help! is an anesthetic dangerous for my 2 year old - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 17 Old 08-30-2002, 05:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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hi, my little girl (29 months) has had kidney monitoring since she was born, due to one of her kidneys not working properly, cysts and a mega ureter. so anyhow, we are doing the hospital thing, vcugs, ivps, etc. i just want this to be over. and i think it will be soon. after her next major appointment, with the vcug and ivp. she bigger now and stronger compared to her last big appointment. her veins are very hard to find. the way she looks at me when they're poking her, i can't bear it. i don't want her to be tortured again, or struggle and make it worse. if they give her an anesthetic (i think thats what its called...when she goes under sleep) can it have any serious side effects?
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#2 of 17 Old 08-30-2002, 10:48 PM
 
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My DD just had to under go tests. The nurses used a numbing cream right on her arm about an hour before they were to put the IV in. It seemed to help, while not having the side effects of being sedated. Also be sure they are using something called the "butterfly" needle. It is much easier on hard to find veins.
Call ahead and talk to a nurse or Dr. to request these things. they make a big difference.

peggy
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#3 of 17 Old 08-31-2002, 06:56 AM
 
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I am also interested in the anesthetic question. Within the next 6 months my 3 year old is due to go in for an operation to straighten his cross eye. The thought of him "going under" really scares me.

Has anyone out there experienced this with their kids? And as the original poster asked (I don't want to take over this thread ), "can it have any serious side effects? "
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#4 of 17 Old 08-31-2002, 11:47 AM
 
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When my son was 8 months old he underwent 8 hours of surgery for bilateral clubfeet. I do not remember the anethetic they used to put him to sleep, but he seemed to have no ill effects. The hardest thing to do was not nurse for 6 hours before the surgery. I did anyway, I'm not going to let my baby go hungary.

He also underwent several hours of surgery to put tubes in his ears. I had to take him back and put the gas mask over his face because he was two then. and would not go back without me. I cried for 2 hours or more after watching his eyes roll back into his head when he went under.

Had to do the same thing again when he had dental surgery at age 5. He has autism and we could not get him to sit in a chair and allow the doc to even look into his mouth much less fix cavities. When he awoke from this one he took off running and promptly thru up. But still had no lingering aftereffects.

I hope these experiences help you.
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#5 of 17 Old 08-31-2002, 04:49 PM
 
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){{{hugs}}} My dd just had a bilateral ureteral reimplantation in June. It sucks. I know that some urologists and radiologists will sedate with versed prior to vcug and ivps testing. Mine don't, and I'm still on the fence about it anyway, although I'm more in favor of it than not. I'm totally with you on those tortured looks and howls of fright. For the actual surgery, she WAS given versed just before being put under. Oh my, was she ever high! She was (14months old at the time) waving and screaming HI!!! to anyone who would make eye contact with her, throwing herself upside down in my arms so that she could view the world from that perspective, and my little flower, who hates any person wearing scrubs, actually giggled, waved, and yelled BYE MAMA! when I handed her over to the anesthesiologist to be taken into the OR. So much for that angst. : Versed is akin to the twilight sleep thing that mamas used to get when they gave birth. It gives the taker of the drug just a bit of amnesia for things so it is supposed to cut down on the trauma of the ordeal.

You're right. General anesthesia is the most dangerous part of it all. I have a friend who is a nurse, and she's very very knowledgeable (it helps to have some medically mainstream friends ), and she recommended that I insist on scheduling things with the urologist according to her favorite pediatric anesthesiologist. It turned out that our urologist does just that anyway, so it was a nonissue. My friend's point in that is that most doctors have a favorite for a reason, and that generally it's because of the person's expertise and skill. Just so you know, my dd has a megaureter on the left side with a completely duplicated collecting system. She also had a ureterocele in the bladder that the megaureter was emptying into. When they reimplanted, they also reimplanted the right side as a just in case scenario thing. She has a little c-section looking scar that is hairline. If you want more info about the whole surgery ordeal, I'd be glad to talk more about it. I'm so glad it's over. Now we have one more (hopefully) u/s scheduled for next week, then a final (again, hopefully) vcug on October 1st, and then we're hoping to put this whole thing behind us.

Leah
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#6 of 17 Old 08-31-2002, 09:02 PM
 
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Just thought I would jump in and give my 2 cents worth... My 2.5 year old had some minor surgery (to remove what is called "prearricular cyst" I think that is how it was spelled. off her ear to pervent the infection from spreading) at 8.5 months old. They used the gas to put her asleep... They said that was the only way they did it for that young, we couldn't wait due to insurance change to get the other stuff... She did fine, took about a week to get her back 100% but not quite sure what that was from...

Side note: My mom has been told by several doctors that Vitamin C helps get it out of your system faster....
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#7 of 17 Old 09-04-2002, 05:29 PM
 
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I had heard that versed (not general or a local, somewhat different--look it up online) was good for VCUG (don't know what IVP is), and I had planned to ask for it when Eli had his 2nd VCUG at age 1. However, I asked my boss, a doc, about Versed, and she said she wouldn't give it to her kids at such a young age (and this is someone who has no problem giving her kids benadryl to help them sleep on a plane!). So, we did it without. Eli had his 1st VCUG at 2 months, and it was horrid!! So needless to say I was panicked at his one year. However, I have to say that it went a bit better. Yes, it definitely hurt him when they put the cath in, but after that he was fine. At his two month test, they had him strapped down (omigod how horrible!!!), but at the one year, he was allowed to sit up (I didn't know this in advance and was so panicked about strapping down this highly active always on the move kid) and so it really wasn't that bad. He forgot about it within minutes after we were done, I really think. However, I guess a two year old would be a little different--I have heard of a 3 yr old having trouble w/diaper changes after the "trauma" from the VCUG--which is where the amnesia from the versed would come in very handy. So, all this to say I guess you should check w/a doc you trust to be on the "conservative" side when it comes to giving toddlers meds, and see what they think about versed. Sorry, this was more rambling than it was helpful.
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#8 of 17 Old 09-05-2002, 11:05 PM
 
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My 2 1/2 y.o. son underwent general anesthesia 2 weeks ago. He had a bilateral otoplasty performed. I know how scary it is to see "that look", and how they behave when they are waking up. My son was a demon child - they kept injecting him with things trying to calm him down ( they started with morphine and worked their way up -- it took 5 tries and 2 hours to get 'him' back.)

Our good friend is doing her residency in anesthesia, and she was very supportive. She explained how they would much rather work on a child than on an adult. Kids are unbelievably resiliant, and it is really hard to damage them. You are doing your child a favour by dealing with these surgeries now. Please try not to feel bad. It is better to deal with it now than later.

My little guy has already forgotten most of everything. He even has told us that he wants to be a doctor so that he can give people bubblegum (antibiotics). He is even keeping on his bandages!

Hugs ((*))
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#9 of 17 Old 11-14-2002, 07:54 PM - Thread Starter
 
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thanks guys, you've helped quite a bit, mostly to know that other mothers go through the same stuff and all in all we just go with the flow of it. luna is going tomorrow for her testing, i'll just go by what my instinct tells me, all should work out fine. i think shes all better, so i'm hoping. thanks for your support, i'll let you know what happens, and i'd love to hear how your munchkins are doing.
wish us luck!
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#10 of 17 Old 11-15-2002, 03:17 AM
 
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Good luck!

And here's the update on my munchkin. She got the "all clear" in early October, so no more VCUG's for her! She will have one more IVP though in January because at her September u/s, it looked as if the hydronephrosis is actually correcting and they think her kidney function is improving! Nothing makes me happier than to tell that story. It makes me teary every time. Good luck again tomorrow, let us know how it goes!
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#11 of 17 Old 11-22-2002, 07:27 PM - Thread Starter
 
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okay here goes.........
well when it came to the anesthetic, when i got in to do the vcug, i forgot to ask! they didn't mention anything about it and luna went through it without it. that was the strangest thing, i was so worried about it then i just ran by instincts and i completely did not think of putting luna under. we go to sick kids hospital in toronto, a ways away for us, so i trust them and i trust that they didn't give it to her for a reason. sick kids hospital really knows what its doing. strange though.
luna was terrified by the whole thing, but we won't talk about that.
its over now.
we had the follow up to tell us how shes coming along and there is no more reflux to her kidney, so no more vcugs. her mega ureter is slightly smaller. but then there are some cysts in her kidney, and they're getting bigger, about 1.5cm (too big is 3cm, that will mean they have to drain them) they don't even know why the cysts are there.
so no more vcugs, ivps, or dmsas anymore.
just ultra sounds
i think.
i'm glad to hear that mommies and babies out there are using their strengths to get all better,
Liam, i'm glad your munchkin is doing better, you must be so happy!
i'm happy too, things are looking good i think.
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#12 of 17 Old 11-22-2002, 08:40 PM
 
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Good news! I hope the cysts stay put, or, better yet, go away all together! I'm sorry it was terrifying for your dd. It's so awful to watch and feel helpless, isn't it? But again, YAY on the reflux being gone!
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#13 of 17 Old 11-27-2002, 12:38 PM
 
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My son needs to have a large mole removed sometime soon and the pediatric plastic surgeon we spoke to said that general anesthesia is actually safer the younger you are. (We were debating waiting till he's older to get it removed.) That is, statistically, things are more likely to go wrong if you're older. Not sure if this is true, or why. It seems counterintuitive.
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#14 of 17 Old 11-27-2002, 11:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I don't know, chiezda, thats sounds unusual to me. For everything from contaminated water to medications, children are at greater risk in the safety arena.
I'm not a specialist in this area though, but i found a couple things that might help.
"Information available on anesthesia adverse outcomes suggests neonates are at higher risk than are older infants and, in turn, older infants are at greater risk than pediatric patients older than 2 years of age.21-28 The following age categories are recommended: 0 to 1 month, 1 to 6 months, 6 months to 2 years, and older than 2 years. Because of the anatomic, physiologic, and psychological differences between children and adults, additional differentiation of pediatric age groups for patients older than 2 years is recommended."
(GO TO:http://www.aap.org/policy/re9820.html )

"Although the relative increment with sevoflurane vs. other volatile anesthetics remains unclear, emergence delirium has "emerged" as a real clinical problem. Although it can be found with adult patients, it is particularly problematic in children."
(GO TO:http://gasnet.med.yale.edu/sa/2001/03/05.php )

Is your son's mole potentially dangerous?
My daughter has a hernia in her bellybutton since she was born, it looks like it might be a bit smaller, but if it doesn't shrink then she'll need an operation to fix it. Some doctors wait till they're 2 years old to fix it, some 3, some 4. It can cause problems but rarely does. I think we're going to wait on it.
Different doctors confict, its always good to get a second opinion, or third. Especially if what your doctor says is questionable. I'll see if i can find anymore info for you too.

And thanks LiamnEmma, I hope the cysts disappear too!
Maybe she'll tell them to get out of there!
It is awful to watch, being able to do nothing,but the best we can do is be strong, hope they understand, and be there for them,eh?
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#15 of 17 Old 11-28-2002, 09:49 PM
 
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Isissunsetblack,

2 doctors have told us that the mole has a 3% chance of becoming fatal melanoma.

We do plan to get a second opinion about anesthesia and the different types of surgery if possible -- looking into it.

Thanks for the information you found!
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#16 of 17 Old 11-29-2002, 12:02 AM
 
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Chiedza,

As someone who grew up having 2 very prominant moles on my face (one eraser head sized one on the side of my nose and one large hairy nevus, adult thumb nail sized on my right cheek), I would recommend that you have the mole removed. Kids can be cruel, and besides that, the younger the child, the less scaring.

I had to wait until I was 19 to have mine removed, and I WISH my parents would have had it dealt with earlier. That was one of the main reasons why we asked our plastic surgeon to move up my son's otoplasty surgery... And he has recovered wonderfully from it.

Good Luck!
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#17 of 17 Old 11-29-2002, 12:27 PM
 
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Actually, I don't know why I keep calling it a mole (habit, I guess). It's actually a birthmark and is technically called a nevus. It's quite large (takes up most of his lower leg) and multicolored and hairy. And potentially cancerous, as I said. We definitely want to get it removed but we're trying to find the best option. Supposedly all options require him to go under general anesthesia, but there are 3 different kinds of operations available. One would require him to go under 5 times but would heal the best. Another would require a skin graft from his butt or thigh but only one surgery. And the third would require a balloon in his leg that would be enlarged slowly over several months to create enough extra skin there to cover the area when they remove the birthmark. The second option seems like the best to my DH and me, but the surgeon said then the skin there would always be kind of soft. So we want to find out how soft and if this would prevent Coltrane from participating in any activities. We've been trying to call our regular doc to get her opinion but haven't reached her yet.
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