The 5 Powerful Psychological Triggers Your Doctor Uses to Vaccinate Your Child - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 14 Old 12-18-2012, 05:03 AM - Thread Starter
 
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http://vactruth.com/2012/12/18/5-powerful-psychological-triggers/?utm_source=The+Vaccine+Truth+Newsletter&utm_campaign=3049d8cdac-12_18_2012_triggers&utm_medium=email

 

 

 

 

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PSYCHOLOGICAL TRIGGER #1: POWER OF AUTHORITY

 

PSYCHOLOGICAL TRIGGER #2: GUILT TRIPPING OR SHAMING THE PARENT

 

PSYCHOLOGICAL TRIGGER #3: SENSE OF URGENCY

 

PSYCHOLOGICAL TRIGGER #4: FEAR OF LOSS

 

PSYCHOLOGICAL TRIGGER #5: THE PROMISE OF HOPE

 

 

 

 

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#2 of 14 Old 12-30-2012, 01:20 PM
 
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Just have to comment the anti vax lobbyists do similar things I could write in big font too, but I'd suggest:

Psychological trigger 1: mistrust of authority (ie. it's "cool" to ignore what people in charge think).

Psychological trigger 2: guilt tripping or shaming (what if they have a reaction, how will you live with yourself?)

Psychological trigger 3: you can always get it later (no urgency needed)

Psychological trigger 4: fear of loss (what if they have a serious reaction).

Psychological trigger 5: Promise of hope (don't worry vpds are very rare these days).

Just to point out it goes both ways. Better to actually do the research and decide for yourself. Better still following a discussion with a real expert. smile.gif

Mother of two living in UK. Daughter (2007) born in USA, son (2010) born here. I'm pro natural birth, midwife care, breastfeeding, co-sleeping, baby wearing and a keen advocate of cloth diapering. I'm a full time working research scientist (physical sciences) and I'm pro-vaccine.

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#3 of 14 Old 12-30-2012, 05:32 PM
 
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You know, I have quite a few doctors who are good friends. I don't think they use most of these lines on parents because they are trying to trick or manipulate them. The doctors I know, at least, genuinely believe that vaccines are safe, that not getting them is dangerous, and they are just saying so.

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#4 of 14 Old 12-31-2012, 10:45 AM
 
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Originally Posted by MichelleZB View Post

You know, I have quite a few doctors who are good friends. I don't think they use most of these lines on parents because they are trying to trick or manipulate them. The doctors I know, at least, genuinely believe that vaccines are safe, that not getting them is dangerous, and they are just saying so.

It almost doesn't matter whether they are consciously trying to manipulate people or not.  If they are consciously trying to manipulate, shame on them.  If they are simply bad communicators, then they do need to learn how to communicate better so they do not come off sounding manipulative.  

 

Put yourself in another shoes.  Let's say (this is just an example, not a comparison) someone had recommended early orthodontia for your daughter.  You were not so sure.  You had read stuff online and in books, etc, that suggested waiting or doing nothing might be fine.  You went into the orthodontist to discuss this - and were met by such lines as "You need to do it now, before you even leave this office.  You will regret this if you do not do it.  I will not do any orthodontia treatment on your daughter (and good luck finding anyone who will) if you do not submit to this - now."

 

Maybe they do think vaccines are safe.  Heck, I bet most of them do.  It does not change the fact that if they employ any of the tactics outlined in the OP, they are acting inappropriately.


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#5 of 14 Old 12-31-2012, 10:46 AM
 
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Yes, my doctor friends are the same way.  They are not consciously trying to trick or manipulate anyone, and they seem to truly believe that vaccines are lifesavers in every single case, and pose absolutely no risk (again, in every single case).

 

They have been taught this all through medical school, and with their Continuing Medical Education classes (which are nearly always both funded and directed by pharmaceutical companies).

 

They also are constantly being given things like "A Physician's Guide For Dealing With Anti-Vaccine Parents,"  written by consultants for vaccine companies, telling the physician that they should tell the parents that there is absolutely no risk of autoimmune problems from vaccination (which is an outright lie--even Merck's own package inserts admit risks of arthritis, Guillaine-Barre, and other disorders as known SIDE EFFECTS of vaccines). 

 

Some of them are starting to realize that they have been lied to in their medical school and ongoing education.

 

Sadly, they are the ones who have seen family members have severe reactions to vaccines--reactions that they were taught were not likely or even possible.

 

With the others, it seems like it's just a matter of time before one of their family members or friends is affected.  At the rate both autism and the number of required vaccines are increasing, pretty soon, it will soon be impossible to ignore the issue.

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#6 of 14 Old 12-31-2012, 10:53 AM
 
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Originally Posted by prosciencemum View Post

Just have to comment the anti vax lobbyists do similar things I could write in big font too, but I'd suggest:
Psychological trigger 1: mistrust of authority (ie. it's "cool" to ignore what people in charge think).
Psychological trigger 2: guilt tripping or shaming (what if they have a reaction, how will you live with yourself?)
Psychological trigger 3: you can always get it later (no urgency needed)
Psychological trigger 4: fear of loss (what if they have a serious reaction).
Psychological trigger 5: Promise of hope (don't worry vpds are very rare these days).
 

I think professional in consultation should be held to a higher professional standard than random people discussing ideas on the internet.  

 

I would be ticked if I went to a doctor and they employed the techniques outlined in the OP; I would be equally ticked if I went to a alt. medicine practitioner, suggested I was considering a vaccine, and they pulled out the "how will you live with yourself if they have a reaction" card?"


There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

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#7 of 14 Old 12-31-2012, 11:04 AM
 
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Originally Posted by prosciencemum View Post

Just have to comment the anti vax lobbyists do similar things I could write in big font too, but I'd suggest:
Psychological trigger 1: mistrust of authority (ie. it's "cool" to ignore what people in charge think).
None of us whose children have been injured by vaccines, or who have seen such reactions in others and wish to avoid them, give a crap about what's "cool."

Psychological trigger 2: guilt tripping or shaming (what if they have a reaction, how will you live with yourself?)
MDC member Michael Belkin, whose infant daughter was killed by vaccines, has expressed exactly that--how hard it is to live with the knowledge that he allowed the injection that killed her to be administered.  Your point heartlessly mocks him and everyone else whose child (or self) has had a life-changing adverse reaction.
Psychological trigger 3: you can always get it later (no urgency needed)
That's not a psychological trigger, it's fact.  If, in fact, there is value to vaccines, it would make perfect sense to get them later, when the risks of the vaccine are either diminished (for any vaccine that may have an effect on neurological development, which many studies have shown), or the vaccine is unnecessary at a later age (such as Rotavirus, which is spread by contaminated FECES--not an issue where proper hygiene and sanitation exist). 

Psychological trigger 4: fear of loss (what if they have a serious reaction).
Again, this is fact.  Please do not mock those whose children have had serious reactions.  We are far more numerous that you want to admit.
 

Psychological trigger 5: Promise of hope (don't worry vpds are very rare these days).
 
Again, some diseases, like Rotavirus, ARE very rare in developed countries (and not because of vaccines). A very few, serious diseases such as polio and diphtheria are, indeed, extremely rare. Therefore, it is logical to delay a vaccination for that disease until the risks of the vaccine itself are much less.
 
But that would take admitting that vaccines do carry some very serious risks for a larger subset of the population than initially believed.  The vaccine manufacturers don't want this to be known.  Neither does the government, which has placed gag orders on the many cases it has conceded, admitted, and compensated.

Just to point out it goes both ways. Better to actually do the research and decide for yourself. Better still following a discussion with a real expert. smile.gif
A real expert would not include people like Paul Offit, who claims that it doesn't matter how many vaccines you inject into a newborn, as he believes that they can handle them all with no problem. 
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#8 of 14 Old 12-31-2012, 01:41 PM
 
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Originally Posted by prosciencemum View Post

Just have to comment the anti vax lobbyists do similar things I could write in big font too, but I'd suggest:
Psychological trigger 1: mistrust of authority (ie. it's "cool" to ignore what people in charge think).
Psychological trigger 2: guilt tripping or shaming (what if they have a reaction, how will you live with yourself?)
Psychological trigger 3: you can always get it later (no urgency needed)
Psychological trigger 4: fear of loss (what if they have a serious reaction).
Psychological trigger 5: Promise of hope (don't worry vpds are very rare these days).
Just to point out it goes both ways. Better to actually do the research and decide for yourself. Better still following a discussion with a real expert. smile.gif

I really just want to comment on trigger # 1 that you have posted. Is that what you actually think? That people who have a mistrust of authority (ie allopathic medical doctors telling them to vaccinate their baby when they have concerns) and make different choices or do not follow the advice do so because it's cool? 

 

That is the furthest thing from the truth - in regards to vaccines and in regards to any mainstream advice they might be getting (ie take these abx right away). Generally people make different choices because of past negative experiences taking said advice, or because they have had better experiences choosing a different path. On the contrary, People who go against the mainstream and make alternative choices often face ridicule and harassment. Do you really think they would endure all of that just to be "cool"? dizzy.gif


If the people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." Thomas Jefferson.

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#9 of 14 Old 12-31-2012, 06:50 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prosciencemum View Post

Just have to comment the anti vax lobbyists do similar things I could write in big font too, but I'd suggest:
Psychological trigger 1: mistrust of authority (ie. it's "cool" to ignore what people in charge think).
Psychological trigger 2: guilt tripping or shaming (what if they have a reaction, how will you live with yourself?)
Psychological trigger 3: you can always get it later (no urgency needed)
Psychological trigger 4: fear of loss (what if they have a serious reaction).
Psychological trigger 5: Promise of hope (don't worry vpds are very rare these days).
Just to point out it goes both ways. Better to actually do the research and decide for yourself. Better still following a discussion with a real expert. smile.gif

Let me assure you that I've put a lot of thought into my choices. I'm not some shallow adolescent mommy who's making my vax decisions to be "cool."

And by the way, even if I assumed for the sake of argument that your list is valid, your comparison is apples-to-oranges. No mother will ever find herself cornered by a so-called "anti-vax lobbyist" in a medical exam room (or in any other situation with a similar power differential), nor will she be forced to consult with this "anti-vax lobbyist" before sending her children to school. And no "anti-vax lobbyist" is in a position to withhold primary, preventative health care services from children to punish parents who disobey their orders. So those psychological triggers are a lot more powerful in a doctors office.

While I take issue with the link in the OP broadbrushing doctors in the same pejorative light...pediatric bullying does unfortunately happen. I'm glad it's being brought to light because there should be more accountability.

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#10 of 14 Old 01-01-2013, 06:17 AM - Thread Starter
 
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i can honestly say i have NEVER met a parent who didn't vax, because, a) they were lazy, or b) it was 'cool' not to vax.    That is one of the most absurd things i have ever heard in this issue....

 

 

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Psychological trigger 1: mistrust of authority (ie. it's "cool" to ignore what people in charge think).
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#11 of 14 Old 01-01-2013, 01:47 PM
 
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OK maybe I was a little extreme (and could have worded it better), but doesn't it just point out that the original 5 things posted are just as daft.... well it does to me.

 

I do think there's a fair amount of wanting to go against the mainstream in MDC mothers though - I have a fair bit too (try cloth diapering while working full time). My main point is that vaccination choices should be outside of that - as I'm sure they are for most people here. 

 

Anyhow this is probably not right for the "Beginning Research" board, so I'll jump out and I won't respond to any of the critiques of my suggestions (move it to the Debate board if you want). I'm sorry I was unable to let the first post lie and I hope I haven't contributed to scaring off any more parents new to the vaccine decision.


Mother of two living in UK. Daughter (2007) born in USA, son (2010) born here. I'm pro natural birth, midwife care, breastfeeding, co-sleeping, baby wearing and a keen advocate of cloth diapering. I'm a full time working research scientist (physical sciences) and I'm pro-vaccine.

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#12 of 14 Old 01-01-2013, 02:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Psychological trigger 1: mistrust of authority (ie. it's "cool" to ignore what people in charge think).

 

 

And,  who's to say what makes someone  an 'authority' or 'in charge' ?  I consider myself to be in charge of my children's health, and the dr is just  a part of solving health issues, and i value his opinion....he is not 'in charge' of them, i am.  I AM the authority on what meds my kids take or not.   I can take his advice into consideration on meds, but he is not the authority.  

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#13 of 14 Old 01-03-2013, 03:47 AM
 
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I don't feel that Dr.s are playing with my mind when trying to get me to vaccinate.  They think it is what is best for my child.  They think what I am doing by not vaccinating is really dangerous.  My kids are their patients and they are doing their job. 


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#14 of 14 Old 01-30-2013, 03:01 PM
 
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If they really wanted to support the health of children, they would not threaten to kick your child out of their practice if they aren't vaccinated. They are punishing you through your child, which I realize is a fairly commonly accepted control tactic, but not caring at all.

 

I mistrust doctors because they have failed me and my family so many times. My parents both died under the care of doctors, as did my father-in-law (he died on the operating table due to a mistake by an anesthesiologist). I have a chronic illness that no doctor has been able to help me with. All but one of my great grandparents lived into their 90s despite having few to no vaccines (or maybe because of that fact), but my parents, who received several vaccines (especially my father, who was in the military), didn't make it nearly as far -- my father died at 65 after a long illness and my mother died at 71 from a mysterious autoimmune disease (dermatomyositis) that nobody in her family had ever had. I could go on, but I won't since this is a vaccine board.


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