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Old 07-14-2014, 12:58 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Total fluff piece

Nonvaxers and vaccine questioners have their celebrity examples in those dumb blondes Jenny McCarthy and Alicia Silverstone.

It is only right that vaccine promoters should have theirs. I do not believe that people should make their healthcare decisions based on what a celebrity does, but really, if people did not really listen to celebrities, I do not think the media would put up these silly fluff reports.

Some pro-vaccine celebrities are -
Amanda Peet, Jennifer Lopez, Salma Hayek, Jennifer Garner, Keri Russell, Kristi Yamaguchi, Marc Anthony, Bill Gates, Queen Rania, Denise Richards, Sarah Michelle Gellar, and Snooki.

Choose your heroes carefully.

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Old 07-14-2014, 03:50 PM
 
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What's a Snooki?
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Old 07-14-2014, 04:03 PM - Thread Starter
 
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What's a Snooki?
The name of a celebrity mother who vaccinates.

http://hollywoodlife.com/2014/07/11/...dlife-podcast/
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Old 07-14-2014, 05:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by applejuice View Post
Nonvaxers and vaccine questioners have their celebrity examples in those dumb blondes Jenny McCarthy and Alicia Silverstone.

It is only right that vaccine promoters should have theirs. I do not believe that people should make their healthcare decisions based on what a celebrity does, but really, if people did not really listen to celebrities, I do not think the media would put up these silly fluff reports.

Some pro-vaccine celebrities are -
Amanda Peet, Jennifer Lopez, Salma Hayek, Jennifer Garner, Keri Russell, Kristi Yamaguchi, Marc Anthony, Bill Gates, Queen Rania, Denise Richards, Sarah Michelle Gellar, and Snooki.

Choose your heroes carefully.
Why would anyone consider someone a "hero" based solely on their vaccination choices - I reserve the title of hero for someone who has done something worthy of it.
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Old 07-14-2014, 05:35 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Sarcasm In Progress.

Calm down.
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Old 07-14-2014, 07:59 PM
 
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This is beginning to remind me of how dictatorships will declare obedient members of the working class to be "heroes of the state".

Don't make waves, do as you are ordered and you get a label on your forehead "good person."

It is fascinating though, that Snooki actually felt like she had to think about vaccinations for at least a few minutes. I think that is a bad sign for the vaccine pushers.
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Old 07-14-2014, 08:09 PM - Thread Starter
 
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she had to think about vaccinations for at least a few minutes.
Yes.

LOL!

The expertise, advice and education of her own pediatrician/physician was not sufficient for her to make up her mind! She had to consider this for just a few minutes.

Vaccines have been a lifelong education for me, long before professor Google.
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Old 07-14-2014, 09:32 PM
 
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Yes.


Vaccines have been a lifelong education for me, long before professor Google.

How is that possible?

There was nothing wrong with vaccines until Google came along.
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Old 07-14-2014, 09:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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There was the PDR at every public library reference shelf.

The reference shelf in the 500s (science) and 600s (applied science) had plenty of information about all things health as well as the general collection. OK, I am a showoff.

"The truth is out there", and you have to find it. It is not hiding though.
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Old 07-15-2014, 12:10 AM
 
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There's actually been anti-vax viewpoints since the invention of vaccine. Some of the early objections are remarkably similar to those found today (eg the - it's not that I think it's dangerous, just that it hasn't been tested enough viewpoint).

I think it's a fascinating insight into human pschycology.

The new thing with the internet is making this viewpoint just a google away from everyone. And in collecting large groups of people with rare opinions.
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Old 07-15-2014, 06:22 AM
 
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There's actually been anti-vax viewpoints since the invention of vaccine. Some of the early objections are remarkably similar to those found today (eg the - it's not that I think it's dangerous, just that it hasn't been tested enough viewpoint).

I think it's a fascinating insight into human pschycology.

The new thing with the internet is making this viewpoint just a google away from everyone. And in collecting large groups of people with rare opinions.
That rare view point really seems to scare PRO vaccinators so much.
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Old 07-15-2014, 10:12 AM
 
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There's actually been anti-vax viewpoints since the invention of vaccine. Some of the early objections are remarkably similar to those found today (eg the - it's not that I think it's dangerous, just that it hasn't been tested enough viewpoint).

I think it's a fascinating insight into human pschycology.

The new thing with the internet is making this viewpoint just a google away from everyone. And in collecting large groups of people with rare opinions.
There's also a long history of humans in authoritarian positions using psychology to drive the masses to not only accept, but to implement their agendas, and to ostracize or demonize those that won't go along.

And we see it in present day.

Just watched a video clips of a congressional panel and pro GMO marketers basically say that the American people aren't smart enough for GMO labelling. Now it will become the norm for those against GMOs to be called stupid by the pro-GMO. (And we see the the same psychological tricks used against non-vaccinators.) I guess the pro-GMO are for labelling when it comes to people, just not their own products.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/0...ushpmg00000072
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Old 07-15-2014, 12:29 PM
 
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Samaxtics, I'm giving your post 3 thumbs up, because 2 thumbs are not enough!!

 
 
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Old 07-15-2014, 12:50 PM
 
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.

The new thing with the internet is making this viewpoint just a google away from everyone. And in collecting large groups of people with rare opinions.
Concern with vaccine safety is not rare.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2011...-over-vaccines


"Overall, a little more than a quarter of households had concerns about the safety or value of vaccines. Among households with kids younger than 18, 30 percent had one of those concerns. People 65 and up had the fewest worries, with 19 percent expressing concern.

Most people believe vaccines work. Among those who expressed a concern about vaccines, only 4 percent said it was over a lack of effectiveness. The more common issues for those with concerns were a fear of side effects (46 percent of the group) or uncertainty about long-term health effects (47 percent).

We wondered if people's opinions about vaccines had changed in the last five years. Nearly a quarter said they had. In that group, 59 percent said their opinions had become less favorable. A little more than a third said their opinions had gotten better."

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

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Old 07-15-2014, 01:30 PM
 
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Samaxtics, I'm giving your post 3 thumbs up, because 2 thumbs are not enough!!
Eat enough GMOs and your future kids might be able to do that someday ;~)
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Old 07-15-2014, 01:57 PM
 
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Not sure why GMO's get brought up here so often.

Do the bananas you eat look like this?



If not, you're eating a genetically modified banana

“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Old 07-15-2014, 02:02 PM
 
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Eat enough GMOs and your future kids might be able to do that someday ;~)


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Old 07-15-2014, 02:04 PM
 
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Actually, this is objections confuses genetic modification, (e.g. cross-breeding and hybridization, centuries-old farming techniques to which virtually nobody objects) with genetic engineering, extracting the DNA of one species and inserting it into that of another to create an entirely new edible food-like substance. Both sides of the debate conflate the two and equivocate on the terms. To learn more about the science of genetic engineering, I recommend the book, Eat Your Genes.

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Not sure why GMO's get brought up here so often.
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Do the bananas you eat look like this?



If not, you're eating a genetically modified banana

In God we trust; all others must show data. selectivevax.gifsurf.gifteapot2.GIFintactivist.gif
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Old 07-15-2014, 02:05 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Concern with vaccine safety is not rare.
Nor is it new. 1976, the year of the swine flu vaccine fiasco showed how worthless it was and how panicked people get over something that the government uses all of its propaganda outlets to promote. Goebbels would be so proud.

A few lawsuits later, the NVIC was established, people were questioning the DPT shot. Donahue had several panels and discussions on vaccines and even 60 minutes had a segment in the early 1980s analyzing vaccines in general and the pertussis component in particular.
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Old 07-15-2014, 02:26 PM
 
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Not sure why GMO's get brought up here so often.

Do the bananas you eat look like this?


If not, you're eating a genetically modified banana
Yah, um no.

Hopefully this article will explain the difference between genetically modified and hybridization/cultivation for you:

http://www.motherearthnews.com/real-...#axzz37ZPOyds0

Basically,

If it can happen in nature - hybridization

If it happens in a lab with more than one species - GM

By the way, I think a GMO banana destined for Africa is being tested in IIRC Idaho.....so heads up if you live there. Oh it has the backing of none other than Bill Gates of course.
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Old 07-15-2014, 02:44 PM
 
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Samaxtics, I'm giving your post 3 thumbs up, because 2 thumbs are not enough!!
me too!!!!!!!!

 

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Old 07-15-2014, 05:03 PM
 
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There's actually been anti-vax viewpoints since the invention of vaccine. Some of the early objections are remarkably similar to those found today (eg the - it's not that I think it's dangerous, just that it hasn't been tested enough viewpoint).
Anti vaxxers also used to think that the smallpox vaccine would cause them to start growing cow parts.

Lots of fear and misinformation back then too....

“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Old 07-15-2014, 05:48 PM
 
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Anti vaxxers also used to think that the smallpox vaccine would cause them to start growing cow parts.

Lots of fear and misinformation back then too....
You've never met a Voices for Vaccines Facebook post you didn't like, have you?

Yes, by all means, lump 21st century vaccine choice advocates in with the 19th-century masses who linked vaccines to growing bovine parts. While we're at it, I'm going to lump those of you in the listen-to-your doctor camp with 19th and 20th century people who listened to *their* doctors and engaged in blood-letting, fetal x-rays, phrenology, lobotomies, palliative mercury therapy, tapeworm-chugging, trepanation, and (gasp!) homeopathy. To name a few. Because surely times can NOT have changed, right?

I've gotta hand it to VfV, though. There's no faster way to win people into vaccine compliance than to make fun of them. Oh. Wait.
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Old 07-15-2014, 06:03 PM
 
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You've never met a Voices for Vaccines Facebook post you didn't like, have you?

Yes, by all means, lump 21st century vaccine choice advocates in with the 19th-century masses who linked vaccines to growing bovine parts. While we're at it, I'm going to lump those of you in the listen-to-your doctor camp with 19th and 20th century people who listened to *their* doctors and engaged in blood-letting, fetal x-rays, phrenology, lobotomies, palliative mercury therapy, tapeworm-chugging, trepanation, and (gasp!) homeopathy. To name a few. Because surely times can NOT have changed, right?

I've gotta hand it to VfV, though. There's no faster way to win people into vaccine compliance than to make fun of them. Oh. Wait.
Non vaxxers lump us together with the "listen to your doctor camp" ALL the time, even on these forums.

It's only fair right?

“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Old 07-15-2014, 06:58 PM
 
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Not sure why GMO's get brought up here so often.
If you're not sure, maybe you should look into the subject, with a variety of sources other than skeptical dinosaurs. Why not listen to a presentation by Robyn O'Brien? It's a great place to start.

Believe it or not, I actually care about food safety about as much as you care about vaccines and herd immunity. Your child and mine should not be eating GMOs, period. Hybridized foods are not even in the same class as GMOs. If you're not sure why GMOs are brought up so often, then you need to find out why. Just because someone says they're safe does not mean it is true. I urge you to please go outside the skeptic box and learn about the dangers of GMOs. As Robyn O'Brien puts it, "Are we allergic to food, or what's been done to it?"


Are you worried you might change your mind? Watch and see if she can convince you. You can still vaccinate while avoiding GMOs, I promise! I think there is someone on this forum who avoids GMOs and still vaccinates, but I'll let her speak for herself. Oh, also, other countries around the world have problems with GMOs. The USA is not always right about everything, and it would be wise to learn why other countries do not want GMOs~

 
 
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Old 07-15-2014, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Most of the EU has banned all GMOs. Most of the EU does not use fluoride in their water. What do they know that we do not?

http://www.gmo-free-regions.org/gmo-free-regions.html
http://ec.europa.eu/food/food/biotec...ivation_en.htm
http://www.thenation.com/blog/176863...os-why-wont-us
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Old 07-15-2014, 07:09 PM
 
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Most of the EU has banned all GMOs. Most of the EU does not use fluoride in their water. What do they know that we do not?

http://www.gmo-free-regions.org/gmo-free-regions.html
http://ec.europa.eu/food/food/biotec...ivation_en.htm
http://www.thenation.com/blog/176863...os-why-wont-us
add to that they don't vaccinate the same as us or for all the same either!

CP is not standard for most

 

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Old 07-15-2014, 07:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
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They do have a vaccine schedule. The Hep B and TB shot are for high risk persons. For the most part, there is not nearly the pressure to vaccinate as here, but the practice is still highly recommended.

http://www.euvac.net/graphics/euvac/...ccination.html
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Old 07-15-2014, 08:57 PM
 
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If a vaccine description uses the term "recombinant" the production involves the use of GMO technology.

The Hep B vaccine was the first that I know of to be using this technology. The most recent is the flublok vaccine with the army worm cells. Nifty!

Very relevant to vaccines and vaccinations.

Many of the concerns that people had about the smallpox vaccine were totally correct. For example, the vaccines were ALWAYS contaminated with bacteria and viruses. The first vaccinations were mostly done arm to arm with non-sterile tools, ideal for spreading whatever person A had to persons B-Z. Later the vaccine was grown on a living calf and then harvested, full of bacteria and viruses. The tools used for vaccination continued to be filthy.

So don't try to tell me that people who complained about the dangers of vaccination were a bunch of crazies. The crazies were the doctors, who had an ideal opportunity to observe germ theory in action, but missed it because they were too busy making fun of people for worrying about vaccine safety.
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Old 07-15-2014, 09:07 PM
 
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NM. Petty.
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