Healing the gut tribe : August - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 348 Old 07-28-2005, 11:58 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hi ,
If you are new to this tribe please check out our original thread :

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...2&page=1&pp=20

We are mamas who are on a gut healing path for ourselves or our little ones through diet and natural supplements. The diet most of us are using is the SCD diet (again refer to the above link for explanation) or the Maker's Diet. Some are using the SCD with adaptations from the Maker's Diet, but still SCD legal. We're learning as we go and offer support and our experiences. To view some of our children's stories visit :

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=260393


http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=313758


http://www.mothering.com/discussions...hlight=autism&


Healing the gut is SLOW, but it can be achieved.

I hope some of you may find this thread helpful .

Peace,
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#2 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 12:59 AM
 
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I'm just replying to subscribe. We aren't on the SCD, but we are going to do the maker's diet ... basically it just confirms what I've been learning anyways about how important it is to heal the gut in order to get the rest of your health in order. So, I am interested to read of all of your journeys.

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#3 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 01:10 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I actually agree with the Maker's diet more than the SCD, but MD is not toddler friendly. The SCD is better for dd, but I have incorp. certain things from the MD into her diet and am seeing the benefits. I added 50:50 fresh carrot juice and switched her cheese from organic to raw goat milk organic. I also changedher 24 hour yoghurt to goat milk yoghurt and am trying to find a place near me to buy raw goat milk to make the yoghurt from that. I just ordered the 30 hour raw organic goat milk yoghurt from www.whiteegretfarm.com and might just stick with that.

Keep us informed on your progress !

Peace,
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#4 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 03:56 AM
 
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Is there a big taste difference between goat milk yogurt/kefir and cow milk yogurt/kefir? I have never had goat milk, but noticed the MD calls for only goat milk yogurt the first two weeks and was wondering about that. The only goat milk that I think I can get ahold of is ultra pasteurized and I've only seen it in quarts at Wild Oats - I would go through about 6-8 quarts in one week. As it is I make our yogurt with organic cow's milk and then mix it in smoothies with raw cows milk. I want to stick as closely as we can to the MD, not only to heal anything going on with us that we don't even know about (I'm sure we (dh & I) are over ran with candida), but also so we can accurately tell others about it too. So far the only issue I can see will be the goat milk vs. the cows milk for the first two weeks.

I'm also hoping to make it as kid friendly as I can for my boys ... a lot of what is allowed the first two weeks they already like, but they will have to do without somethings and then adapt to others (for instance, no breads or tortillas at all, and after the first few weeks, learning to like sprouted bread and whole wheat sourdough). It'll be easier for my younger son than my older son ... thankfully I'm pretty sure they are both rather healthy (don't get sick and both bf), so hopefully by flubbing a little for them, they will still reap the health benefits in the long run without having to notice too big of a difference in their daily eating. (What am I thinking ... they are kids ... they barely eat as it is!!! :LOL)

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#5 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 02:38 PM - Thread Starter
 
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My little wonders - What a good mama you are to do all this for your kiddos !

Goat milk is much easier to digest than cow milk. Raw milk has enzymes that have not been killed by being pasteurized. You can see how both these things would make digestion and absorbtion much easier for a babe with impaired and damaged digestion. You may recall that Rubin has three stages of the diet in the back of his book. He tells those who are sick or with digestive problems that it is imperative to start in phase one which calls for raw goat milk yoghurt. Those who are healthy and already eat well may start the diet at stage three which allows for cow milk and suggests raw, but does not demand it. It all depends on how impaired your digestion is and how much help you need in digestion. I think that goat milk does taste a little different, but not much. I have been told that the milk will have a funky taste if the female goat is kept with a male goat, but will taste like cow milk if only female goats are kept together. Don't even ask where I got that tidbit of useless info .
When your boys can eat grains you might want to check out Food For Life Ezekiel 4:9 tortillas. They are flourless and completely sprouted so much easier to digest. I just wish they didn't have sprouted soy . Not sure about soy for myself and dd.
I know that dd's pancreatic enzymes were low in January five months before we started the diet due to the CDSA stool test from Great Smokies Lab. Since switching her from cow to raw goat cheese and yoghurt she has make much quicker progress.
I need to do some research to see if the raw goat milk cheese and milk has good bacteria in it in addition to the beneficial enzymes. I called alta Dena goat farm that makes the cheese I get from the local HF store and asked that question, but the girl was clueless and could not even understand my question . More research to do. I feel like I'm neglecting one of your other questions. I will repost if that is the case. Please bear with my .

Peace,
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#6 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 02:46 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I am just cutting and pasting the following response I wrote to a mama who is really on the fence about starting the SCD for her babe. I have tried to encourage mamas to read the book - you cannot make an informed decision off other mama's advice and stories. The most powerful thing you can do is educate yourself! This diet may not be the best thing for you or dd/ds. You may want to add things from the Makers Diet to SCD as I did, but you won't know unless you read the books and research for yourself. Empower yourselves - READ!!!


You are the one who has to make this decision and you have the tool to do it in your hands. I thought the diet was rediculous and returned the book to the library after just looking at the recipes in January. Only when I heard of someone that it had helped with digestive problems did I check it out again and was DESPERATE to read it. After reading it EVERYTHING that dd had gone through for the past 10 months made sense. No one could have talked me out of placing her on the diet at that point even though it meant giving her SO many foods that I thought she was allergic to. DD was not eating, vomiting 3 times a day and only keeping 9 oz down per day. She was in the NEGATIVE 30% on the weight chart. So, I felt very desperate to help her.
I think the most powerful thing you can do as a parent other than show your child unconditional love and acceptance is to educate yourself so that you can stand behind the decisions that you make for your child knowing that they were the best decisions you were capable of making. To know that you have done all you can in your power for him/her is so very important.
I regret not doing research into vaccines before dd was born and I will always regret that! I accecpted what I had learned in nursing school instead of doing my own homework even though my Mothering subscription was routinely carrying an article connecting vaccines to autism. I always thought "Oh I eat organic whole foods, have no bad habits (i.e. smoking or drinking), and excercise routinely so my baby will never get autism : ." The hindsight of the foolish is 20:20 when their eyes are opened .
Please just read the book and then with all the mama's wisdom and love you have for your babe decide what is best for him/her. I really do know that this is a very hard decision for you to make and this is the best advice I know to give. You are a wonderul mama or you wouldn't be doing all this searching. The diet may not be the best thing for him/her right now. Trust yourself!!!
Forgive me if I have been too harsh. I try to be very careful about giving advice and just try to share my experiences and point parents to the resources they need to make informed decisions. I can't stand it when people try to shove info in your face or use scare tactics. Know that I meant well even if you found this reply offensive.

Peace and ,
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#7 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 03:27 PM
 
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Thank you so much for all your information Moneca! It is like finding a gold mine! Thank God that we are not in desperate need (at least as far as we can "tell") of healing, but I am sure there is stuff going on that we don't even know about. I am so happy to hear how well your dd is doing ... may she continue to heal and thrive!

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#8 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 03:57 PM
 
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So we are on day two of the diet, but I guess we aren't doing it 100%. Selkie is still nursing so it will never be an all the way thing, but even the changes we have made are making an absolute difference. Selkie ate an entire egg this morning and part of a chicken pancake for lunch! Quillian is also doing it (just starting him today) and I'll let you all know how that goes. He has some gut issues, but you'd never know if you didn't look really closely. I'm hoping to see a big chenage in both of them. I'm toying with the idea of doing it myself, hoever I have been vegan for awhile and don't know if I could eat meat : I have digestive issues myself which got 99% better on the eat to live diet, but maybe this is th final 1%. I'm really thinking about it. How many of you have chosen to do this with their kiddos?
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#9 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 04:12 PM
 
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hi i feel like i have a similar problem as you guys but follow a different diet. i don't like "diets" but a pain that i was having in my stomach went away after quitting all meat but fish (trying to eat things that are easy to digest). i noticed it flared up whenever i ate a lot of meat so here i am. i went to the dr and he did say it was something with my stomach but put me on a medical trial of some medicine to lower the acid in my stomach. i am not taking it b/c it just doesn't sit well with me. ever since i started eating this way i have no pain in my side!!! i also just got a yogurt maker and hope that will help.

i don't expect anyone to know what is wrong with me. sometimes i wonder if it was an ulcer b/c i was under a lot of stress. took some motrin and excedrin out of true necessity and i rarely take those things. i feel that as long as i'm not having pain in my side my body is telling me i am doing something right. i hope to avoid any medicine or a GI exam. yikes!

mountainmom, that probiotic thread is long. why don't we start a new thread about making homemade yogurt?
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#10 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 04:56 PM
 
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I just posted this on the "old" thread on the allergies forum before I had read all the posts and realized you all had moved! Awesome info here! I'll add a little more to my post...
DD's birthday was Monday (July 25) and JANE... Happy Birthday!

I'd been trying for a week to make the 24 hr SCD yogurt from goat milk but had never gotten the temp right, so ended up making the frosting for DD's cake out of organic Wallaby yogurt, Marscapone cheese (my natural foods store won't order the Farmer's or dry curd cottage cheese), and agave nectar. It tasted awesome on the carob cake I made from a recipe from the MDC nutrition forum (not SCD legal). DD didn't want cake...but of course I ate some and I also have been eating the chocolate mousse cake we bought from a local bakery. Not a sign of ezcema on her, just some red around the anus. I'm very grateful I can enjoy foods like that but want to limit my consumption for her sake and mine--I know they aren't the healthiest.

Hi everyone,

Yes, this thread is great and it is great to see so much activity on it. I've heard a lot about the maker's diet but have yet to investigate it. I do have Joseph Mercola's book, "Dr. Mercola's Total Health Cookbook and Program." He advocates a kind of "eat for your type" diet-not blood type, but based on "metabolic type,"
which you determine based on a questionnaire. The forward of the book is by the author of the Maker's Diet, and Dr. Mercola advocates the Maker's Diet quite a lot on his website, so I imagine the diets are similar. However, Mercola's diet is not like the SCD diet at all. Mercola is into raw dairy, beef, and eggs. Similarly the Nourishing Traditions author advocates feeding babies raw egg... I tried that w/ Jasmine at about age 9 mo and she threw up shortly thereafter! Mercola doesn't recommend eating grains, and Nourishing Traditions says only eat grains if they are properly soaked... and of course there are no grains whatsoever on the SCD. I can't imagine that the SCD would help someone loose weight-as replacing grain based flours with nut based flours would add more calories/fat into the diet.

DD's digestion has certainly improved-whole food pieces used to come out undigested in her stool, but not anymore. I simply attribute that to age (she just turned one). She really doesn't get the eczema anymore, even if I eat the "wrong" foods-for which I'm very grateful. I think she got the eczema at 5 months because her system could not handle what I was eating. I think my digestion was poor from being on antibiotics for a month shortly after her birth, for both a breast infection and a retained placenta, not using probiotics, and eating a lot of chocolate and baked goods. Her digestive system, not being fully mature, of course, couldn't handle all the foreign proteins and toxins(?). Yes, I now see it was due to food sensitivity-not allergy per se.

In August I'm doing a consultation with a nutritionist I've been pretty impressed w/ (she knew what the SCD was!) to get her take on things!
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#11 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 09:07 PM
 
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Hey Sarah, I'm so glad to hear you are Jasmine are doing better!

We are still not 100% SCD. DS is still addicted to his rice milk, and seeing as we've only just weaned, I'm not pushing it for the next week or so. I'm also going to find it hard to give up my raw milk kefir (made from Body Ecology starter powder) seeing as I've noticed some very positive changes from it. I guess we are both just being stubborn! But since cutting all grains out of my diet, I can definately feel the benefit. Even with adding honey and more fruit.

The Body Ecology Diet is also for healing the gut, and advocates only a few grains: quinoa, millet, amaranth and buckwheat, which supposedly do not feed the yeast b/c they are more like seeds. Also red skinned potatoes. The SCD says this is rubbish. It's so weird that they have been developed for the same thing, yet diametrically opposed on many issues. Also stevia... the SCD says it's got a chemical structure like a steriod and should be avoided, the BED uses with impunity.

Enough to make you go completely

I'm ordering the Maker's Diet from my library, been meaning to read for a while now so I'll let you know my thoughts when I get a chance to read.
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#12 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 10:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Well, first I'm mountainmon. While I would love to be mistaken for Coleen a.k.a. mountainmom ( she is a master herbalist and VERY wise mama who helped and encouraged me quite a bit over the last year ) I suppose I should make the distinction.

Elisabeth - I'm happy to hear things are going so well. You're a wonderful mama to try everything in your power to help Selkie . Don't stop breastfeeding. I believe that it is more healing to the gut than anything. I mean, look I'm paying 50.00 per 16 oz. of cow colustrum to heal Sierra's gut. You have the real thing for free !

Nicole - There is so much info in the probiotic thread, not to mention ALL the wonderful links. I'm not qualified to start a thread that could compare to that one. It is lengthy. Jane has been at this longer than I have and has done much more research. She may be up for that daunting task :LOL .

Sarah - So good to hear from you again. My chiro told me that it was dangerous to eat raw eggs because there was something called biotin in them that our bodies could not break down and could cause damage. I have no idea what biotin is or if that statement is true. I will try to do some research.
Sounds like you are piecing together a healthful and realistic way of eating from different specialists' ideas of the perfect meal plan. I'm just trying to use my common sense and experience to figure this all out. I don't think SCD is really healthy, but it IS healing Sierra's gut. There is some really important stuff that she misses out on like raw foods (esp. dairy IMO)and eating organic whole foods.
It is wonderful that DD is doing so well!

To everyone. Please learn from my mistakes this past week. First I tried placing Sierra on some probiotics with the HSO from the Makers Diet. I saw that there was barley and fermented maple syrup or molasses in the mix. I figured that the good of so many organisims would outweigh the negative effect of just a little illegal food source. WRONG :. I saw a more cranky dd and more putrid smelling stools again for a couple days . I know that aloe is healing to the gut. I bought some organic aloe juice and slipped about 1/2 an oz in dd's grape juice today. The eczema on her ears burst forth within an hour of consuming it and she had a most putrid smelling diarrhea a few hours later . Ends up aloe is on the illegal list - would have taken me a minute to check instead of being so convinced in my own head that it had to be legal. Oh well, she is doing wonderfully despite my mistakes .

Peace to all ,
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#13 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 10:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Elisabeth and Amy - Jane and I have been discussing the whole idea of BM and the SCD trying to figure out an answer for both of you. There is just NOTHING on it in the book. Jane did find the following post on www.pecanbread.com :

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group.../message/26338

I realize that you may not belong to pecanbread.com so I have just cut and pasted the whole post below. Remember that we do not know the author and can not claim any of it as true. I thought it might help .


From: "iwrf" <welovetyandkiona@...>
Date: Wed Dec 1, 2004 5:53 pm
Subject: Re: Starting SCD with allergic breastfed baby iwrf
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Hi,

Yes! SCD should be wonderful for both of you!

I have a special interest in this area, I have worked with lactation
for many years and SCD for a few. Let me explain this the best I
can, to help you understand how breastfeeding and the SCD interact.

You are the primary person who needs SCD, in addition to your son.
Unfortunately, health care providers are not tuned in to the
digestive health of the mother most times when we are pregnant, and
don't recognize a mother with a "leaky gut." As the mom, we then
pass these whole undigested proteins into our milk and give our
breastfeeding infants the same digestive environment that we have
(which we are often unaware of), which can create "allergies" and
eczema, because it is like they are eating these whole foods from
birth, and their immature immune systems can't handle this. Simply
put, at this point, especially since 90% of his nutrition still
comes from you, his digestive health mirrors yours.

As far as the breastmilk is concerned, PLEASE keep breastfeeding!
This is truly the best thing you can do for yourself and your child,
and you will both benefit together as you both become healthier. How
wonderful that you have found a resource like SCD to help you both
heal! The especially important part of your milk right now (aside
from the bonding experience which is essential) are the
immunoglobulins present in it. There is Secretory IgA, which comes
through all the time and is helping to tame some of his allergic
responses, and there are specific immune proteins generated at other
times. For instance, if he is exposed to a germ of some type, he
passes this through your nipple to you. The very next feeding,
immune complexes are made (only in the breast, they don't go
systemic for you) and are passed back to him to help him fight
whatever he's been exposed to. (Nature's pretty amazing, eh?!)

(If he is still getting this much nutrition from breastfeeding,
chances are he is slightly anemic and thin. As long as your health
care provider is monitoring this, it shouldn't turn into a big
problem. The important thing for him to learn from foods right now
is to experience and be comfortable with different textures, long
term exclusive breastfeeders can end up with texture issues.)

Lactose in breast milk is not the issue here. Babies have something
called salivary amylase, which helps them start breaking down sugars
in their mouths. This disappears after a year of age if not
breastfeeding, or when breastfeeding is no longer the major source
of nutrition, whichever comes later. Because of this enzyme, lactose
is broken down most of the way before it hits the small intestine.
Lactose is not the primary problem here, it is the whole proteins
leaking through your gut barrier which later pass into your milk.
What SCD will do is help heal your gut so you stop passing proteins
through for him to react to, which in turn will help heal his gut.

If you can be more specific with the allergies he has, there are
many people on this board who can help you accommodate those
allergies and still be very successful on SCD. I have worked with
SCD with many folks, and with breastfeeding moms of allergic babes,
and have not yet found a way around eliminating allergens completely
from both of your diets for at least a short period of time.
Otherwise he won't be able to heal completely.

Good luck with everything, sounds like you are choosing the right
paths to help heal your son. It's not easy, but can be very
rewarding. Feel free to email me if you need to.

Namaste,
Anne
PA who uses SCD
on SCD about 3 years
mother of Kiona, almost 4, healed from many GI problems, down from
over 40 food allergies to 7, no longer ASD
mother of Justice, 1, down from over 20 food allergies to 4
stepmother of Tyler, 14, GFCF, no longer ADD

Hope this helps ,
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#14 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 10:52 PM
 
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Moneca,
It's raw egg whites that inhibit biotin absorption. Raw egg yolks are very beneficial. http://www.mercola.com/2005/feb/9/raw_eggs.htm

Yeah I have the Garden of Life HSO's too ... a nice big $45 bottle of it sitting in my fridge irritating me. I've heard fabulous things and bad things about them. Of course I heard the bad things after I bought them :

Of course the crankiness and putrid stools could have been die-off. Or not. Actually it's kind of crazy how a lot of symptoms are commonly explained as "die-off" but is it really that or intolerance? Personally I find that if I eat perfectly, I feel better, not worse. Don't know if that's good or bad.

As long as we are sharing, DS had some duck with me 2 days ago and he didn't digest it well. Pooped 3 times the next day and of course Mr. Independent wouldn't let me change his diaper right away. Preferred to muck around in it and grind it in by riding his car. Got a bullseye rash. Mama Smarty Pants decided to use aloe vera on it and he screamed . Poor baby. Had to resort to nasty Desitin, but the rash is gone in a day.

So this is where we are now:

DS's poops are 99% firm and well digested for the most part, even on our previous lots of rice diet. It's mostly yeast/sugar sensitivity we are working on now, to heal his gut for good. He (and I) really cannot tolerate sugar, potatoes, wheat, etc. And I suspect that he is still allergic to dairy but I've been hesitant to do a full on test of it.

And as I have noticed insomnia and anxiety in myself and also DS from food reactions, that is my ultimate goal with him.... to fix his gut so he can calm down. Besides a normal toddler obsession with "no" he is very focused during the day, it's just when it's time to sleep he gets jittery and fights it like there's no tomorrow. It's stressful, exhausing and time consuming for DH and I. He's been this way since he emerged from the womb. Plus frequent nightaking, DS has slept through the night maybe 10 times in his life. Lately I've been supplementing with magnesium since that works so well with me and it seems to be helping him. Sometimes.

And of course after reading SCD knowledge on bifidus...
http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.i...kb/bifidus.htm
... I wonder if the loads of Baby Jarro he has consumed for over a year did him more harm than good (his stool sample showed tons of bifidus but no acidophilus growth). But it did get rid of the diarrhea so who knows.

This is a very interesting article regarding gut health, vaccines, immune response and autism.
http://www.autismanswer.com/articles...itotoxins.html
I've been looking to the knowledge of the autism community more and more... not just for the mercury issue... but those kids almost always have damaged guts and there's lots to learn from them.

One quote stood out:

Quote:
Another complicating factor in the whole vaccine process is the common practice of acetaminophen (i.e.tylenol) administration prior to, and following vaccination of children. Acetaminophen has been shown to deplete glutathione levels, which are critical for detoxification in the body. Between acetaminophen administration and mercury it would lead to a severe depletion of already low glutathione levels.
No wonder our current generation of kids have messed up immune systems.

And also, I'm thinking about doing a cleanse now that DS has just weaned. Any recs?

Considering The Master Cleanse. Hey, if I use honey instead of maple syrup, it's SCD legal :LOL
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#15 of 348 Old 07-29-2005, 10:54 PM
 
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Thanks for posting that about SCD and bf'ing Moneca, as I read it again, it makes a lot of important points.
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#16 of 348 Old 07-30-2005, 12:26 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Jane - very interesting article on autism. Oh, the bullet we both were blessed to dodge . My dh tried master cleanse for about 3 days a few years ago. He thought he was going to die so he broke it too soon. Before you decide on a cleanse read the makers diet. he has some suggestions in there. Thanks for the info on biotin. yes, it could have been die-off. Sierra had the exact same bifidus 4+ and lack of any other good bacteria in her CDSA. She had also been on Baby Jarrow for months. I wonder...

I would be glad to reveal my cheap, crazy, and perfect way of making 24 hour yoghurt if anyone needs help. It took me 5 weeks to find a way of making it without oveheating and killing the good guys. I make org cow for DH and I. Sierra gets org goat. Would love to make org raw goat if I could find the raw milk closer to me. I drove 2 hours last fall to buy some, but that is a bit of a haul.

Peace,
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#17 of 348 Old 07-30-2005, 07:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mountainmon
I would be glad to reveal my cheap, crazy, and perfect way of making 24 hour yoghurt if anyone needs help.
That would be great, Moneca! I did finally invest in a heating pad which seems to be the right temp-I was going to wrap it or drape it around the container and see!

That was a great article on breastfeeding!

Jane, do you feel better on the SCD as opposed to what you were doing right before that?

My dd also fights sleeping at times, and I've noticed I sleep better when I eat mellower foods... so I'm sure there is a connection!
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#18 of 348 Old 07-30-2005, 10:57 PM
 
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Must Read Article

Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAPS) in children
http://www.i-c-m.org.uk/journal/2004/nov/a01.htm

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Gut flora is something we do not think much about. And yet the number of functions the gut flora fulfils is so vital for us that if some day our digestive tract got sterilised we probably would not survive.

Well-functioning gut flora is the right hand of our immune system. The beneficial bacteria in the gut ensure appropriate production of different immune cells, immunoglobulins and other parts of the immunity. But, most importantly, they keep the immune system in the right balance. What typically happens in a person with gut dysbiosis is that two major arms of their immune system, Th1 and Th2, get out of balance, with Th1 becoming underactive and Th2 becoming overactive. As a result the immune system starts reacting to most environmental stimuli in an allergic or atopic kind of way.

The mixture of toxicity in each child can be quite individual and different. But what they all have in common is gut dysbiosis. The toxicity that is produced by the abnormal microbial mass in these children establishes a link between the gut and the brain. That is why it is logical to group these disorders under one name: the Gut and Psychology Syndrome (GAP Syndrome). The GAP children can present with symptoms of autism, ADHD, ADD, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, dyslexia, dyspraxia, schizophrenia, depression, sleep disorders, allergies, asthma and eczema in any possible combination. These are the children who fall into a gap in our medical knowledge.

Any child with a learning disability, neurological or psychological problems and allergies should be thoroughly examined for gut dysbiosis. Re-establishing normal gut flora and treating the digestive system of the child has to be the number one treatment for these disorders, before considering any other treatments with drugs or otherwise.
Dr. Campbell-McBride cured her child of learning disabilites with diet and uses the SCD in her practice. I'm trying to locate the book she wrote, Gut and Psychology Syndrome. It is published in the UK and only available on her website and at www.amazon.co.uk
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#19 of 348 Old 07-30-2005, 11:08 PM
 
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Yes, Sarah, I can completely tell the difference using SCD... it's better than my previous diet of no sugar, limited fruit, no juice but still eating non gluten grains. I didn't believe it until I tried it.

SCD uses fruit and honey but no grains/corn/potatoes at all. Fruit and honey are monosaccarides and more easily digestible. The sugars are absorbed before they reach the large intestines. More complex carbs like sugar, grains, etc. in a damaged gut are not fully digested and end up fermenting in the intestine and becoming food for the yeast and bad bacteria...which then grow and make digestion even worse. Thus the name, 'The Vicious Cycle'.

Re: Making Yogurt

I'm a wimp, I use a machine... the EuroCuisine from WilliamsSonoma.com. It comes with individual jars but I also use a pyrex glass bowl that I found fits it exactly. I use either a few tablespoons yogurt or Yogourmet as a starter.

However, I may try to rig up a "Moneca Special" with a heating pad b/c I would like to be able to make more than a qt. at at time.
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#20 of 348 Old 07-30-2005, 11:22 PM
 
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More on Breastfeeding and The Gut

Actually that post above that mentions amylase: the enzyme that digests carbs is not all correct.... breastmilk itself contains it. And the baby's pancreas does not start to produce it until after 6 months.

Quote:
Trivia: Ever wonder why cereal mixed with breastmilk doesn't stay thick? Breastmilk contains amylase, which is an enzyme that digests carbohydrates. The longer the mixture sits, the thinner it will get!
http://www.kellymom.com/nutrition/so...rst-foods.html

I have always known that the several bottles we gave DS during his first few days of life contributed to his gut problems. (His hematocrit levels were high, bf'ing was going great, but he needed more fluid.)

If I knew then what I know now I would have asked a bf'ing friend for some of her milk, or demanded banked milk. Again, this is sooooooo common. It's not a wonder that babies today have increased immune system problems.

The Case for the Virgin Gut: Even the Occasional Bottle of Formula Has Its Risks
http://breastfeed.com/resources/articles/virgingut.htm

Supplementation of the Breastfed Baby: "Just One Bottle Won't Hurt"-- or Will It?
http://www.massbfc.org/formula/bottle.html

Delaying Solids
http://www.kellymom.com/nutrition/so...ay-solids.html
Quote:
Delaying solids decreases the risk of food allergies.
It is well documented that prolonged exclusive breastfeeding results in a lower incidence of food allergies.

From birth until somewhere between four and six months of age, babies possess what is often referred to as an "open gut." This means that the spaces between the cells of the small intestines will readily allow intact macromolecules, including whole proteins and pathogens, to pass directly into the bloodstream.This is great for your breastfed baby as it allows beneficial antibodies in breastmilk to pass more directly into baby's bloodstream, but it also means that large proteins from other foods (which may predispose baby to allergies) and disease-causing pathogens can pass right through, too.

During baby's first 4-6 months, while the gut is still "open," antibodies (sIgA) from breastmilk coat baby's digestive tract and provide passive immunity, reducing the likelihood of illness and allergic reactions before gut closure occurs. Baby starts producing these antibodies on his own at around 6 months, and gut closure should have occurred by this time also.
And we started cereal at just after 5 months b/c DS was a big baby and having sleeping problems.... of course everyone, doctor included, said it would help him sleep. A week or so later, eczema appeared.
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#21 of 348 Old 07-31-2005, 12:02 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Jane - I haven't read the whole article on the gap, but am looking forward to it. The clips you posted were very interesting and make perfect sense.

I just wanted to post my "building instructions" for my cheap and perfect contraption.

First, If you have an electric oven you could try placing a 60 watt bulb in for the oven light and leaving it on (the light not the oven) for 24 hours - longer to let the oven heat up first. Test the temp by placing a glass jar with screw on lid filled with water in the oven. Make sure your water is 100 -110 when placing it in the oven and check the temp every 4 hours or so to make sure it is holding 100 - 110. bacteria start to die at 117 and BTVC suggests 100-110. I would have used this EASY pathway if it had been an option. You could make as much yoghurt at one time as your oven will hold.

My way - Electric heating pad on the bottom. Take a large pot (mine is 16 liters, but I would have bought the 20 liter if it was available) with a lid. I can make up to 2 gallons at a time with the 16 liter. Fill it with water to about 5 inches from the top with water. I make sure the water is around 105 deg. Place something in the bottom of the pot (can use a baby food lid if just doing one jar of yoghurt. When I make 2 or more I use a metal trivit that has a rubber coating). You don't want a direct heat source directly below your yoghurt. It will keep the bottom up to 15 deg hotter than the top (trust me - I made this error). You could also use a ceramic ramekin. Just be sure to turn the lid or ramekin upside down once it is submerged to release the air pocket as this may interfere with the conduction ( not really sure I just release the bubble). Place the lid on the pot and turn on your heating pad. Most will have to run it on medium. I run mine on low to keep a 104-106 deg temp.
Heat your milk to 180 deg for 2 minutes on the stove. Make sure to wash everything that touches the milk and yoghurt right before using. THere are airborne yeast that can otherwise land on your utensils and pots. They will culture beautifully just like the good guys .
I fill my sink with cold water and put the pot of milk in there with the lid. It takes the temp down within 5 minutes. Once the temp of the milk decreases to 110 you can add your starter or yoghurt. I use starter - yogourmet. I mix the packets in about 1 cup of milk and make sure there are no clumps. Introducing lots of air by using a wisk or vigorous mixing will decrease you end good beastie count. Add the rest of the milk and mix with a spoon to be sure the culture is mixed with the entire batch.
If using a glass yoghurt container ( I use 1/2 gallon mason jars - you can buy a case of 6 at the hardware store for about 10 dollars ) I find that the yoghurt temp maintains at the same temp to one degree off of the water temp. This way you can just check your water temp every four hours or so instead of opening your yoghurt container to check temp which is not a good idea anyway. I culture mine for 25 hours just to be sure all the lactose has been converted. Carefully remove yoghurt container and place in the BACK of the fridge for 8 hours without touching it. The yoghurt will keep for 3 weeks, but the good beasties start to die after 2 weeks.
Good luck. Gotta run.

Peace,
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#22 of 348 Old 07-31-2005, 12:47 PM
 
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Oh, this is gonna be tough! That was a good post regarding breastfeeding, and I thank you for it. It's what my LC and I have been working on forever. I have DEFINITE gut issues. In fact, I have been treated as though I have celiac disease for awhile now, but things haven't improved 100%. I suppose I could try the SCD I just need to locate a book to make sure I"m doing it properly. I'm just gonna have to commit to chicken and eggs for a bit.
In light of this we clearly haven't been doing the SCD properly for my girl. But the good news is between the chicken, eggs and carrots she's eating more than she has in a long time. THe one thing that intrigues me though is that she takes a good hour and a half to eat an egg and she will only eat it in rice sized bites. She gags if she puts any more in her mouth. Could that be a part of this? Or is it just that she isn't at all used to solid food?
Quillian is on it as well. It's not all that difficult, but I am cheating my way into it. There is nothing in the world that will get that kid to eat carrots, so I've been juicing them. Also I put mashed, raw zucchini in his eggs. We're getting there. I'm sure it will make alot more sense after I read the book.
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#23 of 348 Old 08-01-2005, 04:41 AM
 
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Thanks, Moneca, for the instructions. The water bath contraption sounds like it will work much better. I made some yogurt this weekend, and ended up putting the pot of yogurt directly on top of the pad, even though the pad had warnings about having anything on top of it and I was afraid I'd burn the house down. I tried putting it on the side of the pot but it didn't keep the temp high enough. What you say makes since about the temp being too hot on the bottom, if you put the pot directly on the pad.

Does it matter what type of container you make the yogurt in? I just used the saucepan (with lid) that I used to heat the milk in.

Jane, great article on the GAP! I will be interested to see if you can get the book and what you think of it. You are inspiring me to try the SCD! My DH and I think we both have yeast because we both have a lot of bloating. I did feel better when I was on the elimination diet. It would be interesting to see how I would feel on the SCD. I do have the book and have read it, so I know what is involved.

I have been very conservative with DD in terms of giving her food. At some point I mixed some rice cereal with water, and she didn't want it. So I didn't give her any. She never has had formula. All she really likes eating is meat and some fruits, and a few cooked greens. The one time I gave her rice, several months ago, it did come out whole in her stool. My friends feed their babies "Veggie Bootie," which is some sort of health food version of a cheese puff, which I didn't want to give her. Interestingly, she isn't interested in the health food "junk food" that other moms give their children. Luckily I had decided not to vaccinate, so I didn't have that as an issue with her. I think her gut flora that she got from me probably were not ideal, then the antibiotics I took when she was little didn't help. When I look back at the pics I took when she had the eczema, she did not look happy... in any of the pics I took at that time! I'm sure her stomach was hurting.
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#24 of 348 Old 08-02-2005, 10:15 AM - Thread Starter
 
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For those of you in stage one :
The banana pancakes are wonderful, but I found a way to make them better.
Mix two banana (after mashing) with 3 omega 3 eggs (I found that purred cooked mango chunks also work well and give some variety). Add 1 - 2 Tbsp. of coconut oil. It makes the pancakes more fluffy and I don't need to tell you all about the benefits of coconut oil.

Sarah - Check out the recipes on www.pecanbread.com You might find something for Jasmine. Not sure about making yoghurt in a pot. I feel better doing everything in glass, but try it and let me know. Remember that the only way for us to check and detrmine if the cultures are alive is to make a new batch of yoghurt from the old one and see if you get a solid end product. I would suggest doing this after your first batch to check live bacterial count. This way you won't waste money on organic milk and starter if the bugs aren't alive. I found that you will still have firm yoghurt results from using a starter even if the product is overheated and almost all the good beasties are killed by the time you get to 24 hours.

Best,
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#25 of 348 Old 08-02-2005, 03:20 PM
 
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Mountainmon, thanks for referring me to this thread. The boards are so big now it is easy to miss things.

The problem I've had with goat yogurt is getting ds to eat it. The texture and taste is different. Any tips on overcoming that? I have to throw out three jars I made last month that are still in the fridge.

Ds loves goat milk, though- so it's not the goat taste.

What about nut allergies? Ds can't have any nuts without severe reaction and limited eggs (he doesn't like eggs).

His favorite food is buffalo. Right now he lives on goat milk, raw carrots, apples, buffalo, beef, oatmeal (chewy), occasional rice, cheese and yogurt (cow milk). Sometimes turkey or chicken, rice cakes or corn chips, popcorn, and salsa, fruit leather. He seems to like chewy, crunchy, spicy foods and has textural issues with many cheeses and soft foods.

I would like to get the corn out, as well as fruit leather, rice cakes and oatmeal but need some substitutions.

He is still nursing very often- over 3 years.

(I have the SCD book and was on the diet last year for a month til I reacted to almonds/peacans and gave up).

Any suggestions are appreciated. Thanks!

Being right is not always fair, but being fair is always right
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#26 of 348 Old 08-02-2005, 08:10 PM
 
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So we got our allergy test results back and I am lost. Both kids are allergic to cashew butter and banana, one to eggs, both to avacado etc, etc, etc. My doc says that this particular test is very accurate and to avoid all allergens. How can I possibly heal their guts with these lists? Is it possible to do SCD without eggs, banana, nuts and a whole host of other stuff? THis is going to be REALLY tough.
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#27 of 348 Old 08-03-2005, 12:03 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Monica and Elisabeth -
You've got some limited diets, but I do believe it is possible. Bear with me... .

Monica -

You're smart to stay away from all nuts. This keeps you from al the baked goods . Let see... the goatmilk . I'm sure you've tried smoothies made from the raw goatmilk yoghurt with some fruit and honey. If he doesn't go for these you could freeze the smoothie and make popsicles - perfect for this weather and the good beasties will survive the freezing. If you are really feeling energetic you could buy frozen mango or pineapple chunks, cook them in the oven, puree them and then layer them with the yoghurt in a popsicle mold. Put the puree in first for about a half inch then let it freeze. Repeat with the yoghurt and make several layers. You could even use different purees for multiple colors. Just a thought. I'd hate for you to go to all that work and then him not eat it . You could also make popsicles out of the cooked pureed fruit. I know that all the vitamins and enzymes are gone if you cook the fruit and veggies, but stage one calls for only cooked.

Will he eat wild alaskan salmon? Dd loves it grilled with lemon juice, sea salt, and dill.

Free range buffalo is wonderful. That is what I give dd. You can mix about 2 burgers worth with an omega 3 egg and an avacado and make a meatloaf out of the mixture. I also make the banana pancakes. Sometimes I make it with mango puree. Three omega 3 eggs, two bananas, 1 tbsp coconut oil (don't know if it's risky to use this with nut allergies) and make pancakes. Can you give him raw goatmilk cheese? Alta Dena makes the one we eat. Check out www.pecanbread.com or more recipes and I'll try to stimulate the brain a bit more .

Elisabeth -
What kind of allergy tests were they? Igg, Ige, Iga? We had them all done. It's possible and I'll help you as much as I can. I hope it's not Selkie that is allergic to eggs since she is the one that really needs this diet. Are you going to try the coconut milk yoghurt? Well, no more banana pancakes - bummer! Coconut oil ( if you can take it with nut allergies?), olive oil, , wild alaskan salmon, and ghee (nonclarified butter = no caesin) can give you some fat which I know is important for Selkie. You didn't say anything about being allergic to milk and I know you buy raw goat milk. Does that mean you could try raw goat milk yoghurt for Selkie and mabey some raw goat cheese? You can still cook and puree the mango and other fruits. Can do popsicles if you need to. Taking out nuts, eggs, and avacado takes away a lot of your good fats .
I'll keep thinking and get back to you. I do think you need to sit down with your ND and discuss all this. Sounds like she isn't absorbing any of the supplements that you're giving her because her digestion is so impaired so we have to find a way to make this work. Jane are you out there? Can you help?
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#28 of 348 Old 08-03-2005, 04:35 AM
 
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Hi, this sounds like an intriguing thread. I'll admit I haven't totally read the old thread yet.
Dd, (19 months), has food allergies and eczema. I really believe it has to do with her gut. At three months, her stools changed from the normal breastfed ones to really smelly ones and has never gone back to normal. (the ped said the change was normal.) That was also about the time her cradle cap got really bad and her eczema spread over her body. She hadn't been on meds, not been vaccinated and I hadn't been on anything either. I decided to cut out the main allergens from my diet and finally convinced the ped to do allergy testing. She's allergic to milk (anaphylactic), wheat and dogs. Since then I've also found that she can't tolerate spinach, soy, beans, corn, berries. She also reacts to contact with almond oil.
I have really been trying to heal her. I heard so many good things about Primal Defense that I bought it for her. She takes that 2 times a day. And I give her aloe vera juice and a multivitamin. She also takes floradix iron for anemia. I would love to give her essential fatty acids but I can't seem to get her to take them. Even when I mix them in her food. She's also a very picky eater.
I would love to make coconut milk yogurt and am planning to experiment in the next few weeks. I was planning to use probiotics as the starter although I'm not sure which one. (She has reacted to the Nature's Way Reuterii in the past.) Which strains are the best?
I read the book, Breaking the Vicious Cycle, but quite frankly it depressed me. I don't see how I could do that for us as her allergist wants us to continue avoiding the major allergens (nuts, soy, eggs, milk, seafood, wheat). And I'm too afraid to try goat's milk due to the high percentage of milk allergic people not being able to tolerate it.
Any advice? How doable is the SCD if the major allergens need to be avoided?
Also, what about the aloe is bad? And why is the Primal Defense bad? I have been thinking about switching from that to something else because I can't really see that it helps.
Thanks in advance for the encouragement and advice.
Deborah
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#29 of 348 Old 08-03-2005, 12:10 PM
 
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I've been reading alot of what you all have been saying about healing the gut. With regards to this SCD diet, my gal gets eczema all over her body- she is 2.5 years old and she's been like this for a little over a year now. She is allergic to soy, peanuts, eggs, tree nuts, strawberries, pineapple, oranges, peas and fish. Even when we avoid everything that we know about, she's still itchy. Stress makes her really itchy too. Would she be able to do this diet with all those allergies?

What about other ways to heal the gut? The problem is an overgrowth of yeast, right? First we need to clear that out and then heal the tissue and encourage proper flora? Theoretically, what about taking something like Diflucan? Just a random thought I had--I'm not into taking drugs. Are there other natural ways to heal the gut, specifically with herbs? I found a "gut-healing" recipe in Aviva Jill Romm's Naturally Healthy babies and children that I'm brewing up for my little gal. Can we kill the yeast with herbs? I've been giving her yogurt (not homemade- that's something I need to start doing...) and borage seed oil twice a day and we're seeing improvement with that.
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#30 of 348 Old 08-03-2005, 12:25 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mountainmon
Add 1 - 2 Tbsp. of coconut oil. It makes the pancakes more fluffy and I don't need to tell you all about the benefits of coconut oil.
Thanks, Moneca, for the idea re the banana pancakes. I tried them for the first time the other day. DD wouldn't eat them, but I did, although I didn't particularly like them

My goat milk yogurt I made in a stainless steel pot seemed to be alright... it was the first batch I had made that didn't get way too hot, although for part of the time it wasn't warm enough... I did it for about 30 hrs. It was fairly liquidy. I used an organic yogurt for the starter, so maybe next time I'll try a real starter. I ate some yesterday and I liked it. It hasn't seemed to cause any reaction in Jasmine's skin.

Moneca, your dedication and ideas are great!
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