus).

I wouldn't mess with the regular cultures. They don't culture for all parasites and they have to catch a parasite in the particular sample that you collect. The metametrix is different. The downside is having to pay up front. It was worth every penny and bit of hassle for us.

Call metametrix tomorrow and see if they know of a doctor in their area who uses them. http://www.metametrix.com/content/Pa.../Referral.html Your son's doctor can order the lab. Some doctors will only order tests from labs they regularly use/are familiar with. My son's geneticist was open to this lab but doctors vary on their willingness to branch out.
http://www.metametrix.com/content/Di...sis-GI-Effects
On the bacterial side of things (if it turns out that is the issue rather than parasites) they will also test and tell you what the bugs in question are killed by (natural antibiotics like oregano or garlic as well as prescription options). They will also recommend treatment for the parasites. However for certain parasites you really have to do prescription I've found out. I am more than happy to share all I know if you find out what you're carrying. I've likely seen it here and if I haven't I've learned how to research this stuff and I'll help.

I really, really like metametrix. My doctor ordered just parasitology on my son's follow up stools and that was less expensive than the full GI effects. If you can't do Metametrix do Genova three day stool culture. It's a culture still so you can miss stuff. Two separate Genova cultures though, because each is a three day, is 80 to 90% likely to catch in my reading. And they do look for the parasites outside of giardia and the like (as in the ones that might be making you sick) just like metametrix. The difference is metametrix does DNA and so are far less likely to miss something. But some insurance work with Genova in my understanding if that works better financially.

Rachelle, mommy to 8 year old boys! 

My Blog-free homeschooling finds and my lesson plans and link to the new User Agreement

sbgrace is offline  
Reply

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off