Scientists Say to Delay Breastfeeding to 'Improve' Vaccine Potency - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 06:09 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Scientists are now recommending that mothers delay vital breastfeeding in order to 'improve' the effects of vaccinations, stating that consuming breast milk could hamper the potency of vaccinations such as the rotavirus injection. 

 

 

http://www.www.sott.net/articles/show/240469-Scientists-Say-to-Delay-Breastfeeding-to-Improve-Vaccine-Potency?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

 

 

Live oral rotavirus vaccines have been less immunogenic and efficacious among children in poor developing countries compared with middle income and industrialized countries for reasons that are not yet completely understood. We assessed whether the neutralizing activity of breast milk could lower the titer of vaccine virus and explain this difference in vitro.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20442687

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#2 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 06:12 PM - Thread Starter
 
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http://naturalsociety.com/un-bill-gates-foundation-push-deadly-hpv-shots-on-poor-nations-under-gavi-alliance/

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#3 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 06:56 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imakcerka View Post

 

Scientists are now recommending that mothers delay vital breastfeeding in order to 'improve' the effects of vaccinations, stating that consuming breast milk could hamper the potency of vaccinations such as the rotavirus injection. 

 

 

http://www.www.sott.net/articles/show/240469-Scientists-Say-to-Delay-Breastfeeding-to-Improve-Vaccine-Potency?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

 

 

Live oral rotavirus vaccines have been less immunogenic and efficacious among children in poor developing countries compared with middle income and industrialized countries for reasons that are not yet completely understood. We assessed whether the neutralizing activity of breast milk could lower the titer of vaccine virus and explain this difference in vitro.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20442687

Ok, I have access to the full article and and the soft.net piece either deliberately or accidentally misstates the article's conclusions.

 

"In conclusion, our findings indicate that the neutralizing activity of breast milk could be one of the many factors that might explain the lower observed immunogenicity and effectiveness of live oral rotavirus vaccines among children in developing countries. These data should encourage clinical trials to investigate whether delaying breast-feeding for a short period before and after giving the vaccine (emphasis added) could reasonably improve the immune response and protective efficacy. Since all live oral rotavirus vaccines are potentially susceptible to interference from breast milk neutralizing activity and other factors such as maternal antibody and other enteric flora, a parenteral vaccine with nonliving rotavirus (eg, inactivated vaccine) should be pursued as an alternative that will provide an insurance policy to the global immunization agenda against rotaviruses.26

 

The study authors are suggesting not breastfeeding for an unspecified, BRIEF period of time around the administration of the vaccine be investigated. That's all.

 

 

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#4 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 06:59 PM
 
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Also, rotavirus is given orally. It's not an injection.


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#5 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 07:00 PM
 
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It's still stupid.  What if your baby is hungry in that "short period"?  And if you're going to inflict pain on your child the least you can do for them in breastfeed them while/immediately after a vaccine.  Rotavirus is always given with other injections if the baby is on schedule.

 

 


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#6 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 07:06 PM
 
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Well, rota-viral infections are deadly in third world countries because they lack $0.50 worth of re-dehydration solutions.

 

It is different in the  first world countries. My pedi actually said that we did not have to do rota virus vaccine if we did not feel like it because re-hydrating a baby in US is matter of arriving to ER if needed.

 

Delaying nursing by y 10-15-30 mins to protect a child from rota virus and death in a third world country  does not seem like such high price to pay to avoid infant's death.

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Originally Posted by lovebeingamomma View Post

It's still stupid.  What if your baby is hungry in that "short period"?  And if you're going to inflict pain on your child the least you can do for them in breastfeed them while/immediately after a vaccine.



 

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#7 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 07:07 PM
 
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No, it's not stupid. Diarrhea is a leading cause of infant and child death in developing countries. It would be stupidly shortsighted to be unwilling to let a baby cry a little extra for a couple of hours in exchange for better response to a vaccine that could save that baby's life. If you didn't notice, the researchers also encourage an inactivated vaccine to be developed to avoid this issue altogether.

 

ETA- basically, ditto, Alenushka.

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#8 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 07:18 PM
 
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I'm only suggesting that breastmilk, that has been proven to prevent many diseases, isn't the culprit for making a vaccine less effective.  Just my opinion, as it states, the "reasons are not yet completely understood".  Until it's proven I stand by opinion.  And I'm all for saving babies lives obviously, I just have a hard time believing this one...although if it's proven, I'm all ears.  I'm not anti-vaccine.  

 

Hmmm upon reading more into this I find this all very interesting...I will follow this story post any updates if found.  What I find sad is how countries (especially the US) are focusing so little on trying to improve breastfeeding rates but focus so much on vaccines.  SO much guilt put on mom's who don't vaccinate, but zero guilt on mom's who choose not to breastfeed when they can.  Another topic for another time perhaps :)

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#9 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 08:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm still looking into the "brief period"  how long is it?  And why are they finding the vaccines not being effective.  None of the findings are adequate to me.  I posted it on here hoping others would have a point of view due to knowledge over the issue.  So keep it coming.  If anyone can find something I'm missing link it please.

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#10 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 08:24 PM - Thread Starter
 
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http://www.breastfeeding.com/advocacy/advocacy_doctors_get_commissions.html

 

 

Interesting since it was brought up in numerous articles concerning delayed breastfeeding.  Where else are they going to get milk for their babies.  I'm trying to find out if the milk is liquid formula or powdered.  Powdered mixed with local water could be the culprit in the increase of disease to begin with.  

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#11 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 08:27 PM - Thread Starter
 
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No I have found that it states this is numerous articles.  I have yet to find the time period.  However they tested babies from 4 weeks on.  I have found a few articles that speak about Pakistan Dr's pushing formula.  And yet I can't find anything more.  I'm seriously losing my eyesight searching this junk.
 

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Originally Posted by Katie8681 View Post

Ok, I have access to the full article and and the soft.net piece either deliberately or accidentally misstates the article's conclusions.

 

"In conclusion, our findings indicate that the neutralizing activity of breast milk could be one of the many factors that might explain the lower observed immunogenicity and effectiveness of live oral rotavirus vaccines among children in developing countries. These data should encourage clinical trials to investigate whether delaying breast-feeding for a short period before and after giving the vaccine (emphasis added) could reasonably improve the immune response and protective efficacy. Since all live oral rotavirus vaccines are potentially susceptible to interference from breast milk neutralizing activity and other factors such as maternal antibody and other enteric flora, a parenteral vaccine with nonliving rotavirus (eg, inactivated vaccine) should be pursued as an alternative that will provide an insurance policy to the global immunization agenda against rotaviruses.26

 

The study authors are suggesting not breastfeeding for an unspecified, BRIEF period of time around the administration of the vaccine be investigated. That's all.

 

 



 

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#12 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 08:52 PM
 
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But breastfed babies are far less likely to GET rotavirus in the first place, which is spread via contaminated feces.  And the best way to rehydrate an infant is with breast milk. 

 

I fear this is simply a marketing ploy of the pharmaceutical/formula industry.  Formula has no place in third-world countries anyway, where it is likely to be mixed with tainted water (likely the primary source of rotavirus in the first place) and improperly watered down to last longer.

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#13 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 09:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I took some pieces out of the article, it's a very lengthy article!  There were three factors and I only pasted two as the third was much longer.  Read it if you have time.  I'm beginning to think this is one of those findings that hasn't been researched enough and possibly should not have made it out to the public.  They do not have real answers.  Only possibilities. 

 

 

http://demystifyingmedicine.od.nih.gov/DM10/0406-DiarrhealDiseases/Oral%20Rotavirus%20Vaccines%20%20How%20Well%20They%20Work%20When%20They%20are%20Needed.pdf

 

 

Data from early studies of vaccine
failures completed 3–5 years ago in Bangladesh and South Africa
could establish whether high titers of transplacental antibody
in the infant could neutralize vaccine virus in the gut and
inhibit a robust immune response. Unfortunately, to date, these
results have neither been released by the company nor published
by the investigators [39–43].
 
No differences
in vaccine efficacy were noted between mothers who self-reported
breastfeeding, compared with those who did not.
 
However,
these studies did not examine a key parameter critical to
determining whether breastfeeding might make an impact: the
specific interval between breastfeeding and the administration
of vaccine [3, 4]. If the vaccine was administered at a time
when the infant had not recently been feeding, the vaccine strain
could pass unimpeded to the gut and begin replicating. However,
if the infant was being breast fed at the time of vaccination,
its mouth and gastrointestinal tract could become in vivo sites
for virus neutralization and the vaccine might be expected to
have a diminished effect. Other factors in breast milk might
either buffer the virus from stomach acid and enhance its effect
[49] or entrap virus and prevent it from attachment. No studies
have been conducted to date to determine whether the interval
between breastfeeding and vaccination has any effect on the
immune response to the vaccine

 

 

 

Stomach acid. Rotavirus can be damaged by low pH in the
stomach, and each of the vaccines is administered with a buffer
solution to neutralize stomach acid and maintain the titer of
the virus [52]. The quantity of stomach acid in infants in developing
countries has not been measured; thus, it is unclear
whether a difference in levels of gastric acidity might influence
vaccine uptake.
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#14 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 09:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Big pharma needs to corner the 3rd world country Market.  I've found quite a few articles that state a new push for formula in third world countries.  However the evidence appears to be hearsay.  I haven't found anything conclusive.   
 

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Originally Posted by Taximom5 View Post

But breastfed babies are far less likely to GET rotavirus in the first place, which is spread via contaminated feces.  And the best way to rehydrate an infant is with breast milk. 

 

I fear this is simply a marketing ploy of the pharmaceutical/formula industry.  Formula has no place in third-world countries anyway, where it is likely to be mixed with tainted water (likely the primary source of rotavirus in the first place) and improperly watered down to last longer.



 

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Alenushka View Post

 

Delaying nursing by y 10-15-30 mins to protect a child from rota virus and death in a third world country  does not seem like such high price to pay to avoid infant's death.


 

Where did you get the 10-30 minutes from?

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#16 of 55 Old 01-21-2012, 09:11 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Brief meant 10-30 minutes to her.  However the last article I posted stated...

 

Maybe she founds something I didn't

 

 

No studies
have been conducted to date to determine whether the interval
between breastfeeding and vaccination has any effect on the
immune response to the vaccine
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"None of the findings are adequate to me."

It's _research_, not a clinical guideline. It's a scholarly paper investigating one hypothesis of why the rotavirus vaccine has better rates of efficacy in developed countries, and it made no sweeping recommendations, just suggestions for direction of future research. It was published and was then seized upon by anti-vacc website writers who don't understand and maybe don't want to understand the science involved, because they're obsessed with conspiracy theories.

 

From the second article you posted (which is an awesome and fascinating read about this issue that I'd never heard about- tx for posting):

 

"The exact time of transit of a rotavirus strain from the mouth to the intestine is not precisely known. Gastric emptying times estimated using the Carbon 13 octanoic breath test arrived at a half-time of 47 min [68]; however, these estimates might not be the same for infants in developing countries. Because infants aged 6–24 weeks feed every 120–180 min [69], a delay of 60 min before or after vaccination would allow assessment of the inhibitory effect that concomitant breastfeeding and vaccination might have on immunogenicity. It could also improve the depressed immune response to the vaccine found in Thai infants that was previously reported [45]. Other interventions could be targeted to assess improvements in host response that might be achieved by administering zinc, vitamin A, or a probiotic, such as Lactobacillus GG, at the time of vaccination."

 

So they are suggesting a sixty minute feed delay. Reading entire articles before passing judgment is good.

 

 

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#18 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 05:50 AM
 
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Heres a good idea:  why not do a study of only USA infants, rather than including/comparing to a  3rd world country, who's living conditions dont even come close to ours? Wouldn't they get a better outcome of their findings on this issue since we dont have dirty water and we have enough nutritious food?   

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#19 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 08:10 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I read the entire article.  In fact I read them all.  
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katie8681 View Post

"None of the findings are adequate to me."

It's _research_, not a clinical guideline. It's a scholarly paper investigating one hypothesis of why the rotavirus vaccine has better rates of efficacy in developed countries, and it made no sweeping recommendations, just suggestions for direction of future research. It was published and was then seized upon by anti-vacc website writers who don't understand and maybe don't want to understand the science involved, because they're obsessed with conspiracy theories.

 

From the second article you posted (which is an awesome and fascinating read about this issue that I'd never heard about- tx for posting):

 

"The exact time of transit of a rotavirus strain from the mouth to the intestine is not precisely known. Gastric emptying times estimated using the Carbon 13 octanoic breath test arrived at a half-time of 47 min [68]; however, these estimates might not be the same for infants in developing countries. Because infants aged 6–24 weeks feed every 120–180 min [69], a delay of 60 min before or after vaccination would allow assessment of the inhibitory effect that concomitant breastfeeding and vaccination might have on immunogenicity. It could also improve the depressed immune response to the vaccine found in Thai infants that was previously reported [45]. Other interventions could be targeted to assess improvements in host response that might be achieved by administering zinc, vitamin A, or a probiotic, such as Lactobacillus GG, at the time of vaccination."

 

So they are suggesting a sixty minute feed delay. Reading entire articles before passing judgment is good.

 

 



 

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"Heres a good idea:  why not do a study of only USA infants, rather than including/comparing to a  3rd world country, who's living conditions dont even come close to ours?" 

 

Because the issue they're looking at is how to improve the vaccine efficacy in infants in 3rd world countries.


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#21 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 10:50 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Big Pharma already cornered the market here.  Hell China is even looking into it.  MONEY!  Say what you will. 
 

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Originally Posted by Katie8681 View Post

"Heres a good idea:  why not do a study of only USA infants, rather than including/comparing to a  3rd world country, who's living conditions dont even come close to ours?" 

 

Because the issue they're looking at is how to improve the vaccine efficacy in infants in 3rd world countries.



 

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#22 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 10:50 AM
 
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www.pediatricsupersite.com

 

No word here about a short time elemination of breastfeeding: "Infants who are breast-fed may mount less of an immune response against rotavirus after vaccination compared with infants who are exclusively formula-fed."

 

Edited to bold the important.


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#23 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
 
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There is a lot of contradictory information out there.  
 

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Originally Posted by boomer78 View Post

 

www.pediatricsupersite.com

 

No word here about a short time elemination of breastfeeding: "Infants who are breast-fed may mount less of an immune response against rotavirus after vaccination compared with infants who are exclusively formula-fed."



 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imakcerka View Post

 

No differences
in vaccine efficacy were noted between mothers who self-reported
breastfeeding, compared with those who did not.
 
 

Bolding mine.

 

Don't they realize it makes an ENORMOUS difference whether the babies were completely breastfed or fed some formula/water (probably tainted) or anything else?????  It's like the researchers are purposely setting this up for an outcome of "formula feeding makes vaccines work better."

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Quote:
Originally Posted by boomer78 View Post

 

www.pediatricsupersite.com

 

No word here about a short time elemination of breastfeeding: "Infants who are breast-fed may mount less of an immune response against rotavirus after vaccination compared with infants who are exclusively formula-fed."


No word about the fact that infants who are breast-fed not NEEDING rotavirus vaccination, either.

http://www.drmomma.org/2010/01/breastfeeding-protects-against.html

 

“Rotavirus vaccine cuts deaths of Mexican babies from diarrhoea by 40%," states a January, 2010, British Medical Journal headline summarizing two studies.(1) Yet, a study of Brazilian children finds that exclusive breastfeeding cuts diarrhea cases in this similarly developing nation by a whopping 90% (1 / 9.41), versus a diet of formula and/or other foods.(2)

A study on the cost of breastfeeding promotion programs for Brazil and Mexico accounted a 30 to 40 cent cost per birth for breastfeeding promotion programs.(3) The vaccine costs $190 for a series of 3 oral Rotovirus doses. The vaccine also leads to a substantial increase in cases of intussusception, a dangerous intestinal condition where part of the intestine folds in, inside itself. Treatment costs and lives lost from this side effect of the vaccine should be considered as well.

 

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"The lower immunogenicity and efficacy of rotavirus vaccines in poor developing countries could be explained, in part, by higher titers of IgA and neutralizing activity in breast milk consumed by their infants at the time of immunization that could effectively reduce the potency of the vaccine. Strategies to overcome this negative effect, such as delaying breast-feeding at the time of immunization, should be evaluated."

They've just proved that BREASTMILK DESTROYS THE VIRUS IN QUESTION. Basically, they've just proved that breastfed babies don't need the rotavirus vaccine in the first place.

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#27 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 01:05 PM
 
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Hm, it has not been my experience that breast milk is the only thing that goes into a breastfed baby's mouth. My baby puts his fingers, everybody else's fingers, anything and everything he finds on the floor, etc., straight into his mouth. I think that is pretty typical of babies. Depending on a baby's environment, I can see how even an EBF kid could easily be exposed to rotavirus.

 

Look, nobody is trying to get mothers to stop breastfeeding, at least through this line of research. Let's put the torches and pitchforks away.

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#28 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 01:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Seriously?  You have to realize that big companies always have and always will take advantage of 3rd world countries.  I'll keep my pitch fork out thank you.eyesroll.gif
 

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Originally Posted by Katie8681 View Post

Hm, it has not been my experience that breast milk is the only thing that goes into a breastfed baby's mouth. My baby puts his fingers, everybody else's fingers, anything and everything he finds on the floor, etc., straight into his mouth. I think that is pretty typical of babies. Depending on a baby's environment, I can see how even an EBF kid could easily be exposed to rotavirus.

 

Look, nobody is trying to get mothers to stop breastfeeding, at least through this line of research. Let's put the torches and pitchforks away.



 

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#29 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 02:53 PM
 
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My thought exactly. I should have bolded some words. Some were arguing that the first article only mentioned a SHORT TIME break in bf. The one I posted clearly states breastfed vs. exclusively formula fed. I feel like GSK is paving its path of destruction some more by forcing moms in some countries to not bf at all or to eliminate it. Of course I could be wrong. I'm sincerely hoping I am.
 

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No word about the fact that infants who are breast-fed not NEEDING rotavirus vaccination, either.

http://www.drmomma.org/2010/01/breastfeeding-protects-against.html

 

“Rotavirus vaccine cuts deaths of Mexican babies from diarrhoea by 40%," states a January, 2010, British Medical Journal headline summarizing two studies.(1) Yet, a study of Brazilian children finds that exclusive breastfeeding cuts diarrhea cases in this similarly developing nation by a whopping 90% (1 / 9.41), versus a diet of formula and/or other foods.(2)

A study on the cost of breastfeeding promotion programs for Brazil and Mexico accounted a 30 to 40 cent cost per birth for breastfeeding promotion programs.(3) The vaccine costs $190 for a series of 3 oral Rotovirus doses. The vaccine also leads to a substantial increase in cases of intussusception, a dangerous intestinal condition where part of the intestine folds in, inside itself. Treatment costs and lives lost from this side effect of the vaccine should be considered as well.

 



 


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#30 of 55 Old 01-22-2012, 02:59 PM
 
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That's exactly what I thought when I had read it. Breast milk, being as wonderful as it is, destroys the virus and takes care of what should not be in the body in the first place (and without the need of toxic chemicals). 

 

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Originally Posted by Taximom5 View Post

 

"The lower immunogenicity and efficacy of rotavirus vaccines in poor developing countries could be explained, in part, by higher titers of IgA and neutralizing activity in breast milk consumed by their infants at the time of immunization that could effectively reduce the potency of the vaccine. Strategies to overcome this negative effect, such as delaying breast-feeding at the time of immunization, should be evaluated."

They've just proved that BREASTMILK DESTROYS THE VIRUS IN QUESTION. Basically, they've just proved that breastfed babies don't need the rotavirus vaccine in the first place.



 


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