Infant taken, drugged by MO state officials. - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

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#31 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 06:00 AM
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Where I work, I see failing kidneys every day. These people are old and have abused their bodies (I work with veterans) on top of having the other issues WildKingdom mentioned.

 

Anyway, Miriam, if you don't trust doctors, why aren't you equally as suspicous of Dr. Humpheries? Is it because she says what you want to hear?

 

 

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#32 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 07:29 AM
 
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Originally Posted by WildKingdom View Post



 

The number one cause of kidney failure in the USA is diabetes.  The number two cause is hypertension.  Considering that most people with either one of those conditions is likely receiving a yearly flu shot, yup, there's a good chance that all of them had had a "recent" flu vaccine, like within the past year.

 

A perfect example of "correlation does not equal causation."

 

Kidney failure rarely happens overnight.  It happens over years to decades.  When it does happen overnight, it is usually REALLY obvious what did it (an infection, a medication, etc).
 

 



Nitpicking slightly - the articles miriam posted said nothing about reactions "within a  year".   It did mention (in a vague way) increased hospital visits/reactions within days and weeks after the vaccine. 

 

I do not doubt that the vast majority of kidney issues are caused just as you said - by disease, hard living, infection, medication. 

-------------------------------------------

 

In general, I tend to agree with everyone else.  The babe seems to have been taken for weight issues.  I have no idea whether the doctor agreed with the formula or the parents just thought he agreed with the formula.....neither, for that matter do any of you.  Speculating that the parents only heard what they wanted to hear is, well, speculative (and perhaps shows a bit of an elitist bias - tending to favour  the doctor over the parents).

 

I am not a great lover of CPS for a variety of reasons - but I have no issue with a severely underweight or negligently fed infant being taken into custody if need be.  Infants can die from poor feeding practices.  

 

I do not think this is a vaxxing issue, for the most part.  I think it should be in health or current events.  

 

 

 

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#33 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 08:25 AM
 
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So you are saying the doctor lied and turned them in to CPS behind their back? Then sent them a bill for his services. Seems like a failure in communication that the parents are bearing the brunt now. That is one of many reasons I do not trust doctors.  Trust is earned.  The medical community has not earned it from me. This happens too often.

 

As for the vax issue, any doctor will tell you it is a red flag and a reason to start looking for something else.  I was written up in an ER for cloth diapering and breastfeeding beyond a year.  They were digging deep on me. I still kept my child.  Believe me, not vaccinating your child makes you a social pariah.  Things have not changed in the attitudes of the medical community simply because we can log in to the internet and discuss the pros or cons of childhood vaccinations with people around the world.  I have lived that life and I know. 


I really don't think it counts as lying if you are unable to convince someone not to do something that can severely damage their baby so you finally just throw up your hands and say 'fine!' and call in someone else to help... such as CPS.  That's called protecting a baby.

 

It is perfectly plausible this hypothetical happened but all the parents heard was the end where the doctor threw up his hands and said 'fine!' which of course would lead to their saying the doctor TOTALLY approved of feeding an infant something so clearly unsafe.  Or hell, maybe the doctor never agreed by any stretch and the parents simply made that up.

 

I'm all for getting behind true cases of abuse within CPS, but I have no desire to make CPS seem worse than it is.  They save many lives.  We should fix true problems... not sensationalize stories where the problem is in fact on the parents.

 

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#34 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 02:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 2xy View Post

Anyway, Miriam, if you don't trust doctors, why aren't you equally as suspicous of Dr. Humpheries? Is it because she says what you want to hear?

 

 



I'm only speaking for myself here, but yes. On the vaccine issue, you can find doctors, scientists, and researchers on both sides. We all believe the "side" that we think is true.  That's why I have to remind myself not to take this debate so personally. For or against--we are all just people who want the best for our loved ones and for humanity.

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#35 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 04:32 PM
 
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maybe they failed to mention the last name at the parents wishes.  how do you know it isn't true?  to me, its more believable than not.  And having nothing but mainly bad experiences for the last 25yrs in the medical community, yes i am suspicious too. Very suspicious. Esp after talking to the centarians about diseases and how they really were back in the 1920's...all these standard childhood diseases today being vaxed for were a routine thing for kids back then. What really killed the kids was the lack of antibiotics available at the time, due to secondary bacterial infection setting in which was caused by lack of cleanliness, sanitation, dirty water, etc...

 

There is only one article, all over the internet. This day and age, the way the media is, they would latch onto this like rabid dogs and run with it. One article, no last names (not even fake ones) just screams made up to me. Maybe you choose to believe it because it aligns with your view of CPS, however flawed? I think that the lack of evidence points more to made up then not. You find a real source, on that runs a different version of the story (seriously, every single one online is the same article or refers to the same article) and I will find it more believable.

 

As for the vaccinations, I find that just about every person over the age of 50 I have talked to in my life since having kids has been extremely pro-vaccinations. Yes, there were a lot of "childhood" diseases that kids had and were fine. There were also thousands of kids that died. My grandmother used to cry when she would talk about kids from her school that had died from having measles, or were paralyzed from Polio. I guess everyones experience is different, but from all of our family that is older and clients I have met who are older, they have all been very pro-vaccine.

 

 

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I look bad?  Talk about killing the messenger!  

 

I have had more than my share of encounters with CPS. I handled them alone without any help from any one, especially here. I was home birthing, CD, breastfeeding, homeschooling, and unvaxing before mothering magazine ever hit the stands or the post office.

 

This is not my cause.  My children are grown. You really are reading too much into my posts.  Dust off your crystal ball.

 Well, you did post this originally, so I don't think I am killing the messenger so much as speaking to the person posting.

 

As far as having had run ins with CPS, I honestly have to wonder about the amount of CPS run in around here. It seems that the numbers of them are abnormally high for even a more alternative group. I also breastfed, slow vaxxed (every single ped has been on board with it, even the pretty conservative ones here in Texas), non-circing, etc. I have never had CPS called on me, threatened to be called on me or anything near it. I totally agree that there have been over zealous cases of CPS. I do not believe that either of these cases are(assuming the first is true, which there is no evidence it is.

 

Lastly, if this is not your cause, why are you posting it? Seems you have a dog in this fight if you are posting and arguing about it. I still don't see why it is in the vaccine forum though. *shrug*


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#36 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 05:38 PM
 
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As for the vaccinations, I find that just about every person over the age of 50 I have talked to in my life since having kids has been extremely pro-vaccinations. Yes, there were a lot of "childhood" diseases that kids had and were fine. There were also thousands of kids that died. My grandmother used to cry when she would talk about kids from her school that had died from having measles, or were paralyzed from Polio. I guess everyones experience is different, but from all of our family that is older and clients I have met who are older, they have all been very pro-vaccine.

 

 

I think many older people are pro-vaccine but that may be because many are also simply more likely to accept what their doctor recommends without question.  I think they grew up with less questioning of authority, and carry this over till today.

 

I asked my mother (age 70) if she remembers anyone dying of measles as a child - she said no.  She does remember people with polio, though.  She is quite moderate in her vax stance - she takes the flu shot most years, but was incrediably ticked some years ago when she learned there was thimersol left in some vaccines.

 

 

As far as having had run ins with CPS, I honestly have to wonder about the amount of CPS run in around here. It seems that the numbers of them are abnormally high for even a more alternative group. I also breastfed, slow vaxxed (every single ped has been on board with it, even the pretty conservative ones here in Texas), non-circing, etc. I have never had CPS called on me, threatened to be called on me or anything near it. I totally agree that there have been over zealous cases of CPS. I do not believe that either of these cases are(assuming the first is true, which there is no evidence it is.

 

I have never worried about CPS or felt they might be called on me for not vaxxing.  Never.  I figure they have bigger fish to fry - which they do. My doctors did argue with me a little bit, but nothing horrible.  

 

Lastly, if this is not your cause, why are you posting it? Seems you have a dog in this fight if you are posting and arguing about it. I still don't see why it is in the vaccine forum though. *shrug*

 

I have older kids too, yet here I am posting.  I think it is still possible to care about issues even if one is not actively "in" the deciding phase. 


 

 

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#37 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 07:58 PM
 
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I asked my mother (age 70) if she remembers anyone dying of measles as a child - she said no.  She does remember people with polio, though.  She is quite moderate in her vax stance - she takes the flu shot most years, but was incrediably ticked some years ago when she learned there was thimersol left in some vaccines.


 

 


Your mom is quite a bit younger then my grandmother. My grandmother died almost 20 years ago, at 84, so there is 35 years difference there. She also grew up in rural Missouri, which I would think would make some difference, of course I have no idea where your mom is from. I do not know how many kids she knew that died of it, but I remember her saying one of her friends in 3rd grade died from measles. :(

 

 

 

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I have older kids too, yet here I am posting.  I think it is still possible to care about issues even if one is not actively "in" the deciding phase.

Please do not confuse my comment above as one saying people with older kids should not post. I was just responding to the PP's comment about shooting the messenger. I see her original post as way more than a messenger. Of course you still care about the issues and definitely can have opinions and bring in valuable advice to parents in the deciding phase. Going by the ages of your kids in your siggie, you yourself are in some deciding phase I would say, as they push boosters at 11-12 yrs and the new HPV vaccines (which incidentally I saw on the schedule for my son (I have all boys) and it shocked me, had no idea they made it for boys now too).

 


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#38 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 08:15 PM
 
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I just want to say, as a child, all 5 of us were homebirthed, breastfed (till age 4 and tandemed!!!), co-slept and cloth diapered. and my mother didn't vax my youngest brother.  AND our health insurance was Kaiser Permanente for most of my childhood.  and she was never even threatened with CPS. not once. so, i am REALLY curious WHY you had so many run-ins with CPS.  i am 34 now.  and EVERYONE that i knew growing up lived a similar lifestyle. i honestly thought all babies were born at home and all mommies went to La Leche League until i was around 8.  and the only family that i knew that had CPS called on them had a serious sexual and physical abuse issue that resulted in one child being adopted out of the family.  i even knew homeschoolers before it was really legal and they never had problems. so, i have a hard time believing that those lifestyle choices would bring down CPS.

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#39 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 08:24 PM
 
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Originally Posted by wills_mom View Post

 

 

 Going by the ages of your kids in your siggie, you yourself are in some deciding phase I would say, as they push boosters at 11-12 yrs and the new HPV vaccines (which incidentally I saw on the schedule for my son (I have all boys) and it shocked me, had no idea they made it for boys now too).

 


I am pretty sure we will be skipping HPV  - and I did not know they made it for boys, either!

 

We will look closely at rubella and chicken pox for the girls though.  We will certainly have titers checked and look at current rates before they leave their teens.

 

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#40 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 08:42 PM
 
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Let us not jump to conclusions as to why the previous poster has dealt with CPS. Ummm, does a CPS investigation imply guilt? Don't you know that CPS is full of corruption just like anything else? Would you like me to point you to the many cases of CPS corruption and the sex trade? There are 2 sides to the CPS coin--sometimes, it does help, and sometimes, it does cause harm. It's all about the actual human beings who are working at a job. Some people are good, and some are not!

 

When I say I've had a negative experience with CPS, it could mean that I personally know someone who has dealt with them. Not that I myself have dealt with them (hopefully never!) I mean my experience through family members. In fact,  I was in favor of CPS taking the children of this certain family member. I felt they would be better off growing up with someone else. This person has had CPS called on multiple occasions throughout the years, and nothing happened. When my mother would visit their home on different occasions, she would find the house a total hazardous wreck--I'm talking maggots crawling on the kitchen counter and bags of gross trash everywhere. Dog poop in the house where the puppies ran freely. The kids eventually quit attending school, and the mother did not teach them at home. What the heck were they learning? (mom was lazy and never had a job! Her mommy paid--still pays-- for the house and cars. Gov't pays for food and health insurance. See what your taxes go toward?) 

Later, she began to do drugs, and allow questionable men to "crash" at their place. Drug using men hanging around the young children, and guess what? 16 year old daughter became pregnant by one of the guys. (there were 6 kids total, so lots of opportunities for abuse to happen) Latest news.....druggies ate all the food in the house, so youngest are hungry. My mother's last visit revealed no parent at home and no food in the house. Yes, no food, although they receive gov't assistance, so there is a way to buy the food. My mother has tried to help throughout the years, but she cannot bear to go over anymore.  

The last I heard, this person was trying to sign the youngest kids over to her oldest (20), so she could be free to do whatever she wanted (drugs and partying.) Heck, the kids might be better off with the oldest. She is more responsible than the mother!

 

 Ok, there are some cases when CPS does help, and I admit that. But please know that there are also times where CPS might be wrong.

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#41 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 08:47 PM
 
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I just wish that people would consider how hurtful comments like this are to those who HAVE had their lives unnecessarily interfered with or even destroyed by CPS over AP (or even more frivolous) reasons.  Or maybe people do consider it and just don't care...since all of us who have experienced CPS involvement must be guilty of something.  It's just so hard.  It's like people in jail; everyone their says that their innocent and nobody believes them.  And for the most part, the majority are probably not innocent.  But sometimes people are truly and honestly innocent.  And when you are that person, where do you turn?  People say that news stations or lawyers or somebody would be all over cases like that.  But they're not.  You can't get anyone to hear you or believe you, because everyone assumes you must be guilty and a liar.  Nobody wants to talk about it.  People are either pro-CPS and don't want to hear from or believe people like me; or they are extremely anti-CPS and make people like me look nuts. :-/  I have yet to find the middle ground.

 

And I am not defending the family in this article.  Even after all that me and my kids have been through, I am not radically anti-CPS.  CPS varies so much by state, city, and county (shoot, even by individual social worker).  But just because CPS involvement hasn't happened to you doesn't mean that it couldn't.  The wrong/overzealous/lying social worker combined with a bad ex boyfriend or vindictive MIL and your life can change forever.  I'm not saying it happens a lot.  But it does happen, whether or not the majority wants to believe it.  And I can't blame you if you don't.  I'm going on a year of this hell and it still feels unreal and unbelievable to even me.

 

I won't post anymore on this thread since I realize how off topic this is in the vaccine forum.  I just read the comments, felt a bit hurt, and had to say something.  I'm glad that this baby seems to be doing better and is back home now.

 

 

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I just want to say, as a child, all 5 of us were homebirthed, breastfed (till age 4 and tandemed!!!), co-slept and cloth diapered. and my mother didn't vax my youngest brother.  AND our health insurance was Kaiser Permanente for most of my childhood.  and she was never even threatened with CPS. not once. so, i am REALLY curious WHY you had so many run-ins with CPS.  i am 34 now.  and EVERYONE that i knew growing up lived a similar lifestyle. i honestly thought all babies were born at home and all mommies went to La Leche League until i was around 8.  and the only family that i knew that had CPS called on them had a serious sexual and physical abuse issue that resulted in one child being adopted out of the family.  i even knew homeschoolers before it was really legal and they never had problems. so, i have a hard time believing that those lifestyle choices would bring down CPS.



 

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#42 of 53 Old 07-10-2011, 10:10 PM
 
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Melaya, I'm so sorry to hear about this. I do hope you and your family can get through this ordeal.


 
 
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Obviously , thing different  form state to state. My ER doc thought that cloth diapers were great in prevention of diaper rash.  What do you mean written up? What was ER docs issues with cloth?

Doctors are mandated reporters. They do not have to give a warming to the abusers if they see abuse. Giving a mixture (one can;t call it an infant formula) that will damage child's kidney is abuse.

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So you are saying the doctor lied and turned them in to CPS behind their back? Then sent them a bill for his services. Seems like a failure in communication that the parents are bearing the brunt now. That is one of many reasons I do not trust doctors.  Trust is earned.  The medical community has not earned it from me. This happens too often.

 

As for the vax issue, any doctor will tell you it is a red flag and a reason to start looking for something else.  I was written up in an ER for cloth diapering and breastfeeding beyond a year.  They were digging deep on me. I still kept my child.  Believe me, not vaccinating your child makes you a social pariah.  Things have not changed in the attitudes of the medical community simply because we can log in to the internet and discuss the pros or cons of childhood vaccinations with people around the world.  I have lived that life and I know. 



 

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What did the ER doctor told you? That just seems bizzare. Did you complain to the hospital Patient Relations department?

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#46 of 53 Old 07-11-2011, 05:13 AM
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Blame the victim.  


Yeah, if someone's liver is 10 cm larger than normal and has fatty infiltration, it must be the flu vaccine he got and not the 40 years of hard liquor. eyesroll.gif

 

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I just wish that people would consider how hurtful comments like this are to those who HAVE had their lives unnecessarily interfered with or even destroyed by CPS over AP (or even more frivolous) reasons.  Or maybe people do consider it and just don't care...since all of us who have experienced CPS involvement must be guilty of something.  It's just so hard.  

 



 

Sorry.  

 

I did not want to cast aspersions on miriam or anyone else who has had issues with CPS.

 

I mentioned I had never had CPS involved because I did not want people thinking refusing to vax alone will bring CPS down on your head.  It was not my experience or the experience of other non-vaxxers that I know.  

 

I do not doubt that perfectly good parents sometimes do have CPS involvement, for a variety of reason.

 


 

 

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#48 of 53 Old 07-11-2011, 06:38 AM
 
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Being a non-vaxer was never an issue with me and doctors, schools, ER staff, etc.  And it is not what caused cps involvement in my life, so you're right about that.  However, once the involvement happened, my being anti-vax got brought up a lot and twisted in some bad ways to use against me (among other things).  So yeah, being anti-vax probably will not ever bring CPS to your door.  But to say that they don't care about it at all isn't exactly accurate either.  And for what it's worth, my perfectly healthy six year old was fully vaxed against my will/consent within a week of entering the system.  As the parent, you lose all rights to make or have a say in any medical decision.  So not only was she taken from her mom, home, life...but she was fully vaccinated (which had to have been very scary for her, she knew darn well that we didn't believe in vaccines and why we didn't get them).
 

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I mentioned I had never had CPS involved because I did not want people thinking refusing to vax alone will bring CPS down on your head.  It was not my experience or the experience of other non-vaxxers that I know.  

 

I do not doubt that perfectly good parents sometimes do have CPS involvement, for a variety of reason.

 


 

 



 

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#49 of 53 Old 07-11-2011, 06:48 AM
 
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How horrible greensad.gifangry.gif

 

I would probably be threatening to sue someone if they vaxxed my children before total Termination of Parental Rights happened.

 

I know in many places you cannot sue CPS, or doing so is borderline futile/not worth the energy - but I would be so mad!

 

Ugh.  Much healing to you and your DD.  goodvibes.gif

 

Kathy

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 Ok, there are some cases when CPS does help, and I admit that. But please know that there are also times where CPS might be wrong.

 

I agree, there are times when they are wrong. I think we can all cite cases where they have been overzealous or not nearly zealous enough in their investigations. It is a bureaucracy run by fallible people. Mistakes, poor decision making, bad judgment, all of that is possible. However, when someone says they have had multiple encounters with CPS, it sets up my radar and makes me question why. Especially when they claim it was for cloth diapering, breast feeding, home birthing, etc.
 

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I have his phone number; do you want to call and ask him?

 

Wait, aren't your children grown? You have an ER doc's  phone number from decades ago?
 

 


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Originally Posted by CrazyCatLady View Post

I just wish that people would consider how hurtful comments like this are to those who HAVE had their lives unnecessarily interfered with or even destroyed by CPS over AP (or even more frivolous) reasons.  Or maybe people do consider it and just don't care...since all of us who have experienced CPS involvement must be guilty of something.  It's just so hard.  It's like people in jail; everyone their says that their innocent and nobody believes them.  And for the most part, the majority are probably not innocent.  But sometimes people are truly and honestly innocent.  And when you are that person, where do you turn?  People say that news stations or lawyers or somebody would be all over cases like that.  But they're not.  You can't get anyone to hear you or believe you, because everyone assumes you must be guilty and a liar.  Nobody wants to talk about it.  People are either pro-CPS and don't want to hear from or believe people like me; or they are extremely anti-CPS and make people like me look nuts. :-/  I have yet to find the middle ground.

 

And I am not defending the family in this article.  Even after all that me and my kids have been through, I am not radically anti-CPS.  CPS varies so much by state, city, and county (shoot, even by individual social worker).  But just because CPS involvement hasn't happened to you doesn't mean that it couldn't.  The wrong/overzealous/lying social worker combined with a bad ex boyfriend or vindictive MIL and your life can change forever.  I'm not saying it happens a lot.  But it does happen, whether or not the majority wants to believe it.  And I can't blame you if you don't.  I'm going on a year of this hell and it still feels unreal and unbelievable to even me.

 

I won't post anymore on this thread since I realize how off topic this is in the vaccine forum.  I just read the comments, felt a bit hurt, and had to say something.  I'm glad that this baby seems to be doing better and is back home now.

 

 



 

I am very sorry you had such a trouble with CPS. i know very well that not all CPS cases are correct and that it does just take some very vindictive but simple accusations to get you under the microscope and your kids out of your hands.  i didn't mean to imply that.

 

 my issue was with someone using all these examples that in and of themselves shouldn't bring CPS.  i don't like the chicken little nature of the whole argument that if you practice AP you better watch out cause they will come and get you.  Miriam claimed that she had dealt with CPS many times and that makes me wonder why? because i imagine that if it was just a vindictive person attacking you, it would be one episode (maybe lasting over many years) but not multiple episodes. so if someone claims that they have had multiple episodes of CPS involvement, i would begin to question if it was really a simple matter of an ER doc calling because one used cloth diapers or extended breastfed.  maybe there is some fire with all that smoke. 

and if a parent is being investigated multiple times (as miriam seemed to be claiming) than i would probably not look to them for parenting advice.
 

 

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#52 of 53 Old 07-11-2011, 01:54 PM
 
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I totally get what you're saying.  And I know nothing about Miriam or her story.  I also don't (usually) think that being AP will bring cps to your door.  But I do know that once they are at your door for whatever reason, they can use your crunchy ways against you no matter how well researched or well spoken you may be.  And one ex boyfriend can keep calling and calling.  Then they have to investigate each and every time.  Right there that means multiple episodes of CPS involvement.  Because they keep opening and closing cases for every.single.report made.  The party who calls repeatedly is never held accountable for their bogus calls so they feel free to keep on calling and making your life difficult.  The closed cases don't just go away either...it stays in your file forever.  Then a couple of years later add a pissed off MIL who saw before how easy it was to call CPS on somebody (because she watched the whole situation with the ex boyfriend go down), so she then calls, and the investigating starts up again which equals more episodes of CPS involvement. 

 

I'm not saying that if someone has been called on by a variety of different people, that something might not be up.  Because if that many people are suspicious about something, then it may be worth investigating.  And I am not trying to lecture you specifically at all.  I just want the information out there for people who don't really know how the system works sometimes.  But it isn't always just as easy as show them your nice house, clean kids, etc. and it will all magically go away.  And having multiple cases of cps involvement doesn't necessarily mean that somebody is guilty either.  It could just mean that they know some really rude, clueless, or vindictive people. 

 

In my situation, I take complete responsibility for not completely cutting those people out of my life sooner.  That is where I screwed up.  But that doesn't make me guilty, a bad parent, or a child abuser...just because the system was used against me in such a terrible way.

 

Ok...again sorry for being off topic. redface.gif I promise to stay out of this thread now.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by raelize View Post


 

I am very sorry you had such a trouble with CPS. i know very well that not all CPS cases are correct and that it does just take some very vindictive but simple accusations to get you under the microscope and your kids out of your hands.  i didn't mean to imply that.

 

 my issue was with someone using all these examples that in and of themselves shouldn't bring CPS.  i don't like the chicken little nature of the whole argument that if you practice AP you better watch out cause they will come and get you.  Miriam claimed that she had dealt with CPS many times and that makes me wonder why? because i imagine that if it was just a vindictive person attacking you, it would be one episode (maybe lasting over many years) but not multiple episodes. so if someone claims that they have had multiple episodes of CPS involvement, i would begin to question if it was really a simple matter of an ER doc calling because one used cloth diapers or extended breastfed.  maybe there is some fire with all that smoke. 

and if a parent is being investigated multiple times (as miriam seemed to be claiming) than i would probably not look to them for parenting advice.
 

 



 

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#53 of 53 Old 07-11-2011, 01:56 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raelize View Post


 

I am very sorry you had such a trouble with CPS. i know very well that not all CPS cases are correct and that it does just take some very vindictive but simple accusations to get you under the microscope and your kids out of your hands.  i didn't mean to imply that.

 

 my issue was with someone using all these examples that in and of themselves shouldn't bring CPS.  i don't like the chicken little nature of the whole argument that if you practice AP you better watch out cause they will come and get you.  Miriam claimed that she had dealt with CPS many times and that makes me wonder why? because i imagine that if it was just a vindictive person attacking you, it would be one episode (maybe lasting over many years) but not multiple episodes. so if someone claims that they have had multiple episodes of CPS involvement, i would begin to question if it was really a simple matter of an ER doc calling because one used cloth diapers or extended breastfed.  maybe there is some fire with all that smoke. 

and if a parent is being investigated multiple times (as miriam seemed to be claiming) than i would probably not look to them for parenting advice.
 

 


Have you considered that, along with her own involvement, she might have been talking about CPS involvement of family or friends? It might not be just her own involvement with the CPS. Did she ever say that it was solely her own involvement going on? 

A lot of assumptions being thrown around here (my own included, I get it) As I stated in my previous post, my experience with CPS involved my own family member, not myself. But, if I say I had a bad experience with CPS, all of a sudden people would jump to conclusions and decide I'm a bad mother who has no right to give advice. When, in fact, I DID have a bad experience with CPS, because I feel they failed to help my family.


 
 
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