"72 papers showing vaccines cause autism" - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

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#31 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 03:01 AM
 
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It appears you and others think I'm the author of living green with baby's article on vaccines. I AM NOT. He's a colleague of mine who asked me to post about the poll a while back. Thought you should know. Furthermore, he informed me of a threat he received by someone making reference to mothering. Apparently the mothering member thought the author and I are the same person. Way to keep it classy huh?

You originally posted here, representing the poll as YOURS; now you say it wasn't yours after all? You have already made your agenda clear. Your posts are all about undermining those who question or criticize vaccines, in spite of your original claim of objectivity.

Slinging veiled, second-hand accusations is your way of "keeping it classy?"
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#32 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 04:58 AM
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You originally posted here, representing the poll as YOURS; now you say it wasn't yours after all? You have already made your agenda clear. Your posts are all about undermining those who question or criticize vaccines, in spite of your original claim of objectivity.

Slinging veiled, second-hand accusations is your way of "keeping it classy?"

You should check your facts on this. Here's the original post http://www.mothering.com/community/t/1386673/vaccines-more-good-than-harm#post_17405033 Does that unedited post state anywhere that the poll is mine? I provided info related to that article (the author is a colleague of mine) but that's it.

 

Agenda? I can make a better claim about you on that. All over the internet one can find posts from you on different websites spreading unfounded arguments on the topic.

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#33 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 05:05 AM
 
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A colleague where? In what field? A field somehow relevant to knowing where TaxiMom posts on the Internet?
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#34 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 05:38 AM
 
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You should check your facts on this. Here's the original post http://www.mothering.com/community/t/1386673/vaccines-more-good-than-harm#post_17405033 Does that unedited post state anywhere that the poll is mine? I provided info related to that article (the author is a colleague of mine) but that's it.

 

Agenda? I can make a better claim about you on that. All over the internet one can find posts from you on different websites spreading unfounded arguments on the topic.

HOW WOULD YOU KNOW UNLESS YOU'VE BEEN STALKING HER??

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#35 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 05:57 AM
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HOW WOULD YOU KNOW UNLESS YOU'VE BEEN STALKING HER??

this discussion has deviated greatly from topic. But if you most know, I sat down with my colleague and looked into the threatening message. According to the evidence we were able to determine the most likely culprits. Research showed no connection with Taximom5 and the received message. The most likely culprit was determined, necessary information and evidence was gathered, and delivered to the appropriate channels. No further discussion of this is needed but as one of these 'channels' replied: "investigation is ongoing".

 

Once more I make a call to civil discussion on the topic of vaccines! The hatred against me has lead to a threat against an innocent bystander, this is unacceptable.

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#36 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 07:21 AM
 
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this discussion has deviated greatly from topic. But if you most know, I sat down with my colleague and looked into the threatening message. According to the evidence we were able to determine the most likely culprits. Research showed no connection with Taximom5 and the received message. The most likely culprit was determined, necessary information and evidence was gathered, and delivered to the appropriate channels. No further discussion of this is needed but as one of these 'channels' replied: "investigation is ongoing".

Once more I make a call to civil discussion on the topic of vaccines! The hatred against me has lead to a threat against an innocent bystander, this is unacceptable.

You tell us that seizures, brain damage, and autoimmune disorders temporally related to vaccines are mere coincidences, and that people like me who share mainstream, scientific studies discussing such links are "spreading misinformation around the Internet," all because the flawed, industry-funded studies don't conclusively prove cause.

But then you expect us to believe--with absolutely NO proof--your wild tale of a colleague receiving a threat related to your activity here on MDC?

Talk about a double standard!

My first thought is that your colleague made up this story, with the intention of painting mothers here who question and criticize vaccines as "antivax cranks."

I'd also like to know what "research" was used to ascertain that I'm not connected to any "received messages." Your sentence implies that you have a way of tracking my Internet activity.
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#37 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 07:32 AM
 
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this discussion has deviated greatly from topic. But if you most know, I sat down with my colleague and looked into the threatening message. According to the evidence we were able to determine the most likely culprits. Research showed no connection with Taximom5 and the received message. The most likely culprit was determined, necessary information and evidence was gathered, and delivered to the appropriate channels. No further discussion of this is needed but as one of these 'channels' replied: "investigation is ongoing".

 

Once more I make a call to civil discussion on the topic of vaccines! The hatred against me has lead to a threat against an innocent bystander, this is unacceptable.

 

There is no rational discussion with you from what i've seen here..... and you reap what you sow. 

Your 'discussion' is merely nothing more than mocking parental choice, and misrespresenting yourself as someone who is genuinely interested in discussing the topic from all sides. Your side is one side.  

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#38 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 08:41 AM
 
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nm 

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

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#39 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 08:48 AM
 
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And here - a whole book on bad Pharm by Ben Goldacre:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0007350740/ref=nosim?tag=bs0b-21

 

Nice to see we can agree on something - I really respect Ben Goldacre. I haven't read this one yet, but I just read "Bad Science". Coincidently I just posted in another thread about his views on bad Pharma and a couple of quotes from that book about that with regard to how you can agree pharmaceutical companies have dubious ethics while still thinking on balance vaccination is a good idea. I'll put "Bad Pharma" on my reading list though. :)

 

Link to my post about Ben Goldacre in the thread on "Ethics of Vaccination": http://www.mothering.com/community/t/1387830/ethics-regarding-entire-vaccination-system/100#post_17448282


Mother of two living in UK. Daughter (2007) born in USA, son (2010) born here. I'm pro natural birth, midwife care, breastfeeding, co-sleeping, baby wearing and a keen advocate of cloth diapering. I'm a full time working research scientist (physical sciences) and I'm pro-vaccine.

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#40 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 08:57 AM
 
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Pharma isn't one company either. I follow the indistry a little bit & some really do conduct themselves better than others AND I would consider the company with *any* medication. Historically, mega-bad incidences have been concentrated from one or a few companies . . .
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#41 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 09:02 AM
 
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But then you expect us to believe--with absolutely NO proof--your wild tale of a colleague receiving a threat related to your activity here on MDC?


My first thought is that your colleague made up this story, with the intention of painting mothers here who question and criticize vaccines as "antivax cranks."
 

This.

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There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

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#42 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 09:09 AM
 
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Nice to see we can agree on something - I really respect Ben Goldacre. I haven't read this one yet, but I just read "Bad Science". Coincidently I just posted in another thread about his views on bad Pharma and a couple of quotes from that book about that with regard to how you can agree pharmaceutical companies have dubious ethics while still thinking on balance vaccination is a good idea. I'll put "Bad Pharma" on my reading list though. :)

 

Link to my post about Ben Goldacre in the thread on "Ethics of Vaccination": http://www.mothering.com/community/t/1387830/ethics-regarding-entire-vaccination-system/100#post_17448282

I erased the post (did not feel like getting into it with Bakunin) but yeah, I like Ben Goldacre.  I first saw him on a Ted talk.  I have read a few articles on his site. I am sure his is somewhat pro-vax, but I won't hold that against him, lol.  He (sadly) only has 2 articles on vaccines on his bad science site.  

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There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

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#43 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 09:14 AM
 
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Pharma isn't one company either. I follow the indistry a little bit & some really do conduct themselves better than others AND I would consider the company with *any* medication. Historically, mega-bad incidences have been concentrated from one or a few companies . . .

This is probably true.  I bet some are worse than others!  A few names do pop up over and over again.  I think this would make a good thread at some point, for those that do choose vaccines.  I would want to know which companies have the best safety record (first and foremost) and the least number of questionable decisions.  I prefer to give my money to companies I consider ethical (or at least, more ethical)

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There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

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#44 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 09:31 AM
 
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Ideally I'd like any medications 'Made in the USA' also. It would actually be fantastic if the consumer values that brought us 'organic food' & 'dye free' & 'fair trade' could be applied to this industry, but it is clouded in mystery more so than other consumer products . . .
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#45 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 09:37 AM
 
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I recently read that many pharmaceuticals are being made in Asia.  This made me somewhat conerned, and I immediately checked where vaccines are made for kids in North America.  They are primarily made in N. America and Europe.  I did see an article or two about China being an emerging market for vaccines - and that really concerned me as China does not have the greatest track record with regards to product safety, IMHO.  I think it is something to keep an eye on.

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There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

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#46 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 11:39 AM
 
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what about this report on aspertame by the fda?

http://www.fda.gov/ohrms/dockets/dailys/03/jan03/012203/02p-0317_emc-000199.txt

 

 

I'm not quite sure what that is.  What it is not though is a report from the FDA.  

 

It appears to be a petition or complaint filed with FDA. It was sent to "FDA Dockets Submittal" from the Aspartame Toxicity Information Center which appears to be just one guy (though i could be wrong about that the one guy thing, but I'm not going to waste more time looking).  

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#47 of 50 Old 09-01-2013, 09:07 PM
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Goldacre has brought up some excellent points about pharmaceuticals and bad science. One can only hope that his words are not misinterpreted. He's written about vaccines before and makes some interesting, though not exactly correct arguments here http://www.badscience.net/2013/04/how-vaccine-scares-respect-local-cultural-boundaries/

 

Another writing (with extended excerpt from his bad science book) can be found here http://www.badscience.net/2008/08/the-medias-mmr-hoax/

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#48 of 50 Old 09-02-2013, 01:14 PM
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this discussion has deviated greatly from topic. But if you most know, I sat down with my colleague and looked into the threatening message. According to the evidence we were able to determine the most likely culprits. Research showed no connection with Taximom5 and the received message. The most likely culprit was determined, necessary information and evidence was gathered, and delivered to the appropriate channels. No further discussion of this is needed but as one of these 'channels' replied: "investigation is ongoing".

 

Once more I make a call to civil discussion on the topic of vaccines! The hatred against me has lead to a threat against an innocent bystander, this is unacceptable.

 

This is a FYI post so that the handling of this matter is clear for all to read. 

 

I addressed this accusation privately and have since been told by bakunin that the incident and my response to her report of it has been conveyed to the FBI.  It is not in my power or even within my duty to investigate matters of this nature that occur in personal email and beyond our site services.  However, because there is such grave concern about receiving such an email that a federal agency had to be involved, I feel it is in bakunin's best interests that his/her membership here end. 


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#49 of 50 Old 09-02-2013, 02:57 PM
 
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Cynthia, thank you for letting us know.

Since bakunin chose to name me on this thread as a suspect in what he claimed was a threat to his colleague, I am wondering if he was able to obtain personal information (IP addresses, email addresses, even names?) about the MDC members he (wrongly) accused?

Is there any reason his posts that hint at very serious accusations are not being deleted from this thread? Was there even any proof that bakunin's colleague received a threatening email from an MDC member?

I don't know about anyone else, but I find this whole situation extremely unsettling. What kind of "research" was done concerning me, by whom, and shared with whom?
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#50 of 50 Old 09-03-2013, 12:17 PM
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Cynthia, thank you for letting us know.

Since bakunin chose to name me on this thread as a suspect in what he claimed was a threat to his colleague, I am wondering if he was able to obtain personal information (IP addresses, email addresses, even names?) about the MDC members he (wrongly) accused?

Is there any reason his posts that hint at very serious accusations are not being deleted from this thread? Was there even any proof that bakunin's colleague received a threatening email from an MDC member?

I don't know about anyone else, but I find this whole situation extremely unsettling. What kind of "research" was done concerning me, by whom, and shared with whom?

 

We do not share any access or personal information about our members with other members, no matter what is claimed. 

 

Hinting at very serious accusations is just that - hinting. I was given the text of the email and there was no threat made so saying it was a "threatening" email is just dramatizing the matter. I don't see a reason to delete the accusation. Seems to be an essential story-ending post that people who have been reading should be able to see to understand what occurred. That said, if you feel anything posted was a very direct personal attack you can send me a PM to explain and I can remove it if it does fit our standards of "personal attack" for the debate forums. 

 

I have no idea what type of "research" was done other than comparing language use nor do I know by whom and shared with whom. I don't think you have anything to worry about. :)

 

Let's return this discussion back to the topic it was started for, or wherever it left off. Anything more about this that you question can go to me by PM or email. 

 

Thanks everyone. :)


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