MMR Fun - Merck's listed side effects - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 24 Old 10-25-2006, 06:57 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I recently blogged about the science of vaccines and listed off all the potential side effects of the Merck MMR II vaccine, from their website, listed on the package insert. I highlighted my favorites.

Panniculitis
atypical measles
fever
syncope
headache
dizziness
malaise
irritability
vasculitis
pancreatitis
diarrhea
vomiting
parotitis
nausea
diabetes mellitus
thrombocytopenia
purpura
regional lymphadenopathy
leukocytosis
Anaphylaxis and anaphylactoid reactions
angioneurotic edema
bronchial spasms
arthritis
anthragia
myalgia
encephalitis
encephalopathy
subacute sclerosing panencephalitis
Guillian Barre Syndrome
febrile convulsions
seizures
ataxia
polyneuritis
polyneuropathy
ocular palsies
paresthesia
aseptic meningitis
Pneumonitis
sore throat
cough
rhinitis
Stevens-Johnson syndrome
erythema multiforme
urticaria
rash
pruritis
nerve deafness
otitis media
retinitis
optic neuritis
papillitis
retrobulbar neuritis
conjunctivitis
Orchitis
DEATH

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#2 of 24 Old 10-25-2006, 08:50 PM
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Welcome to the world of 'safe and effective' :

I'd rather have measles, thanks. Actually, I'd rather have all three at the same time, though it doesn't happen in real life
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#3 of 24 Old 10-25-2006, 09:00 PM
 
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Yikes! That scares me! Thanks for this post. We are still deciding about the MMR and if we are going to seperate or not.

Mommy to DS (12-05) DD (9-10) wife to DH :
(2/05, 6/06, 6/08, 9/08 ) Due 5/11
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#4 of 24 Old 10-25-2006, 09:22 PM
 
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Yes, our dd dealt with arthritis as a small child, which I believe to have been caused by her "routine" immunizations, including the mmr.

It is and was a sad thing. In her case, she "outgrew" her chronic illness. I think EBF and a careful diet helped her body to have the resiliency to recover. She's a normal kid now.

I declined all the recent shots her ped reccommended and so far, the school has not made a fuss.
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#5 of 24 Old 10-25-2006, 10:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Don't forget, as MamaintheBoonies posted in another thread, according to Merck:

Quote:
"M-M-R II has not been evaluated for carcinogenic or mutagenic potential, or potential to impair fertility."
So your child could be sterile, AND/OR get cancer! But nobody really knows for sure!
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#6 of 24 Old 10-25-2006, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by alisaterry View Post
So your child could be sterile, AND/OR get cancer! But nobody really knows for sure!
Ahh, but 'medical scientists don't read it this way . For them, not tested = no evidence of harm = safe.

No vaccines have been tested for cancerogenicity, teratogenicity and effect on fertility, not just MMR. It's just not part of standard testing, too much trouble, not cost effective
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#7 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 01:36 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Spy View Post
Ahh, but 'medical scientists don't read it this way . For them, not tested = no evidence of harm = safe.

No vaccines have been tested for cancerogenicity, teratogenicity and effect on fertility, not just MMR. It's just not part of standard testing, too much trouble, not cost effective
Because deafness, diabetes, pancreatitis and death aren't worrisome enough to qualify as "unsafe."

And to think, just two years ago I thought all you anti-vaxers were
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#8 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 04:12 AM
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Originally Posted by alisaterry View Post
Because deafness, diabetes, pancreatitis and death aren't worrisome enough to qualify as "unsafe."
No proof of causal link = no evidence = safe. But hey, the dead child didn't end up having measles!! That's what counts

Quote:
And to think, just two years ago I thought all you anti-vaxers were
Yeah, it's contagious
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#9 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 09:56 AM
 
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Lets not forget the GUT connection. Measles vax virus is in the GUT, from what I recall. If the body does not process the vax properly...

I do not remember exactly what I read on that but I do vividly remember it confirmed that our decision to not vax was the best decision for our Celiac. Celiac Disease is autoimmune and genetic, the gluten antibodies attack the villi in the small intestine preventing proper absorption of nutrients and as a result for our son massive diarrhea.

After I read the GUT connection to Measles vax I was totally convienced natural Measles was way better and our decision was a blessing, truly a miracle of timing. It helped that at about the same time my dh had been reading Autism information and we did not have the Celiac dx, so dh said no as well to the MMR. We both thought independently that our ds2 might have Autism, but the pieces just didn't fit enough for us to discuss it with each other -- we mentioned our research when we finally had the Celiac dx! And I'm thinking we communicate SOOOOO well

BTW - I also read that children who have childhood diseases such as Measles, have less instances of Asthma. Hmmm... I was vaxed for MMR in the 70s and guess what? I have Asthma as an adult!!! IT is brought on by either a respiratory illness or seasonal allergies. I wonder if my allergies could have been prevented by actually having Measles, but we'll never know... My parents don't have allergies or asthma and they had Measles. They don't understand why I have them... Dare I tell them it's their fault for vaxing me!!!

Now if only we could find Measles or CP or other childhood illnesses for our kids to catch!!! (CPS come and get me for medical neglect!!!)
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#10 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 07:05 PM
 
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Wow, that is a very long list! Do peds give their patients this info when giving (or discussing whether to give) the vax?
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#11 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 07:20 PM
 
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Just for fun here are the complications of measles.

Ear Infection
Febrile Convulsion
Infection {bronchitis/croup}
Pneumonia
Encephalitis
Squint
Sub-acute sclerosing panencephalitis


Quote:
What are the possible complications of measles?

Ear infection which causes earache is a common complication.
A febrile convulsion (fit) occurs in about 1 in 200 cases. This can be alarming, but full recovery is usual.
Infections of the airways such as bronchitis and croup are common. These are distressing, but are not usually serious.
Pneumonia (lung infection) is a serious complication that sometimes develops. Typical symptoms include fast or difficult breathing, chest pains, and generally becoming more ill.
Brain inflammation (encephalitis) is a rare but very serious complication. It occurs in about 1 in 5000 cases. It typically causes drowsiness, headache, and vomiting which starts about 7-10 days after the onset of the rash. Encephalitis may cause brain damage. Some children die from this complication.
Squint is thought to be more common than usual in children who have had measles. The virus may affect the nerve or muscles to the eye.
A very rare brain disease called sub-acute sclerosing panencephalitis develops years later in a small number of people who have had measles.
Complications are more likely in children with a poor immune system (such those with leukaemia or AIDS), and in those who are malnourished. This is one reason why measles is still a major problem in some poorer countries. Many malnourished children in the world die when they get measles, usually from a 'secondary' pneumonia.
http://www.patient.co.uk/showdoc/23069075/
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#12 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 07:24 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thank you for sharing that.
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#13 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 07:27 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Minoh View Post
Wow, that is a very long list! Do peds give their patients this info when giving (or discussing whether to give) the vax?
They are supposed to give them an information sheet, but it usually excludes this list. Here is a link to the CDC's information sheet on the MMR.

http://www.cdc.gov/nip/publications/VIS/vis-mmr.pdf

It lists just a handful of these more serious reactions, but says experts aren't sure they are directly related.
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#14 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 07:32 PM
 
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All I know is that if I could dispute, and have a good chance of winning, that my product did not cause the things listed than I would and pharm has the money to do so. So I don't trust that they are not related
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#15 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 07:34 PM
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#16 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 08:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minoh View Post
Wow, that is a very long list! Do peds give their patients this info when giving (or discussing whether to give) the vax?
I've never been told. I've taken my children to the pediatrician and to the local health department for vaxes prior to stopping many years ago. I tried to have a discussion with a new pedi a few years ago, it was pointless and I got an ear full of the scaremongroles...

Has your pedi given you this information? Chances are no and if you ask they will say those are RARE side effects.

And side effects from measles are just as RARE, secondary infections from a cold, the flu, any number of viruses are not uncommon, but not the usually response a healthy body has either. If measles were so deadly we would not be here now would we? My parents, their parents, their parents parents all survived measles as well as many other diseases without vaxes.
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#17 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 09:49 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Electra375 View Post
Has your pedi given you this information? Chances are no and if you ask they will say those are RARE side effects.
I asked about those side effects. They terrified me. I was told they NEVER happen (that is a quote). So we went ahead with vaxing our first dd, despite my intuition screaming at me to stop. The doctors know best, right? Well, it does happen, it did happen, and now my dd is dead. Sorry to be so blunt, but it is the truth.
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#18 of 24 Old 10-26-2006, 11:27 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by barefoot mama View Post
I asked about those side effects. They terrified me. I was told they NEVER happen (that is a quote). So we went ahead with vaxing our first dd, despite my intuition screaming at me to stop. The doctors know best, right? Well, it does happen, it did happen, and now my dd is dead. Sorry to be so blunt, but it is the truth.
You have earned every right to be blunt.
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#19 of 24 Old 10-27-2006, 02:14 AM
 
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Yowza Barefoot Mama!

My intuition all before and during my pregnancy was that vaxes weren't a good idea, and I chose to ignore the intuition for the first 6 months. I concluded that there was too much scaremongering in the no-vax community....yet deep down I seemed to know that it wasn't right. My son isn't vaccine-damaged from what I can tell, but he did get a fever and was so unhappy that evening of the first 2 mo shots. At 6 mo I stopped and I wish I could take out what's been put in. I hope that my stopping and listening to my gut will help me avoid what some other mamas have had to go through. *hugs* to you Barefoot Mama for your loss.

fambedsingle2.gifnovaxnocirc.gifHappy to be a mommy and teacher to D fencing.gif, born 1-17-06 via waterbirth.jpg  and A  blahblah.gif, born 10-6-08 with a homebirth.jpghomeschool.gif

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#20 of 24 Old 10-27-2006, 09:04 AM
 
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People need to know that those RARE side effects do happen. The public masses in general have a right to know Mothers and Fathers never hear their child speak Mommy or Daddy ever again.
Be bold, Be blunt... (but not like the lady at WM a few months ago, she wasn't doing the non-vax community any good, passion, but no tact.)

"It won't happen to me" attitudes can be replaced by the intuition we all have. Gitti recently wrote something to the effect that pretty soon there will be so many vaxes for infants that more and more parents should start to be alarmed and think... I would hope so. Unfortunately the medical community has endoctrinated our country with "the doctor is always right" and "don't question the good doctor" and my all time favorite "the doctor said so".

I don't see an end to mass vaxing. But I do see that education of parents is a possibility starting small and growing larger. It will take large quantities of parents questioning the validity, safety and necessity of vaccines before the medical community will stop baggering us into them. Our Creator, created our immune system, His creation is perfect... Man screwed it up (but don't ask me how I think Man made autoimmune genetic disorders, I don't know, but my ds2 has 1 in addition to IgA deficiency).

FWI - there are a few good docs out there, they just seem fewer and fewer. And while I like our Pedi mostly b/c she has insight and asks me to research my son's CD and she has never pushed vaxes once I said no to the other doc in the practice, she still uses the line "the doctor said so":
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#21 of 24 Old 10-27-2006, 04:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Electra375 View Post
(but not like the lady at WM a few months ago, she wasn't doing the non-vax community any good, passion, but no tact.)
What lady, where?
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#22 of 24 Old 10-27-2006, 06:42 PM
 
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Originally Posted by alisaterry View Post
What lady, where?
Oh, just one day outside our local Wal-Mart there was a lady who was very vocal with a small booth that vaxes caused autism. Her manner was such that as a non-vaxer I was turned off. She was not spouting off facts to grab attention and I found it distasteful. It was hard to explain, but she was just over the top and rather frightful. A few weeks prior there had been a pro-vax booth "it's wise to immunize" garbage for school starting soon.

I think non-vaxers can be vocal and tactful at the same time, KWIM?
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#23 of 24 Old 11-08-2006, 10:45 PM
 
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hugs to you, Barefoot Mama.

your daughter was beautiful.

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=555402

Check out New Moon on my Astrology Site

http://tracyastrosalon.blogspot.com/

 

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#24 of 24 Old 11-08-2006, 11:30 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Minoh View Post
Wow, that is a very long list! Do peds give their patients this info when giving (or discussing whether to give) the vax?
I never saw a vaccine insert any of the times I vaccinated. Just that piece of paper that tells you adverse reactions are so rare they don't even know if they are associated with the shots.
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