Healing the Gut Tribe ~ May - Page 17 - Mothering Forums

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#481 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 09:07 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moonshine
I am hoping that I will understand a lot more once my books finally get here,l but I do appreciate your taking time to help us newbies!!

My question is: Is it so critical to stay away from things like fruit and honey (which was mentioned above) if your problem isn't yeast? I have no evidence (that I am aware of) that I have a yeast problem, but clearly something is going on.
The avoiding fruit and honey is just for those with candidia issues.

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#482 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 09:27 PM
 
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Originally Posted by bubbles
Yup, that was me but no takers. A few people have responded here. I am feeling a lot like there are a lot of families working hard at healing but not sure there are a whole lot who have been successful. I am not trying to be negative or put anyone down I would just like to hear more about what has worked.
We are not fully healed but have seen too much progress to doubt that the diet is doing it.

I have know that I had a candidia issue for years but have lived like an ostrich about it. DD got a yeast diaper rash that never really went away when she was 12ish months old. At 18 months she got molluscum and my naturopath instantly said it is related to yeast and if you can clear up the yeast you will get rid of the molluscum. After several months on homeopathics for yeast the molluscum did clear up but the yeast rash persisited. Searching for answers to why that was going on led me to search in food allergies info. She has reacted to tomatoes and citrus fruit plus randomly getting sploches on her face while eating various things that seemed to have little in common if anything.
Plus, dd hasn't ever slept well. We have had times when it was better than other times but never well. I'm not sure when it began to take hours to get her to sleep. It happened some the first half of her first year but became a consistant thing some time before she was 12 months and got progressively worse. Our lives revolved arround getting her to sleep for naps and bedtime. It got somewhat better after we moved (I think the stress of moving really got to her and she didn't bounce back very quickly at all). We got back to where it took only 1-2 hours after lights out to get her to sleep. Naps typically took an hour after the story was done and lights were out. This is her in arms nursing or being held and walked in pitch black with loud white noise going. We tried every trick we could think of. Not only was she difficult to get to sleep but then she would wake up every 45 min to 2 hours all night long. With naps I had to be there to get her back to sleep after 30-45 min and then I usually could get another 30-45 min out of her. Plus she was clingy all day. At 24 months she still nursed 12-15x every day. She didn't handle being put off for nursing well at all. She would simply fall apart and be completely distraught.

We started scd when she was 25 months old and sick for the umpteenth time that winter. She and I had been gluten free for 3 weeks at this point to see if that would help. We both did react to gluten when we got it by mistake but removing it didn't seem to help us feel better. Within a couple of weeks she was going to sleep for her naps in 15 min or less. (I just don't remember how quickly that started). She also started sleeping longer for both her naps and at night. She had quite a few nights where she slept for 5 hours straight! This was a miracle as far as I was concerned. (her molars have been coming in this whole time so the sleeping was shot soon after that but it was fun while it lasted). And although she still nurses quite a bit, she is far more easily put off. I have been able to make some rules about when I will and won't nurse her and she has adapted easily to this when she never did in the past.

Visually she just looks much healthier. She had dark circles under her eyes and a palor for who knows how long. Those are gone and she looks much more vital than she has ever looked. Her yeast diaper rash is finally completely gone. I haven't seen it at all for a few weeks. She has also potty learned in this time. It was quite quick when it happened. I noticed within a few days of her starting this diet that she began to hold her urine longer. It was enough of a difference that I noticed it.

My mother has celiacs. She has been gluten free for about a year with lots of mistakes but she is getting better all the time. She came to visit me a few weeks ago and ate just scd while she was here. I had of course told her about it and encouraged her to try to follow it but she had resisted becasue it is so difficult. She felt so much better on scd than she had following a gf diet that she now has gone home and continued to eat scd all the time.

We have been on this diet for just under 3 months and I have faith from what I have seen so far that it can heal our guts and get us back to being healthy again. (not that we will ever eat SAD in this house again.)

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#483 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 09:55 PM
 
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CO -
Yes, we use it.

How many times a day do you all do No Fenol between meals?
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#484 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 10:06 PM
 
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moonshine,
You can do a spit test yourself at home to determine if you have yeast issues. Just fill a glass w/water. Spit in it first thing in the morning. If your spit forms little strings that start to descend in the water, you have a yeast problem. Pretty cool eh?

I tried this and while I did not think I had any yeast issues (never had), it wouldn't have surprised me. My spit just kind of bubbled on top for a minute and dissapated.

DD1 has yeast problems and I'm speculating that they came from vaxing and antibiotics. We have never fed her sugary foods or snacks (other than fruit). She has had *some* processed food in her short little life, but not much.

Oh, and to answer Patty's question before: DD1 is doing SCD but not w/fanatical adherence. (She and dh have been doing a modified version.) BUT . . .it's time to start dd2 on it w/fanatical adherence.

AND . . . another question since all this yeast stuff is new to me:
Does yeast mean leaky gut too? What I'm getting at is, once dd1's poops become normal will this mean that the yeast is gone? Will she always be suseptible to yeast problems? Her poopies have never really been normal. She goes from severe constipation to extremely mushy poops.
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#485 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 10:14 PM
 
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For those of you interested in gut flora of babes here's an interesting paper.
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#486 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 10:28 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annikate
AND . . . another question since all this yeast stuff is new to me:
Does yeast mean leaky gut too? What I'm getting at is, once dd1's poops become normal will this mean that the yeast is gone? Will she always be suseptible to yeast problems? Her poopies have never really been normal. She goes from severe constipation to extremely mushy poops.
Yeast overgrowth can cause leaky gut--apparently the yeast starts to burrow through your gut (nice, huh). As for the poop thing, my guess would be that normal poops would be your DD is better, but not necessarily healed. The reason I say that is because I'm sure I have yeast issues, and I have (and have had) normal BMs, so I don't think that is necessarily a great indicator, for me anyway.
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#487 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 10:47 PM
 
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I meant to post my yummy idea for getting more CO into me. I made Jane's Cashew butter bread and had some cashew butter left over. I mixed in more CO and some coconut and some honey and a little bit of salt. It is quite soft so I made little mounds of it (like if you were making cookies) on a plate and put that in the fridge. Once it was cold it hardened nicely. It is like candy! I don't have any ammounts for you, just play with it. I'm sure you could do it with any nut butter. I made it today using the creamed coconut in it. Delish!

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#488 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 10:56 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annikate
moonshine,
You can do a spit test yourself at home to determine if you have yeast issues. Just fill a glass w/water. Spit in it first thing in the morning. If your spit forms little strings that start to descend in the water, you have a yeast problem. Pretty cool eh?

I tried this and while I did not think I had any yeast issues (never had), it wouldn't have surprised me. My spit just kind of bubbled on top for a minute and dissapated.
(
Yea, I did this and my spit did the same thing. One (big) less problem to deal with. I told my sister about it and her spit sank as I thought it would. She has been dealing with chronic athlete's foot, among other health issues.
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#489 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 10:56 PM
 
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TMI probably. My own poops got much better after a couple of weeks on scd but since starting CO I'm constipated again. I'm sure it is die off as it was the first couple of weeks on scd.

We don't do enzymes at all right now. I tried some again today and again got an upset stomach from them . I'll keep trying every few days to a week till I can tolerate them again.

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#490 of 1002 Old 05-15-2006, 11:47 PM
 
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For best results you do no fenol and peptizyde between meals. That breaks down and ushers out the pathogens. I believe that there's more info on the enzyme stuff website under the candida overgrowth?

We took care of yeast just following the diet. I didn't restrict honey or fruit and it did work...and I had some nasty yeast! Everyone will be different of course.
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#491 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 09:31 AM
 
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DH takes NL and such with a grain of salt but generally humors me. Yesterday he asked me to put up a post for him so he must be really worried. DH has Celiac Disease but has been gluten-free for a couple years (pardoning a few accidents). When he does accidently injest gluten he knows about it, he get's fatigue and some nasty but very specific stomach problem (I'll spare you the details). Lately he's been having fatigue like he's been glutinated (pardon my snigglet) but no stomach problems. In fact, when he can get going he feels fine. He get's plenty of sleep (10-14 hours lately ) but always feels like he needs a nap.

He was wondering if it was a problem in his diet. We can't think of anything new he's been eating but maybe someone will know what's going on. We're a little undernorished (I've started tallying how much we eat to prep for pregnancy and was shocked at how little it is) but this has come on suddenly, maybe the past week. I don't think anything has changed though.

Anyhow, hope someone can help. Thanks!!

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#492 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 09:32 AM
 
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Forgot to sub!!

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#493 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 10:38 AM - Thread Starter
 
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As far as success stories go, I'm limited in what conclusions I can draw because I've only been on SCD for 16 days (following 1 month dairy and gluten-free with no results). My acne would be characterized as severe, and while it still looks bad due to all of the scarring and slow healing of cystic acne, I can definately tell a difference. Most of the new break-outs I'm trying to determine if they are menstrual related or related to some foods I introduced too quickly (nut butters, mainly). But I'm having much fewer breakouts, and the biggest improvement is that I'm no longer having large, painful cystic eruptions. I find this diet to be incredibly difficult, mostly because my eating habits were pretty poor to begin with. With even how difficult it has been to adjust our lifestyle to (no more eating out, having to plan every little meal), the improvement has really been worth it. And I've lost about 10 pounds, which was a nice bonus.
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#494 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 12:33 PM
 
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Hi all,

I've been lurking on these boards for a few weeks just trying to assimilate it all. I was hoping you kind ladies could help.

DS dx with milk allergy @7weeks with blood in his stools. Neocate started. 6m we started solids and he did great. At 9 months he reacted with rashes. We thought it was wheat since Cheerios was the last new food we had given. Took out, but rash still not completely gone. Finally took all solids out for 3 weeks (DS was 10m at this time). Rash went away.

Started one new food a week. Rice first week of March went fine, so did sweet potatoes. Green beans, peas and squash he got a rash on the 6-7 day of trial. Then slowly he started reacting to rice and sweet potatoes with the rash. I knew this because I stopped trialling other foods at the beginning of April.

He RAST neg and skin test negative in February.

Dx with delayed food allergies...non igE allergies.

So now at 12.5m we have pulled the two solids he could eat out. Per the ped/allergists at Stanford we are giving him 6m off solids.

I've been talking to a john's hopkins MD who also does homeopathic medicine. She thinks that DS has leaky gut syndrome. And that while 6m will help, if he eats any of the foods too often or in excess the sensitivities will come back.
She also agreed that don't worry about feeding him for the next few months and to give him gut rest. Which I geuss is what the allergist at Stanford Children's Hospital are saying in just a different way.

She said probiotics often help. I'm afraid that he'll be allergic to those too.

But I feel like the Stanford Doctors who while they acknowledge delayed food allergies say not much is known about them....aren't being pro active enough.

I know IgG testing is not as accurate but isn't it a starting pt? Isn't there something we can do?

I don't want to keep trying new foods b/c he is seeming to become allergic to everything with time. And I think the Stanford Doctors and Homeopathic/MD both think that resting his gut will help. But I am just so confused. Nobody I know has allergies and allergic to everything is blowing my mind!

I want to cry b/c he wants to eat and all I can give him is formula =(


I hope you could help. Is there a light at the end of the tunnel?

Arati
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#495 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 01:09 PM
 
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mmMommy, Momtezuma Tuatara appears to be the immune system expert at MDC. Check for her in the Vaccine forum. http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=406983



Pat

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#496 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 01:54 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annikate
For those of you interested in gut flora of babes here's an interesting paper.
Thanks for sharing this article. It was disturbing and fascinating to observe that our son *did* have antibiotics at birth and subsequently has many food intolerances associated with behavioral manifestations. The idea of "reprogramming" his gut with antimicrobial therapy doesn't sit well with me. But, your all's SCD experiences have piqued my interest in a more holistic approach.


Thanks again.

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#497 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 02:02 PM
 
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Arelyn, You might examine what type of vitamin and mineral supplementation he utilitizing? I am no celiac expert, but I know that the B-vitamins are challenging to optimize through foods. And Magnesium, Calcium, Zinc and Iron are all associated with lethargy when depleted. Has he tried dosing with any Vit. C or echinecea? Has the allergen exposure in the environment changed recently? We had Spring about a month ago and many people were feeling the assault on their immune system. I am assuming he eats red meat, since you didn't mention it. That is high in iron and zinc. But, Magnesium and Calcium are more difficult to get adequately in the diet, unless prioritized.

HTH, Pat

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#498 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 07:35 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moonshine
Is it so critical to stay away from things like fruit and honey (which was mentioned above) if your problem isn't yeast? I have no evidence (that I am aware of) that I have a yeast problem, but clearly something is going on.
Did you try the spit test as mentioned in either this thread or the April thread, just to rule out yeast? If you're sure it's not yeast, then I would think just doing SCD should be enough, without also limiting honey and fruit. At least cooked fruit, anyway.

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#499 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 07:40 PM
 
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Arati, you may want to PM Momtezuma your story. She is amazing. Don't be overwhelmed at the amount of info you can recieve from her, it will eventually sink in. Posting in Vaccines also will be helpful and good luck.
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#500 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 08:56 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmMommy
Hi all,

I've been lurking on these boards for a few weeks just trying to assimilate it all. I was hoping you kind ladies could help.

DS dx with milk allergy @7weeks with blood in his stools. Neocate started. 6m we started solids and he did great. At 9 months he reacted with rashes. We thought it was wheat since Cheerios was the last new food we had given. Took out, but rash still not completely gone. Finally took all solids out for 3 weeks (DS was 10m at this time). Rash went away.

Started one new food a week. Rice first week of March went fine, so did sweet potatoes. Green beans, peas and squash he got a rash on the 6-7 day of trial. Then slowly he started reacting to rice and sweet potatoes with the rash. I knew this because I stopped trialling other foods at the beginning of April.

He RAST neg and skin test negative in February.

Dx with delayed food allergies...non igE allergies.

So now at 12.5m we have pulled the two solids he could eat out. Per the ped/allergists at Stanford we are giving him 6m off solids.

I've been talking to a john's hopkins MD who also does homeopathic medicine. She thinks that DS has leaky gut syndrome. And that while 6m will help, if he eats any of the foods too often or in excess the sensitivities will come back.
She also agreed that don't worry about feeding him for the next few months and to give him gut rest. Which I geuss is what the allergist at Stanford Children's Hospital are saying in just a different way.

She said probiotics often help. I'm afraid that he'll be allergic to those too.

But I feel like the Stanford Doctors who while they acknowledge delayed food allergies say not much is known about them....aren't being pro active enough.

I know IgG testing is not as accurate but isn't it a starting pt? Isn't there something we can do?

I don't want to keep trying new foods b/c he is seeming to become allergic to everything with time. And I think the Stanford Doctors and Homeopathic/MD both think that resting his gut will help. But I am just so confused. Nobody I know has allergies and allergic to everything is blowing my mind!

I want to cry b/c he wants to eat and all I can give him is formula =(


I hope you could help. Is there a light at the end of the tunnel?

Arati
It does sound like your DS has a leaky gut. What happens with leaky gut is that improperly digested food proteins get into the bloodstream, which causes the body to think it is being attacked, and it produces antibodies, which cause symptoms of allergies. When you remove the offending food from the diet, but don't heal the gut, the holes in the gut are still there and improperly digested proteins from different foods get into the bloodstream, again causing allergy symptoms...it's a vicious cycle and you can get to the point where it seems you/the child truly is allergic to everything. A couple of people here have been in a similar situation, firefaery and I can't remember who else.

The food allergies should go away if the gut is healed. Maybe in a young baby the gut will heal on its own since it is still developing, but maybe not. There are things you can do to help heal his gut. There is a diet called the Specific Carbohydrate Diet (SCD) that is designed to give the body only foods it can easily digest and this allows the gut to heal. There are plenty of foods on it that are good for babies--cooked fruits and veggies, eggs, chicken... Digestive enzymes are another thing that can be used to help break down food and allow the gut to heal. There are also various supplements that can help with gut healing (zinc, MSM, l-glutamine, cod liver oil, coconut oil, among others).

You may want to do some research on leaky gut (the cheat sheet is a great place to start) and if it sounds like something you want to try, bring some info and talk to your DS's doctor--since he is so young and not BF'ing you might want medical advice on supplements, etc. If it were me I would consult a homeopathic or naturophathic doctor since they generally know way more about nutrition than an MD, but that's up to you.

I hope this helps
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#501 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 09:19 PM
 
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mmMommy,
Your situation sounds much like ours. DD2 has had intolerances to just about everything and RAST tested + for wheat/gluten. I'm sure you know that there are high rates of false +s w/ the test, and, I've heard also false -s. While this may seem pointless, I do think both IgE and IgG testing can give a starting point.

IMO, I would start the SCD with your babe. DO NOT give rice, sweet potatoes, or peas. Squash IMO is okay to begin with.

My dd is only now eating about 10 different solids without problems. And she's hungry! Poor baby. She really wants to eat more. I so know where you're coming from.

Here's what my dd is now eating: (We also introduce one new food a week and have been doing SCD for 4 months now.)
squash
zucchini
egg yolks (just started the whites too)
bananas
pears
avocado
These were her staples for quite a while. We've now branched out to:
broccoli
asparagus
grapes (insides only - no skin)
AND salmon! But will feed this only occassionally.

It's tough knowing what to start with and add. I have tons of links about feeding allergic/intolerant babes, the sequence of foods etc.. if you're interested.

hth
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#502 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 09:22 PM
 
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Jane,
There's been so much talk about magnesium lately. I ran out of my Kirkman's cal/mag combo (SCD illegal) and mistakenly got buffered mag oxide which is doing nothing for me. What kind do you take that you said helps you sleep so well? Is it Natural Calm?
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#503 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 10:09 PM
 
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Okay, I'm going to do it (SCD). I'm going to my HFS tomorrow and buying eggs and fish...this is big for me. I also ordered a yogurt maker, and will try making yogurt with goat milk.

Does anyone actually use the dry curd cottage cheese recommended in the book? And do you think my HFS will have it?

I spent some time making an Excel spreadsheet to keep track of my supplements, and plan on starting a blog to track my progress (starting out with the issues I hope will be addressed in both me and my son by this diet).

I'm a bit excited but also overwhelmed...I can't even shower with my son around, so I'm not sure how I'll be preparing eggs and fish and baking with nut flour. He'll be going on my back in the mei tai a bit more, I guess.

I suppose I should head over to the SCD thread now!

Formerly New Mama to Henry, born August 2005 and Silas, born November 2010.
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#504 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 10:15 PM
 
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New Mama,
It's not an easy diet to start but once you get the hang of preparing everything it'll become second nature. I bake a lot on the weekends when dh is here and freeze stuff for the week. I find dry curd at my regular supermarket near the eggs (not near the cheese). It's called Friendship Farmer's Cheese. It's good too (especially in spinach pie). Yum.
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#505 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 10:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmMommy
Hi all,

I've been lurking on these boards for a few weeks just trying to assimilate it all. I was hoping you kind ladies could help.

DS dx with milk allergy @7weeks with blood in his stools. Neocate started. 6m we started solids and he did great. At 9 months he reacted with rashes. We thought it was wheat since Cheerios was the last new food we had given. Took out, but rash still not completely gone. Finally took all solids out for 3 weeks (DS was 10m at this time). Rash went away.

Started one new food a week. Rice first week of March went fine, so did sweet potatoes. Green beans, peas and squash he got a rash on the 6-7 day of trial. Then slowly he started reacting to rice and sweet potatoes with the rash. I knew this because I stopped trialling other foods at the beginning of April.

He RAST neg and skin test negative in February.

Dx with delayed food allergies...non igE allergies.

So now at 12.5m we have pulled the two solids he could eat out. Per the ped/allergists at Stanford we are giving him 6m off solids.

I've been talking to a john's hopkins MD who also does homeopathic medicine. She thinks that DS has leaky gut syndrome. And that while 6m will help, if he eats any of the foods too often or in excess the sensitivities will come back.
She also agreed that don't worry about feeding him for the next few months and to give him gut rest. Which I geuss is what the allergist at Stanford Children's Hospital are saying in just a different way.

She said probiotics often help. I'm afraid that he'll be allergic to those too.

But I feel like the Stanford Doctors who while they acknowledge delayed food allergies say not much is known about them....aren't being pro active enough.

I know IgG testing is not as accurate but isn't it a starting pt? Isn't there something we can do?

I don't want to keep trying new foods b/c he is seeming to become allergic to everything with time. And I think the Stanford Doctors and Homeopathic/MD both think that resting his gut will help. But I am just so confused. Nobody I know has allergies and allergic to everything is blowing my mind!

I want to cry b/c he wants to eat and all I can give him is formula =(


I hope you could help. Is there a light at the end of the tunnel?

Arati
Your story is so familiar And we are healing

Please, read my story over here, about my 1st son:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...ad.php?t=97824 There's some great advice there, and unfortunately, some members deleted their posts so it gets kinda confusing. BUT, I can tell you that we are on the path to healing, and I so wish I did this diet when my 4 yr old was your son's age. It would have tons easier.

Much love to you,
Amy
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#506 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 11:18 PM
 
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To the mama who was posting for her dh: Celiac disease is an autoimmune disease. Repeated exposure-even minimal exposure will tear up the lining of the intestine and further him on the path to malnutrition. He may be getting "hidden" exposure, or he may be finding that it's all just catching up with him. How long since he was diagnosed? You said he's ben GF for a couple of years-how long did he have symptoms before the diagnosis? What's his diet like? Is he doing anything to heal himself? What supplements is he taking, if any? IF he is becoming deficient in nutrients it would absolutely cause lethargy. But, celiac disease can progress and some people display neurological impairment. Has anything else changed? IS it possible he has a fungal overgrowth or a bacterial infection? Has he recently been on any meds, prescription or over the counter? Does he feel like he's getting enough oxygen?

Nutrients I would be looking at off the bat are iron and B vitamins (especially B-12 which it is difficult to absorb no matter what you eat if you have a damaged gut)

I am beyond exhausted-so I hope this made sense. Perhaps I can post something more coherent tomorrow.
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#507 of 1002 Old 05-16-2006, 11:50 PM
 
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Amy D, thanks for the link to your story. I followed many links there to read Jane's story and about amalgam filling removal and hair testing and NAET, and homeopathy, and elimination diet info, etc. etc.

It was fascinating. Much of the story is the same as ours, but I didn't have you all helping me through it. Glad I found this thread.

Pat

I have a blog.
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#508 of 1002 Old 05-17-2006, 12:27 AM
 
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Annikate-it's natural calm, baby!
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#509 of 1002 Old 05-17-2006, 04:24 AM
 
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Thanks firefaery. I ordered some tonight. Got the flavored kind. Hey, shouldn't you be sleeping?
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#510 of 1002 Old 05-17-2006, 06:09 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scubamama
Arelyn, You might examine what type of vitamin and mineral supplementation he utilitizing? I am no celiac expert, but I know that the B-vitamins are challenging to optimize through foods. And Magnesium, Calcium, Zinc and Iron are all associated with lethargy when depleted. Has he tried dosing with any Vit. C or echinecea? Has the allergen exposure in the environment changed recently? We had Spring about a month ago and many people were feeling the assault on their immune system. I am assuming he eats red meat, since you didn't mention it. That is high in iron and zinc. But, Magnesium and Calcium are more difficult to get adequately in the diet, unless prioritized.

HTH, Pat
The meat here is sold in stalls with no refrigeration so he doesn't eat it. He also doesn't take any vitamins except the occassional Tums and today he took half of a prenatal (we'll split them for a couple weeks to see if it helps). The weather has been uneventful, the pollution levels lower than normal (it was a holiday last week), and he drinks lots of milk (it's made from powder, not fresh, but the side of the can says it's got all those vitamins in it). We're quite stumped.

Traveling mama to DS (2) my nature boy :
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