My 3 month old brain bleed after DTaP Shot!!!!!! - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 07:54 AM - Thread Starter
 
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[FONT=Palatino Linotype]Hello,

My name is megan. I just happened to come across this site, and I AM SO HAPPY THAT I DID!

Its been 1 month since my daughter had her brain bleed... but let me start from the begining!

I had a beautiful baby girl named Aurora on Sept 25, 2005. She was happy healthy and just AMAZING! We did all of her normal shots when she was born and everything seemed fine. At around 2 1/2 weeks she became a fussy baby and cried ALL THE TIME. Which they said she was colic. We tried everything but nothing seemed to work, she had her good and bad days!

At her 2 month wellness checkup she went in for all the normal 2 month shots including the DTaP. She screamed all night, for 7 hours straight. Her leg was so red and swollen, and nothing would soothe her. The next day she had a seizure, which I called her pedi and they said OH THATS NORMAL!!!!!!!! 2 weeks after her shots she passed out on me in a resturant. I rushed her to the ER to find out that she had an Intracranial bleed! No one can tell me why this happened, we are waiting for an MRI in 2 weeks to see if the blood has disappated and if there is anything we can see.... In my heart I feel this shot caused my baby these problems! She now has to be on seizure medication, and I am so afraid of what this brain bleed will do to her in the future... I DO NOT WANT TO GIVE HER ANOTHER DTaP Shot!!!

Can someone tell me the chances of her getting Whooping Cough, and is it as deadly as they make it out to be? I know I read another thread saying there might be other moms that I can talk to that didnt do the DTaP shot, I am just curious to know if they have a plan in case there babies do get it!!!! All the support in not vaxing my baby for this shot would be nice... I have been racking my brain over it for weeks, and next week is her appointment to get the shots and that one they can just check off the list!

Megan & My dear Angel Aurora 17weeks 5days old!
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#2 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 08:04 AM
 
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I am so sorry for yor daughter. I know one of the others here will be able to provide you with great info.
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#3 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Her neurologist is saying that they have never heard of brain bleeds from a shot, so they think the 2 are unrelated!!!!! However, they have NO IDEA why she bled! All things were ruled out:
abuse
avm
blood clotting disorders

Its just so weird to me that she would have all these seizures after and then have a brain bleed at 3 months old!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What steps do I take to report this incident?
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#4 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 09:48 AM
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You can go here:

https://secure.vaers.org/VaersDataEntryintro.htm


i hope that you find out exactly what is going on soon. It sounds very frightning!
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#5 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 10:00 AM
 
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How terrible, Here are some good websites.

http://www.vaclib.org/ You should find all the information you need here.

http://doctoryourself.com/vaccination.html

http://thinktwice.com/

Stay strong and don't let these doctors try to tell you that it is not from vaccinating, chances are that it is.

In my opinion, I would halt ALL vaccinations because your child could have reactions to those too.

God Bless and stay strong! It is YOUR child, do what YOU think is best.
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#6 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 10:04 AM
 
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Before filing your report, make sure you have the manufacturer and lot number. Your doctor would have this information.
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#7 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 10:13 AM
 
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Wow, I'm so sorry!

I would guess your daughter's chances of catching pertussis in the next few months (while still less than 6 months old and therefore more vulnerable to its complications) is much less than her chance of future harm from another shot. And please know that even if she got pertussis, there is a ton of great information here on treating it.

If it were me, I would absolutely stop any and all vaccinations for her right now and research them some more.
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#8 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 10:35 AM
 
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I am so sorry for your poor baby! If my daughter had sufferred a brain bleed after a vaccination, there is no way that any doctor would ever inject another thing into her - at least not until I was really, really sure about it. And I honestly don't know how I'd ever be that sure about any immunizations if the consequences from one injection were as severe as brain bleeding and seizures. Seeing as she's due back for more vaxes next week, there is no way that I could be that positive about an issue as complex as vaccines after researching for only a week. Because of that, I'd cancel the well-baby check up until further notice. You can always decide to vaccinate after doing the research, but once your daughter gets another shot, there is no way to take it back and the results could be devastating as evidenced by your daughter's current condition.

There is a member here named "Sherra" whose daughter ended up in the hospital from brain injury after her 2 month shots. She suspects that it was the DTaP. Perhaps you could use the private message feature that we have here on mothering to send her a message asking about her daughter's issues. I'm sure that she'd be happy to talk with you about her experiences and what she knows about DTaP.

About whooping cough - There are many threads that discuss the incidence of whooping cough as well as treatments for it. The most common treatment method you'll see around here involves sodium ascorbate - which is a form of vitamin C. But it's a much different form than the citrusy, chewable tablets that you might be familiar with. Here's a thread discussing pertussis - I'd pay particular attention to reply #5:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...ssis+ascorbate

You can find many other threads on pertussis if you use the search feature in this forum. If you want to know more specifically about pertussis and vitamin C, enter "pertussis AND ascrobate" into the search box. That having been said, it might be a little early in your research to start thinking about disease treatment. Focusing right now on researching the vaccines themselves might be a better use of your time. But, of course, do what you feel is best.

Welcome to Mothering and good luck with your research - we all know that it can be very overwhelming. But just take it slow - search back through old posts, particularly those in the archive section, and get ready to learn...
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#9 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I did give her shots this round, I broke them up and did them one at a time. She recieved her HIB and POLIO and had no reaction at all, which is why it REALLY makes me think it was the DTaP Shot. She will be going back for her HEP B and Pneumoncocal Vaccine! I have read up a little bit about these two and to my knowledge the side effects are small... swollen leg and fever. If there are more to these shots let me know!
I also looked about the DTaP and it seemed that the DT part was safe and had no side effects really, it was the P that was dangerous! Is this true? Do you think I should give the DT or nothing at all?
Also how do you mommies go through life not being completely parniod that your babies will get something because you didnt Vax? I am so worried she will get Whooping Cough and get really sick!!!! But I have faith that she is a strong little girl and will pull through if she does....
I am strickly breastfeeding, are there things I can eat or drink that will better her system?

Megan
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#10 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:32 PM
 
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I'm going to try and say this very gently. You really need to commit yourself to reading this forum, past threads, the resource area, stickies, ect. There is hours of reasearch to be done. Not to many people here are going to tell you that any vaccine is safe to give. Especially after a reaction like you've experienced. Not to mention you haven't even started to really educate yourself. So the general rule around here is no vaxes until you can make a very informed decision. No need to hurry and rush them, you can always do them later, but you can never take one out. All the questions that you asked have been answered many times before on this forum. I'm sure other moms will pop in here and answer them for you again. Try and do some research yourself though, use the search function, nobody can make the decision for you but we are here to help. Not sure where you got your info, I guess hib has less side effects than other vaxes. But Hep B has been known to cause a LOT of serious reactions, including death. I have Hep B and I don't recommend the vax to anyone. Good luck on your research.

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#11 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:32 PM
 
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"and to my knowledge the side effects are small"

Yes, yet your child was affected. They want us to believe the side effects are small, but the truth is, they are not "rare", they are just rarely reported.

The next vaccine you are planning to get for your child has a pretty high rate of seizures reported (prevnar).

You really need to check out the reports made to VAERS before making a decision how to proceed.

From experience, I would say trust your gut, because you may be very sorry if you don't.

You may find yourself in jail for shaken baby syndrome. Please please please get this reaction documented, request a copy of your child's records BEFORE you mention anything to the dr about adverse vaccine reaction.

Once you have the records, see if they documented the seizure~ if this is not documented, request them to document it and give you a copy of the corrected record. Once you have this corrected record, ask if they filed a report to VAERS, if not, file one yourself because your child's records should have all the information you need to file, if they tell you they filed one, get the report ID # and verify this information with VAERS so a duplicate report isn't filed.

If you think I am being dramatic, I'm not. (see actual case below) This happens way more than we are led to believe, and I cannot believe your dr told you a SEIZURE was NORMAL after a vaccine. If a brain injury is to be expected after a vaccine, then who in their right mind would do this intentionally to an infant????????

http://www.uscfc.uscourts.gov/Unpubl...mer-guzman.pdf
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#12 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:38 PM
 
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Please stop vaccinating until you research research research. It's the best thing you can do for her "system". It seems your child did have a reaction to the DTaP, since I don't believe in "coincidences" right after vaccinations.

You can always vax later. You can never un-vax (I said it for you Angela ) Don't feel the need to follow your Dr's schedule.
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#13 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:38 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AurorasMommy
Also how do you mommies go through life not being completely parniod that your babies will get something because you didnt Vax? I am so worried she will get Whooping Cough and get really sick!!!! But I have faith that she is a strong little girl and will pull through if she does....
I think you'll find that if you read through a few threads on this site, you'll see that most of us here generally feel that our children are healthier and safer because we *don't* vax. Most posters here (yes, I'm making a huge generalization) hold the position that vaccinations inhibit the immune system's development and contribute to a huge variety of "modern" diseases, particularly auto-immune disorders.

There's lots of information here about treating vaccine-preventable diseases. Many VPDs are "deadly" in the sense that some people will get them and will die. However, many of us believe that more people will die or be seriously injured by the vaccine than will die or be seriously injured by the disease. If we keep our children as healthy as possible by breastfeeding, feeding them good food, and ensuring that they get lots of exercise, they will be better able to fight off the diseases that they encounter.

I hope you'll benefit from the information available here as much as I have.

Sarah, mother to Eloïse (5/2005), Lucas (3/2008) and Ilias (7/2011), and due with #4 (March 1, 2014)

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#14 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:42 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thank you, I am going to do the research... I started back on the threads and I am sorting my way through!
Dont think that I would give these shots to my daughter to harm her again... its just that I am outweighing what she should have to what she shouldnt! I know for a fact that the Polio and HIB didnt effect her at all because she is sitting in front of me playing and smiling and its been over a week! So the rest I need to do information on and find out the pros and cons and is it really worth it! I thank you all for replying to me and giving me your advice! I want the best for my baby and I wont do anything that is going to try and take her from me again!
Megan
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#15 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:43 PM
 
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Please read all the links posted in this thread. You'll find some great info. Heres some good information on whooping cough and vitamin c:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=195623

It makes the diseases much less scary when you research each one individually and then research the stats through the CDC and how you would treat it if your child did contract a "VPD".
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#16 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:45 PM
 
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A reaction doesn't always show up in a day or two. Autism, diabetes, auto-immune disorders, learning disabilities, ect. Have all increased since vaxes, nobody can prove that they are not vax related. Yet many people have convincing evidence to show that they just might be. There are potiential long term consequences to consider here as well. I wouldn't rush on polio, your child has a zero to none chance of catching it in the USA.

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#17 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:46 PM
 
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I'm just a newbie here too, and the other mammas can offer you much more insight and research into what you are looking for. But I wanted to tell you how sorry I am your baby had to go thru this. How awful. and I think many of us have had the experience of trying to convince a dr. it was a reaction to the shot only to no avail. My dd had a reaction to her first dtap, but at the time being naive, i thought it was normal. not nearly as severe , but still not unnoticed. Then when she was 20 months old, had a reaction to her last HIB. She had everything but the seizures. THat is when I cut it off. I tried fruitlessly to convince our dr it was the shot, saying that she even gave me a paper (even though I knew more) on reaction levels, and i could check everything off on that sheet except seizures. tHankfully. three phone calls, reaction 24 hours after the shot, and still wouldn't admit it. so no more shots for her.

Also I will tell you from what I've researched that the 4th and 5th dtap doses are supposed to be the worst. my dd will not have either of those doses and I think Australia has even dropped the 4th, if i remember correctely. But I do worry, like you about whopping cough, since we will have a newborn in the spring. But i just can't get over the reactions of that dtap especially those last couple doses.

I'd say research and hault all shots until you feel more comfortable. You can always start them if that is what you want. But can never go back, as has been said many times before here. no doc will admit it was a reaction to you either. I would though, find a more choice friendly doc for your family who respects what your dd went through.

good luck.
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#18 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:46 PM
 
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I just wanted to say, I'm so sorry that your child's doctor did not listen to your concerns!! : I hope that you are looking for a new ped. My child's ped also blew me off, said it was colic, then when I took her to ER she was so sick she stayed for 6 days and came home with a feeding tube.

You are in good hands about the vaccinations questions. I am not as well-read as most on this board. I just wanted to say I'm sorry this happened to her and I hope that you will find a new ped who listens to your concerns and is willing to work with you if you decide not to vaccinate anymore.

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#19 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:47 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AurorasMommy
Also how do you mommies go through life not being completely parniod that your babies will get something because you didnt Vax? I am so worried she will get Whooping Cough and get really sick!!!! But I have faith that she is a strong little girl and will pull through if she does....
My unvaccinated 3.5 year old does not scream for hours on end, does not pass out in restaurants, does not have seziures and does not have a bleeding brain. In fact, he's only had about 4 mild colds to date. Please get a copy of How To Raise A Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor (written by a pediatrician Dr Robert Mendelsohn) and check out the newbies link in this vaccination area, I believe they are discussing that book right now and many have the same concerns as you.

For me, I would rather take my risk with a known disease rather than brain bleeds that puzzle the drs who deny they are vaccine related.

Learn about the diseases, the incidence of, the treatment of. We are trained to fear them so we will line up for these vaccines and not disagree. It will take some time, but will be WELL worth the effort. I have seen many a mama who regrets vaccinating, but where are those who regret not vaccinating? Something to think about.
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#20 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:47 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AurorasMommy
I know for a fact that the Polio and HIB didnt effect her at all because she is sitting in front of me playing and smiling and its been over a week!
Megan
While it's very good that she didn't have an initial reaction to these, once you start reading through these threads you'll see that the less toxins that are injected into your daughter, the better. Here's a list of ingredients included in vaccines:

http://www.informedchoice.info/cocktail.html
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#21 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:49 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suschi
How To Raise A Healthy Child in Spite of Your Pediatrician .
How to raise a Healthy Child in Spite of your Doctor

(just in case she's searching it )
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#22 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:51 PM
 
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Why do people vaccinate? To avoid childhood disease. Yet your mom probably had some and did fine, your grandmother had a few more and did fine, and your great grandmother probably had many and did fine.

Vaccines are a great business based on fear. Childhood diseases were not even considered dangerous until they had the vaccine to sell us. Before that they were considered the normal thing for every growing child.

Oh, sure they can be dangerous in children who are starving to death already, kids in Africa, but certainly not for average healthy kids.

Gosh, I grew up in post war Europe and we were hungry and we had all the childhood diseases. I did not know one single friend or school acquaintance who died. We all had the measles, mumps, chicken pox, rubella, and a few other rashes, we were even proud that we had them because it was considered 'a coming of age' ritual, and all we got from it is natural immunity.

They vaccinate kids for diseases no one had even hear about before they developed the vaccine. Not even the doctors know about any of them.

Vaccines are a big bad business and many children get damaged for life.

Please do your research before injecting your child with anything else. Find out what the actual danger of the childhood disease is. Because you will be surprised how benign they are in a healthy child.

Good luck!
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#23 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:53 PM - Thread Starter
 
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SUSCHI- thanks for the link, and you are so right!
When this all happened I kept telling her pedi that she was having what looked like short seizures... they told me that babies will cry so hard they will hold there breath and have something that looks like a seizure... as time went on Aurora started screaming more and more and more... (DTaP can cause brain inflammation thus leading to pressure=headaches=blurred vision) When I brought her to the ER and she was completely WHITE and PASSED OUT, I kept saying SHES BEEN HAVING SEIZURES, Yet no one would listen to me. We spent 3 days in the hospital and Aurora started to get a little better, but still had these shaky episodes.. I kept telling the doc that it was happening but by the time they came in they would see nothing... They brushed me off as a young 22 year old first time mother! They wouldnt listen to me... they came in with the discharge papers saying Aurora had a stomach bug and just at that moment she had a seizure!!!!! It took 1 1/2 months for them to FINALLY SEE THE SEIZURE AND BELIEVE ME... they hooked her up to an EEG and saw that she was seizing EVERY 3 MINUTES! Then they did an MRI and found she had a brain bleed and it was bad, we spent 3 1/2 weeks in the hospital.. 2 days after christmas!!!! The first thing they asked is if she had been injured and I kept saying no! I kept saying SHES BEEN HAVING SEIZURES FOR A MONTH NOW... Yet when all was said and done they said the seizures are caused from the bleed, YET THERE WAS NO BLEED UNTIL A MONTH LATER... Then when I said that the seizures started 24 hours after her 2 month shots, they kept saying there was no relation, that there has NEVER NEVER NEVER NOT ONCE been a case where a baby had a brain bleed from the shots! I have looked and looked and I cannot find any cases... if I could this could be my way to prove that the DTaP caused my babies BRAIN TO BLEED!

Megan
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#24 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 12:58 PM
 
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I too second, third...Dr. Mendelsohn's book 'How to Raise A Healthy Child In Spite Of Your Doctor'.

My dd has the book and reads it every so often even though she never actually had to use it because of sickness.

My 2 y. old grand baby is completely unvaccinated and is by far the healthiest in his play, music group and all the other mommy/baby groups they belong to.
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#25 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 01:05 PM
 
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Poor baby...

Megan...it might be hard to find cases of that since most Docs react like yours did and brush it off as a coinidence or diagnose it as something else. But your motherly instincts tell you something different, don't they???

Only 10% of vax reactions are actually reported, but I hope someone can find something for you...
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#26 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 01:12 PM
 
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I am so sorry for your whole family and your little girl that you all had to experience the brain bleed. Honestly, I would seriously, seriously consider skipping the shots at least definitely for now until you have researched more.

Here is a link to a thread that might help.




But you might want to know the following...

HARD NUMBERS


For me, I think the first place to begin is with hard numbers--Just how many cases of all these vax-diseases do we get here in the united states? (by the way, if you are out of the us I recommend you search your country’s online stats)

This is one of the hardest to find pages at the cdc… the way that I actually found this page was by accident. I had called the CDC to find out about hib cases and I got a doctor and he sent me to this page…

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/mmwr_wk.html

if you download the current issue it gives you the most uptodate stat that the cdc has on the reportable diseases by the way, the stats are at the end of the document. Anyway, I would start there first.


But just to give you an idea:
Here are the hard numbers for 2004. This is what I found for the last week of the year..... this is the total amount of cases reported to the CDC for 2004.....

Total reported cases to the cdc:

Disease Cases

Diptheria 0
Measles 37
Mumps 236
Rubella 12
Congenital rubella 0
Tetanus 26
Hib (under 5)
Sero b-16
Non sero b-114
Unknown b-156


Out of a population of 295 million people in the united states!!

If you check it now, you will see the number of cases for the year as of now (well to be specific as of last Friday..they update the list on Fridays or weekends-from what I can tell).

Remember it is a cumulative list... it is not that many cases per week. It's the year to date.

I will say that critics of the CDC will say that the numbers don't reflect all the cases since sometimes the cases are so mild they don't even get reported or people don't even go to the doctors because the symptoms are so manageable.

also....if you want to know how many people died of a disease--go to this link. plug in the disease.

http://wonder.cdc.gov/mortICD9J.html

you will be shocked by how small a number it is.



go to this thread for more infor:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...ad.php?t=57794

Check out New Moon on my Astrology Site

http://tracyastrosalon.blogspot.com/

 

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#27 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 03:03 PM
 
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I am so sorry about what happened to your baby.

I am another person who is just starting to look into the topic of vax's and just wanted to invite you to our "newbie" study group as well looking at the risks/benifits of vax's and risks/benifits of the disease. We are using the How to Raise a Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor as a starting place. We have not started yet, still waiting for everyone to get their copy.

I would put a link but my computer skills are not quite there yet. But the thread is usually on the first page.

Go Green I don't vax either, why mess with perfect?
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#28 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 03:30 PM
 
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to you and your sweet girl.

After doing extensive research, we decided not to vaccinate our children at all. Even the CDC admits that there is a greater chance of vax reaction than even CATCHING any of the diseases, and honestly the diseases don't scare me. PLEASE do not vax your daughter again with ANYTHING until you are 100% sure. The next one could kill her.

-Angela
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#29 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 04:23 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AurorasMommy
Also how do you mommies go through life not being completely parniod that your babies will get something because you didnt Vax?
Megan, are you afraid that YOU will catch one of the vaccine preventable diseases? Are you up to date on your shots? Most of them do not give life-long immunity, so you are probably no longer immune to many of them (unless you've had your boosters recently!).

I am so, so sorry to hear about Aurora. Please read more here - and read some more elsewhere! It's so important. And Anglea wasn't being dramatic when she said the next one could kill her. It really could.

When you know about the diseases, you will find that MOST of them are really not scary at all. Many of our parents had measles (and probably all of our grandparents!). Mumps is only "scary" for boys in that it *could* infect a testicle and IF that happened, it *could* make them sterile (the chances are miniscule). Rubella only affects fetuses, if Aurora doesn't get it naturally before she's a teenager, you could have her vaccinated in about 16 years.

There are many, many threads regarding polio and how it is very, very rare and so mild (for most people) 95% of the time, you don't even know you have it.

WC would probably scare me a little, but I feel confident that we would make it through just fine since I have knowledge and resources on how to deal with it. Diptheria is very VERY rare and most cases in the recent past have been in vaccinated people.

I know I've missed a few, but I just wanted to downplay the scare tactics that the doctors use to frighten us into vaccinating. You need to read and be prepared for diseases, but once you read about them, you will stop being afraid.

Good luck on this journey and hold onto your little girl. You owe it to her (and yourself) to research this before you do any more shots!

Melissa
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#30 of 174 Old 02-03-2006, 05:36 PM
 
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My dd had a simalar reaction as yours did (minus the brain bleed ~ as far as we know). Her leg swelled up (swelling was present still at her next well baby visit) and she sreamed for 14 hours solid until she passed out. then she slept for about 8 hours, I woke her up to eat quickly and then she slept some more.

Ihope you find help and healing for your dd.

as for gettig pertussis. It could happen. it will suck if it does. but it is not nessecarily the end of the world. vaccine reactions scare the crap out of me. going through that again, scares the crap out of me. My dd is not normal. I am convinced she will never fully recover from whatever that shot did to her. it flipped some switches that will never go back. maybe she was more prone to it to begin with. either way. I would rather risk pertussis. Dr. are not lazy about diagnosing or treating it. unlike vaccine reactions, at least you can get it diagnosed and treated.

The truest answer to violence is love. The truest answer to death is life. The only prevention for violence is for the heart to have no violence within it.  We cannot prevent evil through any system devised by mankind. But we can grapple with evil and defeat it, but only with love—real love.

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