Piers Morgan falls ill days after a public flu shot with Dr Oz - Page 4 - Mothering Forums

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Old 01-25-2013, 12:42 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Piers Morgan didn't say that.

Doesn't have to its implied. Has vaccine, gets sick with "flu" 10 days later. 

 

#FluVaccineDoesn't Work


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Old 01-25-2013, 12:52 PM
 
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Doesn't have to its implied. Has vaccine, gets sick with "flu" 10 days later. 

 

#FluVaccineDoesn't Work

 

Doesn't prove anything. It's well known flu vaccine cannot stopping 100% of people getting the flu - but it reduces the risk of catching flu by about 50%, hence it will reduce overall the numbers of people getting flu.

 

 

#FluVaccineIsn'tMagicFairyDust


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Old 01-25-2013, 12:56 PM
 
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Also, IF it's flu, it appears to be a relatively mild case.  Full immunity takes about two weeks; he may have developed partial immunity during the 10 days since the shot.


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Old 01-25-2013, 01:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Doesn't prove anything. It's well known flu vaccine cannot stopping 100% of people getting the flu - but it reduces the risk of catching flu by about 50%, hence it will reduce overall the numbers of people getting flu.

 

 

#FluVaccineIsn'tMagicFairyDust

All this doesn't matter. What matters to the perveyors of the flu vaccine is that people take it. When stories like this get out, it damages the public's perception of the "usefulness" of the product.


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Old 01-25-2013, 01:25 PM
 
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This story isn't even getting press outside of antivax websites.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:27 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Sure, it has been buried. But it got out to all the viewers of that particular Piers Morgan show. 


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Old 01-25-2013, 01:28 PM
 
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Doesn't prove anything. It's well known flu vaccine cannot stopping 100% of people getting the flu - but it reduces the risk of catching flu by about 50%, hence it will reduce overall the numbers of people getting flu.


#FluVaccineIsn'tMagicFairyDust
And if your risk of catching flu is 4%, this means the flu shot may reduce your risk to 2%. Woo- impressive. Honest.

#fluvaxisuselessandrisky

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Old 01-25-2013, 01:32 PM
 
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Sure, it has been buried. But it got out to all the viewers of that particular Piers Morgan show. 

 

I don't know that it's been buried, but rather, very few people give a rat's ass about Piers Morgan's sore throat/runny nose when compared to...anything else.


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Old 01-25-2013, 01:43 PM
 
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I don't believe the flu shot causes the flu. I just don't believe that the flu shots work. I believe it's far less efficacious than the propaganda would have us believe. I know many people (and know of others) who had a flu shot--and still got the flu (with enough time for the vaccine to take effect). Likewise, in 2009, everyone I knew who got swine flu in the fall had the regular flu shot first.

 

I say, fine, get the flu shot if you feel like it. I am just tired of the media making it sound like anyone who chooses not to get a flu shot is endangering others or believing that they'll get the flu from the shot. Again, not counting the nasal vaccine, which can spread the flu, the inactivated flu shot doesn't give someone the flu. The problem is that there is a poor efficacy rate (as the Cochrane Collaboration found in 2010).

 

Finally, no one mentions that H3N2 also went around the US in 1996-1997. So, even if the strains are somewhat different, some of us already have immunity from having seen similar strains before this. Similarly, if someone had H1N1, why are they pressured to get another vaccine that includes the H1N1 strain? It doesn't make sense.

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Old 01-25-2013, 01:59 PM
 
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In a severe flu season hundreds if not thousands of people DIE. That is just not the case this year. It might be a "bad flu" in that it makes you feel extra awful, but that is very different than being a severe flu SEASON.

Hundreds and even thousands of people die every season--no matter how severe the flu is.

 

But in the last 10 years, the pharmaceutical industry, aided by the US government, has mounted massive a propaganda campaign in order to promote--and eventually mandate--the flu shot.

 

That propaganda campaign has included the CDC'S drastically exaggerated claims of deaths from the flu, as the deaths of the elderly from pneumonia, from unconfirmed flu-like viruses, and even deaths from old age were included as part of the hype.  It's also included a virtual storm from the media of "this is going to be a severe flu season!"  Funny, we've seen this for a several years in a row now.  And it's never been a severe flu season.

 

A couple of decades ago, it was like this:

Mary:  I think I've got the flu.  Guess I'll stay home from work today.

Tom:  Bummer. Hope you feel better soon.

 

Now it's like this:

Mary:  OMG I'VE GOT A SORE THROAT!  AND A FEVER!!!  AND OMG MY HEAD HURTS AND MY JOINTS ACHE!  I"VE GOT THE FLU!  I NEED TO GO TO THE DOCTOR!  TO THE HOSPITAL!  I NEED MEDICINE!  

 

Tom:  OMG, I'VE BEEN EXPOSED TO THE FLU!  I NEED TO GO TO THE DOCTOR!  I NEED A FLU SHOT!  I NEED TAMIFLU!  I NEED ANTIBIOTICS!

 

Yup.  It's been a VERY effective propaganda campaign.

 

One has to wonder what the outcome would have been if they had spent as much time and effort hyping the results of the Cochrane review, which said that there is no evidence of benefit from the flu shot, outside of perhaps shortening the duration of a flu case by (drum roll, please)....1/2 a day.

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Old 01-25-2013, 02:02 PM
 
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Doesn't prove anything. It's well known flu vaccine cannot stopping 100% of people getting the flu - but it reduces the risk of catching flu by about 50%, hence it will reduce overall the numbers of people getting flu.

 

 

#FluVaccineIsn'tMagicFairyDust

Right.   For every 100 people who get the flu shot, only about 1.2% will get the flu.

 

For every 100 people who DON'T get the flu shot, a whopping...2.7% will get the flu.

 

Yep.  Vaccinate 100 people to maybe prevent ONE case of flu.  And ignore all the cases of people who get sick after the flu shot. Especially ignore the people who suddenly suffer from severe autoimmune disorders, seizures, paralysis, and other inexplicable serious reactions from the flu shot.

 

Because the flu vaccine isn't magic fairy dust.

 

It's money in the bank, baby.  And that's the bottom line.

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Old 01-25-2013, 02:14 PM
 
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Because the flu vaccine isn't magic fairy dust.

 

It's money in the bank, baby. And that's the bottom line.

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Old 01-25-2013, 02:15 PM
 
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and are you serious?  I'm supposed to believe this man has "the flu?"

 

http://www.infowars.com/piers-morgan-falls-ill-days-after-receiving-flu-vaccine/

 

what a joke.

 

 

 

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Sure, maybe he has a mild case of the flu, but it's FAR from a sure thing. There are tons of viruses that go around this time of year he could have!
 
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What would testing him prove? He either has the flu or he doesn't. If he doesn't, then whatever. If he does, oh well some people still get it after the vaccine.
 
 
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And Erin the reason not to test everyone is its a huge waste of time, money, and resources. T&s is very very far from the worst flu season ever. Is not really even a severe flu season.
 
 
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OR he just has a sore throat!  It's equally possible it has nothing to do with the flu OR the flu shot!

 
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except WE DON'T KNOW THE SHOT MADE HIM SICK.

 

Considering he got sick TEN DAYS after the shot I seriously doubt it was the shot, but that's just me.

 

 

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This story isn't even getting press outside of antivax websites.
 
 
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don't talk to me anymore.

 

Wow.

 

Someone is going to a lot of effort to convince people that someone's documented illness following vaccination had nothing to do with that vaccination....  

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Old 01-25-2013, 02:17 PM
 
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Seems like it would be more reasonable and prudent to say something like, "wow, there are many more people getting sick following the flu shot than anyone expected.  Maybe this phenomenon should be studied.  Maybe there are adverse effects that nobody predicted (imagine that!), or maybe the immune system doesn't work entirely the way the experts think it does.  We need to learn more about this before other people become unnecessarily ill!"
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Old 01-25-2013, 02:24 PM
 
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Wow.

Someone is going to a lot of effort to convince people that someone's documented illness following vaccination had nothing to do with that vaccination....  

Wow. Someone went to a lot of effort to try and make Rrrachel look bad.

Does anyone else find hash tags anywhere other than Twitter annoying?
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Old 01-25-2013, 02:30 PM
 
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Wow. Someone went to a lot of effort to try and make Rrrachel look bad.

Does anyone else find hash tags anywhere other than Twitter annoying?
#multiquoteishardtodo

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Old 01-25-2013, 02:37 PM
 
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Seems like it would be more reasonable and prudent to say something like, "wow, there are many more people getting sick following the flu shot than anyone expected.  Maybe this phenomenon should be studied.  Maybe there are adverse effects that nobody predicted (imagine that!), or maybe the immune system doesn't work entirely the way the experts think it does.  We need to learn more about this before other people become unnecessarily ill!"

I certainly don't disagree that the flu shot (as well as other vaccines, and other medical treatments in general) should be studied on an ongoing basis. I think it is a mistake, though, to assume that the scientific community isn't already doing so. 

 

I too think hash tags can be very obnoxious, primarily when they are used in a snarky, pointed way. I'm not so bothered when someone on Facebook writes "My kid got on the table and flung all my stuff everywhere. #HousekeepingFail" or the like, because that's not aimed at anybody. 

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Old 01-25-2013, 02:45 PM
 
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Where's the evidence more people than we would expect are getting sick after the flu shot?
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:05 PM
 
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Where's the evidence more people than we would expect are getting sick after the flu shot?

 

Unfortunately, I don't think most people report when they get sick after the flu shot. This is probably why we don't have enough hard evidence of masses of people getting sick after the flu shot. Currently, all we really have are anecdotes, but lots of them!

Where might someone report illness after the flu vaccine, I'm wondering?


 
 
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:07 PM
 
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Vaers? All the usual vaccine surveillance systems would be actively looking for these masses of people who got sick after vaccination, too, just like any other vaccine. Plus clinical trials.
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:33 PM
 
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VAERS? I thought most of you dismiss reports from VAERS, so what good would that do?  Plus--and I'm assuming here--most people who get the flu vax don't even know what VAERS is. So, maybe the reason there isn't enough evidence of people getting sick after vaccination is that they are just not reporting.

Lack of reports does not mean illness after the vaccine is rare.

 

So, if your average vaccine-receiving patients don't report to VAERS (I'm assuming most don't)  then where will they report? Or, where is there a place to report that the medical establishment will take seriously?


 
 
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:38 PM
 
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I take vaers seriously for what it is, which is an early warning system. I dismiss studies that use it to try and show causality.

There are other vaccine monitoring systems, like vaccine safety data link, that don't rely on reporting at all. They use medical records. So thy would look for something like an increase in regent care, pcp, or er visits in a certain time frame after a vaccine is given.
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:45 PM
 
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I would LOVE to see a VAERS awareness campaign accompanying the flu vaccine campaign:

"If you get sick after receiving the flu vaccine, please report to VAERS." Wouldn't it have been nice to see this during Piers' televised vaccination? Wouldn't it have been great if Dr.Oz informed everyone of VAERS?

The public needs more balanced information.


 
 
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:48 PM
 
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I think it would be great if the public we more aware of vaers. However, I'm also glad we don't have to rely solely on it for data on vaccine safety.
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:52 PM
 
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Here are some examples of studies using vsd to monitor flu vaccine safety.

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/professionals/acip/adversetiv.htm

If rates of sickness after the vaccine were high it would also absolutely show up in clinical studies.
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:10 PM
 
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If rates of sickness after the vaccine were high it would also absolutely show up in clinical studies.

 

I do find it "funny" that most drugs get pulled off the market well after the clinical studies for those little pesty things that don't seem to show up right away.


 

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Old 01-25-2013, 06:16 PM
 
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Mos drugs never make it to market.
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:29 PM
 
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and still the FDA manages to pull some drugs off each year! and restrict others as well -

 

rotarix vaccine

 

 

 http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/26/health/fda-vote-on-restricting-hydrocodone-products-vicodin.html?_r=0

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_withdrawn_drugs


 

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Old 01-25-2013, 06:30 PM
 
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from what i remember, the H1N1 trials  in '09 only lasted  60?days or so before they claimed it was safe...now look at all the reports coming out about it.   

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Old 01-25-2013, 06:34 PM
 
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FDA Likely to Approve H1N1 Vaccine In Advance of Data

 

 

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GAITHERSBURG, Md., July 23 -- The FDA is likely to approve 2009 H1N1 (swine flu) vaccines before trial data can prove their safety and effectiveness against the virus.

 

Approving a vaccine without safety and immunogenicity data is not uncommon, FDA officials said during a daylong meeting of the Vaccines and Related Biological Products Advisory Committee.

http://www.medpagetoday.com/ProductAlert/DevicesandVaccines/15230

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