Red Flags For Risk of Vaccine Reaction - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 37 Old 05-31-2012, 05:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
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At Super-Single-Mama's request, here is a list of situations that could place an infant at risk for adverse reaction to vaccines.

 

 

Red Flags For Vaccine Reaction

 

Family history of thimerosal allergy

Family history of vaccine reaction

Family history of autoimmune disorders

Family history of allergies

Family history of seizure disorders

 

Mother with thyroid disease

Mother with preeclampsia during pregnancy

Mother with gestational diabetes

Mother with hypermesis of pregnancy

Mother with vitamin deficiency, particularly D deficiency

 

 

Low-birthweight or premature infant

Failure-to-thrive infant

Infant with current medical condition

Infant with current illness, especially febrile and diarrheal illnesses

Infant with vitamin deficiency, particularly D deficiency

 

If anyone has additional red flags, please post them, and I will add them to the list!

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#2 of 37 Old 05-31-2012, 05:36 PM
 
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Is there a link to this information or are these just situations where you personally feel are possible red flags because I'm not sure i understand how some would be connected to vaccine reaction risk.
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#3 of 37 Old 05-31-2012, 05:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
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http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00046738.htm is one source of information.

 

In our family, we had most of these red flags going on;  I was later told by doctors that many of these were, in fact, red flags for vaccine reaction.  So, yes, some of this comes from personal experience as well.

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#4 of 37 Old 05-31-2012, 05:46 PM
 
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Thanks for posting this, I appreciate the info as well as learning more about your perspective.
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#5 of 37 Old 06-01-2012, 11:48 AM
 
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Great idea to post a list!  It's hard to explain all the reasons for making the decisions on vaccines.  but this is great and i will certainly pass it on.

 

nothing to add (yet)!


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#6 of 37 Old 06-04-2012, 08:31 AM
 
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With those "Red" flags, you could conclude that vaccines are reacting to an already troubled host. 

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#7 of 37 Old 06-04-2012, 11:37 AM - Thread Starter
 
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With those "Red" flags, you could conclude that vaccines are reacting to an already troubled host. 

I think it's the troubled host that is reacting to the vaccine, but it is also likely that a host is not troubled, but has the potential for trouble--and the vaccine is the trigger. There are probably other triggers as well, but something directly injected into the body is a more obvious trigger than living close to a highway.

 

There are no screenings in place to identify troubled hosts--and many of these "troubles" can be subclinical, and/or can be exacerbated or even triggered by the vaccines.

 

If people (like me, my children, and thousands of others who report the same thing) appear 100% healthy, and then react badly to a vaccine that other people have no trouble with, then much, much more research needs to be done before those vaccines are declared "safe."

 

It is very troubling that reactions like mine have not been studied; and even more disturbing that so many reactions like mine did not get reported by doctors, and are blown off when reported by patients.

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#8 of 37 Old 06-04-2012, 11:48 AM
 
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Taxi we've discussed this before.  I have RA, my mom has Guillian Berre and my brother is undiagnosed.  I have a cousin with cycle cell anemia and there is lupus and a few others in my family.  Hereditary?  Possibly.  We're we all vaccinated... NO!  Any virus, bacteria or trauma physical or mental can cause and AI to come out of dormancy. 

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Those reactions are studied.

Taxi I'm confused why your reactions are still unreported. Why haven't you gone on vaers and reported your and your children's reactions?
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#10 of 37 Old 06-04-2012, 11:59 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Taxi we've discussed this before.  I have RA, my mom has Guillian Berre and my brother is undiagnosed.  I have a cousin with cycle cell anemia and there is lupus and a few others in my family.  Hereditary?  Possibly.  We're we all vaccinated... NO!  Any virus, bacteria or trauma physical or mental can cause and AI to come out of dormancy. 

Yes, we've discussed this before.  (sigh)

 

My reactions alone don't prove that vaccines cause these reactions.

 

The fact that people in your family have AI and have never been vaccinated does not prove that vaccines DON'T cause these reactions. As I said, there are other triggers.

 

But the fact that thousands of other people have reported exactly the same reactions that I have had, and that my children have had, DOES indicate that yes, vaccines can and do cause these reactions.


If Person A has hives that are caused by eating peanuts, and Person B has hives that are caused by fabric softener, but can eat a pound of peanuts with no reaction, Person B's experience does not mean that Person A is not allergic to peanuts, nor does it mean that thousands of other people aren't allergic to peanuts.

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#11 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 04:21 AM
 
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Vaccines do not cause AI diseases/disorders.  They can trigger them.  Trigger them.  They are dormant in your body.  My kids are fully vaccinated, however I do not allow the flu shot.  This has not proven to be a problem for us.  The flu shot is the vaccine that should be thoroughly researched if AI's run in your family. 

 

Again, they're hereditary (possibly) and can be triggered by TRAUMA to the body.  They are not caused by vaccines.  Vaccines do not give you AI's. 

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#12 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 06:31 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Vaccines do not cause AI diseases/disorders.  They can trigger them.  Trigger them.  They are dormant in your body.  My kids are fully vaccinated, however I do not allow the flu shot.  This has not proven to be a problem for us.  The flu shot is the vaccine that should be thoroughly researched if AI's run in your family. 

 

Again, they're hereditary (possibly) and can be triggered by TRAUMA to the body.  They are not caused by vaccines.  Vaccines do not give you AI's. 

 

The recently published studies on aluminum adjuvants and their causal effects of autoimmune disorders indicate a causal relationship.  Those studies have been posted many times on this forum, but if you would like, I can post them again for you.

 

Since vaccines other than the flu shot have been linked with AI's, and since there is research linking aluminum adjuvants to AI's, it's not the flu virus that should be specifically researched, but all vaccines.

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#13 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 06:39 AM
 
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Please post them again if it's not too much trouble.
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The recently published studies on aluminum adjuvants and their causal effects of autoimmune disorders indicate a causal relationship.  Those studies have been posted many times on this forum, but if you would like, I can post them again for you.

 

Since vaccines other than the flu shot have been linked with AI's, and since there is research linking aluminum adjuvants to AI's, it's not the flu virus that should be specifically researched, but all vaccines.

 

 

Any trauma to the body can trigger AI's.  Any.  Food poisoning could be the culprit.  A car accident could be the culprit.  Not just vaccines.  PTSD can be the culprit.  Women coming back from Iraq have a high diagnosis of AI's.  Surgery could be the culprit.  Pregnancy, Environmental toxins, Heredity, Stress, Anxiety, anything!

 

There are so many factors involved it boggles my mind why anyone would stick to one thing and one thing only.  If you eliminated Vaccines... you'd still have AI's. They'd still be prevalent you can't stop environmental factors, you can't the possibility of trauma.  

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Any trauma to the body can trigger AI's.  Any.  Food poisoning could be the culprit.  A car accident could be the culprit.  Not just vaccines.  PTSD can be the culprit.  Women coming back from Iraq have a high diagnosis of AI's.  Surgery could be the culprit.  Pregnancy, Environmental toxins, Heredity, Stress, Anxiety, anything!

 

There are so many factors involved it boggles my mind why anyone would stick to one thing and one thing only.  If you eliminated Vaccines... you'd still have AI's. They'd still be prevalent you can't stop environmental factors, you can't the possibility of trauma.  

 

That's one reason I do my best to avoid food poisoning, car accidents, surgery, environmental toxins, stress, etc. That's also one reason I avoid vaccines for me and my family.

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That's one reason I do my best to avoid food poisoning, car accidents, surgery, environmental toxins, stress, etc. That's also one reason I avoid vaccines for me and my family.

 

 

Are you kidding? 

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#17 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 11:21 AM
 
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Vaccines do not cause AI diseases/disorders.  They can trigger them.  Trigger them.  They are dormant in your body.  My kids are fully vaccinated, however I do not allow the flu shot.  This has not proven to be a problem for us.  The flu shot is the vaccine that should be thoroughly researched if AI's run in your family. 

 

Again, they're hereditary (possibly) and can be triggered by TRAUMA to the body.  They are not caused by vaccines.  Vaccines do not give you AI's. 

 

Vaccines do cause TRAUMA to the body. Hence the creation of antibodies. So vaccines (among other things, if you like) can lead to AI . Once again I bring your attention to the Perdue study.


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Vaccines do not cause AI diseases/disorders.  They can trigger them.  Trigger them.  They are dormant in your body.  My kids are fully vaccinated, however I do not allow the flu shot.  This has not proven to be a problem for us.  The flu shot is the vaccine that should be thoroughly researched if AI's run in your family. 

 

Again, they're hereditary (possibly) and can be triggered by TRAUMA to the body.  They are not caused by vaccines.  Vaccines do not give you AI's. 

 

Vaccines do cause TRAUMA to the body. Hence the creation of antibodies. So vaccines (among other things, if you like) can lead to AI . Once again I bring your attention to the Perdue study.

 

Thats what Imakcerka said. Only she keeps reiterating that AI diseases are already dormant in the body before the trauma happens. That means that someone who has an AI disease dormant in their body is probably going to develop that AI disease anyway - and it could be triggered by anything.

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#19 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 11:26 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Imakcerka, the prevalence and incidence of ALL autoimmune disorders has been increasing--drastically.  If vaccines were only a trigger in the way that any virus or trauma to the body would be, then we would have seen the same prevalence and incidence of these diseases 50 years ago.


We didn't.

 

Just like autism, there is no such thing as a genetic epidemic.  It is generally recognized that autoimmune diseases have environmental causes/triggers; ignoring the fact that we have been injecting ourselves with more and more heavy metals such as mercury and aluminum is ignoring the most likely environmental trigger.  That doesn't mean that there aren't other environmental triggers, and it doesn't mean that vaccines are the trigger for everyone.

 

But we can't afford to ignore the elephant in the room any more.

 

http://www.webmd.com/rheumatoid-arthritis/news/20110110/1-in-12-women-will-have-autoimmune-disease

1 in 12 Women Will Have Autoimmune Disease

 

http://www.endocrine-abstracts.org/ea/0016/ea0016s3.1.htm

Why is the incidence of autoimmune diseases increasing in the modern world?

 

http://www.elaine-moore.com/Articles/EnvironmentalTriggersandInfluences/InfectionandVaccinesinAutoimmuneDisease/tabid/210/Default.aspx

In an article in the September 2002 New England Journal of Medicine, the French researcher Jean-Francois Bach explains how a reduction in the incidence of infectious diseases caused by vaccines, antibiotics, and septic environments is directly responsible for the increased incidence of autoimmune disorder

 

http://www.overcomingmultiplesclerosis.org/News-And-Events/Archive/Detail/Tasmanian+study+shows+MS+incidence+increasing+significantly/

Tasmanian Study Shows MS Incidence Increasing Significantly

"Their data confirm findings from other parts of the world indicating a markedly increasing incidence and prevalence of this disease."


http://www.cdc.gov/diabetes/statistics/prev/national/figage.ht

Fmrom 1980 through 2010, the crude prevalence of diagnosed diabetes increased by 176%.

 

http://rawarrior.com/incidence-of-rheumatoid-arthritis-increasing-women-especially/

Incidence of Rheumatoid Arthritis Increasing, Especially In Women

 

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Thats what Imakcerka said. Only she keeps reiterating that AI diseases are already dormant in the body before the trauma happens. That means that someone who has an AI disease dormant in their body is probably going to develop that AI disease anyway - and it could be triggered by anything.

But we don't KNOW that AI diseases are already dormant in the body; that's just a hypothesis, and a pretty lousy one at that.

 

I've been through car accidents, childbirth, miscarriage, and plenty of viral/bacterial illnesses and emotional traumas.

 

None of them triggered an AI for me.


Vaccines triggered at least 2 for me.


So you can't say that something would have triggered them anyway.

 

A

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#21 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 11:44 AM
 
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Vaccines do not cause AI diseases/disorders.  They can trigger them.  Trigger them.  They are dormant in your body.  My kids are fully vaccinated, however I do not allow the flu shot.  This has not proven to be a problem for us.  The flu shot is the vaccine that should be thoroughly researched if AI's run in your family. 

 

Again, they're hereditary (possibly) and can be triggered by TRAUMA to the body.  They are not caused by vaccines.  Vaccines do not give you AI's. 

 

Vaccines do cause TRAUMA to the body. Hence the creation of antibodies. So vaccines (among other things, if you like) can lead to AI . Once again I bring your attention to the Perdue study.

 

Thats what Imakcerka said. Only she keeps reiterating that AI diseases are already dormant in the body before the trauma happens. That means that someone who has an AI disease dormant in their body is probably going to develop that AI disease anyway - and it could be triggered by anything.

Sorry but that is absolute nonsense. AI disease occurs as a result of damage or wounds in the body. Every vaccine causes damage, or they wouldn't create antibodies, yes, other things can cause damage also, for example environmental toxins. Now, some people are more fragile than others, and this can be inherited, poor maternal/grand-material diet is also a major factor; for those the degree of auto immunity can be much more serious. In the Perdue Study on Great Danes, every vaccinated dog had auto-antibodies, none of the unvaccinated dogs did.


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Are you kidding? 

What part of my post do you not understand, that would lead you to believe I might be kidding?

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Vaccines do not cause AI diseases/disorders.  They can trigger them.  Trigger them.  They are dormant in your body.  My kids are fully vaccinated, however I do not allow the flu shot.  This has not proven to be a problem for us.  The flu shot is the vaccine that should be thoroughly researched if AI's run in your family. 

 

Again, they're hereditary (possibly) and can be triggered by TRAUMA to the body.  They are not caused by vaccines.  Vaccines do not give you AI's. 

 

Vaccines do cause TRAUMA to the body. Hence the creation of antibodies. So vaccines (among other things, if you like) can lead to AI . Once again I bring your attention to the Perdue study.

 

Thats what Imakcerka said. Only she keeps reiterating that AI diseases are already dormant in the body before the trauma happens. That means that someone who has an AI disease dormant in their body is probably going to develop that AI disease anyway - and it could be triggered by anything.

Sorry but that is absolute nonsense. AI disease occurs as a result of damage or wounds in the body. Every vaccine causes damage, or they wouldn't create antibodies, yes, other things can cause damage also, for example environmental toxins. Now, some people are more fragile than others, and this can be inherited, poor maternal/grand-material diet is also a major factor; for those the degree of auto immunity can be much more serious. In the Perdue Study on Great Danes, every vaccinated dog had auto-antibodies, none of the unvaccinated dogs did.

 

Proof please?

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#24 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 12:29 PM
 
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But we don't KNOW that AI diseases are already dormant in the body; that's just a hypothesis, and a pretty lousy one at that.

 

I've been through car accidents, childbirth, miscarriage, and plenty of viral/bacterial illnesses and emotional traumas.

 

None of them triggered an AI for me.


Vaccines triggered at least 2 for me.


So you can't say that something would have triggered them anyway.

 

A

 

Are you saying that the only possible way to get an AI are vaccines?

 

Are you saying that those who are unvaccinated who have AI's are lying?

 

Are you unaware that quite a few AI's were at one point considered Orphan diseases?  Understudied diseases.  In the 80's Guillian Barre was considered an Orphan disease.  I have two Orphan Diseases.  TWO.  I've had them my whole life.  They're still not a huge push to study them.  No money to do so. 

 

The problem I have with you saying vaccines cause AI's and only vaccines cause AI's is that it's not true. 

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At Super-Single-Mama's request, here is a list of situations that could place an infant at risk for adverse reaction to vaccines.

 

 

Red Flags For Vaccine Reaction

 

 

Family history of vaccine reaction

Family history of autoimmune disorders

 

Mother with hypermesis of pregnancy

Mother with vitamin deficiency, particularly D deficiency

 

These first 2 I knew, which is why we delayed that vaccine for our kids, one of whom developed hives after the second dose. Not sure why it didn't happen after the first dose, but perhaps he's allergic to something he doesn't contact other than in that vax? So first dose developed sensitivity, second dose developed hives? 

 

I also hadn't heard the other two I quoted. Are there studies for these? I tested vitamin D deficient 6 months or so after his hives, which was probably an ongoing thing. I wouldn't be surprised if he had been deficient as well. I've read that vitamin D can help with chronic hives, which his became, and we do supplement with it now. And I did have hyperemesis with him and not with his sister. Hmmm.... 

 

I did discover that HepB titers are considered proof of immunity in our state, so we may do that to see if we can stop needing the medical exemption (people don't seem to know what to do with them, camp and school-wise; I guess they're rare.) 


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Vaccines do not cause AI diseases/disorders.  They can trigger them.  Trigger them.  They are dormant in your body.  My kids are fully vaccinated, however I do not allow the flu shot.  This has not proven to be a problem for us.  The flu shot is the vaccine that should be thoroughly researched if AI's run in your family. 

 

Again, they're hereditary (possibly) and can be triggered by TRAUMA to the body.  They are not caused by vaccines.  Vaccines do not give you AI's. 

 

Vaccines do cause TRAUMA to the body. Hence the creation of antibodies. So vaccines (among other things, if you like) can lead to AI . Once again I bring your attention to the Perdue study.

 

Thats what Imakcerka said. Only she keeps reiterating that AI diseases are already dormant in the body before the trauma happens. That means that someone who has an AI disease dormant in their body is probably going to develop that AI disease anyway - and it could be triggered by anything.

Sorry but that is absolute nonsense. AI disease occurs as a result of damage or wounds in the body. Every vaccine causes damage, or they wouldn't create antibodies, yes, other things can cause damage also, for example environmental toxins. Now, some people are more fragile than others, and this can be inherited, poor maternal/grand-material diet is also a major factor; for those the degree of auto immunity can be much more serious. In the Perdue Study on Great Danes, every vaccinated dog had auto-antibodies, none of the unvaccinated dogs did.

 

Proof please?

What are antibodies?


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#27 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 12:58 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Are you saying that the only possible way to get an AI are vaccines?

 

Are you saying that those who are unvaccinated who have AI's are lying?

 

Are you unaware that quite a few AI's were at one point considered Orphan diseases?  Understudied diseases.  In the 80's Guillian Barre was considered an Orphan disease.  I have two Orphan Diseases.  TWO.  I've had them my whole life.  They're still not a huge push to study them.  No money to do so. 

 

The problem I have with you saying vaccines cause AI's and only vaccines cause AI's is that it's not true. 

 

 

Imakcerka, if you read my 2 previous posts on page 1 of THIS THREAD, you will have seen that I acknowledge that there are other triggers besides for vaccines. In fact, you have read my responses to you in other threads AND in pms, I have acknowledged this SEVERAL TIMES.

 

I have NEVER said that vaccines are the only cause of autoimmune disorders.

 

It is a mystery to me why you continue to drastically misquote me so.

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Originally Posted by Taximom5 View Post

I think it's the troubled host that is reacting to the vaccine, but it is also likely that a host is not troubled, but has the potential for trouble--and the vaccine is the trigger. There are probably other triggers as well, but something directly injected into the body is a more obvious trigger than living close to a highway.

 

There are no screenings in place to identify troubled hosts--and many of these "troubles" can be subclinical, and/or can be exacerbated or even triggered by the vaccines.

 

If people (like me, my children, and thousands of others who report the same thing) appear 100% healthy, and then react badly to a vaccine that other people have no trouble with, then much, much more research needs to be done before those vaccines are declared "safe."

 

It is very troubling that reactions like mine have not been studied; and even more disturbing that so many reactions like mine did not get reported by doctors, and are blown off when reported by patients.

 

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Originally Posted by Taximom5 View Post

Yes, we've discussed this before.  (sigh)

 

My reactions alone don't prove that vaccines cause these reactions.

 

The fact that people in your family have AI and have never been vaccinated does not prove that vaccines DON'T cause these reactions. As I said, there are other triggers.

 

But the fact that thousands of other people have reported exactly the same reactions that I have had, and that my children have had, DOES indicate that yes, vaccines can and do cause these reactions.


If Person A has hives that are caused by eating peanuts, and Person B has hives that are caused by fabric softener, but can eat a pound of peanuts with no reaction, Person B's experience does not mean that Person A is not allergic to peanuts, nor does it mean that thousands of other people aren't allergic to peanuts.

 
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#28 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 01:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by LitMom View Post

These first 2 I knew, which is why we delayed that vaccine for our kids, one of whom developed hives after the second dose. Not sure why it didn't happen after the first dose, but perhaps he's allergic to something he doesn't contact other than in that vax? So first dose developed sensitivity, second dose developed hives? 

 

I also hadn't heard the other two I quoted. Are there studies for these? I tested vitamin D deficient 6 months or so after his hives, which was probably an ongoing thing. I've read that vitamin D can help with chronic hives, which his became, and supplementation with it did seem to help a tiny bit. I wouldn't be surprised if he had been deficient as well. And I did have hyperemesis with him and not with his sister.

I'm just about to rush out the door to pick up child from bus-stop, so I'll try to post the links later. 

 

Vitamin D deficiency results in glutathione depletion. Without glutathione, the body cannot excrete heavy metals, such as mercury and aluminum.

 

You might be able to find the information on www.vitamindcouncil.org.

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#29 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 01:08 PM
 
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"I think it's the troubled host that is reacting to the vaccine, but it is also likely that a host is not troubled, but has the potential for trouble--and the vaccine is the trigger. There are probably other triggers as well, but something directly injected into the body is a more obvious trigger than living close to a highway."

 

I find that dismissive.  And I find your crusade to be entirely based on fear mongering.  And it's best that I put you on ignore again.  Good day.

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#30 of 37 Old 06-05-2012, 04:34 PM
 
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I think it is best to avoid triggers.

 

Some are not avoidable - such is life - but avoiding the ones we can or that have very little cost in terms of avoiding makes sense to me.

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