Moms dealing with elevated lead levels - Page 13 - Mothering Forums

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#361 of 626 Old 07-08-2007, 09:34 PM
 
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GooeyRN, can you tell me more about your Dyson? When I checked into vacuums the only vacuum I found to reliably remove lead dust was the Nilfisk family vac, so that is what we bought. The problem with most uprights is that even though they claim to be hepa, not all of the air is directed through the hepa filter. We owned an Oreck Hepa that was only 2 years old and I sold it and bought the Nilfisk for that reason.

TIA,

Ashlea
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#362 of 626 Old 07-08-2007, 11:19 PM
 
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GooeyRN, can you tell me more about your Dyson? When I checked into vacuums the only vacuum I found to reliably remove lead dust was the Nilfisk family vac, so that is what we bought. The problem with most uprights is that even though they claim to be hepa, not all of the air is directed through the hepa filter. We owned an Oreck Hepa that was only 2 years old and I sold it and bought the Nilfisk for that reason.

TIA,

Ashlea
Its the DC15 model. It is obviously working to remove lead, since dd's lead level dropped so much after using it for only 3 months. (dd was being checked every 3 months)
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#363 of 626 Old 07-08-2007, 11:34 PM
 
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Well, that's good to know. I love my Nilfisk, but the Dyson is more readily available, I'd imagine. We live in the city, so run into other lead abatement families, good to have another vacuum to recommend, kwim?
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#364 of 626 Old 07-09-2007, 01:17 PM
 
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I believe there is a federal law regarding landlords and lead paint, requiring that they notify you in writing before you move in of the lead paint. . . . so I believe the landlord will be responsible for the repairs. Get clicking over at epa.gov, and there is a toll free number with info. We have never sued the old landlord. . . . but we probably need to, considering we can't afford an expensive vacuum.

I want to proceed with further natural chelation methods, since I no longer believe that blood lead level is the only marker of metal toxicity. Our kids have it stored in their organs and bones. . . . there was another article in the paper today about childhood lead levels and adult violence and I have spent all morning crying, again. I am a writer, too, and MiriamJoyce's rather glib info-fishing post really got under my skin. Such things are too painful for me to write about in the moment.
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#365 of 626 Old 07-09-2007, 07:16 PM
 
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Thanks very much for the response AMum and provocativa. From our research landlords/owners are required to notify tenants about lead in pre-1978 built houses, whether it is known or unknown. But there is no teeth behind this law. If they don't all that can happen is the EPA can bug them to supply you with info, but not require them to abate. So, argh.

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#366 of 626 Old 07-18-2007, 02:47 PM
 
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While I am so glad to find this tread, I am horrified to be here.
We bought an old house in MA 2 yrs ago. Did we think there might be lead? Sure. Did we do anything about it? No.

I have a 4.5 yr old dd and a 1 yr old.
My dd was tested at 3, 6 months after we moved in and was within normal limits.
I thought "great, no lead and promptly forgot about it.
UNTIL, my ds who is now 1 was tested last week and came back at 14.
Now I am in total freak out mode. A lead detector guy was here all morning and there is lead paint everywhere including our front porches where the paint is clearly chipping.
I feel absolutely sick and dh is making as if it is no big deal at all.
We cannot just move out.
MOst of the paint is in fine condition and we do not open the windows.
Right now I am focusing on just preventing further lead exposure as much as possible, but I don't even know the first place to begin!

I am also anxiously awaiting my dd's results and am terrified what they will be. She SITS on that porch all the time. What the heck is wrong with me/ I feel like the most irresponsible parent in the world.
As sad as it is, I am glad my ds was "only 14" it could be a lot worse considering the exposure potential in this house.

Anyway, if anyone has any advice or just a huge hug I could use it!
THanks.
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#367 of 626 Old 07-30-2007, 02:12 PM
 
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i have a quick question about lead levels: is there such a thing as a ZERO? or does everyone have some lead in their bodies? (from air pollution, etc.)
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#368 of 626 Old 07-30-2007, 04:00 PM
 
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i have a quick question about lead levels: is there such a thing as a ZERO? or does everyone have some lead in their bodies? (from air pollution, etc.)
Good question. When Lucy was diagnosed, her lead was high enough that she was admitted to the hospital immediately. The pediatrician on staff that night had actually done extensive work in inner city Baltimore, which evidently has a very high rate of lead poisoning, so he was kind of a lead expert. (Lucky us, I guess.) Anyway, I asked him the same question. His response was, "Well, no amount of lead is 'normal' for a person to have in their body. That being said, this is New Jersey, which is a very toxic state. We generally don't see kids with zero lead levels, so we consider 3 to 6 to be normal." She's down to a level of 7 now, with a high of 47 last summer.

Stacey teaching teens to read & write... Daddy plays ska, DD1 (7/05) loves trees & princesses, & DD2 (3/10) loves mommy-milk! Please get your kids tested for lead.
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#369 of 626 Old 07-30-2007, 07:39 PM
 
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Anyway, if anyone has any advice or just a huge hug I could use it!
THanks.
Here is a huge hug.

You'll want to read the whole thread but here are the nuggets:

implement shoes off in the house. Wash hands before eating anything or when coming in from playing outside or after playing on the floor (it is in the dirt around the house). Get ahold of a nilfisk (or Dyson -see above posts) vacuum. High protein diet. Lots of cilantro will help get it out of the body. Highest absorbability is from breathing dust as opposed to eating lead contaminated stuff or absorbing through skin contact, or probably even drinking it. Go out on the porch with a few buckets and/or spray bottle and clean it top to bottom. Get everything wet a couple of times. Use detergent (it binds with the lead). Bag up the rags you used (do not run them in your washing machine as this will contaminate clothing, dipes, etc.). Put new sod down in the yard and put wood chips or rocks around the house immediately. Spray these down every once in awhile. Keep walkways to the doorways clean. Wipe floors down every day.

What else am I missing, mamas?
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#370 of 626 Old 07-30-2007, 07:53 PM
 
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implement shoes off in the house. Wash hands before eating anything or when coming in from playing outside or after playing on the floor (it is in the dirt around the house). Get ahold of a nilfisk (or Dyson -see above posts) vacuum. High protein diet. Lots of cilantro will help get it out of the body. Highest absorbability is from breathing dust as opposed to eating lead contaminated stuff or absorbing through skin contact, or probably even drinking it. Go out on the porch with a few buckets and/or spray bottle and clean it top to bottom. Get everything wet a couple of times. Use detergent (it binds with the lead). Bag up the rags you used (do not run them in your washing machine as this will contaminate clothing, dipes, etc.). Put new sod down in the yard and put wood chips or rocks around the house immediately. Spray these down every once in awhile. Keep walkways to the doorways clean. Wipe floors down every day.

What else am I missing, mamas?
Yes to all of this. Also, make sure your child's diet is high in calcium, vitamin C, and iron. Keep an eye open for hidden sources of lead, like vinyl mini blinds. Wash your child's hands constantly! Have a shoes-off house.


Stacey teaching teens to read & write... Daddy plays ska, DD1 (7/05) loves trees & princesses, & DD2 (3/10) loves mommy-milk! Please get your kids tested for lead.
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#371 of 626 Old 08-11-2007, 12:48 PM
 
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Acugirl, .
I understand feeling like an irresponsible parent. That is how I felt (still feel) when our DD1 had elevated lead levels three years ago. It was so overwhelming to have the Dept of Pub Health come into our house and tell us where all the lead is/was. I hope your DDs lead level comes back low.

I agree with pps about keeping the dust to a minumum and cleaning often.
Hugs,
Michelle
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#372 of 626 Old 08-11-2007, 01:30 PM
 
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:

That is so true! Having the health dept come in and interview me, and take samples from around the house. And then, my pediatrician was required by law to report all blood tests until her levels were in an acceptable range and they closed our case... very overwhelming, and really made me feel like such a shmuck.

Stacey teaching teens to read & write... Daddy plays ska, DD1 (7/05) loves trees & princesses, & DD2 (3/10) loves mommy-milk! Please get your kids tested for lead.
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#373 of 626 Old 08-11-2007, 10:59 PM
 
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Took Rowan for her wbv and got a blood draw. She is 32 mos now and we explained what was going to happen. Fortunately it was the good nurse, not the guy who couldn't get it last time after multiple sticks. Dh held her on his lap (dd, not the nurse) and I couldn't be there but I was watching from around the corner. Well, she didn't even cry. After it was over though she let out a wail, but for just a couple seconds. Haven't got the result back yet.

You mamas who have had your dc in the hospital, etc --I feel for you so much!
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#374 of 626 Old 08-14-2007, 02:42 PM
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I am a writer, too, and MiriamJoyce's rather glib info-fishing post really got under my skin. Such things are too painful for me to write about in the moment.
Hey, apologies. Looking back it does look rather glib, but I didn't mean it to. I think I was trying to hold myself distant from my own pain--I've certainly cried hours over this too. This is one of the few honest forums discussing the topic I've found and I very much appreciate it. I should have at least acknowledged that I know many people may not be up for rehashing the details and that I totally respect all the incredible work we are all putting in on this. (And, I've realized as I've been going through it, I shouldn't have taken an assignment on this topic while the experience was so fresh.) Anyhow, sorry 'bout that.
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#375 of 626 Old 08-14-2007, 11:31 PM
 
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Hey All,
My 9 month old came in at a 7 last week. He was a 2 at 6 months. We're testing every 3 months because this house is "hot". If it goes up much more, I want to move. DH doesn't want to move out of our charming old toxic neighborhood. I know it's a "normal" level but it wouldn't be that high if we didn't live in this house. If we were in the 'burbs, I'm sure it would be a 0 or 1 or "less than 2". We can't afford to take care of the problem here (total paint failure outside, peeling and dropping into our yard)d, but we can afford to move.

Why don't more people make a bigger deal of this?
Why does everyone think I'm crazy?
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#376 of 626 Old 08-15-2007, 07:44 AM
 
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Why don't more people make a bigger deal of this?
Why does everyone think I'm crazy?
hugs for you. I know. My DP thought I was absolutely nuts. he worried more about when I was going to stop breastfeeding (like THAT's gonna happen!)!
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#377 of 626 Old 08-15-2007, 09:48 AM
 
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Why don't more people make a bigger deal of this?
Why does everyone think I'm crazy?
Please don't flame me, because I don't take issues of race lightly (I'm a white woman, and constantly struggle with my assumptions). Anyway, I think the answer to your questions is that mainstream American culture thinks that lead poisoning is something that happens to poverty-stricken inner city African American kids (make it the 1970's instead of today, and it's even more believable). Anyway, I dealt with surprise from the health department and family and friends that it was happening to us, a suburban white middle class family.

FWIW, I'm thrilled that my daughter is at the level yours is now! That being said, I'd be more concerned, if I was in your shoes, that her level was going up.

Stacey teaching teens to read & write... Daddy plays ska, DD1 (7/05) loves trees & princesses, & DD2 (3/10) loves mommy-milk! Please get your kids tested for lead.
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#378 of 626 Old 08-16-2007, 09:36 PM
 
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stacey, i have been following your eloquent posts on another thread about lead-i like you! and yes i can tell you the state of kentucky had NO idea what to do with my middle class white lead poisoned baby, child of nurse mama! i think there latest plan is to ignore us, which is okay with me. I got the report of lead in our home a few months ago and it said we had to respond with our plan of action with in 60 days so i made a report outlining how we had addressed the lead (ChildGaurd paint and lots of wet mopping mostly, oh and we replaced the flooring in 3 rooms) that was 7 weeks ago and i have heard nothing, they are supposed to come and re-test the house. Frankly, as long as his levels comtinue to decrease i would prefer that they not. I am sure i probably missed something that he is unable to reach. we had a spike 2 months ago, his level was 9 and went up to 14, but it is down to 13 at his last test. about every other month we test i have had to fight with the lab people who want to do a fingerprick 'no, that is really considered more of a screening, ect, ect' last time i told the tech that and she said 'well......i've never heard that!" 'well, now you have : ' was what i wanted to say!
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#379 of 626 Old 08-18-2007, 06:50 PM
 
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While I am so glad to find this tread, I am horrified to be here.
We bought an old house in MA 2 yrs ago. Did we think there might be lead? Sure. Did we do anything about it? No....

Anyway, if anyone has any advice or just a huge hug I could use it!
THanks.


I live in MA too. Lead is inescapable here. Please try not to feel that this is your fault. The mixed messages are everywhere. Everyone says that lead is everywhere, the law says you have to remove it, but then people tell you to relax. We started lead abatement because we are landlords (a two family we live in) and because we were pursuing adoption. We know we might squeak by on the adoption with lead, but we also knew that it could stop the adoption in it's tracks if they found clear hazards and asked for in inspection. So we decided to remove it before our home study. Everyone thought we were crazy. Then ds's lead test came back high. Thankfully, we were on a waiting list for a contractor, so we got the paint out soon and ds's number came down.

Did ASAP do your inspection? They are really good about helping you find funding. We used a program called Get the Lead Out. We recieved $25,000 in a no interest loan. It was more paperwork than adopting our daughter, but the loan does not become payable until we sell our home.
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#380 of 626 Old 08-18-2007, 09:19 PM
 
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Here is the link for Get the Lead Out:

https://www.masshousing.com/portal/s...=2&cached=true

It looks like they have changed the requirements some.
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#381 of 626 Old 08-19-2007, 10:36 AM
 
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I have read through most of the posts - and thank you all for such valuable information.

DS & I moved into a house on July 1, an old house. The lead paint has been completely covered inside the house - I'm not worried about anything inside.

However a couple of weeks after we moved in they started the process of painting the outside, which included sanding the paint off to the bare wood. I was told by the landlord that it was being cleaned up and I did see the guys cleaning up at the end of the day. We are the first floor flat of a three story house and we come in through the front door, walking onto the porch which was sanded and painted. Though during the process we used the back door. The porch is now painted with the exception of the floor, it was not sanded or painted. I was fairly naive about lead issues until recently when I talked to my landlord about it. I asked if the porch had been cleaned properly to remove the lead, he said it had been swept and cleaned off with water. That day they then cleaned it again, I will be cleaning it tomorrow with the dishwasher detergent using the methods described here.

Until recently I haven't been as diligent as I should have been, because of ignorance. DS was tested between 12-18 months and his level was 0. I called the Dr. about this and they didn't seem overly concerned, said that he was old enough to process it better than an infant, and he would need to be putting lead dust covered things into his mouth in order to be exposed. Luckily I am pretty diligent about washing hands, but have become more diligent. I clean window sills regularly and we have become a no shoe house. I don't let ds play on the porch and he doesn't play in front of the house too much. I am going to call the Dr tomorrow and request a lead blood test though, which they told me they would do at my request.

I am hoping some of you can answer these questions;

1. How long before lead exposure will show up in a blood test?
2. How old were you dc's when they were exposed?
3. Is lead dust hazardous by inhaling it or only by getting it into you mouth?
4. Do older toddlers (ds will be 3 in Dec) really "process" lead better so they are less likely to get lead poisoning?


Thank you so much for all of this great info. I am going to get the ingredients today for the cilantro pesto just to be on the safe side.
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#382 of 626 Old 08-20-2007, 07:21 AM
 
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1- I don't know how long it takes for lead to show up in a blood test, but I think it appears rapidly. 2-birth to 18 months 3-inhaling lead is more toxic 4-three year olds do mouth stuff less than babies, so they ingest less. I would suppose that your doctor is referring to metallothionen production, I do not know at what age a child begins to synthesize it adequately. Some kids don't metabolize any metals well, hence the mercury and autism connection.
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#383 of 626 Old 08-21-2007, 01:34 PM
 
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I just wanted to post the article about this study on cleaning lead dust without high phosphate cleaners, for those who are interested:

http://www.physorg.com/news9091.html

Quote:
The researchers, led by Roger D. Lewis, Ph.D., CIH, of the Saint Louis University School of Public Health, tested how well various detergents removed lead from three common household surfaces: vinyl flooring, wood and wallpaper. They determined that all-purpose floor detergents containing no phosphate did just as well as a more expensive lead-specific product and trisodium phosphate (TSP), a less environmentally friendly substance. Lead-specific cleaners or TSP have long been recommended for lead removal.
I think this is really a case where officials and "experts" are just being dogmatic. They were always told that you needed a high phosphate cleaner, so they're going to keep repeating it, no matter what. Kind of like how so many pediatricians insist that all bf babies need iron and vitamin D supplements, regardless of how much evidence proves that they are wrong.
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#384 of 626 Old 09-04-2007, 08:47 PM
 
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What I read about age and lead was that babies absorb it at a high level, while adults absorb much less. Don't know when it changes, though.

I was told by an EPA person that TSP bonds to lead, making it neutral to humans. Not that it cleans it from a surface any more thoroughly, but it adds another form of protection from the lead, wherever it is (including in the water you use to clean with).

Well, here we go again. Dd's level was 7.4 at 1 yr, 6 something at 18 mos, and we got to the 2 yr appt. late (32 mos) and now it's 14. I feel so awful. I have been slack on the cleaning. I can't believe we didn't take her in sooner. What is wrong with me?

Now I'm wondering if dd's behavior is showing signs. We have a 3 mo baby and I have been limiting nursing for dd1, and I assumed her tantrums and days of constant whining were about those issues. Now I wonder if lead explains all the times she says she's sad, but doesn't know why. Today she woke in the middle of her nap and cried and said, "no, no, no . . ." and I said, "what are you saying no to?" and she said, "I don't know." Everyone says this is all just normal 2 yo stuff. ?????

Well, I'm sure the HD will answer all our questions for us. . . .
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#385 of 626 Old 09-05-2007, 09:31 PM
 
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What about silver plate utensils that have the silver worn off? Do those have lead in the core?

I'm freaking out. Everywhere I look I see stuff that I'm afraid the HD person who comes to visit will think is bad. (mostly not lead related) I don't know how I can keep the house cleaner than I do. I know other people do, I just don't think I can.
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#386 of 626 Old 09-05-2007, 11:52 PM
 
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I wouldn't count on the health dept. to answer all questions, the ladies here certainly weren't up on all their training. I am a terrible housekeeper too, though better than when the nightmare started, if I was going to get the house clean, the kids would have to be chained to the tv, or something equally horrific. As for your dd's symptoms, that is the bitch of this syndrome- it exacerbates some normal conditions (violence, lack of impulse control, sleep disturbances). . . . my mom will say point blank that she sees no effect of the lead on dd1 (now 4), but then she says that she can't take her anywhere because of bolting away and other such impulse control issues. Arrrgh! WTF, ya think the two things might be related? Nah! Anyhoo, in this day and age your dd's level could also have gone up from a toy. TSP does bond to lead (as does the phosphate in dish detergent) but I have also read that dishwasher detergent is usually the most toxic thing in yer average household. . . so tsp (being trisodium phosphate) would be even more toxic. I feel like there would be residue left inside my house. . . . but I also feel like scrubbing the outside sidewalks with it, though I know it's so bad for the environment. My neighbors would surely enjoy watching me scrub the sidewalk. . .
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#387 of 626 Old 09-06-2007, 12:34 AM
 
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I wouldn't count on the health dept. to answer all questions, the ladies here certainly weren't up on all their training.
Oh, that was a bit of sarcasm that didn't read on the screen.

We live in a county that has 1/3 the population it had 100 yrs ago. So I think about 80% of the houses are pre-1977, but it seems like we're the only ones who have this problem. The HD nurse talked to dh and referred to one case she had seen some time ago. The Parents as Teachers educator thought it was rare. I can't see how every kid in the school district doesn't have it. I just want to ask, why us?

Baby fussing, gotta go.
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#388 of 626 Old 09-06-2007, 01:20 PM
 
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well ladies. dd goes in for her latest lead test on monday.. lets hope it went down a lot!!!

Waldorf mama to Autumn DD 9/05 and my Spring DD 4/08 Winter baby due 2/11
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#389 of 626 Old 09-12-2007, 10:54 AM
 
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Hi ladies! I have just finished reading through the ENTIRE thread and want to thank you all for sharing such valuable information.

My dd is 14.5 mos and had a heel stick done at her 12 mo appt. I just found out the result last week, which was a 9. Her 15 mo appt is scheduled for 10/5 and I have requested a venous draw. I am considering having them give me a lab order to have it done sooner. If I go in to the office to have it done, they will charge me for an office visit.

Our house was built in 1925 and we repainted most of it before we moved in. The bathroom was under construction from before DD was born till she was about 4 months old. Then a few months later we demo'ed a decrepit garage in the backyard. We had never spent much time out there, but with the summer, we got a little pool that DD loves to play in. The whole outside of the house has peeling paint and cracked stucco. We also have a dog that tracks in dirt and DH is bad about that too. There are also some plastic blinds, which may be vinyl, and those cheap roll-up shades that could be vinyl.

Also, DD spends 1 day a week at my parents' house (where I grew up), which is from 1918. I mentioned my concerns to my mom, and she thought the cleaning recommendations were crazy. (She didn't even think I should have the test done!) She said those were for people with bad hygiene and we keep our house clean (what?). She thinks it's coming from the water. We use a water filter, but they don't - which is crazy. They used to SELL water filters, and even tested people's water to convince them to buy them. But they never tested theirs! And, their house is filled with dust and peeling/chipping paint!

Where to begin??!! It's so overwhelming. I work FT (4 day week), and most of the cleaning is done by our nanny when she is here Mon-Wed. She mops, but not to the specs mentioned here. I don't know what to do first. Buy test strips? Get the blood draw? Test the water? Clean the floors? Thanks in advance for your help!

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leila1213 is offline  
#390 of 626 Old 09-12-2007, 06:15 PM
 
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PM me if there is anyone that wants some TSP. I have a whole box I'm not going to use.
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