new study on vaccination belief - Page 4 - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
#91 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 04:57 PM
 
dalia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Turquesa:

"Genuinely logical people evaluate arguments and not the people making them."

Yes Yes Yes!!!!!!!

Teacozy:

Ya just had to post that insulting meme even though there was no real reason to do so. Seriously, do you actually think that sort of crap is helpful? I'm sure whoever created that meme really had "the children" in mind... The posting of that just solidified what I have been saying is the intent of this whole thread: to discredit through mockery.

Barf.
Mirzam, dinahx and BeckyBird like this.

Wife to one amazing husband superhero.gif, SAHM to DS bouncy.gif 10/09, DS babyboy.gif 10/19,  one furbaby dog2.gif, and lots of chicken3.gif!

 
joy.gif

dalia is offline  
#92 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:01 PM
 
teacozy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hogwarts
Posts: 1,515
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 383 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalia View Post

Teacozy:

Ya just had to post that insulting meme even though there was no real reason to do so. Seriously, do you actually think that sort of crap is helpful? I'm sure whoever created that meme really had "the children" in mind... The posting of that just solidified what I have been saying is the intent of this whole thread: to discredit through mockery.

Barf.

 

Oh, but the memes on the front page of this thread calling PVers sheep was super helpful right? Why not call out those memes?  Also, I'm not the one who brought the moon walk meme up.  


“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson 
teacozy is offline  
#93 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:04 PM
 
dinahx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: earth
Posts: 2,145
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The idea that GMOs = unsafe is an 'extraordinary claim' really betrays next to no knowledge of the transgenic modification process, RoundUp, genetic contamination, etc.

Really the *precautionary principle* would state that before being introduced wholesale into the infant formula supply, something should be proven safe *beyond a shadow of a doubt*.
dinahx is offline  
#94 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:06 PM
 
dalia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Teacozy:

I don't like those memes either, but to be honest after being called crazy (which is the purpose of this thread) I am kinda feeling more lenient toward my "side". This whole thread is gross. And by the way, pointing out another's wrong does not make you right. Another case of Logic 101.

Surely you can come up with a better argument than "they started it"...
BeckyBird likes this.

Wife to one amazing husband superhero.gif, SAHM to DS bouncy.gif 10/09, DS babyboy.gif 10/19,  one furbaby dog2.gif, and lots of chicken3.gif!

 
joy.gif

dalia is offline  
#95 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:07 PM
 
dinahx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: earth
Posts: 2,145
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
And doesn't the picture on the VfV memo just *look fake* to anyone else? I have no position on the Moon landing, but I don't put anything past the government & era that detonated 254 atomic bombs on their own soil or deforested an entire nation with Agent Orange! If there's a Gov I trust less than say, your average Gov of today, it would be the Gov of 1945-1975 USA.
Mirzam and BeckyBird like this.
dinahx is offline  
#96 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:11 PM
 
dalia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dinahx View Post

And doesn't the picture on the VfV memo just *look fake* to anyone else? I have no position on the Moon landing, but I don't put anything past the government & era that detonated 254 atomic bombs on their own soil or deforested an entire nation with Agent Orange! If there's a Gov I trust less than say, your average Gov of today, it would be the Gov of 1945-1975 USA.

I think I see a "Welcome to New Mexico" sign in the background LOL. Seriously, though, while I do believe we landed on the moon I am not ignorant to the lengths some powers that be will go to harm others for their benefit. It happens.
BeckyBird likes this.

Wife to one amazing husband superhero.gif, SAHM to DS bouncy.gif 10/09, DS babyboy.gif 10/19,  one furbaby dog2.gif, and lots of chicken3.gif!

 
joy.gif

dalia is offline  
#97 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:12 PM
 
teacozy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hogwarts
Posts: 1,515
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 383 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalia View Post

Teacozy:

I don't like those memes either, but to be honest after being called crazy (which is the purpose of this thread) I am kinda feeling more lenient toward my "side". This whole thread is gross. And by the way, pointing out another's wrong does not make you right. Another case of Logic 101.

Surely you can come up with a better argument than "they started it"...

 

My argument isn't "they started it".  I was questioning why you would call out one meme and not the others.The meme I posted was 1) brought up by someone on "your side" and 2) relevant to the thread at least. 


“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson 
teacozy is offline  
#98 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:14 PM
 
dalia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post

My argument isn't "they started it".  I was questioning why you would call out one meme and not the others.  At least the meme I posted was 1) brought up by someone on "your side" and 2) relevant to the thread. 

Well that we can agree on. In fact, as I've been saying, it illustrates very clearly the WHOLE POINT of the thread. To generalize a whole group of people into the "crazy" category. Very helpful to the children. Yes, very helpful indeed...

Wife to one amazing husband superhero.gif, SAHM to DS bouncy.gif 10/09, DS babyboy.gif 10/19,  one furbaby dog2.gif, and lots of chicken3.gif!

 
joy.gif

dalia is offline  
#99 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:19 PM
 
teacozy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hogwarts
Posts: 1,515
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 383 Post(s)

@Dina 

 

"The idea that GMOs = unsafe is an 'extraordinary claim' really betrays next to no knowledge of the transgenic modification process, RoundUp, genetic contamination, etc." 

 

If he is so sure they are unsafe then why doesn't he publish any of his evidence? 

 

You could have the most brilliant brain surgeon in the world claim that carrots cause brain cancer but until he performs studies and has them peer reviewed in a medical journal his assertions are just that, assertions. Not evidence. 


“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson 
teacozy is offline  
#100 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:19 PM
 
dalia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
And just for the record, I am not on a "side". I used that word because that's the way this debate always ends up being fought on this board. The only side I'm on is the side of parents and children who wish to do what's best for their families without suffering ridicule and oppression. My BFF is a vaxer, and I fully support her right to do so. I support the right for vaxxing parents to have a place on this forum and to be heard. And I support my right to make my own choices for my family.

I will *never* support threads like this with an obvious intent to mock and divide. Aren't we all parents? Don't we all want what's best? I assure you I am not nutso. I'm just a mom trying to do my best. I do not appreciate being mocked. It is not helpful and changes nothing while children and families continue to suffer.
Jennyanydots and kathymuggle like this.

Wife to one amazing husband superhero.gif, SAHM to DS bouncy.gif 10/09, DS babyboy.gif 10/19,  one furbaby dog2.gif, and lots of chicken3.gif!

 
joy.gif

dalia is offline  
#101 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:37 PM
 
beckybird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Shattered Paradigm
Posts: 1,926
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 50 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by orangeorchids View Post
 

 I haven't seen one person pro vaccine getting emotional about posts in this thread.

Translation: emotional = illogical, unscientific.

Stirring the pot with this one. Your intention here is all too clear.


 
 
 "Medical propaganda ops are, in the long run, the most dangerous. They appear to be neutral. They wave no political banners. They claim to be science. For these reasons, they can accomplish the goals of overt fascism without arousing suspicion.” — Jon Rappoport
 
 
 
beckybird is online now  
#102 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 05:59 PM
 
dalia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeckyBird View Post

Translation: emotional = illogical, unscientific.
Stirring the pot with this one. Your intention here is all too clear.

Yep. I'm just another woman being hysterical. Just like all those moms who *think* their kids were harmed by vaccines when obviously it was just a coincidence. Vaccines are safe!! (please add sarcastic tone for full effect)
BeckyBird and kathymuggle like this.

Wife to one amazing husband superhero.gif, SAHM to DS bouncy.gif 10/09, DS babyboy.gif 10/19,  one furbaby dog2.gif, and lots of chicken3.gif!

 
joy.gif

dalia is offline  
#103 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 06:00 PM
 
dalia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post

The point of the thread is to debate the study posted. This is a *debate* forum.  If you don't agree with the results in the study then feel free to explain why and provide evidence. Stop attacking the posters that are debating their stance on the study by telling us what we believe or why we are posting on this thread. 

Yes, this is a *debate* forum. Forgive me if I expect actual logical arguments to be presented instead of insults.

Wife to one amazing husband superhero.gif, SAHM to DS bouncy.gif 10/09, DS babyboy.gif 10/19,  one furbaby dog2.gif, and lots of chicken3.gif!

 
joy.gif

dalia is offline  
#104 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 06:43 PM
 
dinahx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: earth
Posts: 2,145
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Perhaps next we will see a 'study' on how parents who question vaccines cry more @ sad movies?
Marnica and BeckyBird like this.
dinahx is offline  
#105 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 07:03 PM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,125
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 177 Post(s)
nm

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is online now  
#106 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 07:20 PM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,125
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 177 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
 

 

The point of the thread is to debate the study posted. This is a *debate* forum.  If you don't agree with the results in the study then feel free to explain why and provide evidence. 

 

The study is useless. I have no idea why it was carried out, except to add fuel to the fire of vaccine wars.  

 

1.  it does not define conspiracy theorist nor does it say what percentage of those who question vaccines are conspiracy theorists.

 

2.  conspiracy theorists can be right.

 

me:  what is 2+2

conspiracy theorist:  4

me - right!  Ding-ding-ding

 

3.  Vaccine decisions should be based on the evidence, or lack thereof.  It is pretty irrelevant whether a "conspiracy theorist" (however that is defined, and my opinion is some people are awfully loose with the term) posts a link or someone else, it is the value of the link that is important.  

applejuice and BeckyBird like this.

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is online now  
#107 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 08:46 PM
 
Taximom5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,198
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Maybe teacozy and orangeorchids would understand how insulting and irrelevant this "study" is if we were to post similar ones about pro vaxxers. Maybe something along the lines of "pro vaxxers are more likely to believe that one group of people has more value than another."

This whole line of thinking is disgusting, and not worthy of MDC.
Mirzam, applejuice and BeckyBird like this.
Taximom5 is offline  
#108 of 139 Old 10-06-2013, 10:42 PM
 
beckybird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Shattered Paradigm
Posts: 1,926
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 50 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by orangeorchids View Post
 

I believe the study was carried out to determine, why people oppose vaccines although science literature for the most part clearly supports the use of them. That does not sound useless to me.

Your remarks seem to be too driven by emotion, potentially skewing your thoughts so I took a look at your claims:

1. Yes, it does define conspiratorial thinking as a form of cognitive style.

2. Irrelevant. The claim is a potential opposition to vaccines due to conspiratorial arguments. There's no conspiracy theories about 2+2 (unless you know something I don't know). It's not about being right, but about being right using conspiracy theories.

3. Bingo. That's the whole argument of the study. Often the best evidence is brought forward by scientists. Many who oppose vaccines do not seem to think so and would rather reach their decision based on propaganda and personal beliefs.

 

That's as much as I could gather from the article, sorry I couldn't be more informative. But who knows, maybe Dr Lewandowsky will become a member one of these days and he can personally answer your questions.

Does this mean that any researcher, doctor, scientist, lay person, parent, etc. who questions/doubts the current scientific consensus is a conspiracy theorist?

Mirzam, applejuice and rachelsmama like this.

 
 
 "Medical propaganda ops are, in the long run, the most dangerous. They appear to be neutral. They wave no political banners. They claim to be science. For these reasons, they can accomplish the goals of overt fascism without arousing suspicion.” — Jon Rappoport
 
 
 
beckybird is online now  
#109 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 06:19 AM
 
Taximom5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,198
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by orangeorchids View Post
 

I think you should post the type of studies if you find them. Maybe in a scientific journal that proves conspiracy theories? Do you know of any?

 

We don't need any more studies.  It's already crystal-clear, based on what all the pro-vaccine people keep saying, over and over.

 

"Vaccines are generally extremely safe, and vaccine reactions are vanishingly rare," coupled with "vaccines should be mandated," and even "those who forego vaccines should be excluded from schools, fired from jobs in health care industries, charged more for group health insurance, and sued when others become ill."

 

There's your proof:  pro-vaccine people believe that those who don't react adversely to vaccines are more important than those who do, simply because there are more who don't.

 

Good news, though (or not):  that is changing.  Because of the ever-increasing vaccine schedule, more and more people are actually having severe vaccine reactions, and the US Department of Health and Human Services is no longer able to keep the issue hushed and gag-ordered.  30 years ago, nobody had even heard that vaccine reactions were possible. Today, everybody knows someone whose family member has had a bad reaction.  And by "sheer coincidence" (or not),  30 years ago, most people had never even heard of autism.  Today, everyone knows at least one family whose child has profound autism.  Despite the best efforts of the pharmaceutical industry and the government that funds them, these people are sharing their stories, and we are learning that a huge percentage of the children with autism also had documented reactions to vaccines.

Mirzam and BeckyBird like this.
Taximom5 is offline  
#110 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 06:48 AM
 
teacozy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hogwarts
Posts: 1,515
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 383 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taximom5 View Post
 

 

We don't need any more studies.  It's already crystal-clear, based on what all the pro-vaccine people keep saying, over and over.

 

"Vaccines are generally extremely safe, and vaccine reactions are vanishingly rare," coupled with "vaccines should be mandated," and even "those who forego vaccines should be excluded from schools, fired from jobs in health care industries, charged more for group health insurance, and sued when others become ill."

 

There's your proof:  pro-vaccine people believe that those who don't react adversely to vaccines are more important than those who do, simply because there are more who don't.

 

Good news, though (or not):  that is changing.  Because of the ever-increasing vaccine schedule, more and more people are actually having severe vaccine reactions, and the US Department of Health and Human Services is no longer able to keep the issue hushed and gag-ordered.  30 years ago, nobody had even heard that vaccine reactions were possible. Today, everybody knows someone whose family member has had a bad reaction.  And by "sheer coincidence" (or not),  30 years ago, most people had never even heard of autism.  Today, everyone knows at least one family whose child has profound autism.  Despite the best efforts of the pharmaceutical industry and the government that funds them, these people are sharing their stories, and we are learning that a huge percentage of the children with autism also had documented reactions to vaccines.

 

" "vaccines should be mandated"   Evidence please? I don't think I have ever seen any PVer on this forum say they believe vaccines should be mandated for everyone. 

 

"30 years ago, nobody had even heard that vaccine reactions were possible. Today, everybody knows someone whose family member has had a bad reaction." 

 

Well, now you know one.  I do not know of a *single* person who has ever had a vaccine reaction. No one in my family. No one in any of my friends' family. No one I ever went to school with.  My husband worked with children for 9 years (thousands of students) and never saw a single vaccine reaction or heard of one.  No one in his family has ever had a reaction to a vaccine either and a lot of the older generation even got the smallpox vaccine.  

 

Statistically you are not likely to ever know anyone who has had a severe vaccine reaction. 


“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson 
teacozy is offline  
#111 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 06:50 AM
 
Taximom5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,198
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)

A bit of a review of what's going on in this thread:

 

Orangeorchids' OP was a link to a study whose clear intent was to discredit and insult those who question vaccines:  "If you distrust vaccines, you're more likely to believe NAS faked the moon landings."

 

Knowing that many members here not only distrust vaccines, but have children who have had adverse reactions to vaccines, orangeorchids seems surprised that they are upset or offended by being branded as crazies:

Quote:
Originally Posted by orangeorchids View Post
 

Why are members against vaccines so sensitive to the posts here? I haven't seen one person pro vaccine getting emotional about posts in this thread. As far as I'm concerned, I have not noticed any offensive posts here.

 

Of course, orangeorchids seems not to have noticed that this entire thread is attacking those who distrust vaccines; we wouldn't expect provaxxers to get emotional about posts calling vaccine questioners crazy.  Would we?

 

And then we have post #119, which, indicates that people who question vaccines MUST be crazy if they don't agree with MOST of the (pharma-funded) science literature;  apparently, we're expected to ignore the independent science that either refutes or calls into question the results of industry-funded/directed studies:

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by orangeorchids View Post
 

I believe the study was carried out to determine, why people oppose vaccines although science literature for the most part clearly supports the use of them. 

 

 

Funny.  When we lay the posts out like this, without all the side-tracked distraction-arguments on whether or not the moon landing was faked, or whether or not GMOs might have unforeseen health consequences, the intent to discredit vaccine questioners really becomes very clear.

Mirzam, rachelsmama and BeckyBird like this.
Taximom5 is offline  
#112 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 06:57 AM
 
dinahx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: earth
Posts: 2,145
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
TeaCozy: then the odds REALLY must be on my side, b/c I even know someone who was compensated by VICP. Not like 'I met them on the internet', like I met them in a tiny Southern town I happened to live in. I also know someone who wrote a book on Polio, so she met a ton of Vax (OPV) acquired Polio victims.

I would say if you never meet anyone with a Vax reaction of any type then you are either hanging out on Non-Vax island or you are not open to hearing about people's real experiences with vaccines.
BeckyBird likes this.
dinahx is offline  
#113 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 06:57 AM
 
Taximom5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,198
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
 

 

" "vaccines should be mandated"   Evidence please? I don't think I have ever seen any PVer on this forum say they believe vaccines should be mandated for everyone. 

 

"30 years ago, nobody had even heard that vaccine reactions were possible. Today, everybody knows someone whose family member has had a bad reaction." 

 

Well, now you know one.  I do not know of a *single* person who has ever had a vaccine reaction. No one in my family. No one in any of my friends' family. No one I ever went to school with.  My husband worked with children for 9 years (thousands of students) and never saw a single vaccine reaction or heard of one.  No one in his family has ever had a reaction to a vaccine either and a lot of the older generation even got the smallpox vaccine.  

 

Statistically you are not likely to ever know anyone who has had a severe vaccine reaction. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
 

 

 

  I do not know of a *single* person who has ever had a vaccine reaction. No one in my family. No one in any of my friends' family. 

Nope.  Not true.  You know of me.  I've had at least three separate severe vaccine reactions.  And my children, all of whom had documented vaccine reactions.

 

You also know of the people whose reactions have been admitted and compensated by the US Department of Health and Human Services, because that has been posted here many times, and you know of the people whose reactions have been reported to VAERS.

 

And if you had school-age children, you would know families in your school district and/or church whose children have had reactions.


They might not tell you about their reactions.  But that doesn't mean you don't know people who have had reactions, no matter how much you misuse statistics.

Mirzam, dinahx and BeckyBird like this.
Taximom5 is offline  
#114 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 07:12 AM
 
teacozy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hogwarts
Posts: 1,515
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 383 Post(s)

@ Taximom 

 

This is a vaccine forum. Of course the number of people who have had a reaction is going to be skewed.  This is not a representation of the general public.  If I went on a brain tumor forum there would probably be many many people posting who have brain tumors.  But in real life I don't know of anyone who has ever had a brain tumor.  To tell people " I know 30 people with brain tumors" without mentioning I know them from a brain tumor forum would sound ludicrous if I wasn't an Oncologist. 

 

You said a bad reaction to vaccines. I know of people who get mild fevers for a day or two. Maybe some soreness or redness. I do not know of anyone who has had a severe reaction.  If a child at church had a severe reaction to a vaccine, we would know about it.  There are open prayers at every service.  My dad has been at the same church for almost 30 years. Never seen or heard of any reaction. 


“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson 
teacozy is offline  
#115 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 08:37 AM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,125
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 177 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
 

@ Taximom 

 

This is a vaccine forum. Of course the number of people who have had a reaction is going to be skewed.  This is not a representation of the general public.  If I went on a brain tumor forum there would probably be many many people posting who have brain tumors.  But in real life I don't know of anyone who has ever had a brain tumor.  To tell people " I know 30 people with brain tumors" without mentioning I know them from a brain tumor forum would sound ludicrous if I wasn't an Oncologist. 

 

Not necessarily.

 

Once upon a time I wondered if the percentage of people on MDC who had a child with a vaccine reaction was skewed.  Did people who experience vaccine reactions tend to congregate on specific sites?  The answer seems to be a soft yes, but (and it is a big "But") there are plenty of stories on non-vaccine, mainstreams boards where people discuss their childs vaccine reaction.  Here is a huge thread from just this week:

 

http://www.cafemom.com/group/advice/forums/read/19137008/Has_a_vaccine_caused_serious_side_effects_to_your_child?next=1


There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is online now  
#116 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 08:51 AM
 
Marnica's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,585
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
 

 

" "vaccines should be mandated"   Evidence please? I don't think I have ever seen any PVer on this forum say they believe vaccines should be mandated for everyone.

 

"30 years ago, nobody had even heard that vaccine reactions were possible. Today, everybody knows someone whose family member has had a bad reaction."

 

Well, now you know one.  I do not know of a *single* person who has ever had a vaccine reaction. No one in my family. No one in any of my friends' family. No one I ever went to school with.  My husband worked with children for 9 years (thousands of students) and never saw a single vaccine reaction or heard of one.  No one in his family has ever had a reaction to a vaccine either and a lot of the older generation even got the smallpox vaccine.

 

Statistically you are not likely to ever know anyone who has had a severe vaccine reaction.

Are you unable to use the quote function? Just curious. I find reading your posts confusing.

 

In any event. The reason the above is true is simply because of how you are defining a reaction. It's the same reason the medical community says that severe reactions are one in a million. If you deny something is a reaction, then you don't have to count it. Asides from your own family and that of your husband, You are not likely to know the personal medical information of the thousands of students he worked with, nor of your own classmates.

 

I have had a vaccine reaction. I do not discuss it with anyone.

Mirzam, BeckyBird and kathymuggle like this.

If the people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." Thomas Jefferson.

Marnica is offline  
#117 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 08:55 AM
 
Mirzam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Outside the hive mind
Posts: 7,500
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 83 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marnica View Post
 
 

Are you unable to use the quote function? Just curious. I find reading your posts confusing.

 

In any event. The reason the above is true is simply because of how you are defining a reaction. It's the same reason the medical community says that severe reactions are one in a million. If you deny something is a reaction, then you don't have to count it. Asides from your own family and that of your husband, You are not likely to know the personal medical information of the thousands of students he worked with, nor of your own classmates.

 

I have had a vaccine reaction. I do not discuss it with anyone.

 

This. 


Rainbow.giftstillheart.gifsmile.gif

 

"If you find from your own experience that something is a fact and it contradicts what some authority has written down, then you must abandon the authority and base your reasoning on your own findings"~ Leonardo da Vinci

Mirzam is online now  
#118 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 09:28 AM
 
teacozy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hogwarts
Posts: 1,515
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 383 Post(s)

I was responding to Taximom's comment "30 years ago, nobody had even heard that vaccine reactions were possible. Today, everybody knows someone whose family member has had a bad reaction."  

 

And I said I don't *know of* anyone who has had a severe reaction to a vaccine, and I haven't.  Statistically, it's not likely that I would because they are so rare.  Maybe we have a different definition of severe or bad reaction? 

 

To state that "everybody knows someone whose family member has had a bad reaction" is a pretty extraordinary claim.  Care to back that up with any evidence that isn't anecdotal? 


“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson 
teacozy is offline  
#119 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 10:05 AM
 
teacozy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hogwarts
Posts: 1,515
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 383 Post(s)

@mama24-7  Please read the debate forum guidelines.

 

"Personally directed negative comments will not be tolerated. Discuss the topic and not the individual." 

 

Please edit your post or you will be flagged. 


“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson 
teacozy is offline  
#120 of 139 Old 10-07-2013, 11:38 AM
 
mama24-7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: with the dust bunnies
Posts: 2,456
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
 

@mama24-7  Please read the debate forum guidelines.

 

"Personally directed negative comments will not be tolerated. Discuss the topic and not the individual." 

 

Please edit your post or you will be flagged. 

 

Right, and the topic is how someone could not see something that is available to be seen, as evidenced by my mentioning another person. Also, I don't see what you have decided is "negative." The only thing I can think that might be negative is the sentence I started w/, "Maybe."  But it'd only be negative if were actually true.  I won't be editing my post at this time & you are welcome to discuss it w/ a mod if you see fit.

 

Have a nice day!

Sus


Baby the babies while they're babies so they don't need babying for a lifetime.
mama24-7 is online now  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off