HIB and The Vaccine Book - Mothering Forums
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 15 Old 01-30-2013, 12:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
thispathisme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 148
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've just read the HIB chapter and Dr. Sears ends it by stating that the ongoing use of the HIB vaccine in the USA helps keep it away... but now that the type B has almost been eliminated, the non-type Bs are increasing and are more resistant to antibiotics and cause more severe reactions.

I'm so confused. If HIB is only one of many bacteria that can cause the infections that we're trying to avoid, but there are no vaccines for the other bacteria, why create one for HIB?

And if there are now all these other more dangerous non-type B forms, why should I/would I even consider the HIB vaccine?
thispathisme is offline  
#2 of 15 Old 01-30-2013, 07:09 PM
 
Rrrrrachel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,154
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The vaccine was created for the most common strains, or the strainsthatcaused most of the disease. As that picture changes I would expect they work to adapt and adjust the vaccine as necessary.
Rrrrrachel is offline  
#3 of 15 Old 01-31-2013, 08:43 AM
 
Marnica's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,585
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)

google serotype replacement. 


If the people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." Thomas Jefferson.

Marnica is offline  
#4 of 15 Old 01-31-2013, 11:45 AM
 
prosciencemum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,706
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marnica View Post

google serotype replacement. 

 

It's discussed in the (well referenced) wikipedia article about PCV.

 

Basically a "serotype" is one of the versions of bacteria which cause pneumoccal disease. And serotype replacement refers to the most common types of bacteria causing these diseases shifting away from the strains in the vaccination. 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneumococcal_conjugate_vaccine

 

From that (go to link to see references):

 

 

 

Quote:
The original 7-valent formulation [of prevnar] contains serotypes 4,6B,9V,14,18C,19F, and 23F, and results in a 98% probability of protection against these strains, which caused 80% of the pneumococcal disease in infants in the US. In 2010, Pfizer introduced Prevnar 13 which contains six additional strains (i.e., 1, 3, 5, 6A, 19A and 7F), which protect against the majority of the remaining pneumococcal infections

 

 

 

 

Quote:
While an overall decline in invasive pneumococcal disease is well documented, concerns have been raised regarding a potential increase in the rate of infections caused by serotypes not covered in the vaccine. Recent data suggest that serotype replacement is increasing (1.61- and 1.28-fold increase in children and adults) but remains minimal when compared to the significant reduction observed in the burden of this vaccine-preventable disease.

 

 

 It seems to me this could be a natural result of a successfull vaccination program. If the serotypes in prevnar (and now prevnar 13) are becoming less common because of vaccination, then while overall rates of pneumoccocal go down you would still see a proportional increase in cases caused by serotypes not in the vaccine. 

 

 Is it something more than this? 


Mother of two living in UK. Daughter (2007) born in USA, son (2010) born here. I'm pro natural birth, midwife care, breastfeeding, co-sleeping, baby wearing and a keen advocate of cloth diapering. I'm a full time working research scientist (physical sciences) and I'm pro-vaccine.

prosciencemum is offline  
#5 of 15 Old 02-01-2013, 01:32 PM
 
minerva23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: down by the riverside
Posts: 465
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)

In my opinion, Serotype replacement is like playing Russian Roulette, since more invasive germs could take over as it has been observed with the pneumococcal vaccine. Our bodies are covered inside out with over 100 trillion bacteria alone. To upset this highly vulnerable system of checks and balances by eradicating certain types just because they may be harmful under certain circumstances, seems to be inviting disaster sooner or later. Or are there just going to be more vaccines added to the schedule until the human body is germ free?


“The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.”
―Socrates

minerva23 is offline  
#6 of 15 Old 02-01-2013, 01:55 PM
 
eireann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 478
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Wikipedia is not a real source and shouldn't be used as such. I could submit an entry about owning a unicorn with a top hat and it would be a published on Wikipedia. Content comes from users, who may or may not have an agenda and who may or may not have the right info. An alternate source is needed for an argument to have any credibility.
Alenushka likes this.
eireann is offline  
#7 of 15 Old 02-01-2013, 02:02 PM
 
Rrrrrachel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,154
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
And if you submitted an article about said unicorn it would be corrected very quickly. And if you've never contributed there before it would probably not be published. Studies show Wikipedia is as accurate or more accurate as a print encyclopedia.

The Wikipedia article is far better referenced than half the stuff about vaccines out there. If you have a correction to make let's hear it, but attacking something just because it came from Wikipedia is so ten years ago.
Rrrrrachel is offline  
#8 of 15 Old 02-01-2013, 02:10 PM
 
Alenushka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: CA
Posts: 1,893
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Other studies have shown that Wikepeia is not accurate.  Even on the undegrad  level siting Wikepedia will get you an F

Turquesa likes this.
Alenushka is offline  
#9 of 15 Old 02-01-2013, 04:07 PM
 
Rrrrrachel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,154
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yes. Wikipedia should not be used in formal writing or research settings. Nor should any other encyclopedia, they're not primary sources. That's not so much the setting we're in here, though.

Seriously, when people are citing natural news, Wikipedia is the one folks are going to complain about? Really?

If the information is incorrect, correct it. Otherwise, get over it.
Rrrrrachel is offline  
#10 of 15 Old 02-01-2013, 07:10 PM
 
eireann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 478
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rrrrrachel View Post

Attacking something just because it came from Wikipedia is so ten years ago.


Did an adult write that sentence? Seriously.
eireann is offline  
#11 of 15 Old 02-01-2013, 07:25 PM
 
Rrrrrachel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,154
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Ok, no sense of humor, check.
Rrrrrachel is offline  
#12 of 15 Old 02-01-2013, 08:05 PM
 
eireann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 478
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Oh, I have a sense of humor. That's just not funny.
eireann is offline  
#13 of 15 Old 02-07-2013, 12:57 PM - Thread Starter
 
thispathisme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 148
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosciencemum View Post

 

It's discussed in the (well referenced) wikipedia article about PCV.

 

Basically a "serotype" is one of the versions of bacteria which cause pneumoccal disease. And serotype replacement refers to the most common types of bacteria causing these diseases shifting away from the strains in the vaccination. 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneumococcal_conjugate_vaccine

 

From that (go to link to see references):

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 It seems to me this could be a natural result of a successfull vaccination program. If the serotypes in prevnar (and now prevnar 13) are becoming less common because of vaccination, then while overall rates of pneumoccocal go down you would still see a proportional increase in cases caused by serotypes not in the vaccine. 

 

 Is it something more than this? 

 

And then wouldn't there be a "need" to create more vaccines?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minerva23 View Post

In my opinion, Serotype replacement is like playing Russian Roulette, since more invasive germs could take over as it has been observed with the pneumococcal vaccine. Our bodies are covered inside out with over 100 trillion bacteria alone. To upset this highly vulnerable system of checks and balances by eradicating certain types just because they may be harmful under certain circumstances, seems to be inviting disaster sooner or later. Or are there just going to be more vaccines added to the schedule until the human body is germ free?

 

That's what I'm wondering... when does it end? 

thispathisme is offline  
#14 of 15 Old 02-15-2013, 03:00 PM
 
Pookietooth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 5,064
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I think that's one of the major dividing points between the pro-vax folks and the anti-vax folks: on the one hand, the pro-vax folks say that we will just develop new vaccines to the new strains, while the anti-vax folks say, it's kind of like an arms race, in which the vaccines are chasing quickly evolving organisms and in the mean time causing super bugs to develop, not to mention weakening our immune systems by messing with the way we develop immunity to viruses and bacteria. The flu vaccine doesn't seem to have resulted in eradicating the flu, and in some studies seems to have made it all the more virulent. 


Jen 47 DS C 2/03  angel.gif04/29/08/ DD S 10/28/09 DH Bill '97.

mighty-mama and her sister Kundalini-Mamacandle.gif

Pookietooth is offline  
#15 of 15 Old 02-15-2013, 03:06 PM
 
Rrrrrachel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,154
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Except most of what we vaccinate before ISN'T rapidly evolving.
Rrrrrachel is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off