Unvaxed=ear infections? - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

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#31 of 56 Old 01-01-2007, 01:29 AM
 
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I think you deserve a more respectful doctor. Once you get over the mental hurdle of firing your doctor (it was a hurdle for me, anyway), it gets really easy--I've done it twice! But seriously, the Finding Your Tribe folks can recommend peds, family practice docs, naturopaths, whoever you'd like.
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#32 of 56 Old 01-01-2007, 01:51 AM
 
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More anecdotal evidence.

3 kids, ages 7, 4 and 2. Never been vacced and never had any ear infections.

As to the op's dr : nice scare tactic :
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#33 of 56 Old 01-01-2007, 02:26 AM
 
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I did read in mothering that bottle feeding affects the development of the inner ear possibly resulting in more infections.

"It should be a rule in all prophylactic work that no harm should ever be unnecessarily inflicted on a healthy person (Sir Graham Wilson, The Hazards of Immunization, 1967)."
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#34 of 56 Old 01-01-2007, 02:30 AM
 
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I would go to another ped after that, what a horrible thing for a doctor to say to a mother just to try to get her to vax.
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#35 of 56 Old 01-01-2007, 12:19 PM
 
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According to my ped ... and this is also anecdotal since she has not studied it, yet.... The unvaxed kids she sees are healthier than the vaxed ones. She stated that the vaxed kids are sick more often, have allergies and excema, whereas the unvaxed kids "just don't have those problems". And she has a large percentage of unvaxed kids in her practice.

Obviously there are other pediatricians who are having very different experiences regarding the health of vaccinated kids.
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#36 of 56 Old 01-01-2007, 05:50 PM
 
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I don't know how it is for all vax'd/unvax'd children but for us my three older children had dozens and dozens of earaches and infections (they were all fully vax'd).
My youngest ds (who we stopped vaxing, has never completed any series of vax's) has had 1 ear infection and that one was a day or so after receiving two vax's. He's been very very healthy.
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#37 of 56 Old 01-01-2007, 08:01 PM
 
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This is interesting. My ds is not current on his shots but has some of them. He hasn't had an ear infection yet and has been healthy for the most part. He also has eczema and may have allergies, but he had the eczema before shots. He also doesn't have it that bad, it's gotten better over his year.

I am very intrigued with this topic. I would love to hear what experiences others have.
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#38 of 56 Old 01-01-2007, 08:49 PM
 
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My fully vaxed ds have had ear infections. My unvaxed dd DD has never had an ear infection but she is only 20 month old. By her age my ds have had 1-2 ear infections.
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#39 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 12:02 AM
 
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My oldest (vaxed to 13 months old) never had an ear infection. Out of my 5 unvaxed children there have been two ear infections thus far. I was vaxed as a child and had one to two every month. So awful!! I actually think it was dairy.
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#40 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 12:17 AM
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Not scientific, but here's my experience.

I'm 48. Had ear infections tilll I was in my 30's. Oldest dd (fully vaxed) never had one, though she DID get whooping cough. Ds had multiple ear infections, was also my milk drinker, also fully vaxed.

Youngest three were mostly unvaxed (killed polio, tetnus) two had one ear infection each.

I'd tell the doc to mind her own business!
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#41 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 02:28 PM
 
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I never ever heard of anyone having an ear infection as a child and the 5 of us never had one among us. My daughter went through her entire babyhood (unvaxed) and never had an ear infection. But now ear infections start in babies quite early and continue throughout childhood. Why? What has changed?
Well, I was vaxed and always had ear aches-we never called them infections. My mom also ran us to the Doctor for everything...

Now DD was vaxed til age 4. Always had ear infections and illnesses. the infections stopped when I stopped taking her to Docs and giving her abx for them. I think it is all intertwined. Vaxing parents are also more likely to run to Doc for every sniffle, earache, etc. The Docs then give abx "just in case" and the cycle begins. Vaxing does nto help this at all, makes it worse. DD was better withing months of skipping meds, seeing a chiro, and using oil and garlic when her ear hurts.

DS was slipped one vax, albeit all reciords of this were lost. He has never hada diagnosed ear infection, but has had ear pain. He has allergies and I believe this was related ( ih ave the same issue). I treated when smaller with expressed BM, older with ear oil. Albeit the times were few and far between with him.

To OP: Doc was messign with you for nto vaxing. Shouldn't have even come to her mind if she is not biased!
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#42 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 05:09 PM
 
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I'm fully vaxed (twice--don't ask) and right now I have a raging double ear infection. My first was selectively vaxed, and has major ear issues. My second and third who are mostly unvaxed, have no ear issues.

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#43 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 07:36 PM
 
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I've read that most kids that have recurrent ear infections are usually just wheat or dairy allergic.... So you may want to look into diet, not that all cases are specifically from wheat or dairy, but the majority of illnesses are usually caused from a less than optimum diet. My dd never had a ear infection and seems to breeze through all of her illnesses and my 7 mo. old ds seems quite healthy too though he has been pulling at his ear since I started eating dairy again.......
So, anyway, Im sorry she blamed you that never feels good. Docs do get a kick back for the amount of kids vaccinated though, so that was probably her way of trying to get you to vac.
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#44 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 07:43 PM
 
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: BAD DOCTOR. Wow, that irritates me.
I've been in similar situations with formula pushing/pro-circumcision fear monger mds.

Now I say: "Ooooh really, please make a copy of that research article for me. I love statistics." Take a pen and paper out and add: "Where was that published? I have access to medical journals."

It took me many visits to doctors that did not match my beliefs to come up with an immediate reply that I was comfortable with.

Good luck finding a new doctor. That kind of talk would make me switch immediately!
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#45 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 07:50 PM
 
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My fully vaxed older 2 children had raging ear infections throughout their childhoods. We finally became vax-educated and stopped vaxing our 3rd child at 6 months. He's never had an ear infection, has never had any Rx, and is rarely sick. If he does come down with something, he's over it very quickly. I'm amazed at the difference!
Our 2nd ds was 6 weeks early, but our ped. reassured us that vaxing him was a-ok. He was the sickliest baby I've ever seen. Got his first cold at 1 month and continued getting cold after cold after cold until he was almost a year old. He was ebf for several months (yep....didn't research enough about bfing either or I would've known the "supply issues" I was having was merely a growth spurt....ignorantly, I supplemented with formula....that's a whole other story). Anyhow, in my own family, the difference in our vaxed and partially vaxed kids are light years apart. I just WISH I'd known about vax's before any of my children were born so that none of them would've ever received any.
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#46 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 08:14 PM
 
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No idea. My son got only his 2 month shots. He had 5 ear infections by the time he was 7 months. He's 9 months now and has tubes. Both DH and I had tubes, so I think it was more from us. He didn't have much of a chance. Since the tubes, he's so much happier. Seeing as he's mostly not vaxxed though, I don't really think that has anything to do with it. Some kids are prone to ear infections, some aren't. Same with viruses. I do know kids in daycare get more, but that's for obvious reasons.
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#47 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 08:22 PM
 
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My own homegrown scientific study does not prove this to be true.

DD #1: fully vaxed with severe reactions; had ear infections like crazy and was on antibiotics for almost her entire first 2 years.

DS #2: Vaxed until 12 months had several ear infections and a ton of illnesses; also had severe vax reactions

DS #3: Never vaxed, never has had a single ear infection EVER, he's 19 mos old in 2 days.
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#48 of 56 Old 01-02-2007, 08:43 PM
 
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Just more anecdotal but my son is 6 and has never had an ear infection.
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#49 of 56 Old 01-03-2007, 01:13 AM
 
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i believe this
is the study to which the OP's ped was referring

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=16950975

to avoid copyright infringment, here is a piece of the results section:

RESULTS: After the introduction of heptavalent pneumococcal conjugate vaccine, otitis media visit rates declined by 20% in children aged < 2 years. This decline represented 246 fewer otitis media visits per 1000 children aged < 2 years annually.


Ok, have at it!
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#50 of 56 Old 01-03-2007, 01:44 AM
 
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Originally Posted by iamleabee View Post
i believe this
is the study to which the OP's ped was referring

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q..._uids=16950975

to avoid copyright infringment, here is a piece of the results section:

RESULTS: After the introduction of heptavalent pneumococcal conjugate vaccine, otitis media visit rates declined by 20% in children aged < 2 years. This decline represented 246 fewer otitis media visits per 1000 children aged < 2 years annually.


Ok, have at it!
I'm very skeptical of those kinds of results.
Are there any placebo controlled trials that show a bona fide decrease in ear infections?
Office visits for suspected ear infections aren't going to tell you much when the docs are telling parents that the baby had an "ear infection vaccine". Couple that with serotype replacement and I'm really not seeing it.
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#51 of 56 Old 01-03-2007, 01:55 AM
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To evaluate vaccine effects while accounting for temporal variability, ratios of pneumococcal-related disease rates in children < 2 years old (vaccine target population) and in children 3 to 6 years old (not routinely vaccinated) were evaluated using a Poisson regression analysis. For children < 2 years old, the differences between observed and expected rates were the estimated vaccine effects
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#52 of 56 Old 01-03-2007, 02:11 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Spy View Post
I'll split the difference with you. The "office visits" get half, and the "pneumococcal-realted observed/estimated effects" get half. 10% to each.

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#53 of 56 Old 01-03-2007, 04:11 AM
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I'll split the difference with you. The "office visits" get half, and the "pneumococcal-realted observed/estimated effects" get half. 10% to each.

Mmmmm... significant!
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#54 of 56 Old 01-03-2007, 04:19 AM
 
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Originally Posted by TwinMom View Post
A few days ago I took the toddler to the doctor; he had a high fever, vomiting, etc. While she was examining him, she said, "Well, you know, kids who don't get shots have a higher rate of ear infections and viruses." It was said in a way (and maybe I'm projecting) that it was kind of my fault that he was ill, that if he had been vaccinated he would be fine. Uh, no, it's dh's fault for catching something at work and then bringing it home! But I'm wondering if she's right, are non-vaxed kids more likely to have ear infections and catch viruses? I don't think that's right, though I don't have anything other than gut instinct to back me up, so I just blankly stared at her until she said something else.
I'm not anti-vax, and this statement still strikes me as bizarre. I would have asked her exactly how this worked... which vaccine prevents ear infections? How is that achieved? I'm not a doctor, but I'm fairly clever and I understand basic science, if it's explained to me. So, I would want to know exactly how a polio vaccine or whatever prevents ear infections. It may well be that there is a vaccine that is linked to lower incidents of ear infection, but I'd want to know which one and why that is so.

I always ask a LOT of questions when I see doctors. Some of them are better at explaining things than others, but they all pretty much try once they realize that I am capable of understanding the answer. Any doctor that wouldn't would be a doctor I'd avoid in the future.
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#55 of 56 Old 01-03-2007, 04:20 AM
 
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LOL!

In all seriousness, if those new bacterial vaccines were doing much, we'd know.
So far, hib epiglottis has gone away. It's true. As rare as it was, it's now totally gone.
But that's it. Yes, Hib bacterial meningitis went down after the vax, but the overall rate of bacterial meningitis didn't change.
Same with prevnar...and same deal with all the other "bacterial infections" these vaccines were supposed to make a thing of the past.
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#56 of 56 Old 01-03-2007, 12:28 PM
 
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Both cousins' kids - 2 1/2 and 10 months - are fully vaxed and have had one cold after another, always with an ear infection. The 2 1/2 year old will be getting tubes soon. 2 1/2 is in daycare; 10 month old is not.

My nephew - 5 months - fully vaxed and has already had one ear infection and FIVE colds. !!! (He is not a daycare baby, either)

My DD - 2 1/2 and vaxed to 2 months has had one 2-day ear infection that was treated with numbing drops and nothing else. She's had two colds.
My DS - 11 months - has only had one cold.

All the above were/are exclusively breastfed to 6 months +.
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