Making Vaccination Decisions -- Where to Start? - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 14 Old 04-19-2010, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hello, my beautiful son is 8 weeks old today (and any day now I'm going to manage to find time to post that birth story).

He'll see a doctor for the first time next week (we had a home birth and so far he has only been seen by the midwife). But, I don't begin to know what I want to do about vaccinations. No vacs? selective vacs? delayed vacs? all vacs? I don't know. And the appointment is next week. Yikes.

From the little research I've done so far I think we'll probably want to make a decision on a case by case basis with each vaccine. Something I'll also have to consider is that when DS is 17 months old we'll be travelling to Prague, so there might be things I want to vaccinate him for before then.

At any rate, with so little time left before his appointment, where should I look for information about vaccinations, especially the common 2 month old vaccinations?

Thanks,

Donna

"She has spread of late into a goodly bulk." Shakespeare, The Winter's Tale 2.1.20-21
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#2 of 14 Old 04-19-2010, 08:19 PM
 
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First - Breathe!

You don't have to make any decision right now. Research and then make an informed decision.

Just tell the doctor that you are researching and have not yet made a decision. Stick to your guns and don't let them fear monger you into getting 'just one or two'

You have all the time in the world to decide. Once you out them in, you can't take them back out.

You might want to start at the top of this forum with the stickes...then take one disease at a time. If the disease still frightens you, look into it further. If it doesn't, cross the vaccine off the list. Start with the ones your babe is due to get at this first visit including HepB...for example, are you or anyone immediately involved with his care Hep B +? Will he be doing injecting drugs or having promiscuous sex? If not, you can most likely rule Hep B out...go from there.

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#3 of 14 Old 04-19-2010, 08:24 PM
 
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Here are some questions to answer for yourself in deciding about vax.

1. Name of the disease
2. Description of the disease
3. Length of time from initial infection to end of all symptoms
4. Infectious period
5. Normal symptoms of the disease
6. Known serious consequences of the disease
7. Proportion of persons infected developing serious consequences
8. Transmission route of the disease
9. Prevalence of the disease
10. Treatments of the disease and efficacy of those treatments
11. Relevant research about the disease
12. Name of the vaccine
13. Company that makes the vaccine
14. Contents of the vaccine
14A. The significance of whether or not the vaccine is live
15. History of development of the vaccine
16. Known side-effects of the vaccine and rate of incidence of those side-effects
17. Possible side-effects not yet acknowledged by the vaccine maker
18. Relevant research into the vaccine
19. How effective is the vaccine at preventing the disease?
20.What is the vaccine meant to do? (Many vaccines are not meant to prevent infection or transmission).
21.Number of cases reported each year.
22.Number of deaths reported each year from the vaccine and natural disease.

Here are some sources to help you out:

Vaccines: The Risks, The Benefits, The Choices 1/18DVD, By Sherri J. TENPENNY



http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/mmwr_wk.html (download the current issue)
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pin...k-chapters.htm
http://vaers.hhs.gov/pdf/PackageInserts.pdf
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...40451107552&q=
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...87981735&hl=en
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pin...ses&deaths.pdf

Health Sentinel Graphs

WHO GRAPH

Vaccine Injury Table


Beyond Conformity Resources Page
Do you have a quick-fire summary?

Inside Vaccines

"It should be a rule in all prophylactic work that no harm should ever be unnecessarily inflicted on a healthy person (Sir Graham Wilson, The Hazards of Immunization, 1967)."
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#4 of 14 Old 04-19-2010, 09:54 PM
 
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I think this is a great place to start! There is a lot to learn, and the people on this board are an excellent source of information. As you look into each vaccine and disease, come here to double-check some of what makes you think. You will get wonderful responses with sources to back up what is being said.

The best decision you can make is to wait to vaccinate until you are completely confident with your decision. Go to the doctor prepared to not vaccinate, tell them you are waiting until you finish researching the subject, and leave it at that. Be prepared for the doctor to pressure you and tell you about the dangers of not vaccinating right away. Most doctors have a "pet vax", and they will tell you that even if you don't get them all right away, it is really really super duper important to get "just this one". The pet vax is varies by doctor. On this board, it seems the most common ones are Hib or DTaP. For our pediatrician, it was rotavirus. Yep, the same one that was just recalled

For what it's worth, my 26 month dd has never been vaxed, has traveled a ton, been around other kids regularly since she was 2 weeks old, and is very healthy. She gets a few colds and whatnot, but overall, she is a picture of health. We take preventive measures, like bfing until she was over 2, organic and whole foods diet, lots of sun and sleep, and an overall healthy and active life.
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#5 of 14 Old 04-20-2010, 12:55 AM
 
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Beyond what others have already mentioned, one thing that's been helpful to me is to expand the list of choices of how to deal with illness (prevention or reduction of likelihood of complications) beyond vaccinate and don't vaccinate.

I have been shocked, completely stunned, at how much we can do, both in terms of long-term lifestyle choices, and with acute disease management, to reduce the likelihood of bad outcomes from illness. I have a kid who gets sick a lot, and I've found that filling my toolbox with a good complement of both has been _incredibly_ useful, not just for vaccinateable diseases, but for all the other stuff that's out there that there's no vaccine for.

Most doctors don't seem to know there are other ways to reduce the likelihood of complications--it's not just random. It's not completely in my control, of course, nothing in life is, but I can stack the deck in my favor, iykwim.
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#6 of 14 Old 04-22-2010, 12:05 AM
 
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One good area to study up on is fever. It is a common symptom of illness in small children. Unfortunately, most of the advice you'll be given on how to cope with this symptom is incorrect. So, if you want to do without vaccines, part of learning how to cope with illness (and as people pointed out above, there will be illness, even if you do every single vaccine), is learning how to cope with fever.
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#7 of 14 Old 04-22-2010, 03:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deborah View Post
One good area to study up on is fever. It is a common symptom of illness in small children. Unfortunately, most of the advice you'll be given on how to cope with this symptom is incorrect. So, if you want to do without vaccines, part of learning how to cope with illness (and as people pointed out above, there will be illness, even if you do every single vaccine), is learning how to cope with fever.
I would love to know of any resources on this that you find helpful!

Ashley - Married to M ~ 12.29.06, Mom to E ~ 10.15.08, Expecting #2 ~ 11.6.10 & praying for VBAC
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#8 of 14 Old 04-22-2010, 06:29 PM
 
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There was a good article in Mothering magazine a few years back...

let me see if I can turn up something useful!

http://ffitz.com/nyvic/health/diseas...-infection.htm
good overview of how illness works

http://www.karmayog.org/publichealth...ealth_3454.htm
one specifically on the benefits of childhood illnesses

http://www.annals.org/content/120/12/1037.full
a more mainstream view which explains why fever can be both beneficial and, sometimes, fatal.

Let me know if you need more.

Another side of this is that drugs commonly used to reduce fever can be quite dangerous in and of themselves, so you get a double whammy when you give, for example acetaminophen to a child. First you deprive the child of the benefit of the fever and then you give them a toxic drug which taxes the liver--at a time when a child needs all of their systems working at their best.
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#9 of 14 Old 04-23-2010, 04:38 PM
 
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Originally Posted by BetterTogether View Post
I would love to know of any resources on this that you find helpful!
You must get yourself a copy of this book: http://www.amazon.com/Raise-Healthy-.../dp/0345342763

written by a pediatrician. Excellent resource to have as you embark on this journey of motherhood. He has a section on vaccines as well.

If the people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." Thomas Jefferson.

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#10 of 14 Old 04-26-2010, 11:34 AM
 
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Hello and welcome! Great that you found your way here! The most helpful information in terms of vaccine resources, studies, experiences and food for thought I found in this forum. Deciding about which vaccines to give and when will be a long and sometimes overwhelming journey, but it's so worth it. And questioning the official immunization schedule takes a lot of courage from new parents, too - be prepared to face a lot of resistance from your ped when you want to delay or forgo certain vaccines. Be prepared to be kicked out of the practice. It is intimidating, but know that this is common practice for most ped's, it happened to many of us - and you will find a new one.

As a start, I always recommend MedicalVoices, a website run by doctors. Go to the webinar series and start with the excellent video Evaluating the Science and Rationale of Vaccines by Lawrence B. Palevsky (page 5, August 17). It will give you peace of mind for delaying vaccines in general until you have researched the individual ones.

Also a thought for your travel to Prague. I was quite insecure and scared before our first flight with DS. He was 11 weeks old and completely unvaxed. Of course I thought about the masses of people at the airport and the cramped environment. But I just used common sense, kept him close to me, made sure people didn't cough at him and the air con didn't blow in his face. We're flying overseas twice a year and DS never even caught a cold on the plane (like myself). He is 3yo old now and healthy as a nut.
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#11 of 14 Old 04-26-2010, 02:23 PM
 
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just wanted to remind everyone of this wonderful post in this thread:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...93&postcount=3

Save it on your computer and work through the list!
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#12 of 14 Old 04-28-2010, 03:17 PM
 
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I always recommend the Aviva Jill Romm book Vaccinations: A Thoughtful Parents Guide.

I have read just about every vaccine book out there (because I went through a phase where its all I read about and I love researching things). Of all the books, this is HANDS DOWN the best most balanced and straightforward approach. I know selective vaxers that love it, non vaxers that love it, etc. She does the best job of any book I've read in explaining how the immune system works, how vaccine immunity differs from natural immunity, etc. Wonderful book.
http://www.amazon.com/Vaccinations-T...2478794&sr=8-1

There are other books I loved also, but they are clearly more slanted in favor of not vaccinating.

One book that is long, but definetly worth a read is EVIDENCE OF HARM by David Kirby. A lot of people argue that its irrelevant now since most of the thimerosal is out of vaccines. I think that's insane to take comfort in, as so much of that book just goes to show how powerful the cover ups can be, how big of a "machine" the mercury moms had to go after, and if all this went down what else could be still hidden?? It reads like a thriller but its all true. Amazing book about hero mothers (who despite being in the midst of autism hell with their own children) managed to find enough surplus to bring this issue to light against big corporations. Its very impressive what they were able to accomplish. As a mother, I am eternally grateful to the "mercury moms."
http://www.amazon.com/Evidence-Harm-...2478845&sr=8-1

XOXO
B

mama to Milena Anjali (4/26/06) and Vincent Asher (4/13/09) ~ married to the love of my life since 2002.
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#13 of 14 Old 05-02-2010, 12:41 PM
 
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I have the Aviva Jill Romm book at my library and several new parents have found it helpful.
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#14 of 14 Old 05-02-2010, 01:20 PM
 
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Originally Posted by BethSLP View Post
One book that is long, but definetly worth a read is EVIDENCE OF HARM by David Kirby. A lot of people argue that its irrelevant now since most of the thimerosal is out of vaccines. I think that's insane to take comfort in, as so much of that book just goes to show how powerful the cover ups can be, how big of a "machine" the mercury moms had to go after, and if all this went down what else could be still hidden??
Another reason it's still relevant is that a lot of moms have a lot of mercury, and some of our kids came preloaded with way too much.
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