1 in 4 not buying! - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
 401Likes
 
Thread Tools
Old 08-29-2014, 05:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
serenbat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,407
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 126 Post(s)
1 in 4 not buying!

http://www.phrma.org/catalyst/back-t...-medical-myths

According to findings from PhRMA’s Second Annual National Health Survey, 1 in 4 Americans believe vaccines can cause autism in young children, including 30 percent of adults who are responsible for raising a child. - See more at: http://www.phrma.org/catalyst/back-t....YavZsVC6.dpuf

 

 pro-transparency advocate

&

lurk.gif  PROUD member of the .3% club!

 

Want to join? Just ask me!

 

"You know, in my day we used to sit on our ass smoking Parliaments for nine months.

Today, you have one piece of Brie and everybody goes berserk."      ROTFLMAO.gif 

serenbat is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-29-2014, 08:06 AM
 
Deborah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: the Seacoast of Bohemia
Posts: 6,563
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 203 Post(s)
However, most people continue to vaccinate, although few manage to stick totally to schedule all the way through. It is impossible to figure out if those who go off schedule are doing so because of vaccine safety concerns or simply because life is complicated.
Deborah is online now  
Old 08-29-2014, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
 
serenbat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,407
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 126 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deborah View Post
However, most people continue to vaccinate, although few manage to stick totally to schedule all the way through. It is impossible to figure out if those who go off schedule are doing so because of vaccine safety concerns or simply because life is complicated.
I would really love to know the percentage of those not parents (grand parents, those older parents 18+ children) since it seems to only be dealing with those currently facing childhood vaccines.

I have seen nothing on what you are saying, would love to see that too.

 

 pro-transparency advocate

&

lurk.gif  PROUD member of the .3% club!

 

Want to join? Just ask me!

 

"You know, in my day we used to sit on our ass smoking Parliaments for nine months.

Today, you have one piece of Brie and everybody goes berserk."      ROTFLMAO.gif 

serenbat is offline  
Old 08-29-2014, 09:07 AM
 
Deborah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: the Seacoast of Bohemia
Posts: 6,563
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 203 Post(s)
The CDC does a very large study every year to see who is vaxing on schedule and who isn't and then the results are published by state and used to harass states where a lot of people opt out.

For example, in VT, the Hep B at birth rate is slightly over 20%. Which makes sense, because Hep B in children is extremely rare in VT.

Here is a CDC page with all sorts of stats broken down in a lot of different ways. http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/imz-mana.../articles.html
Deborah is online now  
Old 08-29-2014, 09:13 AM
 
Mirzam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Resistance Free Earth
Posts: 7,610
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deborah View Post
The CDC does a very large study every year to see who is vaxing on schedule and who isn't and then the results are published by state and used to harass states where a lot of people opt out.
Is that the phone call you get out of the blue from the CDC every so often?

If so, I have always refused to answer. How many other non-vaxers do the same, probably a high percentage, so how truly representative is this study?

t
 
"There are only two mistakes you can make in the search for the Truth. Not starting, and not going all the way." ~ Mark Passio
Mirzam is online now  
Old 08-29-2014, 09:42 AM
 
Deborah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: the Seacoast of Bohemia
Posts: 6,563
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 203 Post(s)
That is one of the ways that they collect data. There are several others.

And yes, phone surveys aren't super dependable.
Deborah is online now  
Old 08-29-2014, 09:51 AM
 
ma2two's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,475
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by serenbat View Post
http://www.phrma.org/catalyst/back-t...-medical-myths

According to findings from PhRMA’s Second Annual National Health Survey, 1 in 4 Americans believe vaccines can cause autism in young children, including 30 percent of adults who are responsible for raising a child. - See more at: http://www.phrma.org/catalyst/back-t....YavZsVC6.dpuf
Wow. But far, far less than 30% refuse to vaccinate their kids. That's the result of some serious disease fear mongering, plus serious societal pressure.
ma2two is offline  
Old 08-29-2014, 09:59 AM
 
Deborah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: the Seacoast of Bohemia
Posts: 6,563
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 203 Post(s)
I think a significant percentage now fall into the selective and delayed camp.

Which is actually sort of handy for the pro-vaccine forces, because they can call anyone who selects or delays "anti-vaccine" when it is convenient for pushing vaccinations and trying to change exemption laws, however, when they want to convince parents that everyone vaccinates, they just switch the narrative and say that there are a fair number who are delaying a little bit because of the evil anti-vaccine propaganda, but with a little bullying from doctors and more marketing research we can get everyone back in the pen so there really isn't a big or effective movement against vaccines, just a tiny group of crazies.

I've seen the stats used in both ways, as needed.
Deborah is online now  
Old 08-29-2014, 05:51 PM
 
Deborah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: the Seacoast of Bohemia
Posts: 6,563
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 203 Post(s)
Here is the "everyone vaccinates" version http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25166924
Deborah is online now  
Old 08-29-2014, 06:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
serenbat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,407
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 126 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deborah View Post
I think a significant percentage now fall into the selective and delayed camp.

Which is actually sort of handy for the pro-vaccine forces, because they can call anyone who selects or delays "anti-vaccine" when it is convenient for pushing vaccinations and trying to change exemption laws, however, when they want to convince parents that everyone vaccinates, they just switch the narrative and say that there are a fair number who are delaying a little bit because of the evil anti-vaccine propaganda, but with a little bullying from doctors and more marketing research we can get everyone back in the pen so there really isn't a big or effective movement against vaccines, just a tiny group of crazies.

I've seen the stats used in both ways, as needed.
I too have seen this, when they can be used in a positive they are great, when they can be used in a negative way great too! A double win!

 

 pro-transparency advocate

&

lurk.gif  PROUD member of the .3% club!

 

Want to join? Just ask me!

 

"You know, in my day we used to sit on our ass smoking Parliaments for nine months.

Today, you have one piece of Brie and everybody goes berserk."      ROTFLMAO.gif 

serenbat is offline  
Old 08-30-2014, 04:57 AM
 
prosciencemum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,828
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 144 Post(s)
Just for fun try an internet search on "1 in 4 Americans believe" - eye opening.

I knew the statistic was familiar. From feb 2015: 1 in 4 Americans believe the Sun orbits the Earth. Only 400 years out of date with that idea.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...th-survey-says
prosciencemum is offline  
Old 08-30-2014, 05:36 AM - Thread Starter
 
serenbat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,407
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 126 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosciencemum View Post
Just for fun try an internet search on "1 in 4 Americans believe" - eye opening.

I knew the statistic was familiar. From feb 2015: 1 in 4 Americans believe the Sun orbits the Earth. Only 400 years out of date with that idea.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...th-survey-says
Nice try at a diversion but you are OT---- way off.

I know it must be hard all the effort & money for that PRO vaccine NO connection message...but still doesn't connect! Discouraged? Going OT is just that-diversion when one has nothing.
serenbat is offline  
Old 08-30-2014, 07:35 AM
 
samaxtics's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Canada
Posts: 666
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 149 Post(s)
Quote:
From feb 2015: 1 in 4 Americans believe the Sun orbits the Earth.
Points for what I'm guessing is a psychic ability psm.

Know what statistic is a really interesting and devastating at the same time?

Medical intervention being the 3rd leading cause of death.

"Practically every food you buy in a store for consumption by humans is genetically modified food"
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Astrophysicist/GMO defender
samaxtics is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 08:28 AM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,226
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 227 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosciencemum View Post
Just for fun try an internet search on "1 in 4 Americans believe" - eye opening.

I played around with terms such as American, distrust, vaccines, autism etc Google. Most hits on the first page did show a decent proportion of American did have issues (safety, efficacy) with vaccines - 25% is not out of whack with what I saw.




It is interesting to me that despite concerns, most people do vaccinate, and often on schedule


I am not sure why. Do people think the good outweigh the bad, despite concerns? Fear of diseases is higher than fear of vaccine reactions? Social pressure - from minor to major?

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 12:45 PM
 
beckybird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Shattered Paradigm
Posts: 2,032
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
PSM, are you hinting that the 1 in 4 Americans who have problems with vaccines are those who also think the Sun orbits the Earth? Remember, most Americans who have problems with vaccines are educated, and probably know that the Sun does not orbit the Earth, or that the Earth is not flat.

They also know that it's not even 2015 yet.

 
 
 "Medical propaganda ops are, in the long run, the most dangerous. They appear to be neutral. They wave no political banners. They claim to be science. For these reasons, they can accomplish the goals of overt fascism without arousing suspicion.” — Jon Rappoport
 
 
 
beckybird is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 01:05 PM
 
prosciencemum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,828
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 144 Post(s)
Not at all. It's just another example showing that a lot of people can believe things to be true when all the evidence points otherwise.
prosciencemum is offline  
Old 08-30-2014, 01:21 PM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,226
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 227 Post(s)
- nm

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 01:34 PM
 
samaxtics's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Canada
Posts: 666
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 149 Post(s)
Something didn't smell right so I went back to psm's link and here is what was stated:

Quote:
A quarter of Americans surveyed could not correctly answer that the Earth revolves around the sun and not the other way around, according to a report out Friday from the National Science Foundation.
Quote:
To the question "Does the Earth go around the Sun, or does the Sun go around the Earth," 26 percent of those surveyed answered incorrectly.
Quote:
Only 66 percent of people in a 2005 European Union poll answered the basic astronomy answer correctly.
They gave a WRONG answer. Doesn't mean it was a belief system. How disingenuous to imply that it was a belief and even worse that it was used to infer a similarity to vaccine critics.

wow.

"Practically every food you buy in a store for consumption by humans is genetically modified food"
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Astrophysicist/GMO defender
samaxtics is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 02:20 PM
 
teacozy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hogwarts
Posts: 1,588
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 437 Post(s)
"One third of Americans utterly reject the theory of evolution and believe instead that humans "have existed in their present form since the beginning of time," a new survey has found."

Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2014-01-america...ution.html#jCp

“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.” ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson
teacozy is offline  
Old 08-30-2014, 02:46 PM
 
contactmaya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,100
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
The prevalence of this skepticism is surprisingly high. Going by comments on articles about vaccines, on a wide array of publications, and by the articles themselves, you would think that vaccine skepticism is rare, and limited to a few lunatics. This makes me think that a large proportion of comments left on these articles are fake. That is quite scary.

As for why people vaccinate? Their children cant go to school if they dont. Homeschooling isnt an option, or is too far off the radar for many people. As for why they vaccinate on schedule-most daycares also require up to date vaccination.
contactmaya is offline  
Old 08-30-2014, 03:10 PM
 
samaxtics's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Canada
Posts: 666
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 149 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by teacozy View Post
"One third of Americans utterly reject the theory of evolution and believe instead that humans "have existed in their present form since the beginning of time," a new survey has found."

Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2014-01-america...ution.html#jCp
What does rejecting evolution have to do with psm's link or being critical of vaccination?

"Practically every food you buy in a store for consumption by humans is genetically modified food"
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Astrophysicist/GMO defender
samaxtics is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 03:21 PM
 
Mirzam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Resistance Free Earth
Posts: 7,610
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 134 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by samaxtics View Post
What does rejecting evolution have to do with psm's link or being critical of vaccination?
It seems like teacozy is of the opinion that those critical of vaccination must, by default, also be creationists. Sounds a bit insulting to me, you know, a putdown, but there you go.....

t
 
"There are only two mistakes you can make in the search for the Truth. Not starting, and not going all the way." ~ Mark Passio
Mirzam is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 03:26 PM
 
prosciencemum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,828
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 144 Post(s)
Just more proof that a lot of people can believe things which go against all available proof.
prosciencemum is offline  
Old 08-30-2014, 03:27 PM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,226
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 227 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by contactmaya View Post
The prevalence of this skepticism is surprisingly high. Going by comments on articles about vaccines, on a wide array of publications, and by the articles themselves, you would think that vaccine skepticism is rare, and limited to a few lunatics. This makes me think that a large proportion of comments left on these articles are fake. That is quite scary.

As for why people vaccinate? Their children cant go to school if they dont. Homeschooling isnt an option, or is too far off the radar for many people. As for why they vaccinate on schedule-most daycares also require up to date vaccination.
Hmmm…not sure what your point is with the first paragraph.

Non-vaxxers are not lunatics - at least not in higher percentages than the rest of the public. I know very few lunatics (not a nice word, btw) and the one person I know who others would define as a lunatic vaccinated her kids on schedule. Most non-vaxxers are quite well educated, and in terms of vaccine knowledge, studies show non-vaxxers surpass those who vaccinate on schedule. I can get the link if you like. (sel/delayers trump us all, though )

As per the last paragraph, only two states have medical-only exemptions. A handful of others are known to be difficult, but most Americans can get exemptions fairly easily. Misconceptions about school and shots may account for the difference in belief and vaccine rates, but the reality is most non-vaxxers can put their kids in public school.

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...


Last edited by kathymuggle; 08-30-2014 at 03:55 PM.
kathymuggle is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 03:40 PM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,226
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 227 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosciencemum View Post
Just for fun try an internet search on "1 in 4 Americans believe" - eye opening.

I knew the statistic was familiar. From feb 2015: 1 in 4 Americans believe the Sun orbits the Earth. Only 400 years out of date with that idea.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...th-survey-says
[QUOTE=teacozy;17967450]"One third of Americans utterly reject the theory of evolution and believe instead that humans "have existed in their present form since the beginning of time," a new survey has found."

Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2014-01-america...ution.html#jCp[/QUOTe

Not quite sure what is up with these two posts.

I suspect the root of the matter is a smear campaign, probably being waged because the pro-vax side is not looking so hot right now. Let's face - a head researcher and scientist at the CDC said some very concerning things about MMR, timing, autism and African American boys as well as some concerning things about tics, males and thimerosal (which is still in some flu shots that pregnant women receive).

In any event, in case this thread is totally hijacked, try again later Serenbat. The dissonace between being skeptical of vaccine and the vaccine rate is quite fascinating.

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...


Last edited by kathymuggle; 08-30-2014 at 07:43 PM.
kathymuggle is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 03:42 PM
 
contactmaya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,100
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
I said 'going by publications/ and /or comments to most articles you come across on the internet, to be specific, yahoo, huffington post, and various others where there is talk of vaccination, there are always comments bad mouthing non vaxers. I didnt mean that 'I' think that. I said, 'You would think that... going by certain publications....'

Therefore, all of the supporting comments on mainstream articles that are critical of non vaxers, are not a true representation of popular opinion, and may well be fake, otherwise you would expect a higher percentage of opinion critical or wary of vaccines.....
contactmaya is offline  
Old 08-30-2014, 03:53 PM
 
kathymuggle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,226
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 227 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by contactmaya View Post
I said 'going by publications/ and /or comments to most articles you come across on the internet, to be specific, yahoo, huffington post, and various others where there is talk of vaccination, there are always comments bad mouthing non vaxers. I didnt mean that 'I' think that. I said, 'You would think that... going by certain publications....'

Therefore, all of the supporting comments on mainstream articles that are critical of non vaxers, are not a true representation of popular opinion, and may well be fake, otherwise you would expect a higher percentage of opinion critical or wary of vaccines.....

Ok - got it. Thanks for clarifying.

While keeping in mind that certain sites or articles do attract certian types, I am frequently impressed by the diversity of opinions on comment feeds.

Once upon a time (a number of moons ago) I used to believe that there weren't many non-vaxxers…that we all congregated on sites like MDC. Some people still say this. I am not sure it is true, though. I regularly see posts, comments etc on mainstream sites where people are expressing concern for vaccines.

There is a battle of two wolves inside us.  One is good and the other is evil.  The wolf that wins is the one you feed.

 

Book and herb loving mama to 1 preteen and 2 teens (when did that happen?).  We travel, go to school, homeschool, live rurally, eat our veggies, spend too much time...

kathymuggle is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 04:12 PM
 
beckybird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Shattered Paradigm
Posts: 2,032
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Also, considering 90+ percent of the US population vaccinates, then the majority of people who failed that scientific questionnaire probably vaccinate as well.
.................................................. ..................................
Quote from Prosciencemum:
"Just more proof that a lot of people can believe things which go against all available proof."
All available proof. ? It seems there is also proof of *rare* side effects from vaccines. Maybe some of us are concerned about that proof too. Nothing crazy about that.

 
 
 "Medical propaganda ops are, in the long run, the most dangerous. They appear to be neutral. They wave no political banners. They claim to be science. For these reasons, they can accomplish the goals of overt fascism without arousing suspicion.” — Jon Rappoport
 
 
 
beckybird is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 04:25 PM
 
samaxtics's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Canada
Posts: 666
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 149 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kathymuggle View Post
Not quite sure what is up with these two posts.

I suspect the root of the matter is a smear campaign, probably being waged because the pro-vax side is not looking so hot right now. Let's face - a head researcher and scientist at the CDC said some very concerning things about MMR, timing autism and African American boys as well as some concerning things about tics, males and thimerosal (which is still in flu shots that pregnant women receive).
I agree. And the tactics being employed only point to an agenda, not a desire for the facts to bear out. And whether anyone wants to believe it, I'd love to see some good studies by the provax to refute/challenge the current events... but...nothing. just snide remarks inferring vaccine critical parents are tinfoil hat wearing, evolution rejecting, sun revolving around the earth loons. Yah, that's going to bring parents onside.

"Practically every food you buy in a store for consumption by humans is genetically modified food"
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Astrophysicist/GMO defender
samaxtics is online now  
Old 08-30-2014, 06:17 PM
 
Deborah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: the Seacoast of Bohemia
Posts: 6,563
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 203 Post(s)
Okay, let us consider one set of supposed facts.

Here is Brian Deer, definitively stating that the children in the case series DID NOT HAVE BOWEL DISEASE. http://briandeer.com/solved/bmj-pathology.htm

And here is the judgement issued clearing Walker-Smith of unnecessarily treating children for bowel disease. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...,d.eXY&cad=rja

Walker-Smith said this after examining the children:
Quote:
“On the issue of autism, I am completely astounded by the clinical features of these children with autism and bowel inflammation. Very often the gastrointestinal symptoms have
been ignored by a succession of the doctors and the findings on ileo-colonoscopy appear to be quite distinctive. This seems to me a whole new syndrome which is in urgent need of
clarification”.
Someone has got to be wrong. Let us leave to one side, the question of MMR and just consider whether Brian Deer was right that none of the children in this case actually had bowel disease.

And then let us consider how science can be bent.

And the fact that although Brian Deer turned out to be wrong, there have been no consequences.
Deborah is online now  
 
User Tag List

Thread Tools


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off