Vaccinated vs unvaccinated study - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 10:33 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Kyle Rutherford View Post

 

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You might be interested in the fact that, out of the parents of the 12 children in the study
 

 

I thought you claimed to be a science teacher. I guess not, since 12 children is an EXTREMELY small sample. Anyone who was an expert would know to not use '12' individuals. It's basic stats.

 


Wondering to whom this is addressed, as I have never claimed to be a science teacher.  Kyle Rutherford also deliberately only partially quoted me--maybe that's as far as he read?    Or he didn't want to admit that the parents of all 12 children fully supported Dr. Wakefield?  

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#62 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 10:43 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Back to the original topic. We debated this same thing a while back, and I'm sure there was some good stuff in that thread. This is about the german vax/no fax study which had issues (e.g. small numbers of unvaccinated children) but was even with that able to show a statistical difference in the health of the two groups - the vaccinated children had less vaccine preventable diseases. Everything else was the same within the statistics: 

 

http://www.mothering.com/community/t/1353634/vaxxed-vs-unvaxxed-study

 

Another interesting point.  They looked at over 13,000 children and couldn't even find 100 completely unvaccinated ones out of that sample.    

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#63 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 10:51 AM
 
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Another interesting point.  They looked at over 13,000 children and couldn't even find 100 completely unvaccinated ones out of that sample.    

yet you post thread after thread after thread (ad nauseam!) on how these completely unvaccinated ones are those you are in fear of :twins  

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#64 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 11:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
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yet you post thread after thread after thread (ad nauseam!) on how these completely unvaccinated ones are those you are in fear of :twins  

 

I'm not going to address this again.  You're only making yourself look silly at this point.   


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#65 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 11:51 AM
 
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I'm not going to address this again.  You're only making yourself look silly at this point.   

you did address it - you replied :bgbounce

 

thought you liked what YOU posted?

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#66 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 12:04 PM
 
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How is this poking and taunting acceptable but unpleasantness from the other side results in a permanent ban?  I'm not arguing against the ban, but am wondering exactly where the line is drawn.  And yes, I do have my big girl panties on and I'm sure teacozy does too.

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#67 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 12:12 PM - Thread Starter
 
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How is this poking and taunting acceptable but unpleasantness from the other side results in a permanent ban?  I'm not arguing against the ban, but am wondering exactly where the line is drawn.  And yes, I do have my big girl panties on and I'm sure teacozy does too.

 

I wonder that as well. 


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#68 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 12:23 PM
 
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Yeah me too. Should I put some kind of animated smiley face here to illustrate how much this makes me curious what the rules are?
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#69 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 01:57 PM
 
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You missed some of Kyle's extremely upsetting posts last night. He was incredibly rude and insensitive to a mother who lost a child. I have quotes if you want to read them. PM me if so.

For the record, I would have been just as furious if a non-vax member had posted what he did. It was awful! I would hope, if you knew what he said, that you would understand and agree.

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#70 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 02:55 PM
 
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Originally Posted by BeckyBird View Post

You missed some of Kyle's extremely upsetting posts last night. He was incredibly rude and insensitive to a mother who lost a child. I have quotes if you want to read them. PM me if so.
For the record, I would have been just as furious if a non-vax member had posted what he did. It was awful! I would hope, if you knew what he said, that you would understand and agree.

I agree about Kyle. His posts were simply disgusting and inappropriate towards that poor mom. He should have been banned immediately instead of allowing him to continue posting for hours.

While I would never compare what Kyle did to the taunting and harassing (not sure if I have the correct word there) that Chickabiddy is referencing. It's generally the same members (from both sides of the debate) but it does get to be a bit much. Where is the line drawn where action is taken by mods.
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#71 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 05:13 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Kyle Rutherford View Post

Quote:
You might be interested in the fact that, out of the parents of the 12 children in the study
I thought you claimed to be a science teacher. I guess not, since 12 children is an EXTREMELY small sample. Anyone who was an expert would know to not use '12' individuals. It's basic stats.


 

In fact, anyone who knows anything about medical research would know that sometimes large sample sizes are very difficult to obtain and that small pilot studies are indeed perfectly acceptable. Especially in cases of rare conditions or, as Taxi has pointed out, when very little is known or recognised about a condition. Cost can also often be a factor. In early research it may be necessary to prove your point with a small sample size in order to attract funding for a larger study.

All studies have limitations and sample size can be one of them. But you will find many, many research papers in highly respected peer-reviewed journals which use small sample sizes. It will usually be commented on in the "limitations" section and the authors will often give the reason there.
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#72 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 05:37 PM
 
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You missed some of Kyle's extremely upsetting posts last night. He was incredibly rude and insensitive to a mother who lost a child. I have quotes if you want to read them. PM me if so.

For the record, I would have been just as furious if a non-vax member had posted what he did. It was awful! I would hope, if you knew what he said, that you would understand and agree.

 

I didn't see anything terrible, so I assume I missed it.  I'm sorry that a bereaved mother was mistreated.  As I wrote, I'm not arguing against his ban.  I am questioning how much one "regular" is allowed to taunt others before action is taken -- either by moderators or by the community.  (I know I (a pro-vaxer) reminded Kyle of the rules last night, and prosciencemum (another pro-vaxer) called him on his rudeness.)

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#73 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 06:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post
 

 

I didn't see anything terrible, so I assume I missed it.  I'm sorry that a bereaved mother was mistreated.  As I wrote, I'm not arguing against his ban.  I am questioning how much one "regular" is allowed to taunt others before action is taken -- either by moderators or by the community.  (I know I (a pro-vaxer) reminded Kyle of the rules last night, and prosciencemum (another pro-vaxer) called him on his rudeness.)

That is not how it went down.

 

We had a conversation this morning.  

 

So, either you missed it and decided to call me on suggesting Cynthia ban Kyle without knowing anything about it (or bothering to read the whole thread and trying to figure out why someone would call for banning) , or you knew about it and in some universe thought my suggesting banning was equivalent to mistreating a grieving mother.

 

I am in blue, you are in green.

 

It is on the military thread, where kyle displayed most of his glory.

 

 

 If you can't do that you may be removed from the forum.  (Cynthia)

"To the bolded:  Yes, please do.  

 

I would start with Kyle Rutherford.  He has repeatedly been disrespectful. " 

 

(10 hours, 57 minutes ago)

 

"And this ^ post is no better."

 

(10 hours, 34 minutes ago)

 

"Don't care.  Flag it.

 

Saying "ban Kyle Rutherford" is in no way equivalent to suggesting someone is using their own childs death as non-vax fodder."

(10 hours and 32 minutes ago)

 

 

 

 

 

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#74 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 06:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post
 

 

I didn't see anything terrible, so I assume I missed it.  I'm sorry that a bereaved mother was mistreated.  As I wrote, I'm not arguing against his ban.  I am questioning how much one "regular" is allowed to taunt others before action is taken -- either by moderators or by the community.  (I know I (a pro-vaxer) reminded Kyle of the rules last night, and prosciencemum (another pro-vaxer) called him on his rudeness.)

 

Taunting is not the same as quoting and or using what a poster wrote or linked so I'm so confused by what you mean?

 

This is a debate about a study and as Becky said, apparently you miss the post that were removed so if a poster is in violation of the policies here, why don't you flag it?

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#75 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 06:12 PM
 
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Also is this some sort of tit for tat thing?  Point out non-vaxxers aren't angelic after some pro-vaxxers were incredibly vile ?

 

The timing is interesting.  Serebat has been on this tangent for days and you choose to call her, and mods, on it now.  Deflection alert!

 

I am not saying the pro-vaxxers do not have a minor point, but the timing is circumspect and classless.

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#76 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 06:23 PM
 
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When we had a conversation this morning I was unaware that KR had been rude to a grieving mother.  I thought the issue was simple disrespect and I know better now.

 

My timing could have been better, I suppose, but classless is a bit harsh.  The incident got me thinking about rudeness and moderation, and what I would hope to see from the community as well as the moderators.

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#77 of 77 Old 02-03-2014, 11:23 PM
 
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I obviously missed the worst from KR too.

But like chick biddy my timing on wondering about what constitutes crossing a line is only prompted by seeing the mods in action. Nothing more.

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