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#61 of 143 Old 02-02-2014, 09:55 PM
 
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http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1447151/

 

On first googling, this is what I came up with about military specific vaccination programs. Thoughts?

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#62 of 143 Old 02-02-2014, 09:58 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Kyle Rutherford View Post
 

Can't prove anything in science, but there is no reason we ought to assume they are dangerous.

Where are the studies that demonstrate they are dangerous? There are millions of service men out there.

There are 1,429,995 military members. In order to show at least some detriment, we would expect at least 71499 service members to show at least some harm.

The problem with looking at it this way is that many of our military members do show significant evidence of harm; but not all of it can be clearly linked to one thing. They are exposed to so much that it would be very difficult to weed out exactly what has caused them health problems or disability. With all of the disability claims, how exactly would the VA doctors go about proving that their disability was linked to vaccine injury? And does the inability to positively prove that necessarily mean that the vaccines given to service members are safe?

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#63 of 143 Old 02-02-2014, 10:02 PM - Thread Starter
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The anthrax vaccine was never proved to be safe and effective. ​

First thing I noticed. Only one author. Red flag.

Second thing I noticed was the beginning paragraph. You can NEVER prove ANYTHING to be safe and effective because PROOF is for math. Not science.

I don't need to read any more than that to not trust it.

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#64 of 143 Old 02-02-2014, 11:13 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Kyle Rutherford View Post
 

Uh. No. I was diagnosed with severe anxiety.

 

I'm confused.  You have severe anxiety, yet you join a parenting forum (even though you have no children or step-children) to tell us that we parents are idiots (you also have that posted on your FaceBook page) and to argue vehemently with us.  You post your real name, but get all offended when people check out your FaceBook page to see if you are really what you say you are.  You say you were in the military, but apparently you were given an early discharge "after a bit."  You say you are a biologist, but you have no degree, and you insist that the only reason you lack a degree is that you refused to pay $50.  You say you are not purposely trying to piss people off, yet you have taunted a mother whose child died, and you have told another mother here to f-ck off.
 
This does not sound like an intelligent use of time for someone with severe anxiety.

You also don't sound like someone who has any wisdom or experience to offer to the parents here.
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#65 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 05:45 AM
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There are several posts in this discussion that are personally pointed and/or inflammatory. Please debate the topic without making remarks about others. Disagreement should posted respectfully. If you can't do that you may be removed from the forum.  

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#66 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 06:44 AM
 
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nm

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

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#67 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 06:55 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Cynthia Mosher View Post
 

There are several posts in this discussion that are personally pointed and/or inflammatory. Please debate the topic without making remarks about others. Disagreement should posted respectfully. If you can't do that you may be removed from the forum.  

To the bolded:  Yes, please do.  

 

I would start with Kyle Rutherford.  He has repeatedly been disrespectful.  

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There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

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#68 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 06:58 AM
 
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Originally Posted by rednightingale View Post
 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1447151/

 

On first googling, this is what I came up with about military specific vaccination programs. Thoughts?

My thoughts:

 

I think you should continue to post after this debacle is over.

 

I think a thread on vaccination and the military could be great.

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There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

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#69 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 06:59 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Kyle Rutherford View Post
 

Vaccines in the military are mandatory. Every year, each soldier is subjected to at least 15 vaccines. They are a group that gets vaccinated the most out of any other group in the US.

If vaccines are dangerous, why would the government give them to their troops?

Why haven't troops shown a deleterious effect to these innumerable vaccines?


Care to list the 15 vaccines each soldier gets each year?

 

You do know that the military goes by CDC schedule, no? They do not recommend to receive 15 vaccines yearly.... So women/men who join the military are examined. Their vaccination history gets recorded and titers are drawn for MMR/varicella. If they need further doses to be up to date they get them. Then yearly flumist. The end. If and only if they deploy to the sandbox, they receive the Anthrax.

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#70 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 07:02 AM
 
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Rednightingale as an ex-military spouse I share your observations. There are many interesting factors to look at. I also noted how on base doctors couldn't care less about families with severe issues (autism mostly) - they didn't even try to help. Refused referrals for testing. Said well they are born that way now medicate them and send them to a home. I have so many abysmal things to say about military doctors it could fill a book! Please stay on the forums for other discussions. You can ignore users or just come to the no vaccine/ or delay/select forums.

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#71 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 07:15 AM
 
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Thanks for being so welcoming. :) I definitely plan to stay around for other discussions; I have learned so much from reading on all the vaccination boards over the past several months. I'm not sure that I have anything really original to contribute, other than questions and anecdotal observations which I know aren't looked upon terribly favorably, but I'm interested in the discussion, nonetheless. 

 

Military members also get the smallpox vaccine - although I believe that is also only if they are deployed. I remember my husband getting it pre-deployment because he was counseled to be very cautious in his contact with me for a certain time afterwards, given that I was pregnant at the time. Military members most certainly do not receive 15 vaccines a year though; I'm not sure where that number comes from. As far as I'm aware the flu shot is the only one that is provided yearly. I'm pretty sure my husband would have mentioned it earlier if he was getting injected with that many vaccines every year.

 

I don't have a lot of experience with on-base doctors, but I have heard a lot of horror stories. I've also heard about the difficulties that families with children on the autistic spectrum face when trying to get much needed services and specialized medical care. I know first hand how difficult it can be to get something that should be simple like respite care, and that was with a child with cancer, so I cannot even imagine how challenging it is when dealing with something like autism that falls on a spectrum and is much harder to quantify.

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#72 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 07:18 AM
 
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Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post
 

To the bolded:  Yes, please do.  

 

I would start with Kyle Rutherford.  He has repeatedly been disrespectful.  


And this post is no better.

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#73 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 07:20 AM
 
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And this post is no better.

Don't care.  Flag it.

 

Saying "ban Kyle Rutherford" is in no way equivalent to suggesting someone is using their own childs death as non-vax fodder.

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There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

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#74 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 07:24 AM
 
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Yes smallpox is only given if deployed to the sandbox.
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#75 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 08:48 AM - Thread Starter
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say you are a biologist, but you have no degree

Are you stupid? Seriously? I already went over this. A degree costs $50. I decided to pursue two degrees before I get the piece of paper. Do you seriously think that knowledge magically and mysteriously enters your mind once you pay the $50? I've also been working in labs around the campus. Sorry. But if you have knowledge on a subject, degree or not, and you are working in the field, you are a biologist.

Hell. The paleontology which Jurassic Park was based off of had absolutely NO degree. He couldn't pass college because he was dyslexic. Does that make him 'not' a paleontologist?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Horner_(paleontologist)

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#76 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 08:49 AM - Thread Starter
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 is that you refused to pay $50. ​

Wrong. I decided to not pay it until I am finished with my second degree. 

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#77 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 08:50 AM - Thread Starter
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You say you are not purposely trying to piss people off, yet you have taunted a mother whose child died, and you have told another mother here to f-ck off.

Taunted? Saying, "It sucks that your child died" is not 'taunting.' It is sympathizing. 

The person I told to f-ck off deserved it for saying I am not a biologist, which I am.

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There are some things that can CAUSE cancer. But it makes no sense to blame things you don't understand. 

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#79 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 09:02 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Kyle Rutherford View Post
 

Taunted? Saying, "It sucks that your child died" is not 'taunting.' It is sympathizing. 

The person I told to f-ck off deserved it for saying I am not a biologist, which I am.

 

I'll just say that typing "That sucks."  when talking about a child that died comes across as callous and dismissive. 

 

You've said your an Aspie and I genuinely do not think you meant to come across that way, but that's why you are getting the reaction you are. 


“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson 
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#80 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 10:02 AM
 
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Are you stupid? Seriously? I already went over this. A degree costs $50. I decided to pursue two degrees before I get the piece of paper. Do you seriously think that knowledge magically and mysteriously enters your mind once you pay the $50? I've also been working in labs around the campus. Sorry. But if you have knowledge on a subject, degree or not, and you are working in the field, you are a biologist.

Hell. The paleontology which Jurassic Park was based off of had absolutely NO degree. He couldn't pass college because he was dyslexic. Does that make him 'not' a paleontologist?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Horner_(paleontologist)

I flagged the "stupid" thing.  Shocking, I know.

 

I will address the rest for kicks.

 

There is a big debate in many fields as to whether or not someone who works in a field, has a lot of training in a field, but does not have a degree in said field can call themselves xyz (Librarian, Accountant, Electrician, Biologist).  For many people, the answer is no.  In some fields, you can get in a lot of trouble for calling yourself something when you do not hold the correct paperwork (all medical fields come to mind).

 

If I told people I was an accountant and set myself as someone who could answer questions on accounting, they might feel deceived if they learned I did not have the correct paperwork.  


There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

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#81 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 10:10 AM
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Feel free to continue the discussion but Kyle Rutherford is no longer a member of this community. :thumb


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#82 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 10:14 AM
 
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Feel free to continue the discussion but Kyle Rutherford is no longer a member of this community. :thumb

Phew!

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#83 of 143 Old 02-03-2014, 10:15 AM
 
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Feel free to continue the discussion but Kyle Rutherford is no longer a member of this community. :thumb

Thank you!

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#84 of 143 Old 02-04-2014, 06:26 PM
 
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Then why mention her child at all?

She said, "My child died of cancer. After that, i worried what to put in my children."

Sorry. But that does not compute. Children get cancer all the time. NATURALLY all the time. It has nothing to do with what you put in the child at all. It has to do with mutations in cancer cells which either activate the protooncogenes to become oncogenes or it causes the TSG area to turn off, causing uncontrollable cell growth.

Children get cancer NATURALLY? Give me a break. The mutations in cancer cells are not from natural causes. Cancer is completely caused by human error. Cells don't just mutate without a cause. This is just common sense. and we know how many raw fruits and veggies protect humans from cancer (protect our cells) and we also know which foods and substances are carcinogens. vaccines do several things which could cause cancer and ALSO contain carcinogens.

 

So he wanted some evidence....vaccines and Gulf War Syndrome.

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Cancer is completely caused by human error.

 

Cite please?


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#86 of 143 Old 02-04-2014, 06:45 PM
 
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Cite please?

If cancer has no cause then what are carcinogens?

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Carcinogens can cause cancer.  So can nature and genetics.  It's a horrible thing to say that all cancer is caused by human error.  It's also horribly wrong.  Please back up your claim.


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#88 of 143 Old 02-04-2014, 07:14 PM
 
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Sure genes can cause cancer. What caused the inherited genetic error to express itself? human error. what caused the inherited genetic error? human error. Humans don't eat anything close to a natural diet, this influences our genes. The entire thing is a mess. Wild animals don't get cancer. They eat a natural diet, they don't get vaccines.

 

Nature causes cancer? You will have to back that one up.


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#89 of 143 Old 02-04-2014, 07:15 PM
 
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 It has nothing to do with what you put in the child at all. 

This is horribly wrong also. The biologist said this? headscratch.gif 

 

 

Eta: Wild animals can still have cancer, but it is usually caused by environmental toxins. 

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#90 of 143 Old 02-04-2014, 07:19 PM
 
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Nature causes cancer? You will have to back that one up.

 

http://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancercauses/geneticsandcancer/oncogenesandtumorsuppressorgenes/oncogenes-tumor-suppressor-genes-and-cancer-what-are-mutations


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