Gov't Concedes Vaccine-Autism Case in Federal Court - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 12 Old 02-26-2008, 01:55 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Government Concedes Vaccine-Autism Case in Federal Court - Now What?
By David Kirby
Posted February 25, 2008 | 12:42 PM (EST)

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To read the rest of Mr. Kirby's piece and to post your comments, please visit
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-...i_b_88323.html.


Think Autism. Think Cure. ®

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#2 of 12 Old 02-26-2008, 02:24 AM
 
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Moving to the main forum...
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#3 of 12 Old 02-26-2008, 03:41 AM
 
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This is really big news in a sense, and I think it does shed some light no what may be causing part of the autism epidemic. I personally think that autism is just a symptom of an underlying physical condition, much like a runny nose is a symptom of a cold or seizures are a symptom of epilepsy. Somehow, either though genetics, exposure to toxins or simply a substance that the body cannot tolerate, may tweak something that causes the symptoms of autism. I really think that the whole puzzle is much bigger than scientists realize, and that current research is just barely beginning to unravel the first threads of evidence and truth surrounding autism disorders. The apparent prevalence of the mitochondrial disorder in individuals with ASD is an important finding, because it could explain why some people are exposed to certain things, vaccinations being one of them, and are fine, and why others react severely to them.

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#4 of 12 Old 02-26-2008, 07:57 AM
 
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Wow, there COULD be a can of worms opened...we'll see.

This really struck me from the op link:
Among the prime cellular targets of mercury are mitochondria, and thimerosal-induced cell death has been associated with the depolarization of mitochondrial membrane, according to the International Journal of Molecular Medicine among several others. (Coincidently, the first case of Mt disease was diagnosed in 1959, just 15 years after the first autism case was named, and two decades after thimerosal's introduction as a vaccine preservative.)

Does any one know how the mechanism of MT disease affects the brain to cause autism symptoms? I would think it would be more the energy/muscle symptoms manifesting.

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#5 of 12 Old 02-26-2008, 10:59 AM
 
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The court decided that this case was not good for a test case.

http://www.uscfc.uscourts.gov/OSM/Autism/modifying.pdf


This is actually pretty old news as far as the trial goes. It was also settled out of court. So it will have no weight on the other cases. (it is also not the first time that something like this has happened-- and, in addition, you also have 3 court cases Merck just won over the past little while that found for them instead of those arguing against thimerosal; since those were in court decisions, they will definitely be more precedent setting)

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#6 of 12 Old 02-26-2008, 12:30 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krizzanne View Post
Wow, there COULD be a can of worms opened...we'll see.

This really struck me from the op link:
Among the prime cellular targets of mercury are mitochondria, and thimerosal-induced cell death has been associated with the depolarization of mitochondrial membrane, according to the International Journal of Molecular Medicine among several others. (Coincidently, the first case of Mt disease was diagnosed in 1959, just 15 years after the first autism case was named, and two decades after thimerosal's introduction as a vaccine preservative.)

Does any one know how the mechanism of MT disease affects the brain to cause autism symptoms? I would think it would be more the energy/muscle symptoms manifesting.

anything that affects metabolism of nutrients could affect neuro functioning...neuro functions require a host of synchronized cellular reactions...if the different types of energy required by each cell is not present, or delayed....it can throw off the ability to commincate and process - either by delaying or making it impossible.

I think Mr. Kirby's biggest point is that there are simply too many ASD people with this very rare deficiency for it to be occuring naturally. I think he's implying that the vaccines are causing this metabolic disorder in some cases and I agree.
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#7 of 12 Old 02-26-2008, 04:38 PM
 
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Carrie – can you explain what they mean by test case and why it isn’t good? I am so far from a lawyer lol. I have no idea about court cases and such but why can’t this be considered a good thing? Didn’t the family get paid for a vaccine causing autism?

I’m just a little confused as to why this case has to be dismissed so quickly when the family won.
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#8 of 12 Old 02-26-2008, 08:59 PM
 
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Candid, the families were petitioning for the right to sue the pharma companies for mercury damage. this family settled out of court so is no use to the rest of the vaccine court proceedings...

and it wasn't decided that the case was not a good 'test case'...they simply couldn't use them as a test case because they were settling before the filing deadlines.
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#9 of 12 Old 02-27-2008, 10:11 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 13Sandals View Post
anything that affects metabolism of nutrients could affect neuro functioning...neuro functions require a host of synchronized cellular reactions...if the different types of energy required by each cell is not present, or delayed....it can throw off the ability to commincate and process - either by delaying or making it impossible.

I think Mr. Kirby's biggest point is that there are simply too many ASD people with this very rare deficiency for it to be occuring naturally. I think he's implying that the vaccines are causing this metabolic disorder in some cases and I agree.
thanks for the explanation! I still have a question, though, wouldn't it manifest more as physical symptoms--lethargy, weakness - first, before affecting neuro functioning?

About what you said Mr. Kirby's point is: ITA!

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#10 of 12 Old 02-27-2008, 10:33 AM
 
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Originally Posted by CanidFL View Post
Carrie – can you explain what they mean by test case and why it isn’t good? I am so far from a lawyer lol. I have no idea about court cases and such but why can’t this be considered a good thing? Didn’t the family get paid for a vaccine causing autism?

I’m just a little confused as to why this case has to be dismissed so quickly when the family won.
no prob...I am not really educated in this area either, so I all I know is what I have read from following the trial. So, with that in mind....basically, there were three initial cases that were heard, the first three cases were also test cases. These were to determine if the thousands of others in the wings should go forward....from my understanding, there were to determine if there was sufficient evidence and ...for lack of other words, ability to win?

Now that the first three are over, they are looking for three more to do in May 2008. This case, because it was settled out of court, was determined not to be a case they could now put to trial. (now whether this is because of the no double trial rule- cant be tried for the same thing twice- or because there was some stipulation in the settlement or because it was simply "already case closed" I have no idea because I don't know enough about law)

It won't be precedent setting (that is, cases closed in court can have a precedent effect in court- can be pointed to and used to argue....someone out there can probably explain this a lot better than me ) while others, such as the recent merck cases, will be because they were brought before a judge and jury.


Warning on all this, I could be totally off on my reasoning (such as why they didn't want it as a test case given it had already been settled) but I think this is about right.

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#11 of 12 Old 02-27-2008, 02:44 PM
 
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Thanks so much for the explanation! I can tell you know just the basics to make it understandable but I get what you are saying. I wonder why they would settle out of court. Maybe the family was happy with the amount offered and afraid they would loose? Oh well…it will be interesting to see what happens in May.

Wasn’t there a court case in Europe where a doctor proved vaccines were not safe and a mother did not have to vax her kids against her wishes (the father wanted to vax and they were divorced). Wonder if that has any weight in America?
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#12 of 12 Old 11-29-2008, 11:51 PM
 
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I have removed some posts from this thread for review. Please be aware of the guidelines for the Vax forum & also remember to avoid posting to take direct issue with another member - if you feel someone has behaved inappropriately in a thread, discuss the situation with a moderator or click the 'report' button at the bottom of the post in question.
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