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#31 of 51 Old 12-15-2006, 11:27 PM
 
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Bear in mind two things. These remedies were worked out in the days when whooping cough was really bad; they didn't know about vitamin C and this, or nothing, was pretty much their only choice.

Specific remedies to be given after every attack of coughing for up to 2 days. If no improvement or unsure which remedy to give, consult a classically trained homeopath (not a new age pendulum using joat/mon).

Obviously older children and adults can work this out, but with babies you're guessing part of the time.

I've combined everything from all of my texts, so the list is extensive. And there are extra notes where people might check. For those with Boericke's repertory go to pagge 892.

Remedy and indication in alphabetical order:

Antimonium Tartaricum Cough when child gets angry, and after eating. Ends in vomiting. "Chest full of rattles." Thirstless: coated tongue.

Arnica 6c violent tickling cough if child gets angry ~ key marker is that child begins to cry before cough because they know its coming, and don't like it. (who would?!)

Belladonna 6 c Child cries and complains of stomach pains before coughing attach comes on, has bursting feeling in head, cough worse at night and when lying down, better after coughing up mucus, then dry tickling in throat starts again and attack is repeated with whooping and retching, child red in face, eyes puffy and bulging.

Bromium 6 c Whooping cough in spring, towards hot weather and worse for the heat. With sensation of coldness in throat. Larynx feels as if covered with velvet, but feels cold.

Byronia Albathis one is for the child who after every time eating coughs and vomits again. (usually they might eat a bit, cough and vomit then eat again, and the second time it stays down, but this one is for the child that coughs every time they eat. Also, the cough shakes the whole body, and if the child is lying in bed, the child has to immediately stand up to cough.

Carbo vegetabilis 6 c Cough mostly hard and dry, or sounds rough. Apt to occur after a full meal. Every cough brings up a lump of phlegm, or is followed by gagging, waterbrash or retching. Pain in chest after cough: burning as from a coal of fire. Craving for salt (key marker) Often a cold sweat after a coughing spell."One of the best medicine for the beginning of whooping cough with gagging, vomiting and red face" (Kent)

Cina 6 c Becomes rigid with clucking sounds down in oesophagus after coughing fit stops. Stomach bloated , yet hungry, not relieved by eating. Grits teeth.

Coccus cacti 6c Coughing worse at night when child is warm in bed, alleviated by drinking cold water , vomited mucus is transparent and stringy. Child tens to hold breath to try and stop the coughing. Particularly for children who wake up in the morning, with cough on cough, which ends in vomitting long strings of ropy mucus. Here coccus will shorten the time of the disease.

cuprum 6c Paroxysms of coughing leave child breathless and exhaused, whooping intakes of breath cause lips to turn blue, cramps in toes and fingers (typically thumbs are tucked into palms), drinks of cold water seem to help Cuprum 6c.

Drosera 6 c = throat feels dry and tickly, impulse to cough is so violent that child vomits and can scarecely breath between coughs, clasps stomach in pain when coughing, feels chilly and restless, symptoms worse after midnight. Impulse to cough follow one another so violently that he can hardly get his breath. When coughing pain in pit of stomach and child can't cough unless they press their hands onto the stomach. Region below the ribs is painful when touched, and when coughing must press hand on it, to stop pain

Ipecac 6cchild feels sick most of the time, becomes rigid, pale and breathless, then relaxes and vomits, which ends attack.


Kali bichrom 6c Stringy, yellow mucus coughed up.

Kali carbonicum 6 c stong and tickling cough, mainly at night. Hard dry hacking cough comes on around 3 am, child very chilly and exhausted, eyelids puffy with bag like swelling between the upper lids and the eyebrows. often a puffy face as well.

Magnesia Phosphorica 6 c violent spasmodic attacks of cough with face blue and turgid. Ends with classical whoop.

Mephitis 1 - 3 c This is for where there is a very "suffocative" feeling, with asthmatic type breathing where the out breath is difficult. very violent cough, spasmodic, especially at night. mucus rales in chest, Desire for salt, worse lying down. Child must be raised all the time. Patient wants to bathe in ice-cold water, or eat iceblock.

Mephitis is a very short acting remedy, and I've found this one good for whooping cough in combination with...

Moschus 1 - 3 c, for children who are extremely tense, nervous, anxious and where the coughing leaves them looking startled. Also where there is tightness of chest, and they keep trying to take deep breaths. So this one is mostly for the asthma type children with intense fear, anxiety and where they feel they are being smothered, and where there is a high degree of hysteria. Moschus kids are better in open air, but worse for the cold.

Obviously aconite has relevance for fear as well, but is only for the begining of an actue disease and not to be used once pathological change has occured, so you are past this stage...

Every child is different, but in terms of stages (using the abreviations of remedies most times, not full, unless using abbreviations would confuse. You can always google each abbreviation also putting the word homeopathy in as well.:

early stages (spasmodic) Aconite, Belladona, Carb Ac, Carbo V, Castanea, Chel, Cina, Coccus, coral, Cupr, Dros, Hyos, Ipec, Mag p, Meph, Naph, Narcissus, Samb, Stann, Thymus

later stages (catarrhal)[/i] Ant t, Cinch, Hep, Ipec, Puls.

vomitting Ant t, Bell, Carbo v, Cereum oz, Coccus, Cupr, Dros, Ipec, Lob. infl, Ver a.

concomittant = body rigid, stiff, cyanosis Am carb, Ant. t, carbo v, Cina, Coral, Cupr.ac, Cupr. m, Iod, Ipec, Mag p, Meph, Op, Samb, Ver.a

coryza Alum, Lyc, Nat.e

coughs following each other rapidly and violently Drosera

Wakes in morning and vomits ropy mucus coccus

coughing and crying Nat mur.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

For after whooping cough, in the few months while the hairs grow back, if a cold provokes the same severe cough, Sanguinaria

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~

Having put all this here, I need to say that I didn't use anything with my kids, because they took it in their stride, vitamin C was enough, and they were not babies. With babies I've primarily used vitamin C, management, Drosera, mephitus, moschus, mag phos; and treated the mothers for anxiety

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#32 of 51 Old 12-16-2006, 01:29 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm still going through the remedies, but have another question now, is not nursing common with WC in babies? DD2 is doing the same thing she did last weekend that landed us in the hospital with an IV, she has nursed two very short times in 12+ hours. That is not her normal, she loves to nurse. When I attempt to nurse her she either screams until I put her vertical again or licks the nipple and promptly falls asleep.

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#33 of 51 Old 12-16-2006, 03:06 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Levy and I e-mailed back and forth, he has not had experience in using liposomal vit c in infants He recommended mixing 1/3-1/2 of a packet and giving it to her in a solid, but when I said she was far too young for solids, he didn't have anything else to suggest.

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#34 of 51 Old 12-16-2006, 10:17 PM
 
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If she needs to be upright to nurse, try football hold as that will keep her in an upright position. Worst comes to worst pump the milk and try getting it in her in an eye dropper, a small amount at a time. Hugs.

Doula, Wife and mom to A (11/23/01) and O (5/7/09)
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#35 of 51 Old 12-18-2006, 04:43 AM
 
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I'm still going through the remedies, but have another question now, is not nursing common with WC in babies? DD2 is doing the same thing she did last weekend that landed us in the hospital with an IV, she has nursed two very short times in 12+ hours.
I'm presuming that maybe you are back in hospital?

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That is not her normal, she loves to nurse. When I attempt to nurse her she either screams until I put her vertical again or licks the nipple and promptly falls asleep.
Will she feed vertical? It's a slightly tricker technique, but can be done.

The main thing is, don't feel bad about having to go back to hospital for the IV if you need it. And remember that any other baby in hospital has been vaccinated for age anyway. It's not your or anyone else's fault, so just keep taking the vitamin C and play it by ear.

s :

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#36 of 51 Old 12-18-2006, 11:36 AM - Thread Starter
 
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She has this thing going where she will eat really great, and then refuse for hours and hours. She started eating Saturday after about 18 hours of almost nothing, nursed like crazy that pm, and all day yesterday. Then during the night and so far today isn't so great again. I've tried nursing vertically, using a dropper (boy does that make her mad), everything, she just isn't interested. I'm wondering if it's a mucous issue, maybe she finally coughs enough up to be comfortable nursing. She is in a good mood, just doesn't want to eat. So far she isn't dehydrated enough for another IV, during the times she is nursing, she's been eating so much to make up for it. As I was typing that, she decided she wanted to nurse. :

I've noticed a change in her over the last 36 hours, her cough is still frequent but it isn't severe all the time, and it doesn't last as long in duration. And she is coughing up so much mucous, it's amazing that all that can come from this tiny baby.

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#37 of 51 Old 12-19-2006, 06:22 AM
 
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I've subbed to make sure I get instant notification if you reply.

Have you increased your SA or have you just concentrated on sussing out the management side a bit more confidantly? I found I relaxed more, once I could see a pattern, and the kids were a lot more relaxed about it, once I found my feet in terms of management.

You sound like you're doing fine though.

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#38 of 51 Old 12-22-2006, 10:04 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Wanted to give an update. DD2 is doing a little better, I noticed an improvement on Monday, but then she went back to where she was before. I haven't had her face turn blue again, but her lips do a few times a day. She is becoming more alert, and sleeping less, today she was awake for most of the day, she had never stayed awake for more then an hour or so. Her coughing fits still are frequent and severe, she'll throw up a few times a day, still producing lots of mucous. We went into the pedi today, she still isn't able to maintain her O2 sats, she might be on O2 for a while yet. Her lungs are clear, but she's lost weight since her last weighing almost 2 weeks ago. She hasn't refused to nurse since Monday, so I've been trying to nurse her as much as I can. I know she is on the mend now, it's just going to be a very long slow process. She will be 2 months old this weekend, and I forsee us staying home for a while yet.


I want to thank you MT for holding my hand through this.

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#39 of 51 Old 12-23-2006, 12:42 AM
 
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How are YOU doing Peony? That is just as important...

I'm presuming you increased your own vitamin C last week? Have you still kept your levels up? I'm presuming if your answer is yes, that's not bothering her?

Her being alert is what you want. When she's sleepy like before, that's when the toxin levels in the body are up, and so yes, it looks as if either its a natural turning point, or what you are doing is working.

Your plan is a good one. Just feed as much as possible, and also try to feed yourself as well as you can. Dont' worry about her weight loss, because my guess is that she will stabilise this week, and her weight might start to rise next week, if not sooner.

That's great that her lungs are clear ~ huge improvement.

You're five weeks into this, so by my estimate you've another maybe three weeks of careful management, and then the cough will tail off.

But don't forget that until her bronchial cilia grow back, if she gets a cold in the 9 months after this, that same cough may start up again.

Anyway, its winter there so its not like you are missing out on sunbathing at the beach


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#40 of 51 Old 12-23-2006, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I increased my SA just by a gram, anymore then that and the extra gas seemed to bother her. I'm hanging in there, exhausted, I'm not able to sleep much between all her coughing fits. I think the coughing hurts her throat now because she swallows a lot and fusses in her sleep, which just keep me awake more.


I'm realizing what a long winter this is going to be. DD1 got a tiny cold last week, one of those where she only had a runny nose for a day, now her coughing has increased more, she's throwing up again, she's snoring like a freight train. DH, who doesn't have the cold, coughed and vomited all over the floor last night, he has had pertussis for well over 2.5, probably 3 months by now. I'm trying to figure out the logistics of keeping DD1 sane, she's bouncing off the walls waiting to play with her friends who are all walking petri dishes, but trying to prevent any more illnesses from entering our house.

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#41 of 51 Old 12-28-2006, 10:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Another update. DD2's cough is still about the same. She got dehydrated again and we ended up in the ER yesterday for another IV. Our issue now she coughs and then vomits, she nurses great, but just can't keep enough of it down. She has lost a lot of weight, she weighed 8lbs 1 oz yesterday, she was 6.11 at birth 2 months ago. We go in next week for another weight check next week, that's if we don't get up there before for fehydration again. :

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#42 of 51 Old 12-28-2006, 11:11 PM
 
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How are you "managing" that? given that her stomach is the size of a small peach, its sometimes hard to manage. Does feeding trigger her cough? If so, the best way to manage it is to feed for about 30 seconds or until she's taken the initial let down. If sitting her up at that point triggers her coughing, and she then vomits, then the chances are that if you feed her again, straight after the first vomitting, then she will keep the second feed down long enough for it to absorb.

If that works, then each feed has to be in a two-step process. Unfortunattely, its the first part of the feed which is the watery part, so perhaps another thing I'd try is expressing the first part of the feed from the other breast as you give her the other side. It requires major organisation and you will feel like a 20 armed paper-hanger. If you have that in a bottle, and she will take that as well, you might be able to keep her hydrated.

But a warning. What you are doing is building up a huge excess of milk, in order for her to keep down enough to hydrate her. When she gets over the peak and things settle down, you will have far too much milk, and that may result in an overfeeding problem.

But for now, if you can build up an excess, and just keep feeding her as much as she will take, and try the double-feed trick, maybe you will find a way to keep her hydrated.

In terms of weight loss, how much has she lost? She canot do better than on breastmilk, so there aren't too many options there, because what you have, is the best thing for her. Given that there should be only another three weeks of this, she should be able to ride it out if you can keep her hydrated, and then she will catch up later.

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#43 of 51 Old 12-29-2006, 01:26 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Nursing isn't triggering her cough. She'll nurse fine, fall asleep, and then later start coughing and puke everything up. She's hungry, so we nurse and start the process over again. She nurses very frequently, and I've been block feeding her for some time now, that's keeping her on one side for 2-3 hours so she gets all the hindmik. I have always had a very good milk supply, I definitely have enough milk to nurse her constantly.I'm thinking of pumping, let the BM settle until it seperates and then syringe feeding her the fatty milk on top. Of course that requires me to get a pump.

Her highest weight was 8.10, she is now at 8.1 The pedi suggested we might add a human milk fortifier (usually used for preemies) to expressed breast milk, I have some they gave me, but I considering syringing the fatty milk over that.

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#44 of 51 Old 01-02-2007, 11:51 PM
 
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Bump...
Wondering how you guys are doing...
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#45 of 51 Old 01-03-2007, 12:02 AM - Thread Starter
 
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We are hanging in there. Gabrielle's cough is getting slightly better, the intensity is still the same but the frequency has decreased some over the last couple days. She still vomits a few times a day, but is keeping most of her nursing sessions down. I've nursing her more then I ever thought was possible, and DD1 was a huge nurser. I think that she has gained weight, she feels heavier. I'm taking her in tomorrow for a weight check to see what exactly the numbers are. Normally I don't do WBV or care what the scale says but I'm going to be keeping an eye on her weight for a little while. Gabrielle is becoming more alert, I truly think that we are on the other side of it, finally. I know it's going to take months before the cough goes away and I'm being very careful about keeping sick people away from her, I don't want her to catch a cold or anything right now. Thnaks for checking up on us.

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#46 of 51 Old 01-05-2007, 11:56 PM
 
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Thats so great Gabrielle's feeling better: !!!! You and Gabrielle are in my thoughts: .....You really are a wonderful mommy .....BTW I clicked on your siggy and you have a beautiful family and Gabrielle wow she looks great for just being so sick....Take Care Have a Wonerful New Year
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#47 of 51 Old 01-06-2007, 12:04 AM
 
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I just started reading this thread. I really hope your DD is doing better! We're thinking of you at my house and wishing you all the best.

Michelle
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#48 of 51 Old 01-06-2007, 12:07 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thats so great Gabrielle's feeling better: !!!! You and Gabrielle are in my thoughts: .....You really are a wonderful mommy .....BTW I clicked on your siggy and you have a beautiful family and Gabrielle wow she looks great for just being so sick....Take Care Have a Wonerful New Year
Thank you! It means a lot to me, because sometimes I don't feel that way.

Gabrielle's weight check went great. She gained 11 ozs in one week!! Sitting on my butt, nursing her non-stop has done wonders for her weight. She still vomits several times a day and has bad coughing spells but i know we are on the other side of this now. The pedi would like us to keep her on O2 until she has not had a bad coughing spell for a week. She is being cautious since we live at 7,000 ft and are close to 40 miles from the hospital. That will probably be in the springtime considering how DD1 and Dh still have bad coughing fits.

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#49 of 51 Old 01-06-2007, 12:12 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I just started reading this thread. I really hope your DD is doing better! We're thinking of you at my house and wishing you all the best.
: Feeling the love right now.

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#50 of 51 Old 01-06-2007, 01:35 AM
 
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Thank you! It means a lot to me, because sometimes I don't feel that way.

Gabrielle's weight check went great. She gained 11 ozs in one week!! Sitting on my butt, nursing her non-stop has done wonders for her weight. She still vomits several times a day and has bad coughing spells but i know we are on the other side of this now. The pedi would like us to keep her on O2 until she has not had a bad coughing spell for a week. She is being cautious since we live at 7,000 ft and are close to 40 miles from the hospital. That will probably be in the springtime considering how DD1 and Dh still have bad coughing fits.
That's awesome news, about her weight gain! Go you!!

I hope she returns to health very quickly
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#51 of 51 Old 08-20-2007, 02:27 PM
 
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Can we archive this thread?? I think it has good information that is worth keeping... Thanks
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