Congressional Hearing on the Federal Response to Autism on C-Span - Mothering Forums
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Vaccinations > Congressional Hearing on the Federal Response to Autism on C-Span
Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 06:59 AM 11-30-2012

I watched this yesterday and it was fascinating. The committee members were talking about an epidemic of autism and vaccinations in the same sentance, questioning the number of vaccines given to babies. Dr Colleen Boyle from the CDC and Dr Guttenmacher from the NIH, looked like a pair of shifty used car salesmen trying to sell of a lemon. 

 

Here is an account from someone who attended the meeting, and includes a link to a video recording of the hearing:

 

http://thinkingmomsrevolution.com/great-what-now/



Mosaic's Avatar Mosaic 07:08 AM 11-30-2012
Thanks, Mirzam. I'll definitely make time to watch this!!
Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 07:08 AM 11-30-2012

Adding AoA's report:

 

http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/11/landmark-autism-hearing-held-in-dc-yesterday.html

 

This was one of the highlights for me, the congressman called Poul Thorsen a 'scum bag'!

 

 

 

Quote:
It didn't help that the CDC's Coleen Boyle testified under oath that fraudster Poul Thorsen had only been involved in a couple of studies with the CDC. Shortly thereafter, a congressman introduced into evidence a list of more than 20 he had worked on. I feel like calling the CDC and asking: "Has Ms. Boyle retained counsel in anticipation of a possible perjury charge?"

 


Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 02:02 PM 11-30-2012

Canary Party's report on the meeting:

 

Congress slams NIH, CDC reps for evading vaccine/autism evidence

 

 

 

Quote:
"Does autism in history predate vaccines?” asked Rep. Darryl Issa (R-Calif.), chair of the U.S. House of Representatives House Oversight & Government Reform Committee. Yes, according to agencies administering the shots; no, according to legislators, physicians and parents filling in the gallery, who reported that their children regressed after receiving vaccinations.

 

 

Quote:
Rep. Patrick Meehan (R-Penn.) asked Boyle if she had ever seen a statistical trend with such an accelerating pace in a 6-year period; she said, “The only one that showed an increase was hyperactivity attention deficit disorder.

WildKingdom's Avatar WildKingdom 03:27 PM 11-30-2012

And, God knows, the US congress always gets it right on medical issues.

 

Right, Congressman Aiken?  


beckybird's Avatar beckybird 03:39 PM 11-30-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by WildKingdom View Post


Right, Congressman Aiken?  

 

I guess this means that all Congressmen are bad then. When one messes up, that means you can't trust any of them. Like doctors, right?


chickabiddy's Avatar chickabiddy 03:41 PM 11-30-2012
Quote:
"Does autism in history predate vaccines?” asked Rep. Darryl Issa (R-Calif.), chair of the U.S. House of Representatives House Oversight & Government Reform Committee. Yes, according to agencies administering the shots; [b]no, according to legislators, physicians and parents filling in the gallery, who reported that their children regressed after receiving vaccinations[/b].

 

It is a matter of fact that autism in history predates vaccines.  I have posted sources on this before.  If there is any question I can dig them up again later tonight.


WildKingdom's Avatar WildKingdom 03:48 PM 11-30-2012
oo
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeckyBird View Post

I guess this means that all Congressmen are bad then. When one messes up, that means you can't trust any of them. Like doctors, right?

My point is, I can't understand why anyone would look to congress for medical facts. And no, I don't think you can trust any of them on medical facts (unless you're talking about one of the two or three doctors in congress).
Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 03:53 PM 11-30-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post

Quote:
"Does autism in history predate vaccines?” asked Rep. Darryl Issa (R-Calif.), chair of the U.S. House of Representatives House Oversight & Government Reform Committee. Yes, according to agencies administering the shots; [b]no, according to legislators, physicians and parents filling in the gallery, who reported that their children regressed after receiving vaccinations[/b].

 

It is a matter of fact that autism in history predates vaccines.  I have posted sources on this before.  If there is any question I can dig them up again later tonight.

The problem was the good doctors from the NIH and CDC were not able to produce proof, because none existed. That just stated an opinion. Pure speculation. Mark Blaxhil on the other hand did provide evidence to the contary.


chickabiddy's Avatar chickabiddy 03:57 PM 11-30-2012

The word "autism" was created in 1908.  If autism did not exist in 1908, there would have been no need to name it.


Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 04:03 PM 11-30-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by WildKingdom View Post

oo
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeckyBird View Post

I guess this means that all Congressmen are bad then. When one messes up, that means you can't trust any of them. Like doctors, right?

My point is, I can't understand why anyone would look to congress for medical facts. And no, I don't think you can trust any of them on medical facts (unless you're talking about one of the two or three doctors in congress).

No one was looking to Congress for medical facts, they were looking to Congress for help with the Autism epidemic. The Congressmen/women were genuinely concerned. 

 

I agree with this quote from AoA:

 

 

 

Quote:
As a general proposition, it is fair to say that the people responsible for running the country do not like hearing that we have double any other nation's vaccine schedule, with a miserable infant mortality rate and an autism epidemic to show for it.

 

From the Canary Party article:

 

 

 

Quote:
Rep. Carol Maloney (D-N.Y.) asked Boyle why the autism rate went from 1 in 10,000 to 1 in 88 in such a short time, adding, “I don’t want to hear that we have better detection. Take better detection off the table. I agree that we have better detection. What are the factors besides better detection?” Boyle promptly replied, “Just to put it in context, better detection is accountable for some of it.” Rep. Maloney proposed spacing out vaccines, and emphasized the importance of listening to parents. “There is too much verbal evidence coming from parents... I had a normal child, I gave him a vaccination, and then they came down with autism,” she said.  

Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 04:13 PM 11-30-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post

The word "autism" was created in 1908.  If autism did not exist in 1908, there would have been no need to name it.

 

And the "autism" they created in 1908 is the same as autism as defined by the DSM IV?


Taximom5's Avatar Taximom5 04:44 PM 11-30-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post

The word "autism" was created in 1908.  If autism did not exist in 1908, there would have been no need to name it.

I must correct you here.  From everything I can find, although the word "autism" was coined in 1910 (don't know where you got 1908); it was used at that point to refer to an aspect of schizophrenia, and has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with today's definition of autism.

 

Mark Blaxill and Dan Olmstead cowrote an excellent book about the history of autism, The Age of Autism--Mercury, Medicine, and a Man-Made Epidemic  http://www.amazon.com/Age-Autism-Medicine-Man-Made-Epidemic/dp/B0055X6B9G, in which they follow the backgrounds of the parents of the first autistic children studied by Kanner--and they found plausible explanations of unusual mercury exposure for those children.

 

from Wikipedia:

 

The New Latin word autismus (English translation autism) was coined by the Swisspsychiatrist Eugen Bleuler in 1910 as he was defining symptoms of schizophrenia. He derived it from the Greek word autós (αὐτός, meaning self), and used it to mean morbid self-admiration, referring to "autistic withdrawal of the patient to his fantasies, against which any influence from outside becomes an intolerable disturbance".[175]

The word autism first took its modern sense in 1938 when Hans Asperger of the Vienna University Hospital adopted Bleuler's terminology autistic psychopaths in a lecture in German about child psychology.[176] Asperger was investigating an ASD now known asAsperger syndrome, though for various reasons it was not widely recognized as a separate diagnosis until 1981.


Taximom5's Avatar Taximom5 04:50 PM 11-30-2012

Here is C-Span's coverage of the hearing:  http://www.c-span.org/Events/Lawmakers-Look-into-Federal-Response-to-Rising-Rates-of-Autism/10737436113-1/

 

Absolutely shocking to see somebody like Coleen Boyle serving as Director of the National Center for Birth Defects and Developmental Disabilities.  It looks like she has done absolutely NOTHING to help those affected by developmental disabilities.  In the hearing, it looked like all she was trying to do was to squirm out of directly answering questions, or else squirm out of answering them truthfully.

 

Here is Age of Autism's commentary on her from 2010: http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/11/cdcs-dr-coleen-boyle-suggested-manipulating-autism-dx-age-in-2000.html


chickabiddy's Avatar chickabiddy 04:53 PM 11-30-2012

I have several sources that cite 1908, but I am not going to bicker over two years, since the point is that it predates vaccines.  Even the 1938 date you pulled from Wikipedia predates the MMR commonly cited as a cause of autism.


Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 06:50 PM 11-30-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taximom5 View Post

Here is C-Span's coverage of the hearing:  http://www.c-span.org/Events/Lawmakers-Look-into-Federal-Response-to-Rising-Rates-of-Autism/10737436113-1/

 

Absolutely shocking to see somebody like Coleen Boyle serving as Director of the National Center for Birth Defects and Developmental Disabilities.  It looks like she has done absolutely NOTHING to help those affected by developmental disabilities.  In the hearing, it looked like all she was trying to do was to squirm out of directly answering questions, or else squirm out of answering them truthfully.

 

Here is Age of Autism's commentary on her from 2010: http://www.ageofautism.com/2012/11/cdcs-dr-coleen-boyle-suggested-manipulating-autism-dx-age-in-2000.html

It was shocking wasn't it? Hardly inspires confidence in the CDC. 


MamaMunchkin's Avatar MamaMunchkin 10:10 PM 11-30-2012

This is - big.  I'm glad there were - both - Democrats and Republicans asking questions.  The last thing needed in the vax debate would be political partisanship. 

 

Hope it'll pave the way to more studies and discussions ... assuming the words spread ...  A quick check on news.google ... as of now (Sat 12/1), no major news outlet has picked it up yet.  Hope it'll be on the radar sooner rather than later ...


Taximom5's Avatar Taximom5 10:31 PM 11-30-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post

I have several sources that cite 1908, but I am not going to bicker over two years, since the point is that it predates vaccines.  Even the 1938 date you pulled from Wikipedia predates the MMR commonly cited as a cause of autism.

Looks like you missed what Wikipedia actually said about the use of the word "autism" in 1910:

 

"The New Latin word autismus (English translation autism) was coined by the Swisspsychiatrist Eugen Bleuler in 1910 as he was defining symptoms of schizophrenia. He derived it from the Greek word autós (αὐτός, meaning self), and used it to mean morbid self-admiration, referring to "autistic withdrawal of the patient to his fantasies, against which any influence from outside becomes an intolerable disturbance".[175]

The word autism first took its modern sense in 1938 when Hans Asperger of the Vienna University Hospital adopted Bleuler's terminology autistic psychopaths in a lecture in German about child psychology.[176] Asperger was investigating an ASD now known asAsperger syndrome, though for various reasons it was not widely recognized as a separate diagnosis until 1981."

 

You can keep insisting that the existence of the word (even if it originally meant something else) in 1910 (or 1908, if you prefer) proves that autistic people (as we understand autism today) were prevalent then, and that people used the word to describe them thus.  But unless you provide a source, there is no reason to believe you, especially since  there is evidence to the contrary.


And certainly nobody is denying that cases of mercury poisoning, which cause symptoms overlapping those of autism, happened in 1908 and earlier.  Perhaps you should familiarize yourself with acrodynia and "Mad Hatter's Disease."


Jennyanydots's Avatar Jennyanydots 01:29 AM 12-01-2012
Just spent the evening watching the hearing with my kids. I'm amazed and encouraged to see these issues being taken seriously and talked about frankly. What next? I'm afraid to be even cautiously optimistic...
chickabiddy's Avatar chickabiddy 06:24 AM 12-01-2012

Taximom, I'm using YOUR source so we don't bicker about sources.  Whether you use 1908, 1910, or 1938, autism pre-dates the current vaccines.


Bokonon's Avatar Bokonon 09:23 AM 12-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post

Taximom, I'm using YOUR source so we don't bicker about sources.  Whether you use 1908, 1910, or 1938, autism pre-dates the current vaccines.

 

But not the smallpox vaccine.


Taximom5's Avatar Taximom5 10:11 AM 12-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post

Taximom, I'm using YOUR source so we don't bicker about sources.  Whether you use 1908, 1910, or 1938, autism pre-dates the current vaccines.

 

(Sigh.) Apparently, you only looked at the date when the word was used, and not the actual meaning of the word as it was used back then (and from everything we can tell, it was only used back then by Eugen Bleuler, who coined it; if you find references to others having used that term back then, feel free to post them.).

 

Please read the history behind the use of the word this time. This is the third time I've posted it:

"The New Latin word autismus (English translation autism) was coined by the Swiss psychiatrist Eugen Bleuler in 1910 as he was defining symptoms of schizophrenia. He derived it from the Greek word autós (αὐτός, meaning self), and used it to mean morbid self-admiration, referring to "autistic withdrawal of the patient to his fantasies, against which any influence from outside becomes an intolerable disturbance".[175]

The word autism first took its modern sense in 1938 when Hans Asperger of the Vienna University Hospital adopted Bleuler's terminology autistic psychopaths in a lecture in German aboutchild psychology."

 

Back in the 1890's, the word "gay" meant something entirely different than it does today.

 

Back in 1908, the word autism was coined by one person to denote something entirely different from autism as we understand it now.

 

1938 does not predate the usage of thimerosal in vaccines, by the way.


Chicharronita's Avatar Chicharronita 10:45 AM 12-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennyanydots View Post

Just spent the evening watching the hearing with my kids. I'm amazed and encouraged to see these issues being taken seriously and talked about frankly. What next? I'm afraid to be even cautiously optimistic...

 

I'm happy to see this but I'm more cautious than optimistic; when they start doing something rathing than just talking I'll really take them seriously. 


kathymuggle's Avatar kathymuggle 12:04 PM 12-01-2012

subbing.

 

I have not watched it yet, but will within the next week when I can devote some time to it.


Chicharronita's Avatar Chicharronita 12:16 PM 12-01-2012

I'd rather read the transcript, but I don't think it's available yet.


Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 05:29 PM 12-02-2012

shake.gif

 

 

 

Quote:
Dr. Coleen Boyle, director of the U.S. Centers for Disease Control’s National Center on Birth Defects and Developmental Disabilities, testified that her goal is “raising awareness of the importance of this as a health problem and one we need to address.” An April 2000 email obtained via FOIA shows that Boyle contacted the CDC’s Frank DeStefano suggesting dilution of vaccine/autism data by adding one- and two-year-olds to his dataset – children too young to have an autism diagnosis then.

http://canaryparty.net/index.php/the-news/123-congress-slams-nih-cdc-reps-for-evading-vaccineautism-evidence


Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 11:05 AM 12-03-2012

Another article on the hearing, by J.B. Handley

 

The Unbearable Wimpiness of Being Autsim Speaks' Bob Wright


Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 06:59 AM 12-04-2012
Taximom5's Avatar Taximom5 08:16 AM 12-04-2012


Awesome info on that link, Mirzam!

 

Some of the lies and obfuscations told by CDC/FDA to the House Oversight Committee at that hearing:

 

 

"Mercury was removed from all vaccines in 2001."  OBVIOUS LIE

"Since mercury is safe, we don’t know why it was removed from most shots, but we’ll look into it and get back to you." No words for this one. banghead.gif

"We don’t know how many multi-vial vaccines still contain mercury." But...you just said it was removed from all vaccines in 2001!


Mirzam's Avatar Mirzam 08:38 AM 12-04-2012

Here's a couple more examples of the ignorance and lies:

 

 

Forty is a little high for the number of shots. I don’t think children get that many. -  Doctors, its 49 doses by age 6

All the vaccines and the schedule have been perfectly thought out by experts. - Oh really? Combined doses of vaccines have never been tested together. Ever.


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