Is vaccinaton ever a GOOD idea? - Page 6 - Mothering Forums
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#151 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 01:23 AM
 
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Originally Posted by katheek77 View Post
Re: Did my husband go in with guns or medicine to Iraq?

Guns. Two of them. An M-4 carbine, and a 9mm pistol.
He went over with the 82nd airborne, 2-325 IAR...

BTW, in 2003, the routine vaccination rate in Iraq was approx. 60%. In the United States it was 79.4% Measles was the leading cause of vaccine-preventable childhood deaths in Iraq at that time.
The leading cause of death in all age groups in Iraq is violence. Not coincidentally this has been the case since 2003.

But let's look at the lesser problem of disease. The Pentagon not only predicted that their illegal bombing of water treatment facilities would lead to increased suffering and disease, they cited it as the rationale for the attacks. Now consider that. If the Pentagon admits that they intentionally caused increased disease, how is it that you are blaming low vaccine coverage?

A father was photographed carrying his son and daughter from the carnage of a U.S. bombing raid that had targetted a wedding. His son had shrapnel blasted into his face and chest. You could see that the boy had peed his pants before he died. His daughter was alive but her foot had been blown off at the ankle. She later developed infections and tetanus and died from complications. Was her death caused by a lack of vaccination?

What's lacking here is perspective. Children who are starving, who have no access to clean water, who are in constant terror of being bombed, shot and killed, are not being devastated because Iraq's routine vaccination rate is 19.4% lower than the U.S. rate. The devastation in Iraq is being wrought by foreigners with M-4 carbines and 9mm pistols.
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#152 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 01:51 AM
 
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Originally Posted by katheek77 View Post
BTW, in 2003, the routine vaccination rate in Iraq was approx. 60%. In the United States it was 79.4% Measles was the leading cause of vaccine-preventable childhood deaths in Iraq at that time.
Where did you get these figures? The WHO's figures for Iraq don't jive with yours: http://www.who.int/immunization_moni.../data/iraq.pdf

Neither do the U.S. figures: http://www.cdc.gov/nip/publications/...G/coverage.pdf
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#153 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 03:06 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Moya View Post
The leading cause of death in all age groups in Iraq is violence. Not coincidentally this has been the case since 2003.

But let's look at the lesser problem of disease. The Pentagon not only predicted that their illegal bombing of water treatment facilities would lead to increased suffering and disease, they cited it as the rationale for the attacks. Now consider that. If the Pentagon admits that they intentionally caused increased disease, how is it that you are blaming low vaccine coverage?

A father was photographed carrying his son and daughter from the carnage of a U.S. bombing raid that had targetted a wedding. His son had shrapnel blasted into his face and chest. You could see that the boy had peed his pants before he died. His daughter was alive but her foot had been blown off at the ankle. She later developed infections and tetanus and died from complications. Was her death caused by a lack of vaccination?

What's lacking here is perspective. Children who are starving, who have no access to clean water, who are in constant terror of being bombed, shot and killed, are not being devastated because Iraq's routine vaccination rate is 19.4% lower than the U.S. rate. The devastation in Iraq is being wrought by foreigners with M-4 carbines and 9mm pistols.
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#154 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 02:49 PM
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Thanks MOYA

WAR IS NOT THE ANSWER!
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#155 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 03:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Moya View Post
The leading cause of death in all age groups in Iraq is violence. Not coincidentally this has been the case since 2003.

But let's look at the lesser problem of disease. The Pentagon not only predicted that their illegal bombing of water treatment facilities would lead to increased suffering and disease, they cited it as the rationale for the attacks. Now consider that. If the Pentagon admits that they intentionally caused increased disease, how is it that you are blaming low vaccine coverage?

A father was photographed carrying his son and daughter from the carnage of a U.S. bombing raid that had targetted a wedding. His son had shrapnel blasted into his face and chest. You could see that the boy had peed his pants before he died. His daughter was alive but her foot had been blown off at the ankle. She later developed infections and tetanus and died from complications. Was her death caused by a lack of vaccination?

What's lacking here is perspective. Children who are starving, who have no access to clean water, who are in constant terror of being bombed, shot and killed, are not being devastated because Iraq's routine vaccination rate is 19.4% lower than the U.S. rate. The devastation in Iraq is being wrought by foreigners with M-4 carbines and 9mm pistols.
We need a "yeah that" smilie that isn't smiling!

I think the problem here is that some people really don't see how these things can be related to diseases like measles or tetanus or polio. They don't understand the enormous impact that sanitation and healthy food have on health. Too many people truly and honestly believe that it's all a crap shoot. They think a well nourished kid is just as likely to die from chickenpox as a starving kid. They say they don't, but in reality they do.

Furthermore, I'd say the majority of people don't even consider the impact of stress. They figure that if we're providing clean water and some rice and beans, then homeless people in fear for their lives shouldn't be any worse off than the child of an upper middle class American with a relatively secure job (not that there is too much job security in this pathetic country, but you know.....) People are so ignorant about the effects of stress on the immune system that they're in denial.

I also believe many military families refuse to face up to the fact that we screwed up Iraq beyond all hope of repair any time in the near future. Change the subject, ignore the subject, anything but admit that it was our military, the one that our husbands are a part of, that maimed and killed thousands of innocent people. No one wants to talk about that. And again, my husband is military, so I'm not saying this from the perspective of an "outsider".
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#156 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 03:30 PM
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Dear Plumm
Yes agreed but looking at the bigger picture regards the war,Its the greedy politicians making these deadly manuvers sending our sons,fathers and husbands to participate in a fallice. The true meaning of this war is "OIL" dominance and controll not helping liberate people from the evils of their own gov.If you told all the soldiers "we are taking over their country because we want all the oil "...........no one would volunteer.
My son is 21 and i would give my own life to STOP him from joining the army,if the draft came along i would take him out of this country.
Do you see Bush sending his two daughters into this WAR?

:
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#157 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 03:43 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by katheek77 View Post

That's just my opinion. It is colored by my husband having served in a third world country (Iraq), and seeing what has been done by non-vaccination.
A great big to your brave hubby for risking his life to serve in the US millitary! Thank you for making the sacrifice to help protect those who sit back on their and exercise their big mouths to complain. War is never a "nice" thing, but regardless of whether or not I agree with the war in Iraq, I will NOT disrespect those who put their lives on hold for months at a time, being away from family and in the line of fire, to keep us safe. Even if it didn't make us any safer, I believe that "it's the thought that counts." If you have an issue with it, take it out on the government, not on the individual brave soldiers who are serving their country. It's extremely rude and thoughtless to do otherwise.

And if "foreigners with M-4 carbines and 9mm pistols" had minded their own business, the children of Iraq would still be cowering in fear over the atrocities being committed by their dictator on his own people.

By the way, Moya, let's see a link to where the Pentagon stated that it's goal in invading Iraq was to cause disease, please. That might shed light on some things in this discussion re: lower vaccination rate in Iraq. TIA!
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#158 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 03:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by tylertyler View Post
.
My son is 21 and i would give my own life to STOP him from joining the army,if the draft came along i would take him out of this country.


:
I understand how you feel. BUT, your son is 21. He's an adult. I find it very, um, scary, that you still control him to that extent. I wonder how he'd feel about moving to a foreign country, leaving all his friends and the culture he grew up in, because mommy and daddy are scared for their little baby boy? :

By the way, which country are you planning on moving to?
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#159 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 03:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Plummeting View Post
They think a well nourished kid is just as likely to die from chickenpox as a starving kid. They say they don't, but in reality they do.


Which is exactly why the government uses WORLDWIDE mortality figures in order to get parents to comply with the immunization recommendations.

Gasp! "Honey, the CDC says that a gazillion babies died of tetanus last year because they weren't vaccinated! I'd better get Junior vaccinated!"


When those umbilical cords are being cut using unsanitary instruments and/or the stump wounds are covered with clay/dirt, the risk of tetanus is going to increase.
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#160 of 161 Old 03-20-2007, 03:58 PM
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chug-a-pug
your answer makes sense now that i read your profile
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#161 of 161 Old 03-21-2007, 02:50 PM
 
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I think enough has been said on this topic, and many others...

I think it's gonna stay closed.

Reading through for possible edit requests. Please remember to keep it friendly!
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